Quinnen Williams, DT Alabama

Originally posted by eastcoast49ersfan:

I've been on the Bosa train for a while because I think he's a better fit with our roster (we have serviceable DTs in base and sub packages next to Buckner), but I wouldn't be mad with QW at all. As long as we get one of them or a package of picks in a trade down, I'll be happy.

QW has one of the highest ceilings in the draft because he's only been a starter for one year and he's carrying a lot of bad weight. He has a lot of room to get stronger and more athletic while guys like Bosa and Allen are maxed out as athletes. In his first year as a starter, QW was probably the most dominant defensive player in college football.

I don't understand the maxed out as athletes stuff, why?

I also will be fine with Q/Bosa or a proper trade down...I do have a preference.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

I don't understand the maxed out as athletes stuff, why?

I also will be fine with Q/Bosa or a proper trade down...I do have a preference.

People confuse maxed out frame with maxed out athlete. Not sure if we want Bosa ballooning up to 280 pounds anyways.

Originally posted by tjd808185:

People confuse maxed out frame with maxed out athlete. Not sure if we want Bosa ballooning up to 280 pounds anyways.

Its not just about frame. Bosa and Allen have had years to grow into their bodies. Its unlikely that they suddenly get noticeably more explosive when you consider theie conditioning.


Williams went on a kamikaze bulk to add 40 pounds in a single year. He can still greatly improve his overall conditioning leading to overall athletic improvement. You could see him add another 10 to 15 pounds of muscle over a few years and settle in around 300 to 305 pounds at a much lower bodyfat.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Its not just about frame. Bosa and Allen have had years to grow into their bodies. Its unlikely that they suddenly get noticeably more explosive when you consider theie conditioning.


Williams went on a kamikaze bulk to add 40 pounds in a single year. He can still greatly improve his overall conditioning leading to overall athletic improvement. You could see him add another 10 to 15 pounds of muscle over a few years and settle in around 300 to 305 pounds at a much lower bodyfat.

So that's like saying aaron Donald was maxed out when he came out of Pittsburgh

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by tjd808185:
People confuse maxed out frame with maxed out athlete. Not sure if we want Bosa ballooning up to 280 pounds anyways.

Its not just about frame. Bosa and Allen have had years to grow into their bodies. Its unlikely that they suddenly get noticeably more explosive when you consider theie conditioning.

Williams went on a kamikaze bulk to add 40 pounds in a single year. He can still greatly improve his overall conditioning leading to overall athletic improvement. You could see him add another 10 to 15 pounds of muscle over a few years and settle in around 300 to 305 pounds at a much lower bodyfat.

Yeah, he was a DE for years before that so he has plenty of technique to play outside. We could just as easily have him lose some of that weight and put him outside with Thomas inside.

I really like Bosa but think QW will be the better player long-term.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by tjd808185:

People confuse maxed out frame with maxed out athlete. Not sure if we want Bosa ballooning up to 280 pounds anyways.

Its not just about frame. Bosa and Allen have had years to grow into their bodies. Its unlikely that they suddenly get noticeably more explosive when you consider theie conditioning.


Williams went on a kamikaze bulk to add 40 pounds in a single year. He can still greatly improve his overall conditioning leading to overall athletic improvement. You could see him add another 10 to 15 pounds of muscle over a few years and settle in around 300 to 305 pounds at a much lower bodyfat.

This - Williams has a lot of room to reduce his body fat after bulking up to play DT at Alabama. He's carrying a lot of bad weight but is still an elite athlete at 300 pounds. It reminds me a little of James Harden who tested as an elite athlete at the NBA combine despite carrying a lot of body fat.

Originally posted by All22:

Yeah, he was a DE for years before that so he has plenty of technique to play outside. We could just as easily have him lose some of that weight and put him outside with Thomas inside.

I really like Bosa but think QW will be the better player long-term.

He wasn't exactly a good DE, having him lose weight to play off the edge would be an epic fail.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

So that's like saying aaron Donald was maxed out when he came out of Pittsburgh

You think Donald is significantly faster/quicker now than when he came out of the draft? I don't. I think he's gotten stronger and so will Allen and Bosa but all those guys were pretty much already at peak conditioning when coming out for the draft.


Williams on the other hand has quite a bit of room for improvement. Its impossible to add as much weight as he did in a year and not add a bunch of sloppy weight in the process. As he cuts down on his bodyfat and improves his overall body composition, it stands to reason that you'll see greater overall improvement in physical ability compared to guys who are pretty much already at their physical peak.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Its not just about frame. Bosa and Allen have had years to grow into their bodies. Its unlikely that they suddenly get noticeably more explosive when you consider theie conditioning.


