Poll: Like or Dislike Players Protesting During the National Anthem?

"Handcuffed teenagers beaten bloody with guns. Unarmed people shot and killed in their cars. Cops firing guns carelessly into busy streets. Mentally ill people tasered in ambulances. Supervisors refusing to challenge a brutal status quo.

These examples didn't come from the New York City Police Department or Ferguson, Missouri, where the killing of unarmed black men by white cops has created a national outcry over institutional racism and excessive force. They were from Ohio, where the U.S. Department of Justice just finished an investigation and report on abusive and often unconstitutional policing by Cleveland Division of Police between 2010 and 2013. They were compiled before November 22, when a rookie officer shot and killed a 12-year-old African-American boy, Tamir Rice, for waving a toy gun around on a playground."

https://www.google.com/amp/www.alternet.org/civil-liberties/15-reasons-americas-police-are-so-brutal%3Famp

Tiny microcosm huh? Interesting.

Originally posted by Wu-5Rings:

Originally posted by LeProfessionnel:

Originally posted by 9ersLiferInChