Eric Mangini Thread

Originally posted by socalniner:
Maybe we'll be good enough to beat the Raiders

LOL!

I think we'll see a major improvement with the Raiders this year based on the way they finished last year.

The 9ers cap situation isn't as bad as it might seem. I expect Brooks and Dahl to be released outright. That clears close to 6 million IIRC. Stevie Johnson isn't going to make 6+ mil next year so hell have his contract restructured. Probably will restructure Pat too and add a couple years onto it. Aldon could get an extension though they might wait and see how he does over the next year. Depending on what Justin decides to do that is another 3.5 million that will come available. All told the 9ers should be able to clear 16-20 million or so for free agency. Keep 6 of that for rookies leaving 10-14 mil for use on some of Gore, Cully, Cox, Skuta and some mid priced/bargain FA's.

Originally posted by pd24:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by Harbaalke:

Im basing it on our cap situation and we drafted CB heavily last draft

I still don't see them letting go of both Cox and Culliver. One of those guys will be retained.

I hope we can keep Cook also

With Mangini on board, I can see Cox getting more valued than Cully. Being that Cox is a better pattern match defender. We'll see.

To be honest I think we should use money on a position we lacked last year. Brock,Johnson,Ward,Acker,Raeser,Cromartie then draft/free agency. Cook on a minimum deal possibly.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Luckycharms:

Originally posted by thl408:

Defensive front stays rooted in a 3-4 base. Defensive backs are most likely to continue and employ pattern match principles. I think it's a safe hire that serves to not deviate too much from the previous scheme under Fangio. There's no all22 film from 2010, which was the last time Mangini held a HC position.

Also thl I read somewhere that Mangini runs a little different 3-4 from Fangio in terms of the NT position, he runs a 2 gap 3-4 which might require us to get a bigger NT to eat up blocks where as Fangio's was a 1 gap. Do you think Williams or Dorsey could be those type of players or are they too small? When you get a chance can you touch on this subject and if this is a big deal in terms of our overall defense or is it something minor. Sorry if it's already been brought up, like i said in a previous post I haven't been able to go through all 25 pages of this thread yet.

On page 21, post #310, we go into that exact subject when pd24 brings it up. Let me know what you think. It think Ian and Dorsey are undersized when looking at the "prototypical" NT. Were they able to succeed because they had beasts in RayMac and Justin flanking them? Size shouldn't matter as long as they are effective but how much of a role did RayMac and Justin play?

Yeah I'm just getting a chance to read over those pages. When I look back at our best run stopping defense (2011) we had Sopoaga running the NT and he still isn't a huge NT, he only weighs 303 so I tend to think it's the players around them. I think if Williams is healthy he can play the NT in mangini's system. J smith and Ray Mac were probly top 5 best DE tandem in the nfl 2011-2014, and we know Willis and bowman are the best ILB combo in the game especially stopping the run. I would prefer to keep Dial and Dorsey at DE where I think they fit. So to answer the question I think it's the front 7 as a whole being stellar in run support. Losing j smith and Ray Mac opens up a little bit of a question mark so I guess we'll have to take the wait and see approach. I think we should pick up a NT in the draft in rounds 3-5 to groom and back up Williams. We know Aldon is pretty good against the run but the question will be how Lynch, Dial, and Tank are against it playing 90% of the snaps a game.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by pd24:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by Harbaalke:
Im basing it on our cap situation and we drafted CB heavily last draft

I still don't see them letting go of both Cox and Culliver. One of those guys will be retained.

I hope we can keep Cook also

With Mangini on board, I can see Cox getting more valued than Cully. Being that Cox is a better pattern match defender. We'll see.

That's actually a great point. Then again, if Mangini likes to bring blitzes he might like Cully in press and run him of that for CB blitzes. This is going to be fun to watch. Fangio blitzed the least of any DC. On offense we are 25th in points. Those are two areas we could start to see more aggression finally.

Originally posted by PhillyNiner:

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by pd24:
Does this mean we go bigger at the NT position?

This is slightly outdated (March 2014), but it lists the average weight (pounds) of all the 3-4 fronts in the league. The orange highlights show that the 49ers averaged the lightest at that position.


http://www.thefalcoholic.com/2014/3/17/5509510/nfl-34-defenses-atlanta-falcons-mike-nolan

edit: can't count. The 49ers are not the lightest at DE.

That's one of the reason our run defense suffered this year

We have never secured a proper NT in the whole time we have run this defense. Cowboy and Ray Mac helped hide this fact and elite LB play made it virtually not matter....but it was exposed this year with injuries being what they were.

Thanks for all this guys. Has it been confirmed Mangini prefers a 2 gap NT? Also weren't the DE's more active as pass rushers too?

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by pd24:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by Harbaalke:
Im basing it on our cap situation and we drafted CB heavily last draft

I still don't see them letting go of both Cox and Culliver. One of those guys will be retained.

I hope we can keep Cook also

With Mangini on board, I can see Cox getting more valued than Cully. Being that Cox is a better pattern match defender. We'll see.

That's actually a great point. Then again, if Mangini likes to bring blitzes he might like Cully in press and run him of that for CB blitzes. This is going to be fun to watch. Fangio blitzed the least of any DC. On offense we are 25th in points. Those are two areas we could start to see more aggression finally.

