Trey Lance QB NDSU

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
PFF Pros and Cons

4. TREY LANCE, NORTH DAKOTA STATE Biggest pro: Physical tools Lance boasts a cannon for an arm in addition to an ability to carve defenses up on the ground — the modern-day NFL's dream traits at the quarterback position. He can sling it to all levels of the field with ease and is a monster in the designed run game. We saw it in his showcase game this past fall as well as throughout his 2019 campaign.

Lance found the endzone for 10-plus yard touchdown runs on 10 occasions in his time starting at NDSU, which is double that of any quarterback on this list despite him playing just one game in 2020. Lance also averaged an impressive 13.4 yards per designed run. Obviously, the level of competition has a lot to do with that, but it goes to show what he can accomplish on the ground with his athleticism.

Biggest con: Accuracy Some quarterbacks on this list have only minor or moderate weaknesses, but this is a massive concern for Lance. It isn't like Trevor Lawrence, who has flashed bouts of inaccuracy every once in a while; Lance has consistently been inaccurate.

Over the past two seasons, he ranks dead last in percentage of accurate throws beyond the line of scrimmage (44.1%) among the quarterbacks on this list. Not only is that the lowest mark, but it's the worst by a country mile — 7.5 percentage points. Comparing that to all first-round quarterbacks since 2017, it'd still rank last by a comfortable margin. And Lance did this by throwing to a tight or closing window at the lowest rate among that group.

Accuracy is king, and Lance is going to need to have an anomalous turnaround, akin to that of Josh Allen this past season, to overcome this flaw.

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2021-nfl-draft-biggest-pro-con-top-qb-prospects

Good god can we stop posting this stupid f**king stat. It's like the 100th time I've seen it in this thread.

Lance is just as accurate as Fields if you aren't pulling the one clickbait stat PFF could find deep up it's ass because someone wanted jokers like you to copy and paste it all over the internet.

By advanced passing metrics there is absolutely nothing concerning about Lance's accuracy. I'm not saying it's a strength, but it's higher than Fields in some areas and plenty high for him to be a top draft pick. You can't compare his throws which averaged 10+ yards down the field to McCorkle who threw shorter passes on a consistent basis. In fact, Andy Reid threw all the short passes out the window when evaluating Mahomes and only looked at throws that require an NFL caliber arm. When you do that, it becomes clear that Fields or Lance is the pick and Jones is a future backup.

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

Originally posted by JoseCortez:

Originally posted by Waterbear:

Originally posted by JoseCortez:
He's just so raw and inaccurate. Needs a ton of work. Seems like a good guy, good leader smart and mature. Just a huge gamble.

He's actually not inaccurate at all and he's only raw in the sense that he hasn't played that many games (same as Mac Jones) and the competition he played wasn't nearly as good as the other prospects. 28 touchdowns to 0 interceptions in 2019 which is a college record.

I don't know why people think he needs a ton of work but Justin Fields or Mac Jones doesn't. Lance has played in a pro style system, he can look off safeties, he knows when to check it down, his footwork during play action and rolling out is fantastic, he can go through multiple reads, he's basically displayed the most ability to play within Kyle's system of any QB in the draft due to his school's scheme.

I'm not saying there is no risk and that he's better than Fields overall but just labeling him "raw" and "inaccurate" is just lazy scouting at this point.

Just because he ran a pro offense doesn't mean he has perfected the qb position. His feet are are all over the place his throwing motion is horrendous, he doesn't have much touch to his passes. There's a reason why he looks spectacular on one post, then there's the ball in the dirt on the next play. You just can't use the third pick on a guy just based on his physical attributes

Sure you can, especially when he's actually got top 5 talent. After the trade it's harder to justify, but that's not his fault.

Once you've seen something you know you can work with, you can talk yourself into anything.

Back the kid, back the coaches.

If the kid will work hard enough, and your coaches are good enough, why wouldn't he reach his potential?

What I struggle with is how you take Lance over Fields. If his arm is bigger in any way it's minor and his touch is way worse than Justin's. His accuracy isn't as good as Justin's.

Are his legs any better than Fields'? I dunno about that.

Basically Fields and Lance ceiling is very similar but the floors are quite a good distance apart.

