Former NY Jets HC Robert Saleh

You always hate to see coaches leave but it happens to every team that has success. LSU just lost their passing game coordinator. Part of being a strong organization is having a HC that thinks ahead. I'm guessing Kyle knew which guys would be targeted by other teams and was already thinking about replacements.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by libertyforever:
Saleh's defense has always been mostly 1 gap, shoot the gaps and playing in the backfield. In addition, the team has been emphasizing the pass defense over run defense by getting speedy stack linebackers who can cover since 2017. All gas no brakes apply all the way back.

LOL. All gas no brakes is a silly media mantra. Every defense would love to play that way every snap. Unfortunately, players still have assignments and have to play off their keys and within the play calls. Lynch has added some critical personnel who CAN pin their ears back more in Bosa and Ford and the W9 calls for it more schematicaly. But Saleh will always be stop-the-run-first.

LOL. Talking about making stuff up.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
You always hate to see coaches leave but it happens to every team that has success. LSU just lost their passing game coordinator. Part of being a strong organization is having a HC that thinks ahead. I'm guessing Kyle knew which guys would be targeted by other teams and was already thinking about replacements.

Or he's been a great organizational leader. As someone who lives in this role, the greatest challenge but also greatest opportunity is to develop leadership and skilled people underneath you. If you have a great DC, that's fine, but ideally you want them to succeed because their success means your success. With success comes opportunity and if you can't provide the opportunity they seek you also have to be ready fill that void. That's where instilling a culture of security and investment in the future is key.
You set the standard that those at the top groom and mentor those working underneath them. Not by giving them the menial jobs either. You teach and instruct but then also give opportunities for them to exercise those things you have taught and give them room to fail. That way they grow and develop.
Ideally, you want your guys at the top to be working themselves out of a job. Meaning, they raise up people all around them capable of doing their job.

Look at Shanahan with Rich Scangarello, for example. He raised up someone to be ready to take the role he had been in. While that didn't work out long term for Rich, it's an example of the leadership principles. It shows that he's setting that example and Saleh is going to follow that as well.
We, as fans, may point to Woods or Korcurek as guys that, 'could replace Saleh if things go bad' but I think Kyle looks at it as, "If Saleh is doing his job, those guys should be getting ready to be in that position."

Interesting quote from an article in the newsfeed about the improvement that Earl Mitchell has seen in the team's defensive line play since his return. I think Kocurek has been a huge addition to this staff and Saleh is apparently showing that he is learning more about what it takes to be a defensive coordinator

"Mitchell also credited 49ers defensive coordinator Robert Saleh and first-year defensive line coach Kris Kocurek for having the defense properly prepared for the Vikings. Mitchell said he remembers communication on the sideline being an issue the past two seasons. But he was impressed with the efficiency of making corrections between defensive series Saturday.

"They came out with their normal game plan," Mitchell said of the Vikings. "I think we were just well-prepared. Coach Kocurek harped on them trying to run to our weak side on our defense, and we keyed on that pretty much and we stayed true to our keys and got after it. We knew what they were going to try to do and kudos to Saleh and everybody."

I think the W9 also shows Saleh's willingness to adapt scheme to personnel. The W9 wasn't talked about too much until AFTER we got both Bosa and Ford.
I remember before the W9 was talked about so much we were talking about Ford as a possible SAM in base because neither he nor Bosa fit the BE mold in our "under" base front. Being that Ford was a 3-4 OLB type the W9 was a way to incorporate him into the lineup to best utilize his talents. The W9 basically is a 3-4 without a NT, in some regards. The DE's are hand in the dirt 3-4 OLB's when it comes to run fit rules. That way you could have Ford on the field in any down and distance situation, if you wanted to.

Originally posted by libertyforever:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by libertyforever:

Saleh's defense has always been mostly 1 gap, shoot the gaps and playing in the backfield. In addition, the team has been emphasizing the pass defense over run defense by getting speedy stack linebackers who can cover since 2017. All gas no brakes apply all the way back.

LOL. All gas no brakes is a silly media mantra. Every defense would love to play that way every snap. Unfortunately, players still have assignments and have to play off their keys and within the play calls. Lynch has added some critical personnel who CAN pin their ears back more in Bosa and Ford and the W9 calls for it more schematicaly. But Saleh will always be stop-the-run-first.

LOL. Talking about making stuff up.

