Eric Mangini Thread

Originally posted by monsterzero789:
Mangenius strikes again!

Mangina stroked again.

There's a reason he was NOWHERE in the league before the geniuses in the higher ranks decided to bring him in as an "advisor". How many times does a guy need to fail before people finally figure out that it's probably better to go with a different person?

Originally posted by JBrack:
Im not trying to be a jerk but I know football and I played it. Its not as elaborate as people think. The terminology gets fuzzy but the basic principles are the same. Fangios base defense was actually very simple. It was a very basic man defense with a two deep set. Meaning two safties over the top. The under means to sit under the wrs to create plays. But the key ingredient is the saftey. If played right, you have the reciver covered over the top and underneath requiring a perfect throw. Remember our defense wasnt perfect. We gave up a lot of yards. But we at least forced them to make the perfect throw everytime. But we were also never out of position which also allowed us to rally to the ball.

We also used to let our Lbs roam and make plays. Now everyone has an assignment doing lord who knows what. I think I heard Bowmans name twice today and one was on a personal foul penalty. Mangini just doesn't play smart football! He tries to be tricky and wants to win because of his efforts and not the players.

I honestly don't know what he is coaching because he has players looking lost! I guess thats why they call him mangenius. Because he thinks to much! Just play your game and who cares?

We dont need to disguise anything. We never did with Fangio much. But we still won because its a very basic defense and concept which allows players to play and not think. Our defense is like a science experiment or something. All he has to do is watch the film and call the same plays. We ran like 3 plays 75% of the time.

Anyways thats my rant, I could keep going but by the time I finished it would be next Sunday and Id have to start all over again.

Thank you for responding. You sounded a bit full of yourself, which is why I posted as I did. Thl is pretty knowledgable. It is clear the defense is struggling with the new schemes brought in by Mangini but it might take more than three game for the team to be fluid in carrying them out. Right now the safeties and Bowman are all over the place. I kept my eyes on Bowman for quite a while to see if the Cardinals were keying on him and going away from his area, but to my eyes it seemed he and the safeties were perhaps doing too many things and nothing smoothly.

So I do agree that Mangini may be trying too hard to disguise the coverages. It's easy to criticize when things don't go well so I hesitate to call his system a flop...yet. I want to give the team, both offense and defense half the year to get it together and then make a more educated comment. Said this early in the off season--difficult first halfl and the team will be lucky if they are 4-4. Then the second half is much easier and they may be in sync by then and have a chance at the playoffs.

PS--there are certainly specific things that have happened in both games open to criticsm...don't mean to imply that I don't agree with you on that. Allowing the Cardinals to have Lynch isolated with Fitzgerald was one of the major glitches I noticed. If they get to the QB...fine, but that's a bad when the blitz fails. And against good QBs it can be brutal!

That's what I said, but then figured they knew more than I did.

Originally posted by JBrack:
Im not trying to be a jerk but I know football and I played it. Its not as elaborate as people think. The terminology gets fuzzy but the basic principles are the same. Fangios base defense was actually very simple. It was a very basic man defense with a two deep set. Meaning two safties over the top. The under means to sit under the wrs to create plays. But the key ingredient is the saftey. If played right, you have the reciver covered over the top and underneath requiring a perfect throw. Remember our defense wasnt perfect. We gave up a lot of yards. But we at least forced them to make the perfect throw everytime. But we were also never out of position which also allowed us to rally to the ball.

We also used to let our Lbs roam and make plays. Now everyone has an assignment doing lord who knows what. I think I heard Bowmans name twice today and one was on a personal foul penalty. Mangini just doesn't play smart football! He tries to be tricky and wants to win because of his efforts and not the players.

I honestly don't know what he is coaching because he has players looking lost! I guess thats why they call him mangenius. Because he thinks to much! Just play your game and who cares?

We dont need to disguise anything. We never did with Fangio much. But we still won because its a very basic defense and concept which allows players to play and not think. Our defense is like a science experiment or something. All he has to do is watch the film and call the same plays. We ran like 3 plays 75% of the time.

Anyways thats my rant, I could keep going but by the time I finished it would be next Sunday and Id have to start all over again.

What do you mean, 'now everyone has an assignment'? Are there defensive calls where guys just do whatever they want? Of course everyone has an assignment. And Fangio didn't run a simple defense. They were pattern matching. That is not basic man coverage.

Mangini is just spot dropping his zone defenders and Palmer and Fitz where finding the quiet areas all game long - behind the LB, in front of the safeties. Mangini pulled his safeties back from all the funky defensive fronts they were showing versus PIT. The 49ers kept everything in front of them and Palmer dissected all the seams.

Now we know why he hasn't been a DC for years

this was my least favorite hire and it's proving true why

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by JBrack:

Im not trying to be a jerk but I know football and I played it. Its not as elaborate as people think. The terminology gets fuzzy but the basic principles are the same. Fangios base defense was actually very simple. It was a very basic man defense with a two deep set. Meaning two safties over the top. The under means to sit under the wrs to create plays. But the key ingredient is the saftey. If played right, you have the reciver covered over the top and underneath requiring a perfect throw. Remember our defense wasnt perfect. We gave up a lot of yards. But we at least forced them to make the perfect throw everytime. But we were also never out of position which also allowed us to rally to the ball.

We also used to let our Lbs roam and make plays. Now everyone has an assignment doing lord who knows what. I think I heard Bowmans name twice today and one was on a personal foul penalty. Mangini just doesn't play smart football! He tries to be tricky and wants to win because of his efforts and not the players.

