WITH THE 12TH PICK OF THE 2021 DRAFT...

These thoughts are sure to change based on what happens in week 17 and the different offseason signings and trades but as of right now, I like the thought of staying where we are and taking a guy like Mac Jones. This kind of pick isn't my norm. Most years I would say take a QB later and develop him, blah, blah, blah. I would probably want an edge rusher to crush it with Bosa and ARik and Mook! I don't see an edge rusher right now that I think is worth the pick imo.

I Watched Mac Jones about a month ago and I thought maybe but watched again last night with more breakdowns and I'm starting to come around. I'm still the biggest zach wilson fan, Mahomes was the draft crush a couple of years ago and Wilson will probably be it this year as well. But Mac Jones is very accurate and can sling the medium to deep routes very well. Watching his legs and his mannerisms remind me of Peyton Manning. But the way he slings a deep pass and stands in the pocket remind me of Big Ben. Go and watch the JT O Sullivan breakdown against Georgia if you haven't!

I like the more mobile playmaking QB for todays NFL but if i'm being honest, I'm not certain that Shannahan does. He hasn't drafted a QB very high so it's hard to know, but he did prefer Cousins over RG3 and he had a bunch of success with Matt Ryan. It sounds like before the Jimmy G trade they were going to go after Cousins again. Could be wrong on all that, but Mac Jones is bigger and can take a hit and still deliver a deep pass on target. When it was Mahomes, I liked him for the same reasons as Zach Wilson but Mahomes could have been drafted by trading back and acquiring more picks. Wilson now comes with a lot to give up.

I don't want to trade tons of future picks for Wilson. Kind of tired of trading picks away for one year loaners(Sanders, Dee Ford, Trent Williams). If we don't resign Trent I will be pissed because we are just wasting picks. We need to stay healthy first but we also need to keep our draft picks and fill a bunch of needs. Our front office I think has hit a bunch of home runs in the draft with Warner, Deebo, Aiuyk, Bosa, etc... but we need the multiple picks to so because you won't hit on every one. We need multiple corners, another edge rusher because Dee Ford didn't work out. We need Center/Oline help and maybe safety help.

Jimmy G will be the QB next year unless there is a crazy trade. The Stafford and Matt Ryan trade scenarios sound ridiculous to me because why would we take on another contract when we desperately want to resign our own guys and honestly I think Jimmy is playing at a similar level to those guys when he is healthy.
Jimmy is hurt a lot though and Mullens and Beathard don't cut it. Drafting a QB early will put pressure on Jimmy to play better and is way cheaper in the long run. You can lock up a first round QB to a rookie contract for 5 years. We will need to sign our guys like Bosa, Deebo, etc...

The QB position has to be upgraded (starter and backup) and it's not an upgrade if we take a QB in the third round to sit for 2 years till they are ready. again, A guy like Mac Jones or Wilson puts pressure on Jimmy to play better now and allows the Niners to break free from the Jimmy G contract next year. Very similar to how the chiefs did it with Alex Smith until Mahomes took over year 2. Alex played with a fire and led them to a very successful year. We can do the same!
The Zach Wilson price is just to high now for me unless he falls in the draft.

Thoughts on the 1st round? Not trying to another Wilson vs whoever debate. Just trying to use rationale and realistic thoughts to gage the first round. I like the DB horn as well and some Oline guys as well.

Nice post! Good luck on that "rationale" thing. And not making it a Wilson vs whoever debate.

Originally posted by krizay:
Nice post! Good luck on that "rationale" thing. And not making it a Wilson vs whoever debate.

This lol

I think the worst thing the 49ers can do is "rationalize" their way into selecting Mac Jones or Kyle Trask in the first round. As 2nd or 3rd rounders these guys make sense...but taking them in the 1st would be redundant, if not crazy, because the 49ers already have a player like them in Jimmy G.

To me, QB pecking order in this draft class is
1) Trevor Lawrence - far and away the best prospect; as close to a lock as it gets.
.
2) Zach Wilson - maybe the most pure thrower of the football we've seen in a long time, but questions about competition and size.
3) Justin Fields - has all the tools and the numbers against good competition but...he's from Ohio St...
.
4) Trey Lance - incredibly small sample size but arguably the most talented passer in the class not named Lawrence.
.
5) Mac Jones - elite timing and anticipation, great accuracy, including on deep balls, but very middle of the road arm and is purely a pocket passer.
6) Kyle Trask - slightly better arm but slightly less accurate than Jones. Otherwise, they are similar prospects.

