Kenneth Grant-DT-Michigan

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49erKing:

Originally posted by SolRebe1:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by Jakemall:

Originally posted by Cisco0623:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Like everyone else I recognize the potential. That said no way in hell can you draft a 340lb NT that can't rush the passer in the 1st. He's a two down guy as of now.

2nd rd sure. I wouldn't want him in a trade down either.

I keep seeing Dalvin Tomlinson comps and that sounds about right.

I see zero reason why he can't be a three down player. We're talking about someone insanely athletic for his size. I think he's capable of playing one or two gap schemes, can hold up as a nose tackle or as a penetrating 3T. Just on pure effort level he's going to be pain for OLs to deal with.

T'Vondre Sweat had far bigger concerns about his size, conditioning and pass rush ability and all he's done is be a consistent monster for the Titans. In a redraft he'd be going early 1st round.

Ok I will be the Debbie downer here. I agree with NY because who the hell has coach k and this staff ever developed along the line? Bosa came in a pro. We need someone more polished technically. They have really whiffed on the d line picks over the years.

Who'd they whiff on besides Kinlaw?

Really? Solomon Thomas???

+ Show all quotes
I was gonna say Kentwan Balmer. But just saw that was in 2008. Where does the time go

2017:
1-3 Solomon Thomas (F-)
6-198 DJ Jones (A)

2018:
4-28 Kentavius Street (D)
5-223 Julian Taylor (D)

2019:
1-2 Nick Bosa (A)

2020:
1-14 Javon Kinlaw (F)

2021:
None

2022:
2-61 Drake Jackson (F)
6-220 Kalia Davis (D)

2023:
5-173 Robert Beal Jr. (D)

2024:
None

Yeah it's been pretty awful. 2 for 10. 20% hit rate.

Let's not go overboard with these grades. Solomon Thomas was not an F-, people just bury him because that was the Mahomes draft and he didn't live up to anything worth 3rd overall but he's still in the league and playing solid football.

We also don't know what would've happened with his career if his sister didn't kill herself. Odds are he never turns into someone worth that pick anyways but such tragedy is certainly an unfortune unseen variable.

Kinlaw and Jackson were both talented players whose careers were derailed by injuries. Kinlaw was a tough lesson for the team but Jackson was just bad luck. Doubt we'll see him again.

The other guys are later picks and hard to expect excellence from them.

However there have been plenty of players they've brought in via FA who haven't done much and turned their careers around. From Arden Key to Charles Omenihu and Clelin Ferrell.

Thomas was a terrible pick. Super awesome human being, but mediocre football player at best.

Aside bosa and jones they have mostly bombed on the d line.

I was wondering, the empire seems to favor Mason Graham, but its most likely he won't be there at 11, so how much of a drop off is there between Graham and Grant?

Originally posted by Cisco0623:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49erKing:

Originally posted by SolRebe1:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by Jakemall:

Originally posted by Cisco0623:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Like everyone else I recognize the potential. That said no way in hell can you draft a 340lb NT that can't rush the passer in the 1st. He's a two down guy as of now.

2nd rd sure. I wouldn't want him in a trade down either.

I keep seeing Dalvin Tomlinson comps and that sounds about right.

I see zero reason why he can't be a three down player. We're talking about someone insanely athletic for his size. I think he's capable of playing one or two gap schemes, can hold up as a nose tackle or as a penetrating 3T. Just on pure effort level he's going to be pain for OLs to deal with.

T'Vondre Sweat had far bigger concerns about his size, conditioning and pass rush ability and all he's done is be a consistent monster for the Titans. In a redraft he'd be going early 1st round.

Ok I will be the Debbie downer here. I agree with NY because who the hell has coach k and this staff ever developed along the line? Bosa came in a pro. We need someone more polished technically. They have really whiffed on the d line picks over the years.

Who'd they whiff on besides Kinlaw?

Really? Solomon Thomas???

