Nick Bosa, EDGE, Ohio St(The Politics Free Thread)

If it's not a torn acl, than i don't think much will bring his stock down to a spot where we will realistically draft.

Originally posted by Giedi:
Geeze if you do and if you dont. So you are telling me either way (trade for a Khalil Mack level edge rusher or move up the draft to pick Bosa) either way we die. What the hell!

Would not have 'died' if we got Mack. Quite the opposite.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Giedi:
Geeze if you do and if you dont. So you are telling me either way (trade for a Khalil Mack level edge rusher or move up the draft to pick Bosa) either way we die. What the hell!

Would not have 'died' if we got Mack. Quite the opposite.

Personally I agree with you. The main argument is a cap and draft argument. Kalil would cost too much draft capital and too much cap space. Yes and Yes. But I think the 49ers would have been OK with the cap space due to Paarag's capanomics and Kyles ability to get undrafted players to play in his offense. It would have been nice to get Kalil, but it is what it is. Next years edge rusher class, so says NY85, Hero, MadDog and the rest of the resident experts say, is very deep. If so, and we do get an edge rusher, we might get *two* of them or we get a top edge rusher *and* a corner. That saves us cap space because of their rookie contracts and we would still have a first round in 2020. Sucks to have no real edge rusher this year, but it is what it is.

Originally posted by Giedi:
Personally I agree with you. The main argument is a cap and draft argument. Kalil would cost too much draft capital and too much cap space. Yes and Yes. But I think the 49ers would have been OK with the cap space due to Paarag's capanomics and Kyles ability to get undrafted players to play in his offense. It would have been nice to get Kalil, but it is what it is. Next years edge rusher class, so says NY85, Hero, MadDog and the rest of the resident experts say, is very deep. If so, and we do get an edge rusher, we might get *two* of them or we get a top edge rusher *and* a corner. That saves us cap space because of their rookie contracts and we would still have a first round in 2020. Sucks to have no real edge rusher this year, but it is what it is.

I understand. Both very weak arguments IMHO but hey, to the draft we go.

I rely very much on the experts in here to point me to the right players and then I do my own due diligence on them with "philm" study to help determine, scheme fit, skill sets that translate best to the NFL, etc.

It's still way too early but it does sound like this is a deeper draft for ER but outside of Bosa, is there really that blue chip difference maker? I'm done with serviceable and average players at key positions. It's time to upgrade.

I hope this guy yells at a nurse at the combine. Drop your draft stock.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000964360/article/buckeyes-de-nick-bosa-out-indefinitely-after-surgery

Originally posted by FL9er:

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000964360/article/buckeyes-de-nick-bosa-out-indefinitely-after-surgery

This sucks for Baby Bosa, but please let every other medical staff overreact and have us draft him.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by Heroism:

Originally posted by Giedi:
Injuries pulled down Harold Landry's draft stock. Might it happen to Bosa and maybe we have a shot at it picking around say 20th pick? Hero's enthusiasm has got me excited about maybe having a shot at this guy.

Bosa is bigger, longer, and stronger with a ten-year NFL vet's repertoire of pass rush moves. There's zero chance of him having a Landry-esque fall unless he tears his ACL or something.

This. I'm wondering if we are aggressive enough to make the move. I'd say no, but it would make for an interesting draft. If not for Bosa, just move high enough and not stand pat.

If Bosa is the number 1 pick in the draft, and we're drafting at 20th pick. Would either of you spend the draft capital to get Bosa, and if yes, how much draft capital do you think it will take to get him?

I'm thinking we are drafting anywhere from 15 to 20. My answer is no. For one, the price would be too high to make that move. You likely could get another team (particularly one lacking in cap space) to trade a rusher for less picks. The good news is, there are many top tier edge rushers available in this draft class. I am in favor of moving up into the top-10 which is not as expensive. Get us one of the top 3 rushers to play on the D-line, then draft another later two more later. Two for the D-line and one that can play linebacker. Either that or sign quality, starting caliber FA if one is available, and unlike most years, there should be some available, then draft another rusher (we still can move up if necessary- why be passive about this?) on the D-line and another at linebacker,

I am not really seeing how Jacksonville holds onto Fowler, although they could work some salary cap magic to keep him. But he's due for a big pay day. Who are they willing to cut loose to make room for Fowler? I can think of a few candidates. But I'm hoping Fowler hits the open market and we can make a move for him. He also won't be nearly as expensive as Khalil Mack. Not the same caliber player, but we don't need him to be. If Lynch can pull this off, our pass rush will be sick. I also expect that Armstead, Marsh, and possibly Mitchell to be off the roster.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Giedi:
Personally I agree with you. The main argument is a cap and draft argument. Kalil would cost too much draft capital and too much cap space. Yes and Yes. But I think the 49ers would have been OK with the cap space due to Paarag's capanomics and Kyles ability to get undrafted players to play in his offense. It would have been nice to get Kalil, but it is what it is. Next years edge rusher class, so says NY85, Hero, MadDog and the rest of the resident experts say, is very deep. If so, and we do get an edge rusher, we might get *two* of them or we get a top edge rusher *and* a corner. That saves us cap space because of their rookie contracts and we would still have a first round in 2020. Sucks to have no real edge rusher this year, but it is what it is.

