Coby Fleener - TE Stanford

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

He looks like Jimmy Clausen.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by ninersrule4:
Isn't TE kind of the least of our worries??

Yes, but red-zone scoring and third down are among the top of that list, adding a monster receiver like Fleener clears that concern up pretty well.


Do you not think that having a 6'6" guy with great route-running and good hands, tremendous agility and leaping wouldn't help Alex out? Not to mention that Fleener comes from a pro-style offense.......namely Harbaugh's, so he's familiar with the system, he's played WR and TE, and at 6'6" 250 is expected to run the 40 between 4.5 and 4.6.


Plus Harbaugh LOVES his TE's, and Fleener is a guy that he recruited. He's also a guy that can go after some of the errant high passes that Alex makes and turn them into actual completion's and touchdown's. Having Fleener on the field at the same time as VD basically puts an end to anyone double-teaming VD, ever.


I see Fleener as a much more of a sure thing than any receiver available at 30. He can come in, is already familiar with the offense, will be ready to contribute from Game 1. He's also highly intelligent, a leader and the kind of guy that Harbaugh loves to go around. There's literally like 100 reasons why he would be a good draft pick for them, however the decision is going to up to Harbaugh and Baalke, whichever way they go, I'm sure it will be a good choice.

No TE is not the least of our worries. As we've beaten to death in every TE thread in the past month, WE NEED PLAYMAKERS! Not just a 6'4" 230IB WR, it doesn't matter if its Kendall Wright, Rueben Randle, Coby Fleener or any other guy. If the guy is a stud at making plays we will look at them and figure out who is the best playmaker.

Phoenix hit on all the correct points, Fleener would pretty much be our TE and VD would motion out wide on a lot of plays with a receiver on the opposite side. We'd dominate people.

Originally posted by sfout:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by ninersrule4:
Isn't TE kind of the least of our worries??

Yes, but red-zone scoring and third down are among the top of that list, adding a monster receiver like Fleener clears that concern up pretty well.


Do you not think that having a 6'6" guy with great route-running and good hands, tremendous agility and leaping wouldn't help Alex out? Not to mention that Fleener comes from a pro-style offense.......namely Harbaugh's, so he's familiar with the system, he's played WR and TE, and at 6'6" 250 is expected to run the 40 between 4.5 and 4.6.


Plus Harbaugh LOVES his TE's, and Fleener is a guy that he recruited. He's also a guy that can go after some of the errant high passes that Alex makes and turn them into actual completion's and touchdown's. Having Fleener on the field at the same time as VD basically puts an end to anyone double-teaming VD, ever.


I see Fleener as a much more of a sure thing than any receiver available at 30. He can come in, is already familiar with the offense, will be ready to contribute from Game 1. He's also highly intelligent, a leader and the kind of guy that Harbaugh loves to go around. There's literally like 100 reasons why he would be a good draft pick for them, however the decision is going to up to Harbaugh and Baalke, whichever way they go, I'm sure it will be a good choice.

No TE is not the least of our worries. As we've beaten to death in every TE thread in the past month, WE NEED PLAYMAKERS! Not just a 6'4" 230IB WR, it doesn't matter if its Kendall Wright, Rueben Randle, Coby Fleener or any other guy. If the guy is a stud at making plays we will look at them and figure out who is the best playmaker.

Phoenix hit on all the correct points, Fleener would pretty much be our TE and VD would motion out wide on a lot of plays with a receiver on the opposite side. We'd dominate people.

This is exactly it. But this point will have to be made 100's of times until the draft gets here. Everytime you break it down and say "we need playmakers and who cares if they are listed as a WR or TE," 5 more people will just say "no we need a wr, did you see the NFC championship game?"

