What is the best use of our 2021 first round draft pick?

I would like to see them trade down around 20 to 26? Use some of the extra pick in second and third rounds on OL use later first round pick on OT, CB, or Rush end.
They will draft a DT.

Originally posted by Mooseman:
You can only put together a realistic choice after your free agents are signed and any significant trades are done.

Very true. But already there is some obvious positions that won't be filled by free agency this year, simply because of the kinds of free agents that will be projected to be available. For example, QB, there's no young Deshaun Watson on the free agency market that I'm aware of. I think there are lots of older and soon to be retiring QB's - but I'm not an expert in the free agency side of things anyway. But that's just an example.

Originally posted by dlance:
I would like to see them trade down around 20 to 26? Use some of the extra pick in second and third rounds on OL use later first round pick on OT, CB, or Rush end.
They will draft a DT.

I agree, if they can't get a top notch Edge rusher, QB, or OLineman - yeah - Trade down.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by dlance:
I would like to see them trade down around 20 to 26? Use some of the extra pick in second and third rounds on OL use later first round pick on OT, CB, or Rush end.
They will draft a DT.

I agree, if they can't get a top notch Edge rusher, QB, or OLineman - yeah - Trade down.

I think the same thing. I don't think there is going to be a sure thing QB at 12. The OT that fit the outside zone maybe can be draft later in first round, and my favorite rush end is Joseph Ossai mite fall to later in the first round as well. Is he worth the 12th pick? Of cores any or all of them could be pick at 13 and I would be pissed. It's a gamble, if there is only one player you like at 12 I would draft him if there are 3 or 4 you like about the same I would try to move back. Then pray one of them is still there when you pick. Plus who do you think will be there in the second round? Is there a OT, CB or a Rush End you really like? That effected who you draft in the first.

Let's take a look at the somewhat realistic options for a QB at #12 or a trade up.

1.Jags. They will take Lawrence
2.Jets. I don't think they are taking a QB.
3.Dolphins. If they don't trade for Watson they may stick with Tua.
4.Falcons. They have Ryan still.
5.Bengals. Taking Oline
6.Eagles. Likely taking a WR
7.Lions. Staying with Goff??
8.Panthers. Wilson or Fields
9.Broncios. Wilson or Fields.
10.Cowboys. Not going QB.
11.Giants. Will give up on Jones?

I'm thinking if the Niners trade up, the Eagles could be a good team to look to. 6 spots is not that much and they won't be looking for a QB. Maybe even the Lions if they decide to stick with Goff. We would have to trade up infront of the Broncos and Panthers who are likely both taking a QB.

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:
I really like the theme of BOI's post, though it's a bit too strong for me. Absolutely right about Kyle wanting to win in structure, and wanting a QB who will get to the best part of his play.

The issue is, and I think McVay has learnt this, is that the defense can win and take away the early parts of your play. That's cool if you have a stud O-Line, but if you haven't the play is broken.

Now is the part where your conversations meet, a Mac Jones, Brady will throw it away and live to fight another down.

A Jimmy will play some hero ball and throw into coverage

A Lamar or Kyler will run and try to get some yards.

The best players Mahomes, Rodgers, Russ Wilson, Deshaun Watson, scramble around give their receivers time and kill you down the field. That's what you pay for, that's the modern NFL, get with it or fall behind.

I think BOI49er pretty well hit it on the head with regard to flashy mobile QBs. The book is still to be written with regard to Mahomes, but aside from last year, even the more recent Superbowl winners are much more likely to be fairly traditional guys.

If there isn't a game changer at 12 I would like to see them trade back a few spots and then trade back to the 20's and get as many second third and forth rounders as possible. Use those pics on CBS, OL, edge throw in a wr or two a lb a dl and use this draft as a restock. Some will stick some will wind up on the practice squad ethier way they are flush with young talent. Then next year when the salary cap goes up and they have a large cap space fill in the hopefully few holes with free agents and dominate for the next 5 to 6 years.

Originally posted by Midbay:

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:
I really like the theme of BOI's post, though it's a bit too strong for me. Absolutely right about Kyle wanting to win in structure, and wanting a QB who will get to the best part of his play.

The issue is, and I think McVay has learnt this, is that the defense can win and take away the early parts of your play. That's cool if you have a stud O-Line, but if you haven't the play is broken.

Now is the part where your conversations meet, a Mac Jones, Brady will throw it away and live to fight another down.

A Jimmy will play some hero ball and throw into coverage

A Lamar or Kyler will run and try to get some yards.

The best players Mahomes, Rodgers, Russ Wilson, Deshaun Watson, scramble around give their receivers time and kill you down the field. That's what you pay for, that's the modern NFL, get with it or fall behind.

I think BOI49er pretty well hit it on the head with regard to flashy mobile QBs. The book is still to be written with regard to Mahomes, but aside from last year, even the more recent Superbowl winners are much more likely to be fairly traditional guys.

Wow, wow, wow you're living in the past, there's a beautiful bright new NFL out there. How anyone can watch Mahomes in particular and not be impressed is beyond me, is that just sour grapes from the Superbowl?