Lance ran a pro style offense more and is a year younger. Is that enough to make him a better prospect over a more accurate and proven player like Fields? Certainly not in my book but I'm not important.

I agree and it's why I'd take Fields as well, however it's not just about arm strength and mobility with Lance.

Some of his under center footwork is light years ahead of anyone in the class, and he has much more developing to do than the others, while it's a leap of faith it's not difficult to see how he could become a top QB in the league.

Lance running install meetings at 19 speaks volumes as well. He's got it between the ears and has the moxie to run a room, it all matters.

Originally posted by Since07:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by Since07:
I'm starting to like Lance over Fields. I'd still take Fields but Lance can drop some beautiful dimes deep and has a lot of room to grow. I sense Fields has nearly reach his potential as a passer already

Based on what?

He calculates his accuracy with good anticipation but doesn't have that natural fast trigger accuracy I see in Zach Wilson and a little in Mac Jones.

Fields has possibly the worst anticipation of all 5 QBs expected to go in the 1st.

Originally posted by GangstaGangsta:

Originally posted by Since07:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by Since07:
I'm starting to like Lance over Fields. I'd still take Fields but Lance can drop some beautiful dimes deep and has a lot of room to grow. I sense Fields has nearly reach his potential as a passer already

Based on what?

He calculates his accuracy with good anticipation but doesn't have that natural fast trigger accuracy I see in Zach Wilson and a little in Mac Jones.

Fields has possibly the worst anticipation of all 5 QBs expected to go in the 1st.

When your offense is heavy in WR option routes throwing with anticipation is asking for trouble. Especially during a season with a ton of cancelled practices.

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

Originally posted by JoseCortez:

Originally posted by Waterbear:

Originally posted by JoseCortez:
He's just so raw and inaccurate. Needs a ton of work. Seems like a good guy, good leader smart and mature. Just a huge gamble.

He's actually not inaccurate at all and he's only raw in the sense that he hasn't played that many games (same as Mac Jones) and the competition he played wasn't nearly as good as the other prospects. 28 touchdowns to 0 interceptions in 2019 which is a college record.

I don't know why people think he needs a ton of work but Justin Fields or Mac Jones doesn't. Lance has played in a pro style system, he can look off safeties, he knows when to check it down, his footwork during play action and rolling out is fantastic, he can go through multiple reads, he's basically displayed the most ability to play within Kyle's system of any QB in the draft due to his school's scheme.

I'm not saying there is no risk and that he's better than Fields overall but just labeling him "raw" and "inaccurate" is just lazy scouting at this point.

Just because he ran a pro offense doesn't mean he has perfected the qb position. His feet are are all over the place his throwing motion is horrendous, he doesn't have much touch to his passes. There's a reason why he looks spectacular on one post, then there's the ball in the dirt on the next play. You just can't use the third pick on a guy just based on his physical attributes

Sure you can, especially when he's actually got top 5 talent. After the trade it's harder to justify, but that's not his fault.

Once you've seen something you know you can work with, you can talk yourself into anything.

Back the kid, back the coaches.

If the kid will work hard enough, and your coaches are good enough, why wouldn't he reach his potential?

What I struggle with is how you take Lance over Fields. If his arm is bigger in any way it's minor and his touch is way worse than Justin's. His accuracy isn't as good as Justin's.

Are his legs any better than Fields'? I dunno about that.

Basically Fields and Lance ceiling is very similar but the floors are quite a good distance apart.

Lance ran a pro style offense more and is a year younger. Is that enough to make him a better prospect over a more accurate and proven player like Fields? Certainly not in my book but I'm not important.

I agree and it's why I'd take Fields as well, however it's not just about arm strength and mobility with Lance.

Some of his under center footwork is light years ahead of anyone in the class, and he has much more developing to do than the others, while it's a leap of faith it's not difficult to see how he could become a top QB in the league.

Lance running install meetings at 19 speaks volumes as well. He's got it between the ears and has the moxie to run a room, it all matters.

This... I completely get how he could end up being the pick...his baseline elite traits, mechanics (now), what he has been taught/scheme at his age is very intriguing. He doesn't have a ton of bad habits that you have to coach out of him because he's just a pup.