Who cares what position they are listed as. We drafted a DE last year to play Fullback. We just need players who can make plays on a consistent basis. I pray we draft Fleener or another Big-Pass Catching TE, but I also do trust Harbs and Trent. There are plenty of WR's to choose from in this draft and I have a hard time telling who's better than who, and certain guys seem to only work if they play in the right system. There is only a small amount of the big TE's that can be used as a mismatch. My wish is to grab Fleener at 30, even trade up to get him if we need to, and then take a chance on Quick or Criner or whoever later on.

I hope the other TE's are very impressive at the Combine and they take some attention away from Fleener...

I like him And its great that he can catch the ball. he is really good at catching the ball. Im just not sure right now if he would be a first round pick.

Originally posted by jacklegniner:
This is exactly it. But this point will have to be made 100's of times until the draft gets here. Everytime you break it down and say "we need playmakers and who cares if they are listed as a WR or TE," 5 more people will just say "no we need a wr, did you see the NFC championship game?"

Who cares what position they are listed as. We drafted a DE last year to play Fullback. We just need players who can make plays on a consistent basis. I pray we draft Fleener or another Big-Pass Catching TE, but I also do trust Harbs and Trent. There are plenty of WR's to choose from in this draft and I have a hard time telling who's better than who, and certain guys seem to only work if they play in the right system. There is only a small amount of the big TE's that can be used as a mismatch. My wish is to grab Fleener at 30, even trade up to get him if we need to, and then take a chance on Quick or Criner or whoever later on.

I hope the other TE's are very impressive at the Combine and they take some attention away from Fleener...

When people bring that up, I ask them quite pointedly if the Giants would have still been able to double-team VD had Fleener been out there on the field instead of Delanie Walker. The answer, obviously, is no.

You can say what you want about Delanie Walker but the guy is 6 feet tall, with questionable hands, on a team desperate for people to make plays, he went half the season without making any catches. Do you think a guy like Fleener get shut down for whole games at a time, especially in the red-zone when teams are going to struggle to defend an athletic freak like Davis and a big, tall physical receiver like Fleener? I don't think so.


49ers need playmakers period, Alex seems to love passing to tight-ends, so why fight it? A 2nd tight-end is a plus, it creates matchup nightmares for the defense, how many teams have the personnel to shut down TWO top tight-ends. I really believe that VD+Fleener is a superior pairing to Gronkowski and Hernandez even.

Why are people so scared of creating a mismatch? A receiver can be shutdown by a cornerback, a 2nd top tight-end forces a team out of their normal defensive formations and is extremely tough to defend. The Giants struggled to stop Hernandez and a one-legged Gronkowski in the Super Bowl, imagine if Gronkowski had been at 100% that game?

Originally posted by dlance:
I like him And its great that he can catch the ball. he is really good at catching the ball. Im just not sure right now if he would be a first round pick.

You may not be sure, but pretty much everyone else has him as a late 1st rounder, early 2nd rounder. Bottomline he's not getting past Indy's pick in the 2nd round. If he runs like a 4.5, he probably won't make it to the 49ers pick in the 1st even.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by jacklegniner:
This is exactly it. But this point will have to be made 100's of times until the draft gets here. Everytime you break it down and say "we need playmakers and who cares if they are listed as a WR or TE," 5 more people will just say "no we need a wr, did you see the NFC championship game?"

Who cares what position they are listed as. We drafted a DE last year to play Fullback. We just need players who can make plays on a consistent basis. I pray we draft Fleener or another Big-Pass Catching TE, but I also do trust Harbs and Trent. There are plenty of WR's to choose from in this draft and I have a hard time telling who's better than who, and certain guys seem to only work if they play in the right system. There is only a small amount of the big TE's that can be used as a mismatch. My wish is to grab Fleener at 30, even trade up to get him if we need to, and then take a chance on Quick or Criner or whoever later on.

(1)I hope the other TE's are very impressive at the Combine and they take some attention away from Fleener...

(2)When people bring that up, I ask them quite pointedly if the Giants would have still been able to double-team VD had Fleener been out there on the field instead of Delanie Walker. The answer, obviously, is no.