I honestly don't know what he is coaching because he has players looking lost! I guess thats why they call him mangenius. Because he thinks to much! Just play your game and who cares?

We dont need to disguise anything. We never did with Fangio much. But we still won because its a very basic defense and concept which allows players to play and not think. Our defense is like a science experiment or something. All he has to do is watch the film and call the same plays. We ran like 3 plays 75% of the time.

Anyways thats my rant, I could keep going but by the time I finished it would be next Sunday and Id have to start all over again.

What do you mean, 'now everyone has an assignment'? Are there defensive calls where guys just do whatever they want? Of course everyone has an assignment. And Fangio didn't run a simple defense. They were pattern matching. That is not basic man coverage.

Mangini is just spot dropping his zone defenders and Palmer and Fitz where finding the quiet areas all game long - behind the LB, in front of the safeties. Mangini pulled his safeties back from all the funky defensive fronts they were showing versus PIT. The 49ers kept everything in front of them and Palmer dissected all the seams.

Disected the seams? Bro what seams? All I saw was green grass around Arizona Wrs on nearly every play.

Fangios defense is not complex at all and it rarely blitzes. It just requires communication among the players to cover there areas.

Its funny you you refer to LB assignments. Its a well known fact that Willis and Bowman were isolated to freelance and make plays. Thats what we call roaming. Allowing our LBs to play a more read and react scheme matched their athleticism.

Spot dropping? Why? Does he have a crystal ball?

Lately the Defence looks like that electric football game, where the men are all running around aimlessly

Originally posted by JBrack:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by JBrack:
Im not trying to be a jerk but I know football and I played it. Its not as elaborate as people think. The terminology gets fuzzy but the basic principles are the same. Fangios base defense was actually very simple. It was a very basic man defense with a two deep set. Meaning two safties over the top. The under means to sit under the wrs to create plays. But the key ingredient is the saftey. If played right, you have the reciver covered over the top and underneath requiring a perfect throw. Remember our defense wasnt perfect. We gave up a lot of yards. But we at least forced them to make the perfect throw everytime. But we were also never out of position which also allowed us to rally to the ball.

We also used to let our Lbs roam and make plays. Now everyone has an assignment doing lord who knows what. I think I heard Bowmans name twice today and one was on a personal foul penalty. Mangini just doesn't play smart football! He tries to be tricky and wants to win because of his efforts and not the players.

I honestly don't know what he is coaching because he has players looking lost! I guess thats why they call him mangenius. Because he thinks to much! Just play your game and who cares?

We dont need to disguise anything. We never did with Fangio much. But we still won because its a very basic defense and concept which allows players to play and not think. Our defense is like a science experiment or something. All he has to do is watch the film and call the same plays. We ran like 3 plays 75% of the time.

Anyways thats my rant, I could keep going but by the time I finished it would be next Sunday and Id have to start all over again.

What do you mean, 'now everyone has an assignment'? Are there defensive calls where guys just do whatever they want? Of course everyone has an assignment. And Fangio didn't run a simple defense. They were pattern matching. That is not basic man coverage.

Mangini is just spot dropping his zone defenders and Palmer and Fitz where finding the quiet areas all game long - behind the LB, in front of the safeties. Mangini pulled his safeties back from all the funky defensive fronts they were showing versus PIT. The 49ers kept everything in front of them and Palmer dissected all the seams.

Disected the seams? Bro what seams? All I saw was green grass around Arizona Wrs on nearly every play.

Fangios defense is not complex at all and it rarely blitzes. It just requires communication among the players to cover there areas.

Its funny you you refer to LB assignments. Its a well known fact that Willis and Bowman were isolated to freelance and make plays. Thats what we call roaming. Allowing our LBs to play a more read and react scheme matched their athleticism.

Spot dropping? Why? Does he have a crystal ball?

We disagree on whether Fangio's defense was complex or not. To me, speaking only to the backend, it was complex as the 7 in coverage were asked to read, react and man up in coverage based on how the WR routes were distributed. around the field. That's pattern matching. I agree with you his fronts were vanilla and so were his blitz packages.

About the seams in the ARI game, you referred to it yourself. The 'green grass around ARI WRs'. Did you think the 49ers were in man and giving up huge separation? Nope. They were in zone coverage and the seams I'm referring to are the areas between zones.

Did you know what I meant by spot dropping? Not sure what you are saying with the crystal ball.

someone tell me why is mangini so enamored with tampa 2 ? Ive seen it today many times and it was awful against receiver just sitting there in front of zones making easy grabs.

Originally posted by Viperboy:
Lately the Defence looks like that electric football game, where the men are all running around aimlessly

LOL...yeah, I think this is what I've been seeing! Maybe we should unplug the game...or plug into 220?

The zones are atrocious. Way too much cover 2. It looked like guys weren't even being covered

Originally posted by lamontb:
The zones are atrocious. Way too much cover 2. It looked like guys weren't even being covered

Game was a disaster, but still interested to see the coaches film, as well as the weekly analysis thread from thl and jonnydel.

One concern from the past 2 weeks was the 49ers abandoning the pattern match coverages that made them so successful under Fangio. Mangini has been using more "spot-dropping", defenders just dropping into an area of the field and squatting without reading the routes. Much simpler, and highly flawed at this level. Curious to see if it was more of the same against the Cards.

Pass defense has been burnt toast the past 2 games, and it goes beyond not being able to get pressure. There were way too many receivers running WIDE OPEN all day.