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Eric Mangini Thread

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Eric Mangini Thread

Originally posted by Constantine:
Does Some our players believe in this

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000494015/article/eric-mangini-aiming-to-create-confusion-with-49ers-d

This is all you need to know: 49ers safety Antoine Bethea said, via CSN Bay Area. "Coach Mangini, his thing is we're going to cause confusion. The opposing offense isn't going to know what we're going to be able to do each down. It could be bringing the pressure. It could be dropping eight into coverage. But it's just keeping the offense on their heels. However, you want to look at it, I think it's going to be a good deal for our defense."

Also Mangini had a nice 1on1 interview that gives your further insight into our philosophy. Yes, Amoeba Defense is a good term for it...the ability to morph on the fly as needed. If I had our personnel I'd do the same! Soooo much you can do with it.

But in all I think it will be similar to Fangio's with a foundation of off coverage schemes but with more exotic and a bigger focus on dictating an offense vs. just reacting to it.

They always say, "Take what the defense gives you." It sounds like Mangini wants to make it harder to figure that out both from an OC's game plan building perspective and pre-snap and in-play for QBs.

And like Bethea said, I think that's a good deal!

"We've got a lot of guys that can play," Dorsey told The San Francisco Chronicle. "There are a lot of young guys that are hungry, so there's a lot of good competition and guys are working hard. There shouldn't be too much of a letdown."
[ Edited by NCommand on May 25, 2015 at 8:22 AM ]
Originally posted by NCommand:
This is all you need to know: 49ers safety Antoine Bethea said, via CSN Bay Area. "Coach Mangini, his thing is we're going to cause confusion. The opposing offense isn't going to know what we're going to be able to do each down. It could be bringing the pressure. It could be dropping eight into coverage. But it's just keeping the offense on their heels. However, you want to look at it, I think it's going to be a good deal for our defense."

Also Mangini had a nice 1on1 interview that gives your further insight into our philosophy. Yes, Amoeba Defense is a good term for it...the ability to morph on the fly as needed. If I had our personnel I'd do the same! Soooo much you can do with it.

But in all I think it will be similar to Fangio's with a foundation of off coverage schemes but with more exotic and a bigger focus on dictating an offense vs. just reacting to it.

They always say, "Take what the defense gives you." It sounds like Mangini wants to make it harder to figure that out both from an OC's game plan building perspective and pre-snap and in-play for QBs.

And like Bethea said, I think that's a good deal!

"We've got a lot of guys that can play," Dorsey told The San Francisco Chronicle. "There are a lot of young guys that are hungry, so there's a lot of good competition and guys are working hard. There shouldn't be too much of a letdown."

Gotcha, do u think he will keep us in top ten defence....
Originally posted by Constantine:
Gotcha, do u think he will keep us in top ten defence....

With the talent we have we should remain top 5 hovering around top 10 to start the year while the defense gels and masters the playbook (new terminology/scheme).
[ Edited by NCommand on May 26, 2015 at 6:31 AM ]
I wish we would had kept vic but im going to give mangenius a chance.
Originally posted by jreff22:
My fear is in making things complicated we may be outsmarting ourselves. This philosophy leaves a lot of room for player error.
indeed
Originally posted by pdizo916:
I wish we would had kept vic but im going to give mangenius a chance.

Not like you have a choice
Originally posted by DonnieDarko:
Originally posted by pdizo916:
I wish we would had kept vic but im going to give mangenius a chance.

Not like you have a choice

Great, defensive confusion! This works, until it doesn't, we have had success, and so have the Sea-f*gs, by keeping our defense simple, many also rans in the NFL still cling to the defensive confusion strategy, this can cause some big plays both ways. I am not excited about this philosophic change.


I am however pretty pumped to see that our offense ran screen as its first play in OTA's, and that the zone block is making a come back!

Go Niners, if anything this next season will be interesting!
I think fans are assuming "confusion" means confusing ourselves. All it really means is that Mangini wants to be less predictable. Sound familiar?

