WR - Breshad Perriman UCF

Originally posted by Vito_Corleone:

Originally posted by NYniner85:


sorry had too


I like a trade down scenario, Baalke has talked about having Gore in their future. Just because they haven't resigned him in Feb doesn't mean much. I would disagree we need a lot of help in many positions. Baalke has drafted over 20 players in the last 2 drafts and some of those players need to finally step up.

Since you brought Yoda into this, I had to link to Chris Conley's Star Wars film:
Retribution (2014) - Star Wars Fan Film(by Chris Conley)

HA! he just moved up my draft board for sure

Originally posted by 49ers808:
Why are you guys talking about Devin Smith in Perrimans thread? Doesn't he have his own thread? Anyways I think for a lot of us, like I mentioned in Dorsetts thread, have just been ultimately missing that speed element we lacked from the WR position for too long. That's why all these guys intrigued me anyways, and I ain't gonna lie, after seeing ODB wreck the league last year to the point where Sherman already thinks he's one of the best, I want some of that too! Whether it be Perriman, Devin Smith, Dorsett, Lockette, hell even Conley, I take any of them at this point as long as we don't miss out on
a deep and talented class this year like we did last. But I do really like Ellington

People are comparing the two based on speed and value...do you grab Perriman in the 1st or Smith in the 2nd?

As far as Dorsett and speed, Baalke did just grab one of the best deep-ball WRs in the league. OBJ while is fast is also very good at route-running, actually really good lol. I would prefer Lockette over Dorsett based on that. He would kill the LOB IMO.

What puts a on my face is the fact that we actually have a good WR coach that helped OBJ and Landry at LSU.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
People are comparing the two based on speed and value...do you grab Perriman in the 1st or Smith in the 2nd?

As far as Dorsett and speed, Baalke did just grab one of the best deep-ball WRs in the league. OBJ while is fast is also very good at route-running, actually really good lol. I would prefer Lockette over Dorsett based on that. He would kill the LOB IMO.

What puts a on my face is the fact that we actually have a good WR coach that helped OBJ and Landry at LSU.

I'm excited for that considering I was a BIG Landry fan while he was in LSU

Originally posted by NYniner85:

People are comparing the two based on speed and value...do you grab Perriman in the 1st or Smith in the 2nd?

As far as Dorsett and speed, Baalke did just grab one of the best deep-ball WRs in the league. OBJ while is fast is also very good at route-running, actually really good lol. I would prefer Lockette over Dorsett based on that. He would kill the LOB IMO.

What puts a on my face is the fact that we actually have a good WR coach that helped OBJ and Landry at LSU.

Excellent point with the WR coach!

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Not sure why you're STILL trying to continue this?? No one has a crush on Parker and YOUR the one still talking about him...if you don't think stats offer some indication on how a players play, then I don't know what to tell you and I doubt we will agree on much. Like I've said over and over I also value how a player plays against top competition and Parker and Smith both fared well.

I will also take the word of people, who's job are scouting and evaluating over yours, I'm sorry but that's how I see it.....and really there isn't anything to argue about because Parker won't even make it to us at 15...I'm really tired of repeating myself with you and contuning to show you different facts while you keep ignoring them and repeating the same "faults" that he might have.

I'm not saying you or anyone has a crush on Parker... but you gotta wonder if certain people have an agenda when flaws that show up on film and are easily observed keep getting denied by those that defend him. The way folks defend Parker's game, it's as if he's a perfect prospect. If that were the case, he'd be considered a blue chip talent and gone in the first 5 picks.

These discussions get so twisted because a lot of people insist on looking at their views in black and white, the truth is there is more gray to all these players and always points on both sides.

I've personally conceded that there are A LOT of desireable qualities and traits in Parker which COULD lead to him being a good pro- he's got a great catching radius, excellent hands, good straight line speed, is competitive and has good playmaking instincts with the ball in his hands.

I also see him running some real lazy routes at times, think his agility/foot precision is very average, and don't see him getting low and exploding out of breaks. These are flaws, IMO, that at the pro level could be very problematic and negate the things he does well.

As far as "...I'll take a pro's opinion over yours", the problem with that is that there are A LOT of "pro" evaluators, and not all of them see eye to eye on these players. So literally anyone could use that argument.

If an NFL GM/scout disagrees that a highly touted prospect is what he's hyped up to be, they are not gonna come out and publicly say so. First off, it's not professional to do so, second, it's an ADVANTAGE for teams to make other teams think they are interested in players they have no intention of drafting. Increases the chance of the player they really want falling to them, and makes them less predictable.