There are four tiers of top QBs in this class. Everyone ranked #1 through #4 CAN become a franchise QB because the tools are there; arm talent, mobility; leadership, etc. The difference is purely in the perceived risk profile based on their experience and projection. You can justify taking someone like Lance in the top 10 because if you think you can develop him, the raw materials are there to have someone elite.

But dropping a first round pick on Mac Jones or Kyle Trask for the 49ers is simply foolish. The upside for these two players is Kirk Cousins or...Jimmy G. Average to slightly above average starters who will keep you competitive, and maybe can even help win a Super Bowl, but they're not players who single-handedly elevate their teams.

There are several teams who would love to have that given how much bad QB play there is in this league. Think the Redskins would take Mac Jones yesterday? They'd be in the playoffs. But the 49ers don't need to burn a first round pick on someone like Jimmy G because they already have him. He can be maddeningly inconsistent he doesn't have a good deep ball, but he's someone you can win with; someone teammates adore and someone who knows the offense.

To me, the calculus for the 49ers is clear. You do your homework on Wilson, Fields and Lance, and if you're convinced one of them is your guy for the next 15 years, you bet the farm and go get them. If not, you stick with Jimmy G and bet on a raw but toolsy QB you can develop in the 2nd, 3rd or 4th round...someone like..Kellen Mond, Jamie Newman, or Desmond Ridder.

Originally posted by dmax:

Originally posted by elguapo:

Chiefs will rest their starters at least for half of the game if not more so the chargers will probably win

The niners are without Trent Williams and Aiyuk so that's a loss bc the Seahawks have to keep pace with GB and the Saints

I'm thinking pick 11

Hoping for a win though

Mahomes isn't going to play, so hopefully that'll be enough for them to lose

Originally posted by lp1986:
To me, the calculus for the 49ers is clear. You do your homework on Wilson, Fields and Lance, and if you're convinced one of them is your guy for the next 15 years, you bet the farm and go get them. If not, you stick with Jimmy G and bet on a raw but toolsy QB you can develop in the 2nd, 3rd or 4th round...someone like..Kellen Mond, Jamie Newman, or Desmond Ridder.

This sounds extremely reasonable to me, probably too much so for the zone. We don't need to draft a mid-tier talent like Jimmy G, we have one. We can go get someone with ++ arm talent and let him develop behind JG for a year and get even with or above the Chiefs. I like the idea of someone who's sturdy enough to not be on IR half the time. I trust Kyle to pick who that is and Lynch to make it so.

Well said!

Originally posted by lp1986:

I think the worst thing the 49ers can do is "rationalize" their way into selecting Mac Jones or Kyle Trask in the first round. As 2nd or 3rd rounders these guys make sense...but taking them in the 1st would be redundant, if not crazy, because the 49ers already have a player like them in Jimmy G.

To me, QB pecking order in this draft class is
1) Trevor Lawrence - far and away the best prospect; as close to a lock as it gets.
.
2) Zach Wilson - maybe the most pure thrower of the football we've seen in a long time, but questions about competition and size.
3) Justin Fields - has all the tools and the numbers against good competition but...he's from Ohio St...
.
4) Trey Lance - incredibly small sample size but arguably the most talented passer in the class not named Lawrence.
.
5) Mac Jones - elite timing and anticipation, great accuracy, including on deep balls, but very middle of the road arm and is purely a pocket passer.
6) Kyle Trask - slightly better arm but slightly less accurate than Jones. Otherwise, they are similar prospects.

There are four tiers of top QBs in this class. Everyone ranked #1 through #4 CAN become a franchise QB because the tools are there; arm talent, mobility; leadership, etc. The difference is purely in the perceived risk profile based on their experience and projection. You can justify taking someone like Lance in the top 10 because if you think you can develop him, the raw materials are there to have someone elite.

But dropping a first round pick on Mac Jones or Kyle Trask for the 49ers is simply foolish. The upside for these two players is Kirk Cousins or...Jimmy G. Average to slightly above average starters who will keep you competitive, and maybe can even help win a Super Bowl, but they're not players who single-handedly elevate their teams.