I was gonna say Kentwan Balmer. But just saw that was in 2008. Where does the time go

+ Show all quotes
2017:
1-3 Solomon Thomas (F-)
6-198 DJ Jones (A)

2018:
4-28 Kentavius Street (D)
5-223 Julian Taylor (D)

2019:
1-2 Nick Bosa (A)

2020:
1-14 Javon Kinlaw (F)

2021:
None

2022:
2-61 Drake Jackson (F)
6-220 Kalia Davis (D)

2023:
5-173 Robert Beal Jr. (D)

2024:
None

Yeah it's been pretty awful. 2 for 10. 20% hit rate.

Let's not go overboard with these grades. Solomon Thomas was not an F-, people just bury him because that was the Mahomes draft and he didn't live up to anything worth 3rd overall but he's still in the league and playing solid football.

We also don't know what would've happened with his career if his sister didn't kill herself. Odds are he never turns into someone worth that pick anyways but such tragedy is certainly an unfortune unseen variable.

Kinlaw and Jackson were both talented players whose careers were derailed by injuries. Kinlaw was a tough lesson for the team but Jackson was just bad luck. Doubt we'll see him again.

The other guys are later picks and hard to expect excellence from them.

However there have been plenty of players they've brought in via FA who haven't done much and turned their careers around. From Arden Key to Charles Omenihu and Clelin Ferrell.

Thomas was a terrible pick. Super awesome human being, but mediocre football player at best.

Aside bosa and jones they have mostly bombed on the d line.

I think they look for elite traits (and all their picks had elite or above average traits) and figure they can coach them up. The problem is. It hasn't really worked out. It's pretty much why I have no interest in a DT at 11 besides Graham. It needs to be a no brainer pick, whenever they address the position. Their pro personnel scouting is better yielding Jordan Willis, Samsun Ebukam, Kerry Hyder, Arden Key, and Charles Omenihu. I'd almost rather they made trades for undervalued Dlinemen still on their rookie contract.

With that said, Grant at 11 is out.

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by Cisco0623:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49erKing:

Originally posted by SolRebe1:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by Jakemall:

Originally posted by Cisco0623:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Like everyone else I recognize the potential. That said no way in hell can you draft a 340lb NT that can't rush the passer in the 1st. He's a two down guy as of now.

2nd rd sure. I wouldn't want him in a trade down either.

I keep seeing Dalvin Tomlinson comps and that sounds about right.

I see zero reason why he can't be a three down player. We're talking about someone insanely athletic for his size. I think he's capable of playing one or two gap schemes, can hold up as a nose tackle or as a penetrating 3T. Just on pure effort level he's going to be pain for OLs to deal with.

T'Vondre Sweat had far bigger concerns about his size, conditioning and pass rush ability and all he's done is be a consistent monster for the Titans. In a redraft he'd be going early 1st round.

Ok I will be the Debbie downer here. I agree with NY because who the hell has coach k and this staff ever developed along the line? Bosa came in a pro. We need someone more polished technically. They have really whiffed on the d line picks over the years.

Who'd they whiff on besides Kinlaw?

Really? Solomon Thomas???

I was gonna say Kentwan Balmer. But just saw that was in 2008. Where does the time go

2017:
1-3 Solomon Thomas (F-)
6-198 DJ Jones (A)

2018:
4-28 Kentavius Street (D)
5-223 Julian Taylor (D)

2019:
1-2 Nick Bosa (A)

2020:
1-14 Javon Kinlaw (F)

2021:
None

2022:
2-61 Drake Jackson (F)
6-220 Kalia Davis (D)

2023:
5-173 Robert Beal Jr. (D)

2024:
None

Yeah it's been pretty awful. 2 for 10. 20% hit rate.

+ Show all quotes
Let's not go overboard with these grades. Solomon Thomas was not an F-, people just bury him because that was the Mahomes draft and he didn't live up to anything worth 3rd overall but he's still in the league and playing solid football.

We also don't know what would've happened with his career if his sister didn't kill herself. Odds are he never turns into someone worth that pick anyways but such tragedy is certainly an unfortune unseen variable.

Kinlaw and Jackson were both talented players whose careers were derailed by injuries. Kinlaw was a tough lesson for the team but Jackson was just bad luck. Doubt we'll see him again.