Williams went on a kamikaze bulk to add 40 pounds in a single year. He can still greatly improve his overall conditioning leading to overall athletic improvement. You could see him add another 10 to 15 pounds of muscle over a few years and settle in around 300 to 305 pounds at a much lower bodyfat.

So that's like saying aaron Donald was maxed out when he came out of Pittsburgh

As an athlete, yes. Donald isn't faster than a 4.68 now. Teams just way underestimated his floor and thought his size would be a bigger hindrance than it was in the NFL, but Donald was absolutely dominant in college. He's also plenty strong at 6'1 285 because he's carrying no bad weight (6'4 285 would be another story, but Donald is short and stout and is able to get leverage with his low center of gravity). NFL scouts just missed on Donald because they thought his size would be a bigger hindrance than it has been, but Donald was already freaky as an athlete coming out of college.

Someone like Brian Burns who put on a lot of weight for the NFL combine and is a year younger than Allen has a lot more room to grow as an athlete (in addition to having room to put on more weight and max out his frame).

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Its not just about frame. Bosa and Allen have had years to grow into their bodies. Its unlikely that they suddenly get noticeably more explosive when you consider theie conditioning.

Williams went on a kamikaze bulk to add 40 pounds in a single year. He can still greatly improve his overall conditioning leading to overall athletic improvement. You could see him add another 10 to 15 pounds of muscle over a few years and settle in around 300 to 305 pounds at a much lower bodyfat.

I don't know that replacing fat with muscle will make him better. The fat, you see, makes him extra squishy. That allows him to seep in between the gaps of the offensive line. Even some of him could ooze in between the opponents limbs, even perhaps grazing against their khram.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Its not just about frame. Bosa and Allen have had years to grow into their bodies. Its unlikely that they suddenly get noticeably more explosive when you consider theie conditioning.


Williams went on a kamikaze bulk to add 40 pounds in a single year. He can still greatly improve his overall conditioning leading to overall athletic improvement. You could see him add another 10 to 15 pounds of muscle over a few years and settle in around 300 to 305 pounds at a much lower bodyfat.

https://247sports.com/college/alabama/Article/Alabama-Football-DL-Quinnen-Williams-adds-40-pounds-since-enrolling-feels-great-at-305-pounds-120875095/

Sounds more like over a course of 3 seasons which is more natural although you are right that he can improve his physique.

Originally posted by eastcoast49ersfan:

As an athlete, yes. Donald isn't faster than a 4.68 now. Teams just way underestimated his floor and thought his size would be a bigger hindrance than it was in the NFL, but Donald was absolutely dominant in college. He's also plenty strong at 6'1 285 because he's carrying no bad weight (6'4 285 would be another story, but Donald is short and stout and is able to get leverage with his low center of gravity). NFL scouts just missed on Donald because they thought his size would be a bigger hindrance than it has been, but Donald was already freaky as an athlete coming out of college.

Someone like Brian Burns who put on a lot of weight for the NFL combine and is a year younger than Allen has a lot more room to grow as an athlete (in addition to having room to put on more weight and max out his frame).

Pretty much and if you go to Donald's scouting report you'll see maxed out frame on the weakness chart. What does that mean though when you run a 4.68 and bench press 35 times? Bosa isn't that kind of an athlete but He's already plenty good to dominate.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

You think Donald is significantly faster/quicker now than when he came out of the draft? I don't. I think he's gotten stronger and so will Allen and Bosa but all those guys were pretty much already at peak conditioning when coming out for the draft.


Williams on the other hand has quite a bit of room for improvement. Its impossible to add as much weight as he did in a year and not add a bunch of sloppy weight in the process. As he cuts down on his bodyfat and improves his overall body composition, it stands to reason that you'll see greater overall improvement in physical ability compared to guys who are pretty much already at their physical peak.

You think Williams will get faster quicker as he getting bigger? I don't

Originally posted by NYniner85:

You think Williams will get faster quicker as he getting bigger? I don't

You lose 10-15 pounds of fat and gain 10-15 pounds of muscle, your body composition has drastically improved but your weight hasn't changed.

So he was a backup DE at 280, petitioned to play inside, got fatter to 305 and now in the NFL, will trim down again and lose fat and add more muscle.

This whole 20+/- oreo cookie fat weight thing is a joke these days with Donald, Thomas, and now QW in a passing league.

The reality is the 20 extra pounds probably did nothing for QW inside. Like Thomas, if you have the skill set to play inside, you have the skill set.