Another bad loss, another week of frustrating and somewhat depressing film. This was a team loss, there were fails all over the place. With the topic being hot about kaepernick being benched - he definitely had his hand in the loss, but, as usual, it's not entirely on one player. However, he is seeing the field worse than I think I've ever seen him before. There are rudimentary passing concepts that he's failing to read.
Most of his completions seemed to be on designed plays and most of his in-completions were on plays that required a read. However, the film shows more things going on than Kaepernick - so, somewhere this team needs a spark to jump start performance.
Personally, I want to see anyone other than Marcus Martin in at center. He's been terrible and at his best, has been bad.
tank Carradine has also shown little to tell me anything about his potential as a player. He was largely the cluprit on Gurley's big TD run. He got dominated 1v1 and pancaked.
Overall, there wasn't a lot of new information to take away from the game other than that we are simply not a very good team.
I'm not sure how much I'll be able to contribute this week to the thread as I have a business trip this week and I'm going to be out of town from Wed-sat. So, I have a little more on my plate today than I'd normally have. Normally, I only work a few hours on Tuesdays, so, we'll see what I have time to contribute as far as breakdowns.
Cheers!
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Week 8 St. Louis rams coaches film analysis
Nov 3, 2015 at 10:54 AM
- jonnydel
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Nov 3, 2015 at 11:09 AM
- Niners816
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how bout the Rams new defense where they have 8 in the box yet still have 2 safeties to potentially go 9 in. Pretty bold strategy if you ask me, especially against 21 personnel
[ Edited by Niners816 on Nov 3, 2015 at 11:10 AM ]
Nov 3, 2015 at 11:12 AM
- awp8912
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I think its safe to say the entire team wasn't trying to win on Sunday. So I wouldn't over analyse this game in particular. The Falcons game coming up seems like a game where we'll truly see if this team has any fight left in them or if they really have all mailed it in.
Nov 3, 2015 at 11:14 AM
- jonnydel
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here's an example that's indicative of how CK's struggling to see the whole field. It's on the last drive of the game. 2nd and 2 from the Rams 24 yard line 3:14 4th qtr
Here, we're going to try a "verticals" concept. It's a deep horizontal stretch concept. Works best against cover 2 zone or cover 3 zone. In fact, this was the passing concept that caused Bill Bellichick and Nick Saban to create their pattern match defenses. Against cover 2 zone, you want to look for the deep middle or deep down the sidelines. Against cover 3, you look for a seam, reading the middle safety. Tampa 2 was also created as a way of combating this concept while maintaining a more simple form of defense. Against tampa 2, you look underneath. St. Louis looks like a cover 2 zone, however, the corners are giving a 5 yard cushion, showing a "soft" 2 zone. This means, that instead of playing the flat, they're playing the hook/curl zone and dropping deeper with the receivers. Just before the snap, the outside defender on the top of the formation(it's a safety) drops back towards the middle - this reveals a tampa 2 zone. They're baiting the throw down the middle.
Note the middle defender is tracking the receiver deepest in the middle of the field. The moment CK see's this he should recognize that there will be no underneath defender as they are now in tampa 2 zone. So, the correct throw, right here, should be the RB on his release.
Instead, CK see's a tiny window for VD and think he can fit it in.
He had a clean pocket, all he needed to do was take a quick hitch step and float the ball out to the RB and it would've been an easy 1st down.
The window is too small to get it into and the pass falls incomplete.
Here, we're going to try a "verticals" concept. It's a deep horizontal stretch concept. Works best against cover 2 zone or cover 3 zone. In fact, this was the passing concept that caused Bill Bellichick and Nick Saban to create their pattern match defenses. Against cover 2 zone, you want to look for the deep middle or deep down the sidelines. Against cover 3, you look for a seam, reading the middle safety. Tampa 2 was also created as a way of combating this concept while maintaining a more simple form of defense. Against tampa 2, you look underneath. St. Louis looks like a cover 2 zone, however, the corners are giving a 5 yard cushion, showing a "soft" 2 zone. This means, that instead of playing the flat, they're playing the hook/curl zone and dropping deeper with the receivers. Just before the snap, the outside defender on the top of the formation(it's a safety) drops back towards the middle - this reveals a tampa 2 zone. They're baiting the throw down the middle.
