Kirk Cousins

No chance we make the Super Bowl without Bosa. Zero. Do people even remember our pass rush without a great edge rusher? Both of the 2 of them. We don't make either one.

Same discussion as we could've drafted Mahomes, too. Just like the song, "we can only imagine." Let's move on.

These guys are always talking about could have had Aaron Rodgers in 2005, could have had Mahomes, could have had Cousins.

It's 2024. Lets go from where we are and what we have. Hindsight is 20/20. You never missed on a pick if you have a time machine and can go back. But all teams miss on picks in real life and without the time machine. They do too. All 31 others. If you dig through their draft history and talk to their fans. We just know this team better.

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by captveg:
Signing Cousins in 2018 probably means we don't draft Bosa, among other differences. Just saying it's impossible to know what would have happened. The team would not have been the same, and reaching the SB and winning it with Cousins is hardly a foregone conclusion.

Bosa wasn't the only reason why we made it to the SB

No, but he's just one example of the team that did that wouldn't be the same if Cousins was signed. You can't just plug in Cousins and think all the bad breaks go our way while all the good breaks remain the same. Maybe we go 9-7 in 2018, but Cousins break his collarbone in Week 7 2019. It's just as probable.

what bad breaks.. we could still pick a quality DE later if we had a good 2018 ..Got Burns and sweat sitting there at the end of Rd 1

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by captveg:
Signing Cousins in 2018 probably means we don't draft Bosa, among other differences. Just saying it's impossible to know what would have happened. The team would not have been the same, and reaching the SB and winning it with Cousins is hardly a foregone conclusion.

Bosa wasn't the only reason why we made it to the SB

No, but he's just one example of the team that did that wouldn't be the same if Cousins was signed. You can't just plug in Cousins and think all the bad breaks go our way while all the good breaks remain the same. Maybe we go 9-7 in 2018, but Cousins break his collarbone in Week 7 2019. It's just as probable.

what bad breaks.. we could still pick a quality DE later if we had a good 2018 ..Got Burns and sweat sitting there at the end of Rd 1

You're seriously asking what bad breaks this team had since 2018? The entire 2020 season was one bad break after the other. Having Cousins doesn't auto reverse them.

Also everyone would be awesome at the draft if they could do it first five years in the future.

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by captveg:
Signing Cousins in 2018 probably means we don't draft Bosa, among other differences. Just saying it's impossible to know what would have happened. The team would not have been the same, and reaching the SB and winning it with Cousins is hardly a foregone conclusion.

Bosa wasn't the only reason why we made it to the SB

No, but he's just one example of the team that did that wouldn't be the same if Cousins was signed. You can't just plug in Cousins and think all the bad breaks go our way while all the good breaks remain the same. Maybe we go 9-7 in 2018, but Cousins break his collarbone in Week 7 2019. It's just as probable.

what bad breaks.. we could still pick a quality DE later if we had a good 2018 ..Got Burns and sweat sitting there at the end of Rd 1

You're seriously asking what bad breaks this team had since 2018? The entire 2020 season was one bad break after the other. Having Cousins doesn't auto reverse them.

Also everyone would be awesome at the draft if they could do it first five years in the future.

i'm not asking about the bad breaks.. you brought them up.. winning a SB would definitely change the outcome of our 2020 season

what the heck does your last statement have to do with anything.. I just gave you facts that there are other players there later in the round if we had cousins and missed out on Bosa

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by captveg:
Signing Cousins in 2018 probably means we don't draft Bosa, among other differences. Just saying it's impossible to know what would have happened. The team would not have been the same, and reaching the SB and winning it with Cousins is hardly a foregone conclusion.

Bosa wasn't the only reason why we made it to the SB

No, but he's just one example of the team that did that wouldn't be the same if Cousins was signed. You can't just plug in Cousins and think all the bad breaks go our way while all the good breaks remain the same. Maybe we go 9-7 in 2018, but Cousins break his collarbone in Week 7 2019. It's just as probable.

what bad breaks.. we could still pick a quality DE later if we had a good 2018 ..Got Burns and sweat sitting there at the end of Rd 1

You're seriously asking what bad breaks this team had since 2018? The entire 2020 season was one bad break after the other. Having Cousins doesn't auto reverse them.

