Coby Fleener - TE Stanford

Originally posted by WRATHman44:
How many MAJOR contributors on offense were rookies? How many members of this year's offense had to adjust to pro playbooks, pro coaching, and the expectation of pro blocking techniques? Receiver is a tough enough position to learn and adjust to in one partial offseason (they only start after the draft), TE is tougher. Not that it would be impossible, but I would trust a guy with 1st round talent and pro skills over a guy with a lot of rough edges.

It's also telling that a veteran like Vernon Davis admitted to struggling with the playbook and didn't really get a hang of it until about 3/4 of the way through the season. If a veteran who has been through a few different playbooks in his time struggles like that, what can you say for a rookie?

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
You keep saying that, and its your opinion, apparently a lot of people disagree with you, so we can agree to disagree.


I don't think that Fleener is a luxury pick at all. Fleener IS the guy most ready to contribute from day 1, period, whether that's WR or TE. You pick a receiver at 30 and a raw TE like Green or even worse....Egnew ......and now you've got two guys that have to develop, will have to learn the offense and will probably take a year or two to get fully going. For a team that is in competition for a Super Bowl....THAT IS a LUXURY that you CAN'T afford to take if you have a guy who's ready to contribute from the get-go.



OR, at least to me, the sensible approach is this. Draft Fleener, run your offense out of the 2 TE set predominantly, end the double-team's on VD, then go pick a WR in rounds 2 or 3 who is basically as talented as a guy you would have picked in the 1st round, develop that guy, let him contribute here and there and develop and progress. Call me crazy, that just seems to make the most sense.

Agreed. The #2 TE in this offense (especially if it's a guy like Fleener) will be targeted more than the #2 receiver.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
You may not be sure, but pretty much everyone else has him as a late 1st rounder, early 2nd rounder. Bottomline he's not getting past Indy's pick in the 2nd round. If he runs like a 4.5, he probably won't make it to the 49ers pick in the 1st even.

I agree I dont think he will make it out of the second round and if he runs a 4.5 i dont think he will last to pick 30.

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
Agreed. The #2 TE in this offense (especially if it's a guy like Fleener) will be targeted more than the #2 receiver.

great point. I totally agree.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by WRATHman44:
How many MAJOR contributors on offense were rookies? How many members of this year's offense had to adjust to pro playbooks, pro coaching, and the expectation of pro blocking techniques? Receiver is a tough enough position to learn and adjust to in one partial offseason (they only start after the draft), TE is tougher. Not that it would be impossible, but I would trust a guy with 1st round talent and pro skills over a guy with a lot of rough edges.

It's also telling that a veteran like Vernon Davis admitted to struggling with the playbook and didn't really get a hang of it until about 3/4 of the way through the season. If a veteran who has been through a few different playbooks in his time struggles like that, what can you say for a rookie?

You mean the rookie tight end coached by Harbaugh at Stanford?

At the end of the day, we need receiving targets. Coby Fleener may not be a wide receiver, but he is the best and safest player at his respective position that will be available at pick 30 and would provide two things we dearly lack: a sure-handed safety blanket for Alex Smith on short/intermediate routes and a tall jump ball target in the redzone). These are two areas where Vernon Davis clearly struggles, making Fleener the perfect compliment (unlike Walker who is a poor man's Vernon Davis).

The drop off between Fleener and a TE that will be available at our 2nd round pick is enormous compared to the dropoff between a late 1st round wr (Alshon Jeffery, Mohammad Sanu, Rueben Randle) and a late 2nd/3rd/4th round wr (Joe Adams, Nick Toon, Juron Criner, Brian Quick, Jarius Wright, Stephen Hill, Devon Wylie, Marvin Jones, Gerrel Robinson). Given that we play the majority of snaps in 2 TE sets, Fleener is not a luxury pick, but a safe and skilled talent. He will be an immediate starter and will see more targets than any young wr in our offense.

Would I ideally want to draft a number one WR over Fleener..... DEFINITELY. Will a number one WR be available at the end of the first (that can reasonably be expected to become number 1 wr)... NO. I would rather take a sure thing of a top 15 TE to form the most fearsome TE duo in the NFL, than take a player that is not much more skilled or safer of a pick than a player we could land at the end of round 2,3 or 4.