We'll still be running all the same coverage schemes as thl408 highlighted below (and in his thread):

Defensive Overview and Cornerback techniques - - - Post #3
MoFC versus MoFO - - - Post #4
Cover 0 - - - Post #5
Cover 1/ Cover 1 Robber - - - Post #6
Cover 2 Man - - - Post #7
Cover 2 Zone - - - Post #8
Tampa 2 - - - Post #9
Cover 3 - - - Post #10
Cover 4 - - - Post #11
Quarters coverage - - - Post #12
Cover 6 - - - Post #13
Pattern Matching - - - Post #14

Read more at http://www.49erswebzone.com/forum/niners/179447-film-analysis/#Hr7YVJusvyOeMVcy.99

Again, the difference will be on being less predictable and bringing more exotic blitzes at times. The coverage schemes will be the same too...WHEN those are called may be different. More dictating of the offense vs. just sitting back, pattern-matching in off coverage (which is difficult to do as a unit). If we ever need to go back and play disciplined, more vanilla off coverage, we already know we can do that pretty easily.

I think Mangini wants to utilize the tools we have...wants to use ALL of them. For instance, use Tartt as a robber in DIME, the 4-man pass rushing rotation of Brooks/Lynch and Aldon/Harold, inside pass rushers such as Carradine and Dockett. I'm sure he wants to match up a guy like Johnson in the slot when playing someone like J. Graham and Marshall, play more jam-press at the LOS with Johnson, Cook, Brock, etc., utilize more speed with Reaser, blitz Bethea/Tartt (more), allow Bowman and Wilhoite to play more downhill vs. being stuck in coverage, rotate the DL a lot more, etc.
Originally posted by NCommand:
With the talent we have we should remain top 5 hovering around top 10 to start the year while the defense gels and masters the playbook (new terminology/scheme).

I hope so...
Originally posted by Constantine:
Originally posted by NCommand:
With the talent we have we should remain top 5 hovering around top 10 to start the year while the defense gels and masters the playbook (new terminology/scheme).

I hope so...

I think of it this way...this team played pretty vanilla on defense last year d/t most of the 21 players that ended the year on I.R. being defensive players...we ended the year with Moody starting, along with the 6'6" Dial stuck at NT, Carradine starting the final 3 games, TJE, Cromartie at CB along with McFadden and our outside 6'2" CB having to play the slot CB position. We still ended the year top 5 and #1 in TO's despite playing playoff teams. Now, all those players are returning AND we're adding guys like Wright, Reaser, Acker, Bowman, Ian/Dorsey, AA, Dial back to LDE, Dockett, Tartt, Brock, etc.

Mangini should be able to close his eyes and just point to a play on the playbook and run it effectively. The rotation we now have along the DL and OLB's is insanely good (has to be close to tops in the NFL if not THE best front 7). The back end of Bethea and Reid now with Bowman back and Tartt (robber) in the middle of the field will make the outside CB's jobs soooo much easier. With the added competition and depth there, whoever wins those two CB spots is going to have a very nice year IMHO...like last year when we were starting Cully (returning from an ACL) and Cox (forced to start b/c Brock was hurt) and we were forced to start the raw rookie in Johnson. And we didn't even have Aldon for the first 9 games and had to move Brooks to the WILL after the Lemonier fail and Lynch had to start at SAM.

There is no reason this defense shouldn't remain at least top 5 again when it's all said and done.
[ Edited by NCommand on May 26, 2015 at 8:59 AM ]
Originally posted by NCommand:
I think of it this way...this team played pretty vanilla on defense last year d/t most of the 21 players that ended the year on I.R. defensive players...we ended the year with Moody starting, along with the 6'6" Dial at the NT position, Carradine starting, TJE, Cromartie at CB along with McFadden and pour outside 6'2" CB playing the slot CB position. We still ended top 5 and #1 in TO's. Now, all those players are returning AND we're adding guys like Wright, Reaser, Acker, Bowman, Ian/Dorsey, AA, Dial back to LDE, Dockett, Tartt, Brock, etc.

Mangini should be able to close his eyes and just point to a play on the playbook and run it effectively. The rotation we now have along the DL and OLB's is insanely good (has to be close to tops in the NFL if not THE best front 7). The back end of Bethea and Reid now with Bowman back and Tartt (robber) in the middle of the field will make the outside CB's jobs soooo much easier. With the added competition and depth there, whoever wins those two CB spots is going to have a very nice year IMHO...like last year when we were starting Cully (returning from an ACL) and Cox (Brock was hurt) and were forced to start the raw rookie in Johnson. And we didn't even have Aldon for the first 9 games.

There is no reason this defense shouldn't remain at least top 5 again when it's all said and done.

Totally agree.

Add to that, IMO, Mangeni will be more aggressive compared to Fangio and we'll see more sacks and hurries.
  • thl408
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Originally posted by Constantine:
Does Some our players believe in this

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000494015/article/eric-mangini-aiming-to-create-confusion-with-49ers-d

The 49ers have already been causing a lot of confusion with regards to QBs reading coverage. Of all the 49er games I've watched, no team plays as many coverages as the 49ers did under Fangio. What I think Bethea is referring to with the whole "confusion" talk is about offensive line protection schemes.