I stand by most post above, we are fortunate that Kyle wins much more frequently than most playcallers, so if you can only win from structure it doesn't kill us.

Rodgers has shown the added dimension this offence gets with my preferred style of QB.

A blue chip player at 12 for any position! Including kicker!

Granted this is the draft simulator but there is a lot of talent that fits needs in the middle of the draft. Two small trade backs in the first netted.
18 Azeez Ojulari edge
45 Creed Humphrey C
50 Eric Stokes CB
78 Jordan Smith edge
110 Tutu Atwell Wr
142 Richard LeCounte S
159 Jacoby Stevens S
173 Darrius Stills DL
196 Isreal Mukuama CB
206 Matt Bushman TE
Some could have been a interior line most would fill current needs and upgrades. But there is a lot of talent in the middle of the draft.

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:
I really like the theme of BOI's post, though it's a bit too strong for me. Absolutely right about Kyle wanting to win in structure, and wanting a QB who will get to the best part of his play.

The issue is, and I think McVay has learnt this, is that the defense can win and take away the early parts of your play. That's cool if you have a stud O-Line, but if you haven't the play is broken.

Now is the part where your conversations meet, a Mac Jones, Brady will throw it away and live to fight another down.

A Jimmy will play some hero ball and throw into coverage

A Lamar or Kyler will run and try to get some yards.

The best players Mahomes, Rodgers, Russ Wilson, Deshaun Watson, scramble around give their receivers time and kill you down the field. That's what you pay for, that's the modern NFL, get with it or fall behind.

I agree with your preferred QB-style, but I think you're underselling the role of structure. Every play starts with structure, and I'd imagine every coach would prefer his QB to execute it at an elite level. If you think of a play as having 2 parts, where Part A is the play design and Part B is when protection breaks down, the different QB-types you list come into play in Part B. Every play has a part A, but not every play has part B. I definitely prefer QB's who extend the play and get the ball downfield, as long as they're proficient while the play holds up.

Originally posted by jackburton1:

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:
I really like the theme of BOI's post, though it's a bit too strong for me. Absolutely right about Kyle wanting to win in structure, and wanting a QB who will get to the best part of his play.

The issue is, and I think McVay has learnt this, is that the defense can win and take away the early parts of your play. That's cool if you have a stud O-Line, but if you haven't the play is broken.

Now is the part where your conversations meet, a Mac Jones, Brady will throw it away and live to fight another down.

A Jimmy will play some hero ball and throw into coverage

A Lamar or Kyler will run and try to get some yards.

The best players Mahomes, Rodgers, Russ Wilson, Deshaun Watson, scramble around give their receivers time and kill you down the field. That's what you pay for, that's the modern NFL, get with it or fall behind.

I agree with your preferred QB-style, but I think you're underselling the role of structure. Every play starts with structure, and I'd imagine every coach would prefer his QB to execute it at an elite level. If you think of a play as having 2 parts, where Part A is the play design and Part B is when protection breaks down, the different QB-types you list come into play in Part B. Every play has a part A, but not every play has part B. I definitely prefer QB's who extend the play and get the ball downfield, as long as they're proficient while the play holds up.

Yeah I agree, and with Kyle that is definitely magnified (with Kyle, a smart QB and a great O-Line we'd probably never see part B).

It's more of an indictment of our OL.

I just don't like how people think of mobile QB's as a hindrance, as long as they function within part A they're invaluable.

IMO Mahomes is one of the best pocket passers in the NFL, it just so happens that he's also the best outside of structure.

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

Originally posted by Midbay:

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:
I really like the theme of BOI's post, though it's a bit too strong for me. Absolutely right about Kyle wanting to win in structure, and wanting a QB who will get to the best part of his play.

The issue is, and I think McVay has learnt this, is that the defense can win and take away the early parts of your play. That's cool if you have a stud O-Line, but if you haven't the play is broken.

Now is the part where your conversations meet, a Mac Jones, Brady will throw it away and live to fight another down.

A Jimmy will play some hero ball and throw into coverage

A Lamar or Kyler will run and try to get some yards.

The best players Mahomes, Rodgers, Russ Wilson, Deshaun Watson, scramble around give their receivers time and kill you down the field. That's what you pay for, that's the modern NFL, get with it or fall behind.

I think BOI49er pretty well hit it on the head with regard to flashy mobile QBs. The book is still to be written with regard to Mahomes, but aside from last year, even the more recent Superbowl winners are much more likely to be fairly traditional guys.

Wow, wow, wow you're living in the past, there's a beautiful bright new NFL out there. How anyone can watch Mahomes in particular and not be impressed is beyond me, is that just sour grapes from the Superbowl?

I stand by most post above, we are fortunate that Kyle wins much more frequently than most playcallers, so if you can only win from structure it doesn't kill us.

Rodgers has shown the added dimension this offence gets with my preferred style of QB.

Not sure where you get that from my post. Fact is aside from the last Superbowl, the dominant group of actual champions are more traditional QBs. I am impressed by Mahomes, but he is a singular talent really; by far the best-of-the-new-breed in my opinion and surrounded by an astounding amount of offensive talent. When I say the book is still to be written on him, well it obviously is. All arrows are up and he has a big chance to cement a legacy in a few days.