Delanie Walker is the most overrated 49er and has been for quite some time. If people think we must replace Michael Crabtree and Josh Morgan, then how can you not argue that Delanie Walker shouldn't be replaced.

Fleener would not only provide the safest and most talented player at their respective position, but would also be able to contribute from day 1. For a team that came one play away from a Super Bowl this is a win-win by being able to invest in both the immediate and longterm future of the franchise.

We have the unusual advantage of having the BPA also be a player we know better than anyone, who has played his entire career in our offense (or a version of it), and plays a role that we desperately need. Harbaugh knows Fleener better than any coach/GM and if he feels that Fleener warrants a first round pick, then this is the most slam dunk pick of the draft.

Originally posted by Shorteous:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by WRATHman44:
How many MAJOR contributors on offense were rookies? How many members of this year's offense had to adjust to pro playbooks, pro coaching, and the expectation of pro blocking techniques? Receiver is a tough enough position to learn and adjust to in one partial offseason (they only start after the draft), TE is tougher. Not that it would be impossible, but I would trust a guy with 1st round talent and pro skills over a guy with a lot of rough edges.

It's also telling that a veteran like Vernon Davis admitted to struggling with the playbook and didn't really get a hang of it until about 3/4 of the way through the season. If a veteran who has been through a few different playbooks in his time struggles like that, what can you say for a rookie?

You mean the rookie tight end coached by Harbaugh at Stanford?

That's the point. Fleener has been in a pro system (which happens to be Harbaugh's system), and he has had pro coaching. His adjustment would be easier than most.

Originally posted by 49oz2superbowl:
At the end of the day, we need receiving targets. Coby Fleener may not be a wide receiver, but he is the best and safest player at his respective position that will be available at pick 30 and would provide two things we dearly lack: a sure-handed safety blanket for Alex Smith on short/intermediate routes and a tall jump ball target in the redzone). These are two areas where Vernon Davis clearly struggles, making Fleener the perfect compliment (unlike Walker who is a poor man's Vernon Davis).

The drop off between Fleener and a TE that will be available at our 2nd round pick is enormous compared to the dropoff between a late 1st round wr (Alshon Jeffery, Mohammad Sanu, Rueben Randle) and a late 2nd/3rd/4th round wr (Joe Adams, Nick Toon, Juron Criner, Brian Quick, Jarius Wright, Stephen Hill, Devon Wylie, Marvin Jones, Gerrel Robinson). Given that we play the majority of snaps in 2 TE sets, Fleener is not a luxury pick, but a safe and skilled talent. He will be an immediate starter and will see more targets than any young wr in our offense.

Would I ideally want to draft a number one WR over Fleener..... DEFINITELY. Will a number one WR be available at the end of the first (that can reasonably be expected to become number 1 wr)... NO. I would rather take a sure thing of a top 15 TE to form the most fearsome TE duo in the NFL, than take a player that is not much more skilled or safer of a pick than a player we could land at the end of round 2,3 or 4.

Delanie Walker is the most overrated 49er and has been for quite some time. If people think we must replace Michael Crabtree and Josh Morgan, then how can you not argue that Delanie Walker shouldn't be replaced.

Fleener would not only provide the safest and most talented player at their respective position, but would also be able to contribute from day 1. For a team that came one play away from a Super Bowl this is a win-win by being able to invest in both the immediate and longterm future of the franchise.

We have the unusual advantage of having the BPA also be a player we know better than anyone, who has played his entire career in our offense (or a version of it), and plays a role that we desperately need. Harbaugh knows Fleener better than any coach/GM and if he feels that Fleener warrants a first round pick, then this is the most slam dunk pick of the draft.

I liked all of your post and agree, but the bolded part, not so sure of.

Still... Fleener and then a 2nd rd wideout like Hill, Streeter, or Criner would be an excellent way to boost the pass game.