It would be nice to see some more blitzs finally called on 3rd downs. The idea of having Aldon and Lynch coming off the edges with Willis or Bow coming up the gut on 3rd and short with our CBs lined up in press will be a breath of fresh air.

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by pd24:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by Harbaalke:
Im basing it on our cap situation and we drafted CB heavily last draft

I still don't see them letting go of both Cox and Culliver. One of those guys will be retained.

I hope we can keep Cook also

With Mangini on board, I can see Cox getting more valued than Cully. Being that Cox is a better pattern match defender. We'll see.

That's actually a great point. Then again, if Mangini likes to bring blitzes he might like Cully in press and run him of that for CB blitzes. This is going to be fun to watch. Fangio blitzed the least of any DC. On offense we are 25th in points. Those are two areas we could start to see more aggression finally.

It would be nice to see some more blitzs finally called on 3rd downs. The idea of having Aldon and Lynch coming off the edges with Willis or Bow coming up the gut on 3rd and short with our CBs lined up in press will be a breath of fresh air.

No question. And Bethea is a proven stud on blitzes and Reid looks good also. Lots of options.

Originally posted by thl408:
With Mangini on board, I can see Cox getting more valued than Cully. Being that Cox is a better pattern match defender. We'll see.

Music to my ears! It also may be time for Cully to be swept out as they try to clean up the roster.

Originally posted by dtg_9er:

Originally posted by thl408:
With Mangini on board, I can see Cox getting more valued than Cully. Being that Cox is a better pattern match defender. We'll see.

Music to my ears! It also may be time for Cully to be swept out as they try to clean up the roster.

I can't wait to see what direction we start to go in once we get an OC...what philosophy we will employ and how that will affect the personnel moving forward.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by dtg_9er:

Originally posted by thl408:
With Mangini on board, I can see Cox getting more valued than Cully. Being that Cox is a better pattern match defender. We'll see.

Music to my ears! It also may be time for Cully to be swept out as they try to clean up the roster.

I can't wait to see what direction we start to go in once we get an OC...what philosophy we will employ and how that will affect the personnel moving forward.

Agree! It will be interesting to see if Baalke drafts differently toward the new scheme. If it's a Coryell offense he may see the need for more vertical receivers, though I thought the Harbaugh offense could have used them as well.

Looking at the personnel is a bit confusing as I still believe they are somewhat mismatched for a particular scheme and need to either use the various assets or make changes.

Will be watching:

• TE--will they be blockers or receiving threats...or injured!
• WR--does Baalke go after a threat in the first round? Or will they continue to build an all around solid but not scary receiver corps.
• OL--do they keep Iupati? Boone at OT? I've read that zone requires so much practice that it needs to be used almost all the time to stay in sync.
• QB--can a new OC help Kaepernick learn and improve?

Wish they could start two weeks ago...LOL! But with the limited practices in the current CBA I'm a bit worried this transition will take more than one off season.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by dtg_9er:

Originally posted by thl408:
With Mangini on board, I can see Cox getting more valued than Cully. Being that Cox is a better pattern match defender. We'll see.

Music to my ears! It also may be time for Cully to be swept out as they try to clean up the roster.

I can't wait to see what direction we start to go in once we get an OC...what philosophy we will employ and how that will affect the personnel moving forward.

do you guys think justins decision whether to come back or not has a major issue on the draft in regards to the line?

Originally posted by dtg_9er:
Agree! It will be interesting to see if Baalke drafts differently toward the new scheme. If it's a Coryell offense he may see the need for more vertical receivers, though I thought the Harbaugh offense could have used them as well.

Looking at the personnel is a bit confusing as I still believe they are somewhat mismatched for a particular scheme and need to either use the various assets or make changes.

Will be watching:

• TE--will they be blockers or receiving threats...or injured!
• WR--does Baalke go after a threat in the first round? Or will they continue to build an all around solid but not scary receiver corps.
• OL--do they keep Iupati? Boone at OT? I've read that zone requires so much practice that it needs to be used almost all the time to stay in sync.
• QB--can a new OC help Kaepernick learn and improve?

Wish they could start two weeks ago...LOL! But with the limited practices in the current CBA I'm a bit worried this transition will take more than one off season.

well at least ck is spending alot of time working on the little things within his own game here in the off season,, maybe that will be a few less things he has to worry about when its time to learn whatever system they are going to put it??. of course if we have a scheme to actually fit the players strengths ( unlkike former regimes)maybe it will not be that much of a learning curve??

Originally posted by cciowa:
do you guys think justins decision whether to come back or not has a major issue on the draft in regards to the line?

Could have a major impact. Losing Smith would be the biggest loss I can imagine for the team, even greater than Willis and/or Bowman. At least those guys have really good backups. There isn't another DL on the team with the combination of strength, quickness and knowledge of Justin Smith!

Originally posted by cciowa:
well at least ck is spending alot of time working on the little things within his own game here in the off season,, maybe that will be a few less things he has to worry about when its time to learn whatever system they are going to put it??. of course if we have a scheme to actually fit the players strengths ( unlkike former regimes)maybe it will not be that much of a learning curve??

Am hoping this is a big off season for Kaepernick and that he makes major strides next year!