QB CJ Beathard - signs with Jacksonville

I think it is a mental game as much as a physical game

Originally posted by qnnhan7:

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

Originally posted by qnnhan7:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:
He's always looking for the guy that can run his offense,

That evil b*****d!

lol Kyle asking too much out of the qb position, like playing pro style under center

I mean like walk in and run it without coaching. That's hard to find these days, you're picking from a limited pool.

No one is saying this. We are talking about guys that can progress, function, and improve with coaching better than the last guy that was here. Kyle taking Hoyer over Kaep despite the better athleticism should tell you how inadequate Kaep has been in this area.

I wouldn't say inadequate, he just doesn't fit Kyle's system. Also, I'm not saying he's the next Steve Young either, I'm over that. I think Colin's opening to be good or great has pretty much closed unless Colin can find another Harbaugh with the patience and system that fits with him. Hoyer is an immediate fit for Kyle's system, no need to have a 2+ year project on his team when he can find a Hoyer, Barkely, and a CJ that pretty much can be plugged on day one and be functional.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by qnnhan7:

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

Originally posted by qnnhan7:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

He's always looking for the guy that can run his offense,

That evil b*****d!

lol Kyle asking too much out of the qb position, like playing pro style under center

I mean like walk in and run it without coaching. That's hard to find these days, you're picking from a limited pool.

No one is saying this. We are talking about guys that can progress, function, and improve with coaching better than the last guy that was here. Kyle taking Hoyer over Kaep despite the better athleticism should tell you how inadequate Kaep has been in this area.

I wouldn't say inadequate, he just doesn't fit Kyle's system. Also, I'm not saying he's the next Steve Young either, I'm over that. I think Colin's opening to be good or great has pretty much closed unless Colin can find another Harbaugh with the patience and system that fits with him. Hoyer is an immediate fit for Kyle's system, no need to have a 2+ year project on his team when he can find a Hoyer, Barkely, and a CJ that pretty much can be plugged on day one and be functional.

This. It's more about teams not wanting to engineer a whole new offense just to fit his skill set HaRoman-style. No more pass (if open; if not) scramble (ad lib run or pass). Kyle wants no part of that because he'd have to change the offense for every player. Rather than teaching WR's proper technique and timing of passes through repitition it's backyard ball...you're working on scrabble drills, when to block downfield for your QB vs. scramble to get open. That offense is very limited in 2017 now. It's been a big reason Seattle has hit a wall and gotten destroyed in the playoffs...that, and their defense getting embarrassed by timing offenses on the road.

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Perfectly said. Beathard had a ton put on his plate and he talked about that. A lot of these spread QB's don't have to think much.

But they're able to take teams to SBs, have the 2nd best TD-int ration in league history, win MVPs. I just think Kyle is limiting our prospects unnecessarily.

Who has the second best TD/int ratio in league history?

http://www.footballdb.com/leaders/career-passing-tdintratio


Anyhow, I think Shanahan would draft a spread QB, this years QB class was just weak and there was no QB worth a top 3 pick. Trubisky just didn't have enough tape and he came from a spread offense.

I think it's obvious we're saving cap space and the QB spot for a run at Cousins but if we don't land him I can see us going after one of the top QB's in the 2018 draft, spread QB or not.

There's ways to evaluate a QB outside of him running a pro system in college but if Shanahan see's a guy in the second round that he thinks can run his offense I'm not going to freak out of he passes on Rosen or Darnold. (Although Rosen runs some pro-concepts so I would think that's our target in the 2018 draft if we can't land Cousins)

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
The odds get even worse the further down you go in the draft. People always point to the exceptions but not the 50 other guys who couldnt hack it at all. The 49ers bought themselves a lottery ticket and are hoping they can win big. Odds are that Beathard winds up like a Hoyer type and I'd be perfectly fine with that.

Skill in evaluation is only a small part of it. Luck is a HUGE part of it, especially later on in the draft. If the Patriots had any inkling of what Tom Brady could be they wouldnt have passed on him twice in the 6th round alone.

Bill Walsh was right on Montana and Young but felt Giovanni Carmazzi could turn into an NFL starter and urged the Colts to pass on Peyton Manning.

Ron Wolf, one of the premier talent evaluators of all time has talked extensively about how much finding a QB is equal parts good scouting, coaching and scheme plus a whole lot of luck.

Its a crapshoot but I think its a moot point overall. Drafting Beathard to me means the 49ers think there is a very good shot of Cousins being available and if he is I expect them to go all in on him with Beathard projecting as the long term backup.