Fleener makes too much sense to draft him at 30. I would even trade up to get him if necessary.
He reminds me of a Jimmy Graham type, tall 6'6 target. Two tight end sets are becoming increasingly effective because of the mismatch problems. I have a gut feeling that fleener is a top 5 TE potential. Him and Davis is A HUGE Problem for defenses. With crabtree on one side with a burner WR to stretch the field or quick slants would be deadly. I forsee a lot teams copying the two TE sets or even 3 TE sets because of the success teams have been having. I see it as a new style of football becoming very popular in the future.

You're right, it does make too much sense to not draft him at 30. I'm assuming we won't hear much about him from the FO hoping he falls to us. My concern is another team, ala the giants jumping up to grab him from us.

Originally posted by 9erguy:
You're right, it does make too much sense to not draft him at 30. I'm assuming we won't hear much about him from the FO hoping he falls to us. My concern is another team, ala the giants jumping up to grab him from us.

or the Colts, who I already hate (and will continue to hate forever) for having the dumb luck to get Manning and Luck back-to-back. If they traded up to get Fleener ahead of us. My hate would reach a thermonuclear, face-of-the-f**king-sun HEAT! That said, I think they would make that sort of move. It makes even more sense for them, with Dallas Clark an injury-prone FA and Them wanting to set their new Franchise w/a weapon hat he is comfortable with.

With all the love Fleener is getting and also being the clear cut #1 TE in this draft, really really doubt he falls to the 30th pick.

It wouldn't surprise if he went to the Eagles at #15.

Originally posted by Kolohe:
With all the love Fleener is getting and also being the clear cut #1 TE in this draft, really really doubt he falls to the 30th pick.

It wouldn't surprise if he went to the Eagles at #15.

the eagles will take that lb from bc or kendall wright especially if theyre really thinking of trading jackson before taking a te

Originally posted by 49oz2superbowl:
At the end of the day, we need receiving targets. Coby Fleener may not be a wide receiver, but he is the best and safest player at his respective position that will be available at pick 30 and would provide two things we dearly lack: a sure-handed safety blanket for Alex Smith on short/intermediate routes and a tall jump ball target in the redzone). These are two areas where Vernon Davis clearly struggles, making Fleener the perfect compliment (unlike Walker who is a poor man's Vernon Davis).

The drop off between Fleener and a TE that will be available at our 2nd round pick is enormous compared to the dropoff between a late 1st round wr (Alshon Jeffery, Mohammad Sanu, Rueben Randle) and a late 2nd/3rd/4th round wr (Joe Adams, Nick Toon, Juron Criner, Brian Quick, Jarius Wright, Stephen Hill, Devon Wylie, Marvin Jones, Gerrel Robinson). Given that we play the majority of snaps in 2 TE sets, Fleener is not a luxury pick, but a safe and skilled talent. He will be an immediate starter and will see more targets than any young wr in our offense.

Would I ideally want to draft a number one WR over Fleener..... DEFINITELY. Will a number one WR be available at the end of the first (that can reasonably be expected to become number 1 wr)... NO. I would rather take a sure thing of a top 15 TE to form the most fearsome TE duo in the NFL, than take a player that is not much more skilled or safer of a pick than a player we could land at the end of round 2,3 or 4.

Delanie Walker is the most overrated 49er and has been for quite some time. If people think we must replace Michael Crabtree and Josh Morgan, then how can you not argue that Delanie Walker shouldn't be replaced.

Fleener would not only provide the safest and most talented player at their respective position, but would also be able to contribute from day 1. For a team that came one play away from a Super Bowl this is a win-win by being able to invest in both the immediate and longterm future of the franchise.

We have the unusual advantage of having the BPA also be a player we know better than anyone, who has played his entire career in our offense (or a version of it), and plays a role that we desperately need. Harbaugh knows Fleener better than any coach/GM and if he feels that Fleener warrants a first round pick, then this is the most slam dunk pick of the draft.

I agree.

Originally posted by FredFlintstone:

Originally posted by Kolohe:
With all the love Fleener is getting and also being the clear cut #1 TE in this draft, really really doubt he falls to the 30th pick.

It wouldn't surprise if he went to the Eagles at #15.

the eagles will take that lb from bc or kendall wright especially if theyre really thinking of trading jackson before taking a te

If not the Eagles, then the Bears would be another landing spot at #19, but I just don't see him falling to the 30th pick.