I am not that enamored with uber-elusive scrambling QBs not named Mahomes, and I don't think there is any real evidence to suggest that that type is going to be dominant in the future. Mahomes may be, but there is only one of him.

For that reason, I'm not excited about a lot of these first round QBs and would rather go EDGE or a even OL.

Originally posted by Midbay:

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

Originally posted by Midbay:

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:
I really like the theme of BOI's post, though it's a bit too strong for me. Absolutely right about Kyle wanting to win in structure, and wanting a QB who will get to the best part of his play.

The issue is, and I think McVay has learnt this, is that the defense can win and take away the early parts of your play. That's cool if you have a stud O-Line, but if you haven't the play is broken.

Now is the part where your conversations meet, a Mac Jones, Brady will throw it away and live to fight another down.

A Jimmy will play some hero ball and throw into coverage

A Lamar or Kyler will run and try to get some yards.

The best players Mahomes, Rodgers, Russ Wilson, Deshaun Watson, scramble around give their receivers time and kill you down the field. That's what you pay for, that's the modern NFL, get with it or fall behind.

I think BOI49er pretty well hit it on the head with regard to flashy mobile QBs. The book is still to be written with regard to Mahomes, but aside from last year, even the more recent Superbowl winners are much more likely to be fairly traditional guys.

Wow, wow, wow you're living in the past, there's a beautiful bright new NFL out there. How anyone can watch Mahomes in particular and not be impressed is beyond me, is that just sour grapes from the Superbowl?

I stand by most post above, we are fortunate that Kyle wins much more frequently than most playcallers, so if you can only win from structure it doesn't kill us.

Rodgers has shown the added dimension this offence gets with my preferred style of QB.

Not sure where you get that from my post. Fact is aside from the last Superbowl, the dominant group of actual champions are more traditional QBs. I am impressed by Mahomes, but he is a singular talent really; by far the best-of-the-new-breed in my opinion and surrounded by an astounding amount of offensive talent. When I say the book is still to be written on him, well it obviously is. All arrows are up and he has a big chance to cement a legacy in a few days.

I am not that enamored with uber-elusive scrambling QBs not named Mahomes, and I don't think there is any real evidence to suggest that that type is going to be dominant in the future. Mahomes may be, but there is only one of him.

For that reason, I'm not excited about a lot of these first round QBs and would rather go EDGE or a even OL.

It was the term flashy mobile QB's, just think that people are too slow to react to change. As long as the QB can win in structure, any extra playmaking or mobility is a huge plus.

Aaron Rodgers may actually be the best example of it, but he's so Uber smart that I'm really talking about the guys mentioned above.

I'm surprised you aren't enamoured with Watson, who 2/3's of the league are willing to trade the farm for, you must be sick of Russ burning us even when we think we've got him bottled up.

Josh Allen is just coming into his own, though I'd rather he spent a little longer scrambling before going for the rushing yards. Similar to Dak

Justin Herbert will be next when he develops. It's just a huge advantage.

There are 4 of those guys in this draft and 3 could be available, it's a big opportunity, but like I said, you've got to win in structure first as your bread and butter, then go nuts when the play breaks down.

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

It was the term flashy mobile QB's, just think that people are too slow to react to change. As long as the QB can win in structure, any extra playmaking or mobility is a huge plus.

Aaron Rodgers may actually be the best example of it, but he's so Uber smart that I'm really talking about the guys mentioned above.

I'm surprised you aren't enamoured with Watson, who 2/3's of the league are willing to trade the farm for, you must be sick of Russ burning us even when we think we've got him bottled up.

Josh Allen is just coming into his own, though I'd rather he spent a little longer scrambling before going for the rushing yards. Similar to Dak

Justin Herbert will be next when he develops. It's just a huge advantage.

There are 4 of those guys in this draft and 3 could be available, it's a big opportunity, but like I said, you've got to win in structure first as your bread and butter, then go nuts when the play breaks down.

Watson is interesting but there seems to be something intangible (in a bad way) that shows up in his W/L. Part of it is surely the situation in Houston, but so far he seems to be at his best after the game is already lost. Almost like garbage time really fits his style more than crunch time.

Wilson is Wilson. Incredibly frustrating and dangerous but beatable.

I think Murray could be quite good, but he seemed to take a lot more hits last year as people figured out how he moves, and I'm afraid he is going to be broken before too long. His talent level gets taken at the very top of the 1st round but the system he gets taken so highly for could be his undoing.

Rogers, he seems fairly traditional to me. Moves well, but you can take that away and he can still be good, and running isn't his bread and butter anyway. If his style is the future, I question why he hasn't won another superbowl if he was ahead of his time.

Allen is more successful the more traditional he becomes. His legs are more deadly the less he has to use them. He really seems to want to move beyond being just a superior athlete, and he clearly puts in the time. (look at changes in his mechanics and footwork) If he hadn't really worked on that stuff, he wouldn't be much of a threat to win superbowls.