I've always been told it was Bill Belichick's genius that got them Tom Brady and luck had nothing to do with it.

But seriously, this is 100% right.

Finding a QB is so difficult for a reason. Just so much has to go right and so much has to not go wrong. Who knows what some of these epic busts could've done if they weren't rushed out there on horrible teams. Look at Steve Young. Some guys need a great situation to be in for that light to go off for them.

Wrong place wrong time and a possible great QB in another situation is a bust.

People expecting CJ to be the next Montana/Brady need to cool their jets. The good thing is Kyle knows offense and he knows what traits he think are helpful to run his offense. The rest unfortunately isn't up to him. CJ seems like a bright and hard working kid so hopefully he works hard enough at his craft with Kyle's mentorship that he turns into a legit QB....but I wouldn't put my money on that.

The great news is we don't have to rush him out there. This front office/coaching staff at least on paper have time. Aaron Rodgers wouldn't be the QB he is today if he had to start as a rookie. For all the Alex Smith vs Aaron Rodgers discussions if we had taken Aaron over Alex and threw him out there in that offense(ironically same one as he runs today to some extent under McCarthy) at the time he wouldn't be close to what he is now. Him being able to sit behind Favre and rework his mechanics allowed him to hit the ground running with a great team around him and only fuel his confidence which could've been shattered for that horrible 49ers team.

But with this position unless you're getting a known commodity which is so damn rare(who lets go of a franchise QB in their prime?) you need to invest in the position and essentially, yes, get lucky.

Originally posted by genus49:

I've always been told it was Bill Belichick's genius that got them Tom Brady and luck had nothing to do with it.

But seriously, this is 100% right.

Finding a QB is so difficult for a reason. Just so much has to go right and so much has to not go wrong. Who knows what some of these epic busts could've done if they weren't rushed out there on horrible teams. Look at Steve Young. Some guys need a great situation to be in for that light to go off for them.

Wrong place wrong time and a possible great QB in another situation is a bust.

People expecting CJ to be the next Montana/Brady need to cool their jets. The good thing is Kyle knows offense and he knows what traits he think are helpful to run his offense. The rest unfortunately isn't up to him. CJ seems like a bright and hard working kid so hopefully he works hard enough at his craft with Kyle's mentorship that he turns into a legit QB....but I wouldn't put my money on that.

The great news is we don't have to rush him out there. This front office/coaching staff at least on paper have time. Aaron Rodgers wouldn't be the QB he is today if he had to start as a rookie. For all the Alex Smith vs Aaron Rodgers discussions if we had taken Aaron over Alex and threw him out there in that offense(ironically same one as he runs today to some extent under McCarthy) at the time he wouldn't be close to what he is now. Him being able to sit behind Favre and rework his mechanics allowed him to hit the ground running with a great team around him and only fuel his confidence which could've been shattered for that horrible 49ers team.

But with this position unless you're getting a known commodity which is so damn rare(who lets go of a franchise QB in their prime?) you need to invest in the position and essentially, yes, get lucky.

Whose expecting CJ to be Montana/Brady? All I've been noticing is optimism of a nice ceiling and saving money to put elsewhere to stack the team like SEA did when Wilson emerged.

Originally posted by NCommand:
This. It's more about teams not wanting to engineer a whole new offense just to fit his skill set HaRoman-style. No more pass (if open; if not) scramble (ad lib run or pass). Kyle wants no part of that because he'd have to change the offense for every player. Rather than teaching WR's proper technique and timing of passes through repitition it's backyard ball...you're working on scrabble drills, when to block downfield for your QB vs. scramble to get open. That offense is very limited in 2017 now. It's been a big reason Seattle has hit a wall and gotten destroyed in the playoffs...that, and their defense getting embarrassed by timing offenses on the road.

Yes, that's the WCO in a nutshell. Timing and repetition, and the complexity. Simple college offenses cannot work in the NFL because of the talent parity. You need that complexity, slight of hand, misdirection, fool the defense kind of offense because of that parity. Harbaugh did try to implement the principles of the WCO into his offense, and to a certain extent he had the players he needed for the WCO type when Alex was here and Baalke didn't screw up the roster yet. You need a Freddy Solomon guy with speed that scares defenses deep to make room for the underneath passes, and I never saw Baalke put a priority on that kind of player. Walsh had Renaldo Nehemiah, and he was a track and field star, and really wasn't very productive, but his speed scared defenses silly. Basically he was the bright shiny object that distracted defenses while Clark and Solomon killed defenses underneath.

