There are 117 users in the forums
Originally posted by KowboyKiller:
And that's a very level headed opinion for sure. Jimmy being healthy is perhaps the biggest factor in his improvement this year, he hasn't been fully healthy since 2019 and his availability is the main reason they wanted to move on from him in the first place.
Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
I haven't changed my opinion on JG at all. I can acknowledge that he's playing well so far this year other than a couple of games. He's managed to stay healthy which is a big deal for him. He's always been efficient and I don't see anything different from what I've seen the past 5 years.
That doesn't mean I don't think they should move on from him after the season. If they elect to keep him and give him a new contract, they need to trade Lance and draft another future replacement in 2023 or 2024. I'm not sure they would get that much for Lance since he's played so little so I think keeping Jimmy is a bad option. Let him walk, take the compensatory pick and move on. Lance will struggle next year but that's going to happen eventually no matter who they replace JG with unless they sign a big time free agent. That would be too expensive.
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by Sanfran_chrisco:
We'd all have a laugh, no doubt haha
Beers, food and rooting for the Niners. Nothing more.
It wouldn't be I'm right you're wrong. It wouldn't be name calling or you said something negative about a player at some point so you suck lol.
No one would talk like they do in here….in person.
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
We'd all have a laugh, no doubt haha
Beers, food and rooting for the Niners. Nothing more.
It wouldn't be I'm right you're wrong. It wouldn't be name calling or you said something negative about a player at some point so you suck lol.
No one would talk like they do in here….in person.
Alight. You're all welcome to my house for the game Sunday. If you're in NW Alabama, I'm not even lyin
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by YACBros85:
Originally posted by Furlow:
Why does JT get so much hate as an analyst? Just because he wasn't good enough for the NFL doesn't mean he doesn't understand football. Not one person in here played in the NFL - hell most of us never even played in college or high school - yet everyone has a strong opinion.
Not saying I agree with him 100% of the time but the dude definitely knows the game and the position.
100% agree with this. JT's opinion holds more weight than anyone in these threads. Regardless of how successful he was in the NFL. No one in here has the level of experience nor the time spent studying NFL defenses.
I love JT. I especially appreciate that he's always noting he doesn't know how the QB is coached up within a play but still gives his best take given his experiences. I respect that a ton.
The only caution with him is he is ALWAYS looking for the biggest play so he comes from that perspective, hence the nickname, J.T. O'Picksalot.
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by RiceOwensStokes:
Keep those countdowns to nothing coming.
only guarantees that he'll sign an extension after he wins the super bowl.
Say bye to Bosa if you want to sign Jimmy to $30M per. Say bye to Jimmie Ward. Say bye to upgrading RT. Say bye to getting another CB. Say bye to upgrading anything. Say bye to Lance because you're all but telling him and the league he was a bust after 4 QRs of football….yeah I don't see this FO, ownership and coaching staff going in that direction.
if they win the SB, it then gives Kyle more breathing room to develop Lance and gives the team money to keep everything around the QB going long-term.
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Altho it is fun to prognosticate into the future, it seems pointless right now because nobody knows how this season turns out nor whether we take home #6 or not. F.O is probably going over multiple scenarios but I bet they are making no certain plans for JG at present. They need to see where we end up and how JG takes us to SB win or not. Best to just let sleeping dogs lie for now and then decide about Jimmy's future when season is over.
As for Jiimmy's play, i see a lot of difference between now and last 4 yrs. You mentioned health…well, he is truly healthier than at anytime he has been here since the self induced ACL tear while running out of bounds. Last yr was the thumb, but nobody knew about the shoulder. Now, it is obviously healthy. So yes, there is a difference.
But moreso than the above being healthy is the one key JG was missing. And that was a receiver who runs great routes and doesn't drop the ball. Also, he happens to be a whiz at sliding thru cracks in the line. Lastly, he, of all our good hands guys, knows how to and where to be as an outlet, or check down. Watch McCaf as checkdown and he just knows how to be in the right spot at exactly the right time so Jimmy KNOWS where he can dump off the ball. And McCaf knows YAC so check downs for him end up being 8 yards not two. Since Jimmy has been here, does any of our receivers know how to position himself so that if primary target is covered, that checkdown will be in exactly the right place for our QB? I can't think of anyone who is a checkdown plays it as well as McCaf.
And that has instilled in JG the confidence that if targets are covered, checkdown ,MCC is there. I think that has made Jimmy significantly better qB than he was previous to MCC's arrival . This team became complete once McCaf stepped on the field.
Final thot is that we need OL , DL, DB, WR, RB, & LB rotational guys who can come in and play like starters in case of injury. Well, to that, i would suggest we look at what having a QB who can do that also. I don't mean a Mullins, or Gabbert type QB, but a true JG/TL pair . Look what that has done for us this yr. True it was never planned that way, but in the years of the NEW INJURY NFL, if you don't have a first class QB in the wings and #1 goes down, your season is over. F.O is very aware of this, and it will be interesting how they finesse this at season's end. With Jimmy and his talents, he literally saved our bacon.