I understand. Both very weak arguments IMHO but hey, to the draft we go.

I rely very much on the experts in here to point me to the right players and then I do my own due diligence on them with "philm" study to help determine, scheme fit, skill sets that translate best to the NFL, etc.

It's still way too early but it does sound like this is a deeper draft for ER but outside of Bosa, is there really that blue chip difference maker? I'm done with serviceable and average players at key positions. It's time to upgrade.

Assuming we pay Buckner the $$$ in an accelerated depreciation schedule, we'll have Buck for another 3+ years. Add to Buck a good Edge Rusher in the draft - Low first round, high second round, and you have the makings of a good to great D Line pass rush. Harold Landry was a 2nd round pick. And he went in the 2nd in a very weak edge rusher class. I'd be looking for a guy with explosion, speed, and then size and strength. In that order. The LEO position as Hero pointed out required *speed* as a prerequisite. Fred Dean was a very undersized Elephant/Leo, so was Haley. They were subbed in on pass downs, with the exception of Haley who grew bigger as time went on and was there in on base downs too. So I'd be looking for a DE/OLB that could grow to become a base player too. In 1986 Walsh drafted two DE's basically - Larry Roberts and Charles Haley, and considering it's almost the equivalent of a QB, Kyle as OC was able to get RG3 and Kirk Cousins. I'd go the same way. And also try to get the best undrafted free agent pass rushers available to.

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
I'm thinking we are drafting anywhere from 15 to 20. My answer is no. For one, the price would be too high to make that move. You likely could get another team (particularly one lacking in cap space) to trade a rusher for less picks. The good news is, there are many top tier edge rushers available in this draft class. I am in favor of moving up into the top-10 which is not as expensive. Get us one of the top 3 rushers to play on the D-line, then draft another later two more later. Two for the D-line and one that can play linebacker. Either that or sign quality, starting caliber FA if one is available, and unlike most years, there should be some available, then draft another rusher (we still can move up if necessary- why be passive about this?) on the D-line and another at linebacker,

I am not really seeing how Jacksonville holds onto Fowler, although they could work some salary cap magic to keep him. But he's due for a big pay day. Who are they willing to cut loose to make room for Fowler? I can think of a few candidates. But I'm hoping Fowler hits the open market and we can make a move for him. He also won't be nearly as expensive as Khalil Mack. Not the same caliber player, but we don't need him to be. If Lynch can pull this off, our pass rush will be sick. I also expect that Armstead, Marsh, and possibly Mitchell to be off the roster.

Yes I agree, those are good draft moves and those three players would be the players I'd like to replace with top quality D Linemen/Edge Rushers.

I think the rebuild of the pass rush starts with free agency, get the best free agent pass rusher you can get, and sign them to as long a long term contract you can get. I think one reason for this is good pass rushers are rarely ever going to hit free agency and if you land one, on his second contract - you want to sign him for as long as possible (using the Paraag technique of front ending a lot of the contract). If you can get a 5 year contract from a free agent pass rusher with 50% to 75% front loaded the first year - that's what I'd sign him up for.

Draft, then do what you just stated above. Just overload that position with Draft quantity *and* quality. Just go defense in 2019, at least in the first four rounds. We all know Kyle can get undrafted players on offense that can be plugged into any gaps. A potential gap is McKinnon. Assuming he doesn't recover 100% - John Should just ask Kyle to get an undrafted free agent to replace/back him up. I think one guy that can replace McKinnon is on the roster already. Raheem has some serious speed, and if he just dedicates himself to improving those hands (catching 500 balls on the jugs machine every day), he can be a McKinnon 2.0. Same with the left tackle and guard, Kyle can get good undrafted backups or low round draft picks that can be developed at those positions. But Guard might be one where you spend one of your top four draft picks on.

If they don't draft an edge rusher in the 2019 draft - I will seriously be

Originally posted by Giedi:
Yes I agree, those are good draft moves and those three players would be the players I'd like to replace with top quality D Linemen/Edge Rushers.

I think the rebuild of the pass rush starts with free agency, get the best free agent pass rusher you can get, and sign them to as long a long term contract you can get. I think one reason for this is good pass rushers are rarely ever going to hit free agency and if you land one, on his second contract - you want to sign him for as long as possible (using the Paraag technique of front ending a lot of the contract). If you can get a 5 year contract from a free agent pass rusher with 50% to 75% front loaded the first year - that's what I'd sign him up for.