Also everyone would be awesome at the draft if they could do it first five years in the future.

i'm not asking about the bad breaks.. you brought them up.. winning a SB would definitely change the outcome of our 2020 season

what the heck does your last statement have to do with anything.. I just gave you facts that there are other players there later in the round if we had cousins and missed out on Bosa

If you can't think of any bad breaks since 2018 then you should stop all the complaining about the woulda shoulda coulda, because I don't know what to tell ya otherwise. I figured they were rather obvious. Signing Cousins doesn't automatically make those go away was my point.

Not making the Super Bowl in 2019 would have also changed how 2020 went. You can't just say "get Cousins" and then only expect positive outcomes across the board. Maybe signing Cousins has a ripple effect that causes the team to be far worse in 2019.

What my last statement has to do with it is, again, getting Cousins doesn't suddenly make the billion variables that follow all turn out great for the 49ers. Therefore projecting that they could have got players that by 2024 are proven to have been solid pros is part of this magical thinking. That's 20/20 hindsight thinking. No one gets to have that in the actual moment. Saying they could have got Sweat instead of Bosa is assuming that by signing Cousins another team doesn't have the need to grab Sweat before us, for example. This is all a pointless exercise in fantasy.

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by captveg:
Signing Cousins in 2018 probably means we don't draft Bosa, among other differences. Just saying it's impossible to know what would have happened. The team would not have been the same, and reaching the SB and winning it with Cousins is hardly a foregone conclusion.

Bosa wasn't the only reason why we made it to the SB

No, but he's just one example of the team that did that wouldn't be the same if Cousins was signed. You can't just plug in Cousins and think all the bad breaks go our way while all the good breaks remain the same. Maybe we go 9-7 in 2018, but Cousins break his collarbone in Week 7 2019. It's just as probable.

what bad breaks.. we could still pick a quality DE later if we had a good 2018 ..Got Burns and sweat sitting there at the end of Rd 1

You're seriously asking what bad breaks this team had since 2018? The entire 2020 season was one bad break after the other. Having Cousins doesn't auto reverse them.

Also everyone would be awesome at the draft if they could do it first five years in the future.

i'm not asking about the bad breaks.. you brought them up.. winning a SB would definitely change the outcome of our 2020 season

what the heck does your last statement have to do with anything.. I just gave you facts that there are other players there later in the round if we had cousins and missed out on Bosa

If you can't think of any bad breaks since 2018 then you should stop all the complaining about the woulda shoulda coulda, because I don't know what to tell ya otherwise. I figured they were rather obvious. Signing Cousins doesn't automatically make those go away was my point.

Not making the Super Bowl in 2019 would have also changed how 2020 went. You can't just say "get Cousins" and then only expect positive outcomes across the board. Maybe signing Cousins has a ripple effect that causes the team to be far worse in 2019.

What my last statement has to do with it is, again, getting Cousins doesn't suddenly make the billion variables that follow all turn out great for the 49ers. Therefore projecting that they could have got players that by 2024 are proven to have been solid pros is part of this magical thinking. That's 20/20 hindsight thinking. No one gets to have that in the actual moment. Saying they could have got Sweat instead of Bosa is assuming that by signing Cousins another team doesn't have the need to grab Sweat before us, for example. This is all a pointless exercise in fantasy.

now you're just be defensive and acting everything goes to s**t on one move.

Bad breaks as you call them are just effects of prior decisions. While there is no guarantee what will happen in the future, one thing for sure is that the same effect will not happen if we had a different QB.

By waiting for Cousins, you think: other players lives would change and have different paths in draft, we somehow lose the capability of building a team and not be good enough to make it the super bowl...

even though we have built two separate super bowl teams ... lol

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
what bad breaks.. we could still pick a quality DE later if we had a good 2018 ..Got Burns and sweat sitting there at the end of Rd 1

Maxx Crosby in Round 4.

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
there was a 100% chance.. that's how petty Dan synder was.

No there wasn't. People greatly overrated that nonsense. The same Snyder owned team traded Trent Williams to the 49ers just a couple years later. Nobody in the NFL was going to give Kirk $55 mil in 2018.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
The only knock on Kirk has been his lack of a championship. He has better numbers than Montana overall. Naturally comp% and passer rating are higher because everyone is higher in this era. He has a lower INT %. A higher TD %. I'm not saying he's anywhere near Joe and the different eras make a true comparison hard but Cousins has had a good career. He only missed one game until last year when he injured his achilles and missed 8. Now he's started all 5 this year. That's one reason his name often came up when teams were looking to improve at that position. I heard an interview with him this morning and he sounded like a really bright guy. I'm pretty sure the Niners could have won a SB with him.

