Who's on your do NOT draft list?

Originally posted by krizay:
I watched every target and catch. I seen nothing from him that suggests he wouldn't have YAC in THIS offense.



I Stopped half way through. It's all moot anyway due to his non football issues

The thing with him though is the plays he doesnt get the ball. I read multiple reports saying his effort is lacking on plays where he isnt the target. If you aren't blocking your butt off in Kyle's offense then you aren't playing. Maybe he wasnt coached to do that in college i dont know.

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:
Im not discussing his value, only his "scouting report," and honestly just as discussion not as argument. I guess we just have different views on evaluating the tackle position. I think his aggressiveness is his nature, and has nothing to do with "short" arms. A ton of tackles flame out of the league because they lack punch timing/aggressiveness/quick hands. After all, what good are long arms if you don't use them? Doesn't matter how long your arms are if you're late, or passive. See: Kingsley Suamataia.

Overextending is a coaching/technique and/or strength issue. See: Tyler Guyton. Ridiculous length, always over his skis. He made Darius Robinson a lot of money because he wouldn't stop over extending at the Senior bowl.

Oversetting: again, not a length issue. Length can help if you DONT have range, because you can use your arms to reach where your feet can't take you. See: Dawand Jones; not a bad mover, but it doesnt matter if he cant reach his spot against wide rushers, because they arent getting around that body anyway. But If you have the range in your vertical set because of your explosion and athletic ability, you don't need your arms to cast a wide net, and you don't need to open your hips prematurely, giving an soft inside go. See: Joe Thomas. Short arms, amazing vertical set.

Again, outside of super outliers like 31" arms, length helps to mitigate issues, but Rosengarten has the natural tools to mitigate length issues. His biggest issue is lower body strength and consistent pad level...if a skilled edge is going to long arm him to death, it wouldn't matter if he had 34" arms, 1 arm is longer than 2

I'm not arguing with ya. I appreciate your takes in here…I don't agree with all of them and you don't agree with all mine. Which is fine.

IMO his aggressiveness is in part because he knows he can't rely on his length. It's a double edged sword. He can play on his toes too much at times. Like I said I don't think it's a deal breaker. It does drop him in this draft. I agree with Guyton, thing is he does have long arms and those issues CAN be coached up. He can learn that. RR can't grow his arms. That will take time and not sure SF wants to do that at pick 31.

At least we agree that he has lower body strength issues. He's young and that can improve but that will be an issue in the NFL.

I do care about value and grades…I can like so and so based on scouting/film. I'm then gonna put grades on each guy and when I think they should go. Teams have big boards for a reason. I'm not gonna change my grade on a guy because he's been linked to SF…he's not a top 50 guy for me. I think he will be there in the 2nd because that's where he should go.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
IMO his aggressiveness is in part because he knows he can't rely on his length. It's a double edged sword.

To me, this implies he would play less aggressively if his arms were 1/2" longer. But that lack of aggression would only render his longer arms irrelevant.

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
IMO his aggressiveness is in part because he knows he can't rely on his length. It's a double edged sword.

To me, this implies he would play less aggressively if his arms were 1/2" longer. But that lack of aggression would only render his longer arms irrelevant.

You can toss out arm length or wingspan…both are in the 20th percentile.

You can still be aggressive and have long arms…again he has to be aggressive (imo) consistently in part because he's lacking there.

I mean there's a ton to like about him…I don't want you to think I'm hate him or something. He's not a 1st rd talent or a top 50 guy in my book for a couple reasons which I went over.

not a single person would be talking about him as a first round talent if there wasn't some mocks putting him to SF because we went to his workouts and Joe taught him.

Brandon thorn…

"Needs to learn to reel in his aggressive, risk-taking approach in pass protection to prevent oversetting and quick, clean losses across his face"

imo partially he's acting like this because he doesn't have ideal length.

I think we both agree with this…

"Rosengarten struggles to consistently anchor due to well-below-average play strength and is easily manipulated into drifting and oversetting on an island, leading to clean losses across his face"

FWIW Thorn has him as the 80th overall player in this draft and a 4th rd grade.

again I like him…I don't like him in RD1. He's a day 2 guy, always has been.

Originally posted by miked1978:
The thing with him though is the plays he doesnt get the ball. I read multiple reports saying his effort is lacking on plays where he isnt the target. If you aren't blocking your butt off in Kyle's offense then you aren't playing. Maybe he wasnt coached to do that in college i dont know.

Thats why I ended my post with it was moot.