My lord. He's literally said this 100 times to date. And it's smart...stop the run first and get yourself in position to actually BE all gas no brakes.

^ 100% on all of that. Saleh could have thrown an ego b***hfit but instead, welcomed it, adapted, grew and succeeded. That alone should be commended.

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Or he's been a great organizational leader. As someone who lives in this role, the greatest challenge but also greatest opportunity is to develop leadership and skilled people underneath you. If you have a great DC, that's fine, but ideally you want them to succeed because their success means your success. With success comes opportunity and if you can't provide the opportunity they seek you also have to be ready fill that void. That's where instilling a culture of security and investment in the future is key.
You set the standard that those at the top groom and mentor those working underneath them. Not by giving them the menial jobs either. You teach and instruct but then also give opportunities for them to exercise those things you have taught and give them room to fail. That way they grow and develop.
Ideally, you want your guys at the top to be working themselves out of a job. Meaning, they raise up people all around them capable of doing their job.

Look at Shanahan with Rich Scangarello, for example. He raised up someone to be ready to take the role he had been in. While that didn't work out long term for Rich, it's an example of the leadership principles. It shows that he's setting that example and Saleh is going to follow that as well.
We, as fans, may point to Woods or Korcurek as guys that, 'could replace Saleh if things go bad' but I think Kyle looks at it as, "If Saleh is doing his job, those guys should be getting ready to be in that position."

Like any organization, you have to be prepared when people leave. If you have a good organization, no matter what the product, you probably hired good people. Good people are always moving upward.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by libertyforever:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by libertyforever:
Saleh's defense has always been mostly 1 gap, shoot the gaps and playing in the backfield. In addition, the team has been emphasizing the pass defense over run defense by getting speedy stack linebackers who can cover since 2017. All gas no brakes apply all the way back.

LOL. All gas no brakes is a silly media mantra. Every defense would love to play that way every snap. Unfortunately, players still have assignments and have to play off their keys and within the play calls. Lynch has added some critical personnel who CAN pin their ears back more in Bosa and Ford and the W9 calls for it more schematicaly. But Saleh will always be stop-the-run-first.

LOL. Talking about making stuff up.

My lord. He's literally said this 100 times to date. And it's smart...stop the run first and get yourself in position to actually BE all gas no brakes.

It's true. Stop the run on 1st and 2nd down so they can feast on 3rd. It's a whole lot easier to get a sack when it's 3rd and 8 than when it's 3rd and 2

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

2nd best defense in the NFL, headed to the NFC Championship thanks to the defense and still people hating on Saleh so they don't have to admit they were wrong.

Go Niners, disappoint the haters by dominating GB again.

You're so defensive of your boy. Literally, nobody is "hating on him."

False
Examples of hating:
Hoping he would leave for a HC gig
Giving credit to assistants or players over giving credit to the DC
Saying he doesn't choose his schemes, assistant coaches or starters
Preferring Wade Phillips to be the DC

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by NCommand:

You're so defensive of your boy. Literally, nobody is "hating on him."

It's part of posting on this forum. Any constructive criticism or observations are viewed as being a hater. Nothing could be further from the truth. Most fans that say 'negative things' are actually die hard fans that just want this team to be the best in every area.

Very much agreed. The only ones I've seen hate on him are just your usual inciters. I love his passion for the guy though.

Thank you.
Dude took over a nightmare and he met almost all of my metrics each year for improvement.

Originally posted by jonnydel:
I think the W9 also shows Saleh's willingness to adapt scheme to personnel. The W9 wasn't talked about too much until AFTER we got both Bosa and Ford.
I remember before the W9 was talked about so much we were talking about Ford as a possible SAM in base because neither he nor Bosa fit the BE mold in our "under" base front. Being that Ford was a 3-4 OLB type the W9 was a way to incorporate him into the lineup to best utilize his talents. The W9 basically is a 3-4 without a NT, in some regards. The DE's are hand in the dirt 3-4 OLB's when it comes to run fit rules. That way you could have Ford on the field in any down and distance situation, if you wanted to.