You can say what you want about Delanie Walker but the guy is 6 feet tall, with questionable hands, on a team desperate for people to make plays, he went half the season without making any catches. Do you think a guy like Fleener get shut down for whole games at a time, especially in the red-zone when teams are going to struggle to defend an athletic freak like Davis and a big, tall physical receiver like Fleener? I don't think so.


49ers need playmakers period, Alex seems to love passing to tight-ends, so why fight it? A 2nd tight-end is a plus, it creates matchup nightmares for the defense, how many teams have the personnel to shut down TWO top tight-ends. I really believe that VD+Fleener is a superior pairing to Gronkowski and Hernandez even.

Why are people so scared of creating a mismatch? A receiver can be shutdown by a cornerback, a 2nd top tight-end forces a team out of their normal defensive formations and is extremely tough to defend. The Giants struggled to stop Hernandez and a one-legged Gronkowski in the Super Bowl, imagine if Gronkowski had been at 100% that game?

Other sane people!!!! I'm not alone!!!!

1. Orson Charles will perform real well and make a push to make people wonder who will be the best TE, I just think Fleener will win out because of his height, Allen is listed as 6-4 and Charles at 6-3 both could easily drop an inch and Fleener at 6-6 could still lose an inch still be 2 inches taller with a bigger wing span :/

2. Everyone is quick to point out that Janoris Jenkins shut down multiple 6-3 physical WRs in career which is a perfect example of the fact that we need as many mismatches on the field as possible. If we only have one big mismatch then they can double team him and allow a slower LB to cover the other TE and CB to guard the WR on the field....If we have VD, Fleener and even Crabtree or similar type WR we would be able terrorize people especially if we reintegrate the screen pass they will have to account for Gore or Hunter as well.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by ninersrule4:
Isn't TE kind of the least of our worries??

Yes, but red-zone scoring and third down are among the top of that list, adding a monster receiver like Fleener clears that concern up pretty well.


Do you not think that having a 6'6" guy with great route-running and good hands, tremendous agility and leaping wouldn't help Alex out? Not to mention that Fleener comes from a pro-style offense.......namely Harbaugh's, so he's familiar with the system, he's played WR and TE, and at 6'6" 250 is expected to run the 40 between 4.5 and 4.6.


Plus Harbaugh LOVES his TE's, and Fleener is a guy that he recruited. He's also a guy that can go after some of the errant high passes that Alex makes and turn them into actual completion's and touchdown's. Having Fleener on the field at the same time as VD basically puts an end to anyone double-teaming VD, ever.


I see Fleener as a much more of a sure thing than any receiver available at 30. He can come in, is already familiar with the offense, will be ready to contribute from Game 1. He's also highly intelligent, a leader and the kind of guy that Harbaugh loves to go around. There's literally like 100 reasons why he would be a good draft pick for them, however the decision is going to up to Harbaugh and Baalke, whichever way they go, I'm sure it will be a good choice.

If he measures 6'6" 250 lbs. at the combine and runs between 4.5 - 4.6 you can rest assured he won't be sitting there available at #30. He'll be way gone by then. Especially after the NFL sees what New Orleans and the Patriots did with TE's in recent times. The NFL is a copycat league. SEE 6'6" PRODUCTIVE TE. GO GET 6'6" TE WHO WILL BE PRODUCTIVE.

Originally posted by sfout:
Other sane people!!!! I'm not alone!!!!

1. Orson Charles will perform real well and make a push to make people wonder who will be the best TE, I just think Fleener will win out because of his height, Allen is listed as 6-4 and Charles at 6-3 both could easily drop an inch and Fleener at 6-6 could still lose an inch still be 2 inches taller with a bigger wing span :/

2. Everyone is quick to point out that Janoris Jenkins shut down multiple 6-3 physical WRs in career which is a perfect example of the fact that we need as many mismatches on the field as possible.