Originally posted by krizay:
Originally posted by KowboyKiller:
And that's a very level headed opinion for sure. Jimmy being healthy is perhaps the biggest factor in his improvement this year, he hasn't been fully healthy since 2019 and his availability is the main reason they wanted to move on from him in the first place.
Everyone to a man said that last offseason prior to the draft. Since the selection they used every other reasoning possible.
Originally posted by Furlow:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by RiceOwensStokes:
Keep those countdowns to nothing coming.
only guarantees that he'll sign an extension after he wins the super bowl.
Say bye to Bosa if you want to sign Jimmy to $30M per. Say bye to Jimmie Ward. Say bye to upgrading RT. Say bye to getting another CB. Say bye to upgrading anything. Say bye to Lance because you're all but telling him and the league he was a bust after 4 QRs of football….yeah I don't see this FO, ownership and coaching staff going in that direction.
if they win the SB, it then gives Kyle more breathing room to develop Lance and gives the team money to keep everything around the QB going long-term.
Just messing, NY. I somewhat agree. Bosa and Jimmy would be tough. Would have to be a short front loaded deal for Jimmy and a long back loaded deal for Bosa.
Someone posted yesterday that if Jimmy keeps playing like this then the only players we'd HAVE to have would be Jimmy, CMC, and Bosa. Everyone else is replaceable.
A big if of course because this is unchartered territory for Jimmy. Even I'd need to see this for a full season and a Super Bowl run/win to be convinced to re-sign him long term.
Regardless of what happens, I think even Jimmy's harshest critics (not you just in general) can step back and appreciate this run with Jimmy. He's far from perfect, but the dude is a gamer, tough, and leaves it all on the field. It's been fun watching him, this team, and Kyle compete together. They look like they genuinely enjoy playing together as well which is rare.
Originally posted by 49ers81:
I never know what to make of Steve's comments these days. One minute he's all in on Lance and how Jimmy got 'fired' from the team because of this that and the other thing and how he isn't the guy to carry the team forward. And now this quote. You gotta love the fact that Steve remains a 49er through and through but I'm not sure these contrary takes really help the narrative around the team.
A lot of the usual suspects are in here giving Jimmy grudging credit for playing well while at the same time insisting he will inevitably return to what they deem his normal play. My take is that Jimmy is playing to his potential and that his current success doesn't surprise me at all. It is something he has always been capable of but which has occasionally been untracked by a tendency for errant throws and kind of head scratching picks. Clearly McCaffrey's presence has helped a lot by giving him a reliable check down option that keeps him from feeling he needs to try and force the ball into tight windows to make a play.
There has been a lot of chatter about a play you mentioned in your recent breakdown where Jimmy hit McCaffrey on a short route that picked up a first down when he possibly had an opportunity for a bigger play with Aiyuk further down the field. And of course all of the usual suspects are latching onto this as proof of Jimmy not being a "big play" QB. The situation isn't helped of course by the fact that career back-up, I never took any team to a playoff game, JT O'Sullivan chose to highlight that play and insist that any real QB has to make that throw. With all that in mind I would be curious as to your take on the current level of Jimmy's play. Is he actually playing better than he has in the past or is he just finally in a better position with McCaffrey's presence to utilize the traits he has always possessed?
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by RiceOwensStokes:
Keep those countdowns to nothing coming.
only guarantees that he'll sign an extension after he wins the super bowl.
Say bye to Bosa if you want to sign Jimmy to $30M per. Say bye to Jimmie Ward. Say bye to upgrading RT. Say bye to getting another CB. Say bye to upgrading anything. Say bye to Lance because you're all but telling him and the league he was a bust after 4 QRs of football….yeah I don't see this FO, ownership and coaching staff going in that direction.
if they win the SB, it then gives Kyle more breathing room to develop Lance and gives the team money to keep everything around the QB going long-term.
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Say bye to Bosa if you want to sign Jimmy to $30M per. Say bye to Jimmie Ward. Say bye to upgrading RT. Say bye to getting another CB. Say bye to upgrading anything. Say bye to Lance because you're all but telling him and the league he was a bust after 4 QRs of football….yeah I don't see this FO, ownership and coaching staff going in that direction.
if they win the SB, it then gives Kyle more breathing room to develop Lance and gives the team money to keep everything around the QB going long-term.
Originally posted by dj43:Jimmy is still a big question mark , this is year 6 and a contract year.
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Say bye to Bosa if you want to sign Jimmy to $30M per. Say bye to Jimmie Ward. Say bye to upgrading RT. Say bye to getting another CB. Say bye to upgrading anything. Say bye to Lance because you're all but telling him and the league he was a bust after 4 QRs of football….yeah I don't see this FO, ownership and coaching staff going in that direction.
if they win the SB, it then gives Kyle more breathing room to develop Lance and gives the team money to keep everything around the QB going long-term.
I disagree that resigning JG would mean we lose multiple other players.