Draft, then do what you just stated above. Just overload that position with Draft quantity *and* quality. Just go defense in 2019, at least in the first four rounds. We all know Kyle can get undrafted players on offense that can be plugged into any gaps. A potential gap is McKinnon. Assuming he doesn't recover 100% - John Should just ask Kyle to get an undrafted free agent to replace/back him up. I think one guy that can replace McKinnon is on the roster already. Raheem has some serious speed, and if he just dedicates himself to improving those hands (catching 500 balls on the jugs machine every day), he can be a McKinnon 2.0. Same with the left tackle and guard, Kyle can get good undrafted backups or low round draft picks that can be developed at those positions. But Guard might be one where you spend one of your top four draft picks on.

If they don't draft an edge rusher in the 2019 draft - I will seriously be

I wouldn't be shocked if they bring someone in like Brandon Graham...philly won't be resigning him.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Giedi:
Yes I agree, those are good draft moves and those three players would be the players I'd like to replace with top quality D Linemen/Edge Rushers.

I think the rebuild of the pass rush starts with free agency, get the best free agent pass rusher you can get, and sign them to as long a long term contract you can get. I think one reason for this is good pass rushers are rarely ever going to hit free agency and if you land one, on his second contract - you want to sign him for as long as possible (using the Paraag technique of front ending a lot of the contract). If you can get a 5 year contract from a free agent pass rusher with 50% to 75% front loaded the first year - that's what I'd sign him up for.

Draft, then do what you just stated above. Just overload that position with Draft quantity *and* quality. Just go defense in 2019, at least in the first four rounds. We all know Kyle can get undrafted players on offense that can be plugged into any gaps. A potential gap is McKinnon. Assuming he doesn't recover 100% - John Should just ask Kyle to get an undrafted free agent to replace/back him up. I think one guy that can replace McKinnon is on the roster already. Raheem has some serious speed, and if he just dedicates himself to improving those hands (catching 500 balls on the jugs machine every day), he can be a McKinnon 2.0. Same with the left tackle and guard, Kyle can get good undrafted backups or low round draft picks that can be developed at those positions. But Guard might be one where you spend one of your top four draft picks on.

If they don't draft an edge rusher in the 2019 draft - I will seriously be

I wouldn't be shocked if they bring someone in like Brandon Graham...philly won't be resigning him.

Far better than last offseason's signing and a decent start IF we can't get Fowler.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Giedi:
Yes I agree, those are good draft moves and those three players would be the players I'd like to replace with top quality D Linemen/Edge Rushers.

I think the rebuild of the pass rush starts with free agency, get the best free agent pass rusher you can get, and sign them to as long a long term contract you can get. I think one reason for this is good pass rushers are rarely ever going to hit free agency and if you land one, on his second contract - you want to sign him for as long as possible (using the Paraag technique of front ending a lot of the contract). If you can get a 5 year contract from a free agent pass rusher with 50% to 75% front loaded the first year - that's what I'd sign him up for.

Draft, then do what you just stated above. Just overload that position with Draft quantity *and* quality. Just go defense in 2019, at least in the first four rounds. We all know Kyle can get undrafted players on offense that can be plugged into any gaps. A potential gap is McKinnon. Assuming he doesn't recover 100% - John Should just ask Kyle to get an undrafted free agent to replace/back him up. I think one guy that can replace McKinnon is on the roster already. Raheem has some serious speed, and if he just dedicates himself to improving those hands (catching 500 balls on the jugs machine every day), he can be a McKinnon 2.0. Same with the left tackle and guard, Kyle can get good undrafted backups or low round draft picks that can be developed at those positions. But Guard might be one where you spend one of your top four draft picks on.

If they don't draft an edge rusher in the 2019 draft - I will seriously be

I wouldn't be shocked if they bring someone in like Brandon Graham...philly won't be resigning him.

Gimme Graham and a 1st or 2nd round rookie and i'd be happy. Still hoping for Lawrence though.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

I wouldn't be shocked if they bring someone in like Brandon Graham...philly won't be resigning him.

He looks like a solid player. If we can get someone like him, *and* use a draft pick on a young edge rusher, then we won't have to use another draft pick on the same position. We can free up that draft capital to get a guard or an arby or a corner.

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Far better than last offseason's signing and a decent start IF we can't get Fowler.

I don't know how serious they are at getting an edge rusher this year. They signed Attaochu, and they got this Daeshon Hall on the practice squad and neither has made the team. Fowler looks like a solid player, but I'm thinking if they were really serious at getting Fowler, they'd have made a move already after the failure to get Kalil.