There are several teams who would love to have that given how much bad QB play there is in this league. Think the Redskins would take Mac Jones yesterday? They'd be in the playoffs. But the 49ers don't need to burn a first round pick on someone like Jimmy G because they already have him. He can be maddeningly inconsistent he doesn't have a good deep ball, but he's someone you can win with; someone teammates adore and someone who knows the offense.

To me, the calculus for the 49ers is clear. You do your homework on Wilson, Fields and Lance, and if you're convinced one of them is your guy for the next 15 years, you bet the farm and go get them. If not, you stick with Jimmy G and bet on a raw but toolsy QB you can develop in the 2nd, 3rd or 4th round...someone like..Kellen Mond, Jamie Newman, or Desmond Ridder.

If Jimmy G had

elite timing and anticipation, great accuracy, including on deep balls, but very middle of the road arm and is purely a pocket passer

we wouldn't even be discussing needing a QB

Originally posted by lp1986:
I think the worst thing the 49ers can do is "rationalize" their way into selecting Mac Jones or Kyle Trask in the first round. As 2nd or 3rd rounders these guys make sense...but taking them in the 1st would be redundant, if not crazy, because the 49ers already have a player like them in Jimmy G.

To me, QB pecking order in this draft class is
1) Trevor Lawrence - far and away the best prospect; as close to a lock as it gets.
.
2) Zach Wilson - maybe the most pure thrower of the football we've seen in a long time, but questions about competition and size.
3) Justin Fields - has all the tools and the numbers against good competition but...he's from Ohio St...
.
4) Trey Lance - incredibly small sample size but arguably the most talented passer in the class not named Lawrence.
.
5) Mac Jones - elite timing and anticipation, great accuracy, including on deep balls, but very middle of the road arm and is purely a pocket passer.
6) Kyle Trask - slightly better arm but slightly less accurate than Jones. Otherwise, they are similar prospects.

There are four tiers of top QBs in this class. Everyone ranked #1 through #4 CAN become a franchise QB because the tools are there; arm talent, mobility; leadership, etc. The difference is purely in the perceived risk profile based on their experience and projection. You can justify taking someone like Lance in the top 10 because if you think you can develop him, the raw materials are there to have someone elite.

But dropping a first round pick on Mac Jones or Kyle Trask for the 49ers is simply foolish. The upside for these two players is Kirk Cousins or...Jimmy G. Average to slightly above average starters who will keep you competitive, and maybe can even help win a Super Bowl, but they're not players who single-handedly elevate their teams.

There are several teams who would love to have that given how much bad QB play there is in this league. Think the Redskins would take Mac Jones yesterday? They'd be in the playoffs. But the 49ers don't need to burn a first round pick on someone like Jimmy G because they already have him. He can be maddeningly inconsistent he doesn't have a good deep ball, but he's someone you can win with; someone teammates adore and someone who knows the offense.

To me, the calculus for the 49ers is clear. You do your homework on Wilson, Fields and Lance, and if you're convinced one of them is your guy for the next 15 years, you bet the farm and go get them. If not, you stick with Jimmy G and bet on a raw but toolsy QB you can develop in the 2nd, 3rd or 4th round...someone like..Kellen Mond, Jamie Newman, or Desmond Ridder.

This!

also as of right now I don't see the top end of this draft being full of elite studs at positions we need. I would be fine giving up a 1st/2nd and a 1st next yr (maybe a little extra) to go get whatever QB they think is the long-term answer at QB. No one wants to lose future picks, but half the time they don't pan out anyway.

They'd still have a 3rd (for Saleh)4th, 3 5ths, 6th, 2 7ths in a draft that's got some good talent on day 3. SF has also shown they can find talent with UDFAs.

Originally posted by krizay:
If Jimmy G had we wouldn't even be discussing needing a QB

We're discussing needing a QB largely because Jimmy seems to get seriously injured every other season. You just can't have that from a franchise QB. Not to mention he really doesn't have the incredible physical abilities that a lot of these younger QBs coming into the league have.

Originally posted by BSNAPZZ:
We're discussing needing a QB largely because Jimmy seems to get seriously injured every other season. You just can't have that from a franchise QB. Not to mention he really doesn't have the incredible physical abilities that a lot of these younger QBs coming into the league have.