I think Charles will dazzle at the combines and everyone will jump on his bandwagon. Mayock has him as his top TE, just ahead of Fleener and then Allen. Supposedly the guy is capable of running a 4.4. If so then that is great because that will give teams another target to focus on instead of Fleener. Charles is a smaller, athletic tight-end, kind of an athletic freak along the lines of VD.

If it comes to it and Fleener gets drafted before the 49ers have a shot at him, I'm really starting to warm up to Ladarius Green who alas is also beginning to move up the draft boards. He could be had with the 49ers 2nd round pick, he's not as polished as Fleener, nor as good a blocker, but he's still got the size(6'6" or 6'5" depending on who you believe) and has terrific athletic ability with good hands. In either case, he would be a nice consolation prize.

2. Exactly. I feel like some people are being so short-sighted, obsessed with a receiver, when adding another receiver is absolutely no guarantee of major improvement in the red-zone. It'll help, but I think a 2nd dominant tight-end running around makes for a much bigger mismatch. A lot of teams have 2 good CB's, there's very few that shutdown two dominant tight-ends, especially when one of them is VD, who's the fastest TE in football. He showed what a scary matchup he can be at WR, put a big, physical TE with good hands in the middle of the field and you can mix in runs or passes and totally have the defense off balance.

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
If he measures 6'6" 250 lbs. at the combine and runs between 4.5 - 4.6 you can rest assured he won't be sitting there available at #30. He'll be way gone by then. Especially after the NFL sees what New Orleans and the Patriots did with TE's in recent times. The NFL is a copycat league. SEE 6'6" PRODUCTIVE TE. GO GET 6'6" TE WHO WILL BE PRODUCTIVE.

I know, I'm hoping Harbaugh takes him out to a Chinese buffet the night before or something.

fleener + vincent jackson + 2nd round WR

The WR & TE argument is allot like the 3-4, or 4-3 defense argument... teams will target different players based on their scheme. Superbowl is a great example... one offense was built around its wide receivers, the other around its tight ends but both were effective throughout the season cause they were catered to their players strengths.

Right now this offense (at least IMO) is better suited for drafting a playmaker at TE over WR because it is a WCO based power scheme and it's ran by a QB who favors high percentage short-to-intermediate throws over highrisk-high reward throws. Not saying the WR position doesnt need an massive upgrade since it clearly does, but a 1st round TE will make a greater impact than a 1st round WR. What good is a 6'3 burner of a WR if only 1 or 2 downfield shots get called a game. Especially if the read isnt timely, cause the WR has already ran out of the QB's range unless its CK's 70 yard arm.

Originally posted by DonnieDarko:
fleener + vincent jackson + 2nd round WR

Kind of big on Garcon=cheaper, younger, less drama prone. He's got the speed to be a decent deep threat and is a nice playmaker. The big receivers I really like are Streeter, Hill and McNutt.


If the 49ers can come away with Garcon, re-sign Morgan, draft Fleener or Green and one of the 3 aforementioned receivers, I'm going to be psyched as all hell for the season to start.

Originally posted by 5280High:
The WR & TE argument is allot like the 3-4, or 4-3 defense argument... teams will target different players based on their scheme. Superbowl is a great example... one offense was built around its wide receivers, the other around its tight ends but both were effective throughout the season cause they were catered to their players strengths.

Right now this offense (at least IMO) is better suited for drafting a playmaker at TE over WR because it is a WCO based power scheme and it's ran by a QB who favors high percentage short-to-intermediate throws over highrisk-high reward throws. Not saying the WR position doesnt need an massive upgrade since it clearly does, but a 1st round TE will make a greater impact than a 1st round WR. What good is a 6'3 burner of a WR if only 1 or 2 downfield shots get called a game. Especially if the read isnt timely, cause the WR has already ran out of the QB's range unless its CK's 70 yard arm.

spot on mang.