Goodwin and Robinson say hi.

Originally posted by LeProfessionnel:
Who has the second best TD/int ratio in league history?

http://www.footballdb.com/leaders/career-passing-tdintratio

Anyhow, I think Shanahan would draft a spread QB, this years QB class was just weak and there was no QB worth a top 3 pick. Trubisky just didn't have enough tape and he came from a spread offense.

I think it's obvious we're saving cap space and the QB spot for a run at Cousins but if we don't land him I can see us going after one of the top QB's in the 2018 draft, spread QB or not.

There's ways to evaluate a QB outside of him running a pro system in college but if Shanahan see's a guy in the second round that he thinks can run his offense I'm not going to freak out of he passes on Rosen or Darnold. (Although Rosen runs some pro-concepts so I would think that's our target in the 2018 draft if we can't land Cousins)

The QB is such a critical position on a football team, I have no doubt that he looks at all the QB's, spread, pro-set offense, option offense etc.. and has good people always giving him tape of the QB draft prospects. He basically said in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTOD7wJJ5vY if there was a top flight QB that he **knew** was going to be a great QB, he would spare no expense to get him. So, I think he means he is going to trade up and maybe use a lot of draft capital to draft a can't miss daft prospect, or in the Cousins situation, a lot of cap space. I can see him using a 2nd or 3rd round pick again at the QB position next year, even if Hoyer and CJ have outstanding years, because he really values the position.

http://www.49ers.com/news/article-2/Fann-Mail-Analyzing-Two-Weeks-of-49ers-OTAs/6e028557-df28-4a72-bd4b-4f0f63d1b4a1

Beathard has been solid, and that's all you can ask for from a first-year player. He's yet to throw an interception during two open practices thus far, and has shown the ability to make timing throws with plenty of zip. It's also positive to hear that he is acclimating well in the quarterback's room, asking good questions and picking up on the offense. Beathard is getting third-team reps behind Brian Hoyer and Matt Barkley.

He is a breath of fresh air and seems willing to learn.

listening is the most important thing.

There have been a litany of very talented QBs out of College who refuse to listen and are banished to the potential file that is never fulfilled.

Originally posted by GoldenGateGlory:

He is a breath of fresh air and seems willing to learn.

listening is the most important thing.

There have been a litany of very talented QBs out of College who refuse to listen and are banished to the potential file that is never fulfilled.

This. Hope he continues on the path he has started on for sure, it will benefit him & the 49ers!!

Its a long journey from adolescence to manhood for all of us.

Originally posted by SmokeCrabtrees:
Whose expecting CJ to be Montana/Brady? All I've been noticing is optimism of a nice ceiling and saving money to put elsewhere to stack the team like SEA did when Wilson emerged.

It was more of a general comment but I have seen a few comparisons to Montana...I think we both know some people may take those comparisons too closely.

We all want him to work out but until he shows some major things in camp/preseason or regular season if he gets that opportunity I think QB is still #1 on our needs list.

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by SmokeCrabtrees:

Whose expecting CJ to be Montana/Brady? All I've been noticing is optimism of a nice ceiling and saving money to put elsewhere to stack the team like SEA did when Wilson emerged.

It was more of a general comment but I have seen a few comparisons to Montana...I think we both know some people may take those comparisons too closely.

We all want him to work out but until he shows some major things in camp/preseason or regular season if he gets that opportunity I think QB is still #1 on our needs list.

Haha. All good. Just pinches my skin when someone speaks fo

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by SmokeCrabtrees:

Whose expecting CJ to be Montana/Brady? All I've been noticing is optimism of a nice ceiling and saving money to put elsewhere to stack the team like SEA did when Wilson emerged.

It was more of a general comment but I have seen a few comparisons to Montana...I think we both know some people may take those comparisons too closely.

We all want him to work out but until he shows some major things in camp/preseason or regular season if he gets that opportunity I think QB is still #1 on our needs list.

Just punches my skin a lil bit when someone takes what 1-3 people said and acts like EVERYONE is saying the same thing lol.

I pretty much agree with you though. Hypothetical talks can be fun but they can get old quick especially if they don't even see the field lol.

Either we have a Dak situation where the top two QBs gets hurt for CJ to get his chance... or CJ beats out Barks at some point during the year before it's over, then Hoyer hgets hurt and CJ gets his chance like Kap did.