Really, comes down to backing an opinion up with something concrete and then using your own judgement to see which flaws/good qualities translate best to the pro level and which ones are the most problematic.

Originally posted by LowerTheBoom:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Not sure why you're STILL trying to continue this?? No one has a crush on Parker and YOUR the one still talking about him...if you don't think stats offer some indication on how a players play, then I don't know what to tell you and I doubt we will agree on much. Like I've said over and over I also value how a player plays against top competition and Parker and Smith both fared well.

I will also take the word of people, who's job are scouting and evaluating over yours, I'm sorry but that's how I see it.....and really there isn't anything to argue about because Parker won't even make it to us at 15...I'm really tired of repeating myself with you and contuning to show you different facts while you keep ignoring them and repeating the same "faults" that he might have.

I'm not saying you or anyone has a crush on Parker... but you gotta wonder if certain people have an agenda when flaws that show up on film and are easily observed keep getting denied by those that defend him. The way folks defend Parker's game, it's as if he's a perfect prospect. If that were the case, he'd be considered a blue chip talent and gone in the first 5 picks.

These discussions get so twisted because a lot of people insist on looking at their views in black and white, the truth is there is more gray to all these players and always points on both sides.

I've personally conceded that there are A LOT of desireable qualities and traits in Parker which COULD lead to him being a good pro- he's got a great catching radius, excellent hands, good straight line speed, is competitive and has good playmaking instincts with the ball in his hands.

I also see him running some real lazy routes at times, think his agility/foot precision is very average, and don't see him getting low and exploding out of breaks. These are flaws, IMO, that at the pro level could be very problematic and negate the things he does well.

As far as "...I'll take a pro's opinion over yours", the problem with that is that there are A LOT of "pro" evaluators, and not all of them see eye to eye on these players. So literally anyone could use that argument.

If an NFL GM/scout disagrees that a highly touted prospect is what he's hyped up to be, they are not gonna come out and publicly say so. First off, it's not professional to do so, second, it's an ADVANTAGE for teams to make other teams think they are interested in players they have no intention of drafting. Increases the chance of the player they really want falling to them, and makes them less predictable.

Really, comes down to backing an opinion up with something concrete and then using your own judgement to see which flaws/good qualities translate best to the pro level and which ones are the most problematic.

That was all directed towards Jrouter4949 not you.....

Originally posted by buck:
Devin Smith was targeted a grand total of 48 times in 2014. He had 33 receptions.

Ezekiel Elliott had 28 receptions. Dontre Wilson had 21 receptions. Both Elliot and Wilson are running backs.

Smith's low number of receptions could be as much a reflection on the offensive scheme or play calling as it is a reflection on his skill as a wide receiver.

Devin Smith wasn't a full time player for Ohio St.... I disagree with the low number of targets because other WR's have been a lot more productive in Urban Meyer's offense, even if it is simplified.

I also do no think that Smith would only primarily be targeted on deep balls if he was doing a good job of getting open underneath.

I think the excuse works if you're talking about a team that runs like a triple option offense, like Georgia Tech. They barely throw the ball period, so even guys like D. Thomas and Calvin Johnson aren't gonna catch tons of balls. Lot of running and QB running in Urban Meyer's offenses, but frequency of passes is much greater.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
That was all directed towards Jrouter4949 not you.....

Oh, I know man, I just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in on the topic.

It's not like I think Devante Parker has bust written all over him, woulldn't be pissed if we drafted him... he's just not near the top of the list of players I personally see as being elite pro's. I think he could be solid, but I'm personally looking for more than that out of a 1st round pick.

If that makes sense.

Originally posted by buck:
Over the past two years, Perriman had a catch rate of 56.69%.

In 2013, his catch rate was 61.9%, in 2014, his catch rate was 53.9%. That is a decline of 8.71%.

Perriman's reported drop rate in 2014 was 13.79%, which appears to be rather high.

I lack the football intelligence to know if those colligate numbers are particularly significant, but I find them somewhat disconcerting.

To my uneducated mind, it looks like a low success rate and a high failure rate.

But, then I am not an expert.

It's about sample size, brother.

When you only have 60 balls thrown your way, 7 drops is gonna look A LOT worse than if you have 120 balls thrown your way.

That's why you always refer back to the game tape to see what the root of the problem is. There are different reasons why players drop the ball. Sometimes it's just bad hand eye coordination and they're clumsy. Sometimes it's nerves- catching the ball can be very psychological-- that's why WR's with a "Go get it" mentality that attack the ball generally have fewer drops, while players that are "body catchers" and brace for the ball to arrive tend to have more drops. Maybe they just haven't spent enough time training their eyes and hands to be on the same page.