As long as it's not the 7-10th ranked tackle at 31 I'm good.

Guyton
Suamaatia
Morgan
Barton

Is my list.

I do like Morgan, but not at 31

I wont be particularly original.

I don't like Mims because he just seems like a raw project in an area where the coaching hasnt shown they could develop an oline diamond in the rough....and this being a win-now team.

Guyton - not exactly Do not Draft, but Im just not in love with this tape and similar to Mims. A bit too raw.

I dont like Bowers - even though there is zero chance they are even looking at him - simply because TEs being picked high in the first round are awful value imo

Latu- I think he can still be good but I just don't see top 10-15 pedigree here. Am fine with him going top 25-30

Originally posted by miked1978:
The thing with him though is the plays he doesnt get the ball. I read multiple reports saying his effort is lacking on plays where he isnt the target. If you aren't blocking your butt off in Kyle's offense then you aren't playing. Maybe he wasnt coached to do that in college i dont know.

Knowing Kyle and his hard ass attitude towards receivers, AD would most definitely be in the dog house in his rookie year with his unwillingness to block.

Originally posted by the_dynasty:
I wont be particularly original.

I don't like Mims because he just seems like a raw project in an area where the coaching hasnt shown they could develop an oline diamond in the rough....and this being a win-now team.

Guyton - not exactly Do not Draft, but Im just not in love with this tape and similar to Mims. A bit too raw.

I dont like Bowers - even though there is zero chance they are even looking at him - simply because TEs being picked high in the first round are awful value imo

Latu- I think he can still be good but I just don't see top 10-15 pedigree here. Am fine with him going top 25-30

Interesting list.

I love Mims, even with his limited snaps he played better than I thought for someone that's developmental. I'd like if if we somehow get him.

I was a Guyton guy but yeah he's a bit raw and I think he's going to Baltimore before us anyways.

Bowers is a raw talent. But 1st round TEs rarely become transcendent. I thought OJ Howard was gonna dominate the league, just for kittle to be the best TE in that class in the 5th round. But man Bowers is something different imo.

I disagree with Latu. He might not be a high end athlete but wow he is so polished with his pass rush, him and Bosa as a tandem would be a dline coach dream with their technician playstyle.

some one needs to punch john lynch in the head repeatedly until he his permanently disabled and stop him from using so many drugs there is no way a sober person drafts ricky pearsall with the 31st pick he continues to make these ridiculous moves then tells everyone that he thought they were good but hind sight is 20 20 even though everyone knows they are horrendously bad decisions at the time solmon thomas and ruben foster, jerrick mckinin, donte pettis, jawon kinlow, deforst buckner trade, number 3 pick trade, ricky pearsall

Originally posted by davedavedave:
some one needs to punch john lynch in the head repeatedly until he his permanently disabled and stop him from using so many drugs there is no way a sober person drafts ricky pearsall with the 31st pick he continues to make these ridiculous moves then tells everyone that he thought they were good but hind sight is 20 20 even though everyone knows they are horrendously bad decisions at the time solmon thomas and ruben foster, jerrick mckinin, donte pettis, jawon kinlow, deforst buckner trade, number 3 pick trade, ricky pearsall

I don't think wishing for someone to be disabled is either appropriate or pleasant. Goodbye.

NY all that arguing about Morgan we did yesterday and he went 25. Tried telling you he was top 50!!!

__PRESENT

Originally posted by davedavedave:
some one needs to punch john lynch in the head repeatedly until he his permanently disabled and stop him from using so many drugs there is no way a sober person drafts ricky pearsall with the 31st pick he continues to make these ridiculous moves then tells everyone that he thought they were good but hind sight is 20 20 even though everyone knows they are horrendously bad decisions at the time solmon thomas and ruben foster, jerrick mckinin, donte pettis, jawon kinlow, deforst buckner trade, number 3 pick trade, ricky pearsall

this is one of the longest sentences known to mankind and apparently it's still going.

Originally posted by davedavedave:
some one needs to punch john lynch in the head repeatedly until he his permanently disabled and stop him from using so many drugs there is no way a sober person drafts ricky pearsall with the 31st pick he continues to make these ridiculous moves then tells everyone that he thought they were good but hind sight is 20 20 even though everyone knows they are horrendously bad decisions at the time solmon thomas and ruben foster, jerrick mckinin, donte pettis, jawon kinlow, deforst buckner trade, number 3 pick trade, ricky pearsall

Espn ranked him the 35th prospect.. not that big of a reach