The other guys are later picks and hard to expect excellence from them.

However there have been plenty of players they've brought in via FA who haven't done much and turned their careers around. From Arden Key to Charles Omenihu and Clelin Ferrell.

Thomas was a terrible pick. Super awesome human being, but mediocre football player at best.

Aside bosa and jones they have mostly bombed on the d line.

I think they look for elite traits (and all their picks had elite or above average traits) and figure they can coach them up. The problem is. It hasn't really worked out. It's pretty much why I have no interest in a DT at 11 besides Graham. It needs to be a no brainer pick, whenever they address the position. Their pro personnel scouting is better yielding Jordan Willis, Samsun Ebukam, Kerry Hyder, Arden Key, and Charles Omenihu. I'd almost rather they made trades for undervalued Dlinemen still on their rookie contract.

With that said, Grant at 11 is out.

Agreed. Finding a DT who can stop the run and eat two blockers feels like it can be had in middle rounds (even mid to late). So far I am seeing Grant anywhere from 15 down to 50. I would not mind him in the second.

Originally posted by Cisco0623:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49erKing:

Originally posted by SolRebe1:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by Jakemall:

Originally posted by Cisco0623:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Like everyone else I recognize the potential. That said no way in hell can you draft a 340lb NT that can't rush the passer in the 1st. He's a two down guy as of now.

2nd rd sure. I wouldn't want him in a trade down either.

I keep seeing Dalvin Tomlinson comps and that sounds about right.

I see zero reason why he can't be a three down player. We're talking about someone insanely athletic for his size. I think he's capable of playing one or two gap schemes, can hold up as a nose tackle or as a penetrating 3T. Just on pure effort level he's going to be pain for OLs to deal with.

T'Vondre Sweat had far bigger concerns about his size, conditioning and pass rush ability and all he's done is be a consistent monster for the Titans. In a redraft he'd be going early 1st round.

Ok I will be the Debbie downer here. I agree with NY because who the hell has coach k and this staff ever developed along the line? Bosa came in a pro. We need someone more polished technically. They have really whiffed on the d line picks over the years.

Who'd they whiff on besides Kinlaw?

Really? Solomon Thomas???

I was gonna say Kentwan Balmer. But just saw that was in 2008. Where does the time go

+ Show all quotes
2017:
1-3 Solomon Thomas (F-)
6-198 DJ Jones (A)

2018:
4-28 Kentavius Street (D)
5-223 Julian Taylor (D)

2019:
1-2 Nick Bosa (A)

2020:
1-14 Javon Kinlaw (F)

2021:
None

2022:
2-61 Drake Jackson (F)
6-220 Kalia Davis (D)

2023:
5-173 Robert Beal Jr. (D)

2024:
None

Yeah it's been pretty awful. 2 for 10. 20% hit rate.

Let's not go overboard with these grades. Solomon Thomas was not an F-, people just bury him because that was the Mahomes draft and he didn't live up to anything worth 3rd overall but he's still in the league and playing solid football.

We also don't know what would've happened with his career if his sister didn't kill herself. Odds are he never turns into someone worth that pick anyways but such tragedy is certainly an unfortune unseen variable.

Kinlaw and Jackson were both talented players whose careers were derailed by injuries. Kinlaw was a tough lesson for the team but Jackson was just bad luck. Doubt we'll see him again.

The other guys are later picks and hard to expect excellence from them.

However there have been plenty of players they've brought in via FA who haven't done much and turned their careers around. From Arden Key to Charles Omenihu and Clelin Ferrell.

Thomas was a terrible pick. Super awesome human being, but mediocre football player at best.

Aside bosa and jones they have mostly bombed on the d line.

Thomas was a terrible pick in hindsight. He still wasn't an F- type pick. I can show you some real F- picks in the top of the draft. Guys who never see a 2nd contract.

Jamarcus Russell went #1 in the first round that saw 4 HOFers drafted in the top 15.
Jason Smith went #2 overall in 2009 and never saw a deal after his rookie one.
Aaron Curry who was considered a blue chip LB prospect bombed so bad he couldn't stick past his rookie deal.