Note the middle defender is tracking the receiver deepest in the middle of the field. The moment CK see's this he should recognize that there will be no underneath defender as they are now in tampa 2 zone. So, the correct throw, right here, should be the RB on his release.
Instead, CK see's a tiny window for VD and think he can fit it in.
He had a clean pocket, all he needed to do was take a quick hitch step and float the ball out to the RB and it would've been an easy 1st down.
The window is too small to get it into and the pass falls incomplete.
Nov 3, 2015 at 11:17 AM
- jonnydel
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Originally posted by Niners816:I noticed that. They seemed to put so much confidence in their D-line against our O-line that they ran a big Nickel with a single high safety most of the game. They were daring us to throw it in the intermediate area of the sidelines. They were going to have a safety in place to take away throws over the top with the corners pressed and the big nickel matched up speed against our multiple TE sets to take away slide concepts.
how bout the Rams new defense where they have 8 in the box yet still have 2 safeties to potentially go 9 in. Pretty bold strategy if you ask me, especially against 21 personnel
Nov 3, 2015 at 11:19 AM
- Joecool
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I would like to see passing plays and whether or not the play designs and play calls are getting open targets.
Nov 3, 2015 at 11:26 AM
- qnnhan7
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Holys**t, that's 10 open yards in front of the RB on 2nd&2
Another instance of Kaep just forcing the throw.
Another instance of Kaep just forcing the throw.
[ Edited by qnnhan7 on Nov 3, 2015 at 11:28 AM ]
Nov 3, 2015 at 11:29 AM
- jonnydel
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Here's a basic concept that we've covered many times here, it's a staple around the league, "slant/flat" concept. He doesn't even try and make the key read.
The Rams give a cover 3 zone look. We have a slant/flat concept called with Torrey Smith and VD. You read the key defender, if he goes out on the flat, you throw the slant, if he stays in on the slant, you throw the flat - that simple.
The key defender drives out on VD, the throw should be to the slant. However, CK's already starting his throwing motion, he decided before the snap that he was throwing it to VD.
You see how the key defenders action should determine the throw. There's an open hole where TS could turn it upfield and split the defense for a first down.
Instead, the throw is to VD who now has 2 defenders closing in on him with no where to run.
Torrey Smith wasn't happy about the pass - neither should he be.
This is not the first time in recent weeks I've seen CK fail to make the read on this play. This is an old passing concept that's used everywhere in the NFL and in most college offenses and even high school offenses. I have no idea why he's struggling with plays like this. There's no excuse.
Now, understand that he's not doing this on every single play, sometimes guys just aren't open, but, when the plays are there and the reads are simple - there's no excuse at all.
The Rams give a cover 3 zone look. We have a slant/flat concept called with Torrey Smith and VD. You read the key defender, if he goes out on the flat, you throw the slant, if he stays in on the slant, you throw the flat - that simple.
The key defender drives out on VD, the throw should be to the slant. However, CK's already starting his throwing motion, he decided before the snap that he was throwing it to VD.
You see how the key defenders action should determine the throw. There's an open hole where TS could turn it upfield and split the defense for a first down.
Instead, the throw is to VD who now has 2 defenders closing in on him with no where to run.
Torrey Smith wasn't happy about the pass - neither should he be.
This is not the first time in recent weeks I've seen CK fail to make the read on this play. This is an old passing concept that's used everywhere in the NFL and in most college offenses and even high school offenses. I have no idea why he's struggling with plays like this. There's no excuse.
Now, understand that he's not doing this on every single play, sometimes guys just aren't open, but, when the plays are there and the reads are simple - there's no excuse at all.