One thing Fangio did not do much of is utilize the 3-4 alignment to his advantage when it came to bringing various types of blitz pressure. One of the main advantages that a 3-4 has over a 4-3 is the ability to disguise who the 4 pass rushers will be. Then, if there's a blitz, which players will be blitzing. The uncertainty causes confusion for the Oline.

The foundation for confusion on the backend (coverage) is already there from the past seasons under Fangio/Donatell. They were also already dropping 8 into coverage at times. What was not there is blitzing an ILB while dropping both OLBs into coverage, or overloaded blitzes. It's not so much about the frequency of blitzing that I'd like to see different - if a team doesn't have to blitz to generate pressure, then there's no need to be blitz happy unless the opposing Oline can't get their protection calls right. I'd like to see a wide variety of blitz/pass rush packages. Something like Bow on a pass rush while Aldon and Lynch drop back. This confuses the pass protection calls for an offense and is what I think Bethea is referring to.
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by Constantine:
Does Some our players believe in this

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000494015/article/eric-mangini-aiming-to-create-confusion-with-49ers-d

The 49ers have already been causing a lot of confusion with regards to QBs reading coverage. Of all the 49er games I've watched, no team plays as many coverages as the 49ers did under Fangio. What I think Bethea is referring to with the whole "confusion" talk is about offensive line protection schemes.

One thing Fangio did not do much of is utilize the 3-4 alignment to his advantage when it came to bringing various types of blitz pressure. One of the main advantages that a 3-4 has over a 4-3 is the ability to disguise who the 4 pass rushers will be. Then, if there's a blitz, which players will be blitzing. The uncertainty causes confusion for the Oline.

The foundation for confusion on the backend (coverage) is already there from the past seasons under Fangio/Donatell. They were also already dropping 8 into coverage at times. What was not there is blitzing an ILB while dropping both OLBs into coverage, or overloaded blitzes. It's not so much about the frequency of blitzing that I'd like to see different - if a team doesn't have to blitz to generate pressure, then there's no need to be blitz happy unless the opposing Oline can't get their protection calls right. I'd like to see a wide variety of blitz/pass rush packages. Something like Bow on a pass rush while Aldon and Lynch drop back. This confuses the pass protection calls for an offense and is what I think Bethea is referring to.

Totalllly!

BTW, these little quotes by Tank play right into the idea that we'll use more tools in the tool box (something we were just talking about) and create that "confusion:"

Now, the 49ers need to get production from a player who showed unique pass-rush skills as a senior at Florida State with 13 sacks. But as much as the 49ers would like Carradine to pile up sack numbers, it might be more important that he selflessly creates opportunities for outside linebacker Aldon Smith.

"We work together a little bit, figuring out what kind of stunts and things we could do," Carradine said. "I'm excited to work with him this year. He's a great pass-rusher. I feel like I can bring something to the table to help him as well as he helps me."

Without Justin Smith and Ray McDonald on the team's defensive line, the 49ers figure to use more of a rotation than what the team has featured in the past.

"It's opened opportunities for the young guys to step up and become a factor, become a great player on the team and help the team and execute the things we got to go for the defensive line," Carradine said.

Carradine figures to see action at right defensive end on base downs, along with Darnell Dockett and Quinton Dial. Dockett and Carradine figure to be two of the team's top inside pass-rushers in nickel situations.

"We got guys who can play left and right end," Carradine said. "We got guys who can play in the nickel package. We got guys who can play in the base package. So it's different. We're all going to work together. Each guy does things different. We're going to do it together and get things done. For me, I can do both. I'm excited about it. Other guys can do it as well."

http://www.csnbayarea.com/49ers/smiths-retirement-creates-opportunity-49ers-carradine

New head coach Jim Tomsula, who formerly coached the defensive line, agrees. He believes the players on the roster are versatile enough that the coaching staff will be able to rotate them into various spots, depending on circumstances, to play to their strengths.

"They're all cross-trained so they can play them all," Tomsula said of nose tackle and the two outside slots. "It creates the depth at that position."


http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/sports/Niners-Darnell-Dockett-is-Being-Patient-305022231.html
[ Edited by NCommand on May 26, 2015 at 11:38 AM ]
as long as he doesn't get too cute
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