This boils down to value. You don't use a first round pick on a QB unless you're convinced it's a major upgrade over your current situation. Yes Jimmy G can't be relied upon at this point, but the notion of blowing a valuable 1st round pick on someone with similar tools but just as many risks (who know if they develop at all) seems ludicrous.

If you're not sold on Wilson, Fields or Lance - enough so to trade up for them - then settling for Jones or Trask in the middle of the round feels...crazy.

I much rather ride with Jimmy G, invest in the IOL, DE and Secondary, and find a toolsy prospect to develop and a veteran backup like Fitzpatrick to back up him up.

Originally posted by krizay:

Originally posted by lp1986:
I think the worst thing the 49ers can do is "rationalize" their way into selecting Mac Jones or Kyle Trask in the first round. As 2nd or 3rd rounders these guys make sense...but taking them in the 1st would be redundant, if not crazy, because the 49ers already have a player like them in Jimmy G.

To me, QB pecking order in this draft class is
1) Trevor Lawrence - far and away the best prospect; as close to a lock as it gets.
.
2) Zach Wilson - maybe the most pure thrower of the football we've seen in a long time, but questions about competition and size.
3) Justin Fields - has all the tools and the numbers against good competition but...he's from Ohio St...
.
4) Trey Lance - incredibly small sample size but arguably the most talented passer in the class not named Lawrence.
.
5) Mac Jones - elite timing and anticipation, great accuracy, including on deep balls, but very middle of the road arm and is purely a pocket passer.
6) Kyle Trask - slightly better arm but slightly less accurate than Jones. Otherwise, they are similar prospects.

There are four tiers of top QBs in this class. Everyone ranked #1 through #4 CAN become a franchise QB because the tools are there; arm talent, mobility; leadership, etc. The difference is purely in the perceived risk profile based on their experience and projection. You can justify taking someone like Lance in the top 10 because if you think you can develop him, the raw materials are there to have someone elite.

But dropping a first round pick on Mac Jones or Kyle Trask for the 49ers is simply foolish. The upside for these two players is Kirk Cousins or...Jimmy G. Average to slightly above average starters who will keep you competitive, and maybe can even help win a Super Bowl, but they're not players who single-handedly elevate their teams.

There are several teams who would love to have that given how much bad QB play there is in this league. Think the Redskins would take Mac Jones yesterday? They'd be in the playoffs. But the 49ers don't need to burn a first round pick on someone like Jimmy G because they already have him. He can be maddeningly inconsistent he doesn't have a good deep ball, but he's someone you can win with; someone teammates adore and someone who knows the offense.

To me, the calculus for the 49ers is clear. You do your homework on Wilson, Fields and Lance, and if you're convinced one of them is your guy for the next 15 years, you bet the farm and go get them. If not, you stick with Jimmy G and bet on a raw but toolsy QB you can develop in the 2nd, 3rd or 4th round...someone like..Kellen Mond, Jamie Newman, or Desmond Ridder.

If Jimmy G had

elite timing and anticipation, great accuracy, including on deep balls, but very middle of the road arm and is purely a pocket passer

we wouldn't even be discussing needing a QB

Yeah that's kind of my thought on this.

What I want to fix is jimmy's contract, jimmy's health and the timing, anticipation, etc...
Jimmy is just kind Alex Smith type at this point. The team can be successful around him. But if we made the playoffs again with him, I don't know how much I trust him. Playoff football for me I typically lean to the teams with the best QB. Kyle schemes guys open but sometimes we need the QB to step into a throw and hit the wr on the money. That's not Jimmy and his health and contract are a concern as well.

I agree on Lawrence and Wilson. Fields i haven't really watched yet but if he's that good he will also require a trade up. I want to like Lance but there is a very small sample size of him out there and everything Ive seen so far is kind of clunky. It looks like he's still in the beginner stage of everything except throwing it 70 yards downfield.

Mac Jones isn't a 2nd or 3rd rounder. originally I thought he was an end of the 1st round trade up for some team. I'm confident right now that he's a top 20 guy. that could change considering there's so many players who sat out from covid etc... guys could rise up the draft boards.