Nov 3, 2015 at 11:33 AM
- SJniner7
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Good breakups so far. Looks like he even could have hit a little WR curl on post #8, with 5-10 yards in front of the guy.
Nov 3, 2015 at 11:37 AM
- jonnydel
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Originally posted by SJniner7:yeah, it's a curl/flat concept on that side. Again, a simple key defender read.
Good breakups so far. Looks like he even could have hit a little WR curl on post #8, with 5-10 yards in front of the guy.
Nov 3, 2015 at 11:55 AM
- thl408
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I got a few examples of why Kap's benching is well deserved, as if it's not obvious. He has a severe case of tunnel vision and indecisiveness. It wasn't all bad as I remember two good throws to Simpson where Simpson could have helped out Kap and made the catch, but overall, I agree that there are basic concepts that Kap is failing to read and target. These failed reads/throws occurred on key 3rd downs, and in the red zone, when the game was still in the balance.
I thought Simpson had a decent game after coming back from what was essentially a 1.5 year layoff and he could have helped earlier this season. Tartt flashed some physicality as well as some bad technique playing deep safety. He seems to excel attacking downhill which is what his college tape also showed. There will be a learning curve as he adjusts to the speed of the NFL after going against weak competition at a small college. The forced fumble he created was actually a mixed bag play. He did poorly to give up the catch, but showed his physical play to force the fumble.
On the big Gurley run, Tank was the main culprit getting flattened, but Bow also did not get into his run fit, and I think that's what allowed Gurley to take the run up the middle and not towards where Tartt was going. Reid with another timid angle and that makes for another highlight run from Gurley.
The story of the game was failed 3rd downs/red zone attempts on offense, and giving up a few chunk plays on defense. This will be a fairly quick breakdown of just a handful of plays from me.
I thought Simpson had a decent game after coming back from what was essentially a 1.5 year layoff and he could have helped earlier this season. Tartt flashed some physicality as well as some bad technique playing deep safety. He seems to excel attacking downhill which is what his college tape also showed. There will be a learning curve as he adjusts to the speed of the NFL after going against weak competition at a small college. The forced fumble he created was actually a mixed bag play. He did poorly to give up the catch, but showed his physical play to force the fumble.
On the big Gurley run, Tank was the main culprit getting flattened, but Bow also did not get into his run fit, and I think that's what allowed Gurley to take the run up the middle and not towards where Tartt was going. Reid with another timid angle and that makes for another highlight run from Gurley.
The story of the game was failed 3rd downs/red zone attempts on offense, and giving up a few chunk plays on defense. This will be a fairly quick breakdown of just a handful of plays from me.
Nov 3, 2015 at 11:58 AM
- Niners816
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Originally posted by jonnydel:I noticed that. They seemed to put so much confidence in their D-line against our O-line that they ran a big Nickel with a single high safety most of the game. They were daring us to throw it in the intermediate area of the sidelines. They were going to have a safety in place to take away throws over the top with the corners pressed and the big nickel matched up speed against our multiple TE sets to take away slide concepts.Originally posted by Niners816:how bout the Rams new defense where they have 8 in the box yet still have 2 safeties to potentially go 9 in. Pretty bold strategy if you ask me, especially against 21 personnel
This is getting a little cocky though Seriously though, I still can't wrap my mind around this play. I get that it's a run and all but you just have to look and see if everyone is at least covered.
Nov 3, 2015 at 11:58 AM
- qnnhan7
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Tank kinda slipped and lost leverage on that play. I thought we did a decent job on Gurley. Most of his yardage came from that play.
Nov 3, 2015 at 11:58 AM
- PacTiger
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Its nice to see someone else agree with me about marcus martin and Tank.
Nov 3, 2015 at 12:02 PM
- qnnhan7
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Originally posted by Niners816:
This is getting a little cocky though Seriously though, I still can't wrap my mind around this play. I get that it's a run and all but you just have to look and see if everyone is at least covered.
Maybe Kaep was too wrapped up in his mind, thinking 'they don't trust me enough to call a passing play on first down.'
f**k it just do the handoff.