Fields is my QB2 though, would be completely happy with either guy.

Originally posted by IceMan1763:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
PFF Pros and Cons

4. TREY LANCE, NORTH DAKOTA STATE Biggest pro: Physical tools Lance boasts a cannon for an arm in addition to an ability to carve defenses up on the ground — the modern-day NFL's dream traits at the quarterback position. He can sling it to all levels of the field with ease and is a monster in the designed run game. We saw it in his showcase game this past fall as well as throughout his 2019 campaign.

Lance found the endzone for 10-plus yard touchdown runs on 10 occasions in his time starting at NDSU, which is double that of any quarterback on this list despite him playing just one game in 2020. Lance also averaged an impressive 13.4 yards per designed run. Obviously, the level of competition has a lot to do with that, but it goes to show what he can accomplish on the ground with his athleticism.

Biggest con: Accuracy Some quarterbacks on this list have only minor or moderate weaknesses, but this is a massive concern for Lance. It isn't like Trevor Lawrence, who has flashed bouts of inaccuracy every once in a while; Lance has consistently been inaccurate.

Over the past two seasons, he ranks dead last in percentage of accurate throws beyond the line of scrimmage (44.1%) among the quarterbacks on this list. Not only is that the lowest mark, but it's the worst by a country mile — 7.5 percentage points. Comparing that to all first-round quarterbacks since 2017, it'd still rank last by a comfortable margin. And Lance did this by throwing to a tight or closing window at the lowest rate among that group.

Accuracy is king, and Lance is going to need to have an anomalous turnaround, akin to that of Josh Allen this past season, to overcome this flaw.

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2021-nfl-draft-biggest-pro-con-top-qb-prospects

Good god can we stop posting this stupid f**king stat. It's like the 100th time I've seen it in this thread.

Lance is just as accurate as Fields if you aren't pulling the one clickbait stat PFF could find deep up it's ass because someone wanted jokers like you to copy and paste it all over the internet.

By advanced passing metrics there is absolutely nothing concerning about Lance's accuracy. I'm not saying it's a strength, but it's higher than Fields in some areas and plenty high for him to be a top draft pick. You can't compare his throws which averaged 10+ yards down the field to McCorkle who threw shorter passes on a consistent basis. In fact, Andy Reid threw all the short passes out the window when evaluating Mahomes and only looked at throws that require an NFL caliber arm. When you do that, it becomes clear that Fields or Lance is the pick and Jones is a future backup.

Lance is most certainly not as accurate as Fields. Almost any person who charted their accuracy shows Lance is way less accurate.

It doesn't mean Lance isn't accurate, just not as accurate as Fields.

this covers virtually any accuracy related stat you can find

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/0/d/1Tp_UPHgVsRMJpXAtyyvKVrLRfdeNey-OZS0iDPu2f5E/htmlview

Originally posted by genus49:
Lance is most certainly not as accurate as Fields. Almost any person who charted their accuracy shows Lance is way less accurate.

It doesn't mean Lance isn't accurate, just not as accurate as Fields.

this covers virtually any accuracy related stat you can find

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/0/d/1Tp_UPHgVsRMJpXAtyyvKVrLRfdeNey-OZS0iDPu2f5E/htmlview

Yeah no need to hate on Fields, dude is the most accurate QB in this draft. Kid is one of the highest graded recruits ever for a reason....you can tell Lance has spent a ton of time working on his mechanics (best thing he could have done with no season). That will help his accuracy "issues" a ton. I would be very excited for either guy in Kyle's offense.

Originally posted by genus49:
Lance is most certainly not as accurate as Fields. Almost any person who charted their accuracy shows Lance is way less accurate.

It doesn't mean Lance isn't accurate, just not as accurate as Fields.

this covers virtually any accuracy related stat you can find

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/0/d/1Tp_UPHgVsRMJpXAtyyvKVrLRfdeNey-OZS0iDPu2f5E/htmlview

Dude. Charting is subjective in nature. Stop using your source as the bible and pretending you're not an armchair GM like the rest of us.

I have my own source that says he's slightly more accurate than Fields in at least one metric, slightly less in others.

Edit: And by "my own source".. I mean a book put together by people who are considered experts on the topic and use a very scientific method to compile their metrics.