I not so sure about that. Kocurek was hired in mid January. I immediately looked up his coaching history and saw that it was with Jim Schwartz (wide 9 innovator). With Kocurek comes the wide9. He's not here to teach 4-3 Under. Dee Ford wasn't acquired until mid March.
My speculation is the coaching staff wanted to get away from 4-3 Under because there were so few instances where it was applicable (offense in 21, Saleh alluded to this) so they wanted a defensive front more adapted to rushing the passer - wide9. So they got Kocurek. Kocurek said, "you want me to coach wide9, get me the horses I need".
So they traded for Ford.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by jonnydel:
I think the W9 also shows Saleh's willingness to adapt scheme to personnel. The W9 wasn't talked about too much until AFTER we got both Bosa and Ford.
I remember before the W9 was talked about so much we were talking about Ford as a possible SAM in base because neither he nor Bosa fit the BE mold in our "under" base front. Being that Ford was a 3-4 OLB type the W9 was a way to incorporate him into the lineup to best utilize his talents. The W9 basically is a 3-4 without a NT, in some regards. The DE's are hand in the dirt 3-4 OLB's when it comes to run fit rules. That way you could have Ford on the field in any down and distance situation, if you wanted to.

I not so sure about that. Kocurek was hired in mid January. I immediately looked up his coaching history and saw that it was with Jim Schwartz (wide 9 innovator). With Kocurek comes the wide9. He's not here to teach 4-3 Under. Dee Ford wasn't acquired until mid March.
My speculation is the coaching staff wanted to get away from 4-3 Under because there were so few instances where it was applicable (offense in 21, Saleh alluded to this) so they wanted a defensive front more adapted to rushing the passer - wide9. So they got Kocurek. Kocurek said, "you want me to coach wide9, get me the horses I need".
So they traded for Ford.

With the size of AA, DeFo and our bench DTs, the speed of our LBs, and the ability of our SS, wide 9 works well for us.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by jonnydel:
I think the W9 also shows Saleh's willingness to adapt scheme to personnel. The W9 wasn't talked about too much until AFTER we got both Bosa and Ford.
I remember before the W9 was talked about so much we were talking about Ford as a possible SAM in base because neither he nor Bosa fit the BE mold in our "under" base front. Being that Ford was a 3-4 OLB type the W9 was a way to incorporate him into the lineup to best utilize his talents. The W9 basically is a 3-4 without a NT, in some regards. The DE's are hand in the dirt 3-4 OLB's when it comes to run fit rules. That way you could have Ford on the field in any down and distance situation, if you wanted to.

I not so sure about that. Kocurek was hired in mid January. I immediately looked up his coaching history and saw that it was with Jim Schwartz (wide 9 innovator). With Kocurek comes the wide9. He's not here to teach 4-3 Under. Dee Ford wasn't acquired until mid March.
My speculation is the coaching staff wanted to get away from 4-3 Under because there were so few instances where it was applicable (offense in 21, Saleh alluded to this) so they wanted a defensive front more adapted to rushing the passer - wide9. So they got Kocurek. Kocurek said, "you want me to coach wide9, get me the horses I need".
So they traded for Ford.

Agree, and I credit Saleh for tossing his ego and learning the Wide 9 and Woods coverage schemes.

I see a lot of compatibilities between the 3-4 under and the wide 9. The coverage on the back end can be the same, however, the 3-4 under and the Wide 9 compatibilities - in a nickel situation - are (I think) similar. I just think it's a better nickel alignment than a traditional Saleh Big nickel when pass rushing (to thl's point about stop the pass first). I mean when Seifert went nickel against Marino, he just rushed 4 guys. Fred Dean was mostly rushing and not doing his dropping into the flat and covering the RB/TE flaring. (for example)

I think the difference between the Saleh 3-4/(4-3?) under and the wide 9 is the emphasis on the pass. Saleh's big nickel is totally different in design from the Wide 9, in my opinion. Saleh's big nickel is to stop the run and generate some sort of pressure to give the QB some heat, but it's primary purpose is to stop the run (NCommand's point). To me it was more read and react vs the Wide 9 which is to just gap penetrate to stop the pass, and oh by the way, hopefully gum up the blocking scheme so that if they do run. There is no reading involved and you need quick/fast/agile DLinemen able to penetrating deep into the gaps to screw up the run blocking to do that scheme. As NC said, it's a 180 degree opposite of the Big Nickel in my opinion.

That's why I think the current architects of the *current* defense - is Woods/Kocurek, but the foundation of the scheme is always the Seifert/Carroll 3-4/4-3 under defense (which is the Cover 3 & Cover 2) defense.

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

Thank you.
Dude took over a nightmare and he met almost all of my metrics each year for improvement.