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Originally posted by thl408:You guys' points make a lot of sense now that Mangini has been retained and made DC. What he learned under Belichick jives a lot with the scheme Fangio ran in the 13 and 14 seasons. I was looking at the first handful of games in the 2011 season and I didn't see any pattern reading in the secondary. I don't know if it's because of how the offseason leading up to Harbaughs first season as HC was lockout shortened and Fangio didn't have time to implement the exotic coverage schemes. I'm now curious enough to know when the exotic coverages were implemented.
It could be (maybe) that once Fangio wanted to get more complex with coverages, that Magini was brought on to give his expertise in the pattern match schemes. The 49ers for sure ran it in 2012. After 2012, Mangini was brought on and there was a lot of pattern matching in 13 and 14. When I have some time, I'll go back and look at just exactly when the 49ers began to employ the exotic split coverages into their defensive scheme.
Originally posted by Big_Daddy:
Originally posted by thl408:
You guys' points make a lot of sense now that Mangini has been retained and made DC. What he learned under Belichick jives a lot with the scheme Fangio ran in the 13 and 14 seasons. I was looking at the first handful of games in the 2011 season and I didn't see any pattern reading in the secondary. I don't know if it's because of how the offseason leading up to Harbaughs first season as HC was lockout shortened and Fangio didn't have time to implement the exotic coverage schemes. I'm now curious enough to know when the exotic coverages were implemented.
It could be (maybe) that once Fangio wanted to get more complex with coverages, that Magini was brought on to give his expertise in the pattern match schemes. The 49ers for sure ran it in 2012. After 2012, Mangini was brought on and there was a lot of pattern matching in 13 and 14. When I have some time, I'll go back and look at just exactly when the 49ers began to employ the exotic split coverages into their defensive scheme.
He definitely changed the pass defense over time. 2011 felt like a lot of man up and 2 deep back. It was an early criticism of mine.
After we picked up Eric Reid, it seemed our defense got more complex. We still didn't bring great pressure besides Aldon but we held up on the back end
Chris Law @ChrisLaw
Cardinals HC @BruceArians says their new Defensive Coordinator will be hired from within. #Cardinals will make announcement next wk #REshow
Originally posted by boast:
good article posted by Valrod in the PL
http://blog.sfgate.com/49ers/2015/01/26/eric-mangini-and-the-2005-patriots-defense-what-happened/
Eric Mangini and the 2005 Patriots defense: What happened? http://t.co/bUyyYPG8Bu #49ers
— Eric Branch (@Eric_Branch) January 26, 2015
Originally posted by boast:
good article posted by Valrod in the PL
http://blog.sfgate.com/49ers/2015/01/26/eric-mangini-and-the-2005-patriots-defense-what-happened/
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by boast:
good article posted by Valrod in the PL
http://blog.sfgate.com/49ers/2015/01/26/eric-mangini-and-the-2005-patriots-defense-what-happened/
Good perspective:
OK, you get the idea. The 2005 Patriots were just a bit banged up.
That said, injuries happen. Just ask the 2014 49ers, whose injury ravaged defense had 20 different starters and still ranked fifth in the NFL in yards allowed under since-departed coordinator Vic Fangio (The 49ers, however, actually allowed 340 points, two more than the '05 Patriots).
Originally posted by dtg_9er:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by boast:
good article posted by Valrod in the PL
http://blog.sfgate.com/49ers/2015/01/26/eric-mangini-and-the-2005-patriots-defense-what-happened/
Good perspective:
OK, you get the idea. The 2005 Patriots were just a bit banged up.
That said, injuries happen. Just ask the 2014 49ers, whose injury ravaged defense had 20 different starters and still ranked fifth in the NFL in yards allowed under since-departed coordinator Vic Fangio (The 49ers, however, actually allowed 340 points, two more than the '05 Patriots).
If any team has been more dinged up than the 2014 niners...bet they weren't 8-8! LOL!
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by jimmythegreekjr:
That makes sense. Mangini could have been hired while we were waiting.
Its hard to get excited about the hire, but I can't really get all that down on it since he does have a pretty strong defensive background and if you look at his background and how Belichick pretty much treated him like a son of sorts, there's certainly the potential for him to do well. His biggest issue IMO was his maturity, he was hired as a head coach at a very young age and when he failed at that, he was immediately rehired by another shoddy, downtrodden franchise which I think is the worst possible thing that could have happened.
Now that he's been out in the wilderness so to speak, maybe something has clicked upstairs, I guess that's all we can hope for really but if the guy was causing massive problems behind the scenes, I really doubt Tomsula would have wanted to retain him.
TBH, I got the feeling fromm day 1 and Fangio's comments, IIRC, aligned more with the idea Mangini was hired to provide additional insight for Fangio...then Roman...and then kept on staff with the only opening we had (TE). My personal feeling is that Baalke loved his defensive mind and has kept him on staff this entire time just for this role...DC. Looking at how Baalke works, this is his kind of move and I wasn't surprised by it at all. I hated to lose the proven coaches we had for an "unknown" but perhaps, within the FO, that "unknown" to us was actually a "known." We have a tendency to develop a farm system internally with players...from the PS to starters, over two years, the ACL club, etc. Perhaps Baalke was taking that same approach with his coaching staff as well.
You guys' points make a lot of sense now that Mangini has been retained and made DC. What he learned under Belichick jives a lot with the scheme Fangio ran in the 13 and 14 seasons. I was looking at the first handful of games in the 2011 season and I didn't see any pattern reading in the secondary. I don't know if it's because of how the offseason leading up to Harbaughs first season as HC was lockout shortened and Fangio didn't have time to implement the exotic coverage schemes. I'm now curious enough to know when the exotic coverages were implemented.
It could be (maybe) that once Fangio wanted to get more complex with coverages, that Magini was brought on to give his expertise in the pattern match schemes. The 49ers for sure ran it in 2012. After 2012, Mangini was brought on and there was a lot of pattern matching in 13 and 14. When I have some time, I'll go back and look at just exactly when the 49ers began to employ the exotic split coverages into their defensive scheme.
Originally posted by thl408:
Agreed. I've only looked at the first 5 or so games in the 2011 season and I saw mainly straight up man and spot dropping zone coverages. I saw very little spot dropping zone in '13 and '14. I'll go over the rest of 2011 and 2012. I know in 2012 they were pattern matching, but I don't know if it was as frequent as in 13 and 14.
The current timeline as I currently understand it. I hope to fill in the blanks sometime this week.
2011 (first 5 games): no exotic coverages
2012: 49ers did have exotic coverages, but not sure of the frequency.
2013 offseason: Mangini comes on board
2013 and 2014: lots of exotic coverages.
When using the term "exotic coverages" I am referring to pattern matching and/or split coverages where one side of the field is playing a certain coverage and the other side is playing a different coverage. This messes with QBs alot, but is hard to teach and requires very smart safeties who are responsible for calling out the coverage they feel is best suited for the defense, given the down/distance/scouting/formation that the offense is showing presnap.