Consider this: Let's use Stafford and Derek Carr as examples of mid-to-upper-level QB contracts. Both are getting paid $40M/yr. I would assert JG is better than either of those two, although that is not my main point. What I am suggesting is that we look at Garoppolo as being willing to stay here (he won't find a better spot) at $25-30M/yr. That plus Lance's $9.8M cap number for 2023 brings us to a QB tab of $40M/yr. Considering that we have no idea what we will get from Lance next season but we know what we have now with Garoppolo, is it unreasonable to pay the market rate for what we are now getting from Jimmy?
With the 2025 cap number projected to go from the current $208,000,000 to $256,000,000, there are multiple scenarios in which Marathe can maneuver those contract extensions, along with some options in a new contract for JG, to keep the guys you mention. Backload those contracts with that additional $46M in cap money and we keep winning.
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by 49ers81:
I never know what to make of Steve's comments these days. One minute he's all in on Lance and how Jimmy got 'fired' from the team because of this that and the other thing and how he isn't the guy to carry the team forward. And now this quote. You gotta love the fact that Steve remains a 49er through and through but I'm not sure these contrary takes really help the narrative around the team.
A lot of the usual suspects are in here giving Jimmy grudging credit for playing well while at the same time insisting he will inevitably return to what they deem his normal play. My take is that Jimmy is playing to his potential and that his current success doesn't surprise me at all. It is something he has always been capable of but which has occasionally been untracked by a tendency for errant throws and kind of head scratching picks. Clearly McCaffrey's presence has helped a lot by giving him a reliable check down option that keeps him from feeling he needs to try and force the ball into tight windows to make a play.
There has been a lot of chatter about a play you mentioned in your recent breakdown where Jimmy hit McCaffrey on a short route that picked up a first down when he possibly had an opportunity for a bigger play with Aiyuk further down the field. And of course all of the usual suspects are latching onto this as proof of Jimmy not being a "big play" QB. The situation isn't helped of course by the fact that career back-up, I never took any team to a playoff game, JT O'Sullivan chose to highlight that play and insist that any real QB has to make that throw. With all that in mind I would be curious as to your take on the current level of Jimmy's play. Is he actually playing better than he has in the past or is he just finally in a better position with McCaffrey's presence to utilize the traits he has always possessed?
One thing that I have been harping about for weeks, and Steve Young mentioned it down toward the end of his comments is the role that Brian Griese is playing in all this. He also recalled that he felt there was a lack of trust on Kyle Shanahan's part toward JG. Steve tied the two together and asserted that Griese has had a large role in building trust by teaching Garoppolo some of those details that had been lacking. For that reason, Young now believes Jimmy should stay here for 10 years.
Some of you may recall that I leveled criticism of Shanahan after his comment that he didn't care about the QB details as long as the ball arrived on time. Now, while there may be more to that, the fact we have gone through multiple QB coaches during Kyle's time here, with little or no improvements from any of them, speaks to the importance of good position coaching on the finer points of playing the position. Now enter Brian Griese and we see JG seeing the field, making reads and throws that he had not made previously with any regularity. Certainly the addition of CMC has had an impact on that, however, the QB still has to see the field and set up the throw. That is where Griese comes in. The fact Garoppolo is doing technical things he has not done before should inform us as to the value of the work Griese is doing. The light that is shining there is why Steve Young has now changed his view of the situation. The greatest proof of that was demonstrated in the AZ game where the running game was being stuffed in the beginning but Kyle was willing to put the game on Jimmy's shoulders to open it up by passing the ball, and that opened up an offense we have not seen before. Trust.
The timeline also points to the emergence of a better offense via better QB coaching. Garoppolo had no opportunity to work with Griese prior to the start of the season, and even then, it was not until the third week that they began working together daily. Over the succeeding weeks, the time spent together resulted in Jimmy acquiring those details just in time to put them all in play when CMC arrived. Perfect storm.
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Originally posted by dj43:Jimmy is still a big question mark , this is year 6 and a contract year.
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Say bye to Bosa if you want to sign Jimmy to $30M per. Say bye to Jimmie Ward. Say bye to upgrading RT. Say bye to getting another CB. Say bye to upgrading anything. Say bye to Lance because you're all but telling him and the league he was a bust after 4 QRs of football….yeah I don't see this FO, ownership and coaching staff going in that direction.
if they win the SB, it then gives Kyle more breathing room to develop Lance and gives the team money to keep everything around the QB going long-term.
I disagree that resigning JG would mean we lose multiple other players.
Consider this: Let's use Stafford and Derek Carr as examples of mid-to-upper-level QB contracts. Both are getting paid $40M/yr. I would assert JG is better than either of those two, although that is not my main point. What I am suggesting is that we look at Garoppolo as being willing to stay here (he won't find a better spot) at $25-30M/yr. That plus Lance's $9.8M cap number for 2023 brings us to a QB tab of $40M/yr. Considering that we have no idea what we will get from Lance next season but we know what we have now with Garoppolo, is it unreasonable to pay the market rate for what we are now getting from Jimmy?
With the 2025 cap number projected to go from the current $208,000,000 to $256,000,000, there are multiple scenarios in which Marathe can maneuver those contract extensions, along with some options in a new contract for JG, to keep the guys you mention. Backload those contracts with that additional $46M in cap money and we keep winning.