I'm good to admit I was wrong on guys like Justin Herbert. I didn't see anything special about him. Looked basic and thought he would bust out. From his first game against almost beating KC I could see that he has it. I think Mac Jones can be promising like that as well. Nothing flashy but he seems smart, I can see him reading the defense and picking the 1 vs 1 matchup. He takes hits in the pocket despite people believing everything is just clean and easy with Bama's oline. His anticipation and deep passes would have won us another Superbowl though. Jimmy played solid for 3 quarters or so. But when the pressure came he unraveled a bit(see deep pass to e sanders or the multiple wide open passes to Kittle over the middle when he should have known the blitz was coming). Jones in theory looks like he can do those things. I'm not trying to complicate it.

I don't think Mac Jones is settling. Again, my first thought is a shut down corner or an edge rusher because our winning percentage when Bosa and Dee Ford were on the field was insane.

But Right now with our unexpected win against arizona, we have only upped the cost to trade up for a Wilson or Fields, etc...

Trade down. Get a Center and a guard as well as looking out for db's. Obviously if an edge rusher worth taking drops to us, we take him.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
This!

also as of right now I don't see the top end of this draft being full of elite studs at positions we need. I would be fine giving up a 1st/2nd and a 1st next yr (maybe a little extra) to go get whatever QB they think is the long-term answer at QB. No one wants to lose future picks, but half the time they don't pan out anyway.

They'd still have a 3rd (for Saleh)4th, 3 5ths, 6th, 2 7ths in a draft that's got some good talent on day 3. SF has also shown they can find talent with UDFAs.

Our thoughts are normally similar. If that's all it cost us, I would be fine with the trade up as well. But as of right now Wilson or Fields sounds like trading up to the top 3. That's a lot of picks.

I wish there were more DE's and DB's or even a free ranging safety at the top of the draft but as of now I don't see it.

Originally posted by jacklegniner:

Yeah that's kind of my thought on this.

What I want to fix is jimmy's contract, jimmy's health and the timing, anticipation, etc...
Jimmy is just kind Alex Smith type at this point. The team can be successful around him. But if we made the playoffs again with him, I don't know how much I trust him. Playoff football for me I typically lean to the teams with the best QB. Kyle schemes guys open but sometimes we need the QB to step into a throw and hit the wr on the money. That's not Jimmy and his health and contract are a concern as well.

I agree on Lawrence and Wilson. Fields i haven't really watched yet but if he's that good he will also require a trade up. I want to like Lance but there is a very small sample size of him out there and everything Ive seen so far is kind of clunky. It looks like he's still in the beginner stage of everything except throwing it 70 yards downfield.

Mac Jones isn't a 2nd or 3rd rounder. originally I thought he was an end of the 1st round trade up for some team. I'm confident right now that he's a top 20 guy. that could change considering there's so many players who sat out from covid etc... guys could rise up the draft boards.

I'm good to admit I was wrong on guys like Justin Herbert. I didn't see anything special about him. Looked basic and thought he would bust out. From his first game against almost beating KC I could see that he has it. I think Mac Jones can be promising like that as well. Nothing flashy but he seems smart, I can see him reading the defense and picking the 1 vs 1 matchup. He takes hits in the pocket despite people believing everything is just clean and easy with Bama's oline. His anticipation and deep passes would have won us another Superbowl though. Jimmy played solid for 3 quarters or so. But when the pressure came he unraveled a bit(see deep pass to e sanders or the multiple wide open passes to Kittle over the middle when he should have known the blitz was coming). Jones in theory looks like he can do those things. I'm not trying to complicate it.

I don't think Mac Jones is settling. Again, my first thought is a shut down corner or an edge rusher because our winning percentage when Bosa and Dee Ford were on the field was insane.

But Right now with our unexpected win against arizona, we have only upped the cost to trade up for a Wilson or Fields, etc...

Agree with this on Jones. Sure, I'd like Wilson, sure I want them to look into the cost and do it if they can— But I'm also fine with us just taking Jones in the teens, then using our next picks on DB, OL—hopefully after already adding a cheap vet DB and/or IOL in FA—DE (Ford replacement), TE2... We'll probably draft two DBs honestly, a corner and a safety. And yeah, we get our guys back, Jimmy gets another chance (with added pressure but a good team around him again), Jones gives us security and upside behind Garoppolo.