Much better deep ball and availability than Jimmy G. He also knee the offense so the learning curve would have been a lot smaller. I'm fully convinced that we're now talking about a Quest for 7 or 8 had they just signed Cousins in 2018 as planned.

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
now you're just be defensive and acting everything goes to s**t on one move.

Bad breaks as you call them are just effects of prior decisions. While there is no guarantee what will happen in the future, one thing for sure is that the same effect will not happen if we had a different QB.

By waiting for Cousins, you think: other players lives would change and have different paths in draft, we somehow lose the capability of building a team and not be good enough to make it the super bowl...

even though we have built two separate super bowl teams ... lol

You don't get it. At all.

I'm saying things going to s**t after getting Cousins is ALSO A POSSIBILITY, because there are no guarantees. You keep saying getting Cousins would be some miracle balm. I'm saying that's a fantasy, because real life isn't a plug and play video game. Therefore, all made up scenarios are EQUALLY likely. I'm just stating one extreme example.

It's not about being defensive. It's about being realistic about not knowing how things would be different. Just assuming the positive outcomes is silly.

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
now you're just be defensive and acting everything goes to s**t on one move.

Bad breaks as you call them are just effects of prior decisions. While there is no guarantee what will happen in the future, one thing for sure is that the same effect will not happen if we had a different QB.

By waiting for Cousins, you think: other players lives would change and have different paths in draft, we somehow lose the capability of building a team and not be good enough to make it the super bowl...

even though we have built two separate super bowl teams ... lol

You don't get it. At all.

I'm saying things going to s**t after getting Cousins is ALSO A POSSIBILITY, because there are no guarantees. You keep saying getting Cousins would be some miracle balm. I'm saying that's a fantasy, because real life isn't a plug and play video game. Therefore, all made up scenarios are EQUALLY likely. I'm just stating one extreme example.

It's not about being defensive. It's about being realistic about not knowing how things would be different. Just assuming the positive outcomes is silly.

I don't see anyone saying Cousins is a miracle balm. All I see is people saying he's better than JG. Considering how close they came to winning with JG having Cousins might have been enough to make the difference. Of course there's no way of knowing just as there's no way of knowing how good a draft pick will be.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
now you're just be defensive and acting everything goes to s**t on one move.

Bad breaks as you call them are just effects of prior decisions. While there is no guarantee what will happen in the future, one thing for sure is that the same effect will not happen if we had a different QB.

By waiting for Cousins, you think: other players lives would change and have different paths in draft, we somehow lose the capability of building a team and not be good enough to make it the super bowl...

even though we have built two separate super bowl teams ... lol

You don't get it. At all.

I'm saying things going to s**t after getting Cousins is ALSO A POSSIBILITY, because there are no guarantees. You keep saying getting Cousins would be some miracle balm. I'm saying that's a fantasy, because real life isn't a plug and play video game. Therefore, all made up scenarios are EQUALLY likely. I'm just stating one extreme example.

It's not about being defensive. It's about being realistic about not knowing how things would be different. Just assuming the positive outcomes is silly.

I don't see anyone saying Cousins is a miracle balm. All I see is people saying he's better than JG. Considering how close they came to winning with JG having Cousins might have been enough to make the difference. Of course there's no way of knowing just as there's no way of knowing how good a draft pick will be.

When the rhetoric goes from saying "Cousins being better than JG would have given a better chance in retrospect" to saying "Cousins would have guaranteed multiple championships and I knew that in February 2018", well, that's when I push back a little.

While I agree that Cousins' is a better quarterback than Jimmy G (he's certainly a lot more durable), I'm not sure that we would have fared any better with him under center. Don't forget that Cousins joined a loaded Minnesota Vikings football team with a top 3 defense, a receiving corps comprised of Diggs, Theilen and Rudolph, and Dalvin Cook as the running back. That team had reached the NFC conference game in 2017 and with Cousins, they only won 1 playoff game in 6 years. Kirk is a nice guy and a good, reliable thrower of the football, but there's just something about him that turns his teams into mediocre .500 clubs.