Double Edit: Holy f**k your source looks like your weekend hobby. LOL so official.

Originally posted by IceMan1763:

Originally posted by genus49:
Lance is most certainly not as accurate as Fields. Almost any person who charted their accuracy shows Lance is way less accurate.

It doesn't mean Lance isn't accurate, just not as accurate as Fields.

this covers virtually any accuracy related stat you can find

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/0/d/1Tp_UPHgVsRMJpXAtyyvKVrLRfdeNey-OZS0iDPu2f5E/htmlview

Dude. Charting is subjective in nature. Stop using your source as the bible and pretending you're not an armchair GM like the rest of us.

I have my own source that says he's slightly more accurate than Fields in at least one metric, slightly less in others.

Edit: And by "my own source".. I mean a book put together by people who are considered experts on the topic and use a very scientific method to compile their metrics.

Double Edit: Holy f**k your source looks like your weekend hobby. LOL so official.

After weeks of going back and forth and watching games, I must say I was wrong Trey Lance should definitely be our pick at #3...... I was wrong. I was caught up in the name Fields and OSU...... Lance would actually be a weapon for us in the pass and compliment the run game. something thats missing from our attack. Plus his arm is really elite. I'm talking russell wilson type elite...

Originally posted by NYniner85:

3: 49ers ➡️ Trey Lance
6: Dolphins ➡️ Kyle Pitts
16: Cardinals ➡️ Devonta Smith
32: Buccaneers ➡️ Asante Samuel Jr.

NFL mock draft 2.0 from @ConorOrr ⬇️ https://t.co/bPTjqNoYMd

— Sports Illustrated (@SInow) April 13, 2021

Yup. This guy gets it, this guy fu(ks.

I keep hearing people say the kid graduated high school and college early. Is there any truth to that?

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

Originally posted by JoseCortez:

Originally posted by Waterbear:

Originally posted by JoseCortez:
He's just so raw and inaccurate. Needs a ton of work. Seems like a good guy, good leader smart and mature. Just a huge gamble.

He's actually not inaccurate at all and he's only raw in the sense that he hasn't played that many games (same as Mac Jones) and the competition he played wasn't nearly as good as the other prospects. 28 touchdowns to 0 interceptions in 2019 which is a college record.

I don't know why people think he needs a ton of work but Justin Fields or Mac Jones doesn't. Lance has played in a pro style system, he can look off safeties, he knows when to check it down, his footwork during play action and rolling out is fantastic, he can go through multiple reads, he's basically displayed the most ability to play within Kyle's system of any QB in the draft due to his school's scheme.

I'm not saying there is no risk and that he's better than Fields overall but just labeling him "raw" and "inaccurate" is just lazy scouting at this point.

Just because he ran a pro offense doesn't mean he has perfected the qb position. His feet are are all over the place his throwing motion is horrendous, he doesn't have much touch to his passes. There's a reason why he looks spectacular on one post, then there's the ball in the dirt on the next play. You just can't use the third pick on a guy just based on his physical attributes

Sure you can, especially when he's actually got top 5 talent. After the trade it's harder to justify, but that's not his fault.

Once you've seen something you know you can work with, you can talk yourself into anything.

Back the kid, back the coaches.

If the kid will work hard enough, and your coaches are good enough, why wouldn't he reach his potential?

The biggest reason he might not is that becoming a better PASSER doesn't happen much. He is not a bad one, but despite his rocket launcher, he's not a great one either.

There some things few QBs get better at. Accuracy is one. Vision is another.

But the positive is that he'd get time to work on mechanics and all that. Aaron Rodgers completely changed his mechanics, so it's not impossible.

I get what you're saying, and I somewhat agree, but there's a difference between a 23 year old with all that muscle memory in the bank, and judging a 19 year old kid with little professional coaching.

He's had a year working on his mechanics and has clearly improved, and has more room to grow.

Yes, which is one reason I like Lance. He's just barely outside that range of maximum brain elasticity, and he hasn't had as much training, which means there's less that has to be unlearned.

Why do people say his accuracy needs improvement when he didn't throw an INT for a season. I haven't watch any of his games, but that alone means he is accurate.