This team tends to learn from their mistakes so looking back to their first draft isn't even indicative of where they stand today.

Originally posted by DarkShinobiX:
I was wondering, the empire seems to favor Mason Graham, but its most likely he won't be there at 11, so how much of a drop off is there between Graham and Grant?

Grant is not a legit pass rusher right now. A lot of potential. Graham is legit.

Graham is looked at a locked in top 10 pick. Grant is more of an end of the 1st early 2nd guy.

I've seen a lot of mocks with Grant near the end of the first. I don't see it because he isn't a pass rusher. But he is my guy in the 2nd.

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
I've seen a lot of mocks with Grant near the end of the first. I don't see it because he isn't a pass rusher. But he is my guy in the 2nd.

Yeah, I like him. But you're right he is going in the 1st round. We have some options later like Tyliek Williams, Pegues, Phillips and Caldwell. Give me Walter Nolen in the 1st and Caldwell after the 4th round.

Trade back to late 20s and draft him or Derrick Harmon. Would be able to grab 3-4 extra picks in the process in rounds 2-4 to grab even more DL.

Way better than picking Nolen at #11 only and getting no extra picks.

Originally posted by Ezekiel38:
Trade back to late 20s and draft him or Derrick Harmon. Would be able to grab 3-4 extra picks in the process in rounds 2-4 to grab even more DL.

Way better than picking Nolen at #11 only and getting no extra picks.

If this is the plan, I'd be in. We could take multiple shots at DT, LB, and G/C.

Originally posted by Ezekiel38:
Trade back to late 20s and draft him or Derrick Harmon. Would be able to grab 3-4 extra picks in the process in rounds 2-4 to grab even more DL.

Way better than picking Nolen at #11 only and getting no extra picks.

If they think Nolen is better than Grant, go get Nolen.

People gotta realize that teams have to want to move up all the same. I'm down for trading back, I just don't know if teams are gonna want to move up, especially from the 20s to 11.

I like Grant but I'll take Caldwell on day 3.

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
If this is the plan, I'd be in. We could take multiple shots at DT, LB, and G/C.

And we know Kyle wants and needs another WR somewhere in this draft. Maybe another RB. So the added capital will come handy.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
If they think Nolen is better than Grant, go get Nolen.

People gotta realize that teams have to want to move up all the same. I'm down for trading back, I just don't know if teams are gonna want to move up, especially from the 20s to 11.

I like Grant but I'll take Caldwell on day 3.

Yes! I like to wait and address NT later. We have a couple options for sure.

Originally posted by frankieuc68:

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
If this is the plan, I'd be in. We could take multiple shots at DT, LB, and G/C.

And we know Kyle wants and needs another WR somewhere in this draft. Maybe another RB. So the added capital will come handy.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
If they think Nolen is better than Grant, go get Nolen.

People gotta realize that teams have to want to move up all the same. I'm down for trading back, I just don't know if teams are gonna want to move up, especially from the 20s to 11.

I like Grant but I'll take Caldwell on day 3.

Yes! I like to wait and address NT later. We have a couple options for sure.

I wish Gray would've worked out. That deep threat hits different. You cant just blindly committ to 8 in the box or say you are going to play man. That and a 2nd TE that is a good blocker but still offer something in the passing game would be great.

It seems popular to bag on the Solomon Thomas pick but trading down a spot with the bears so they could draft trubisky was money and one of those picks converted to Fred Warner. As for who they took with the third overall pick sometimes the deck is just stacked against you. The only way for that pick to have been successful in hind sight and make sense at the time based on need would have been picking a guy predominately mocked in the 10-20 range as the third overall. You put every other gm in that same exact spot and you compare results and you might not have a single case where somebody else does better than Solomon Thomas and a bunch of picks. Of course they have screwed up many high draft picks but this wasn't one of them. Stacked deck and still managed to come out ok.

I'm out on Grant in the first round. Now if he's within reach at #43 then i'm down to do whatever it takes to get him. I don't think you spend a premium pick on a run stopping DT who could develop into a pass rusher.
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