When you look at Breshad Perriman's game tape, he makes some RIDICULOUS catches that a lot of WR's aren't even physically capable of. He catches with his hands, and has elite body control. That tells me his drops aren't because of any sort of physical/coordination related short-coming.

The game film shoes a guy with great catching ability who needs to focus on consistency and concentration, not a goofball with bad hands. You can coach up and fine tune consistency/concentration, you can't coach somebody up to not be clumsy.

Talk about climbing up draft boards, Kiper has this guy as his 9th overall on his big board.

Originally posted by mayo49:
Talk about climbing up draft boards, Kiper has this guy as his 9th overall on his big board.

Kiper is an idiot who takes bribes from agents. He's a hack who was in the right place at the right time.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Buck didn't you read LowerTheBoom and Jrouter4949's posts? They don't put much stock in STATS unless it proves their point

thanks for some good FACTS

Clearly other people either didn't read or absorb what I said.

You act like I just simply said that I don't agree with that stat for the simple fact that it's a stat and nothing else.

I explained in detail WHY and HOW that stat can be incredibly misleading and cited several variables in doing so. I'm not the one being adamant that a particular stat or two is the End All, Be All metric in who the better player is.

I've referred to game film over and over to back up what I'm saying. Stats can be debated, the physical skills and ability that show up during a game are not "variable".

It comes down to the fact Devin Smith is riding some stupid hype that comes with winning a national championship on a powerhouse, premier football program, as well people running away with a COMPLETELY ERRONEOUS comparison to DeSean Jackons -- which starts and ends with both players being light skinned black guys and running fast...

...and the fact that Perriman flew under the radar pretty much the whole college season, didn't have a "sexy name", or the national exposure of a player playing in a huge program and in a national championship game.

People don't like to admit that they didn't spot such obvious talent earlier, that's why there are people in this thread in complete denial about even the most obvious things like Perriman's deep speed.

Because they are such great armchair GM's, that there is NO WAY talent could have slipped their eye lol

Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Kiper is an idiot who takes bribes from agents. He's a hack who was in the right place at the right time.

I completely agree about Kiper and honestly try my best to tune him out as much as possible.

At the same time, I don't think (and I'm not saying you are implying this) that just because Kiper likes a player and isn't a real scout means that the player isn't any good.

Speaking for myself, my opinion on Perriman has nothing to do with Kiper backing him. In fact, I wish Kiper DIDN'T because he's such a joke that it's an almost an indictment on hte player if he likes them lol.

Hey Wrathman44.... were/are you also on the 49ers.com mb?

Originally posted by NYniner85:
People are comparing the two based on speed and value...do you grab Perriman in the 1st or Smith in the 2nd?

As far as Dorsett and speed, Baalke did just grab one of the best deep-ball WRs in the league. OBJ while is fast is also very good at route-running, actually really good lol. I would prefer Lockette over Dorsett based on that. He would kill the LOB IMO.

What puts a on my face is the fact that we actually have a good WR coach that helped OBJ and Landry at LSU.

I'll start off by saying to me, "value" means nothing. You don't get success as a team by bringing home a good report card the day after the draft, you gain success by those players becoming good professionals.

That being said, Devin Smith in the 2nd round would be an absolute horrible investment. Maybe in the 4th round getting him is "good value", but if you're drafting a player in the 2nd, you should have reasonable expectations for that player to be a starter, if not a potential Pro-Bowl talent. If you draft a player that was projected to go in the 3rd round in the 1st, and that player goes on to be an All-Pro, the people who criticized that GM will later be laughed at, not the GM. Nobody's gonna look back at a player whose highly successful and said "Ya, his team still messed up drafting him that high".

Absolutely nothing about Smith's production or skill-set that spells anything past a 1-trick pony deep threat in the NFL.

Perriman possesses a handful of rare qualities that spell potential #1 WR. The only one that Smith has, his deep speed, isn't even as good as Perriman's.

Originally posted by LowerTheBoom:
I completely agree about Kiper and honestly try my best to tune him out as much as possible.

At the same time, I don't think (and I'm not saying you are implying this) that just because Kiper likes a player and isn't a real scout means that the player isn't any good.

Speaking for myself, my opinion on Perriman has nothing to do with Kiper backing him. In fact, I wish Kiper DIDN'T because he's such a joke that it's an almost an indictment on hte player if he likes them lol.

Hey Wrathman44.... were/are you also on the 49ers.com mb?

nope. I was on the SacBee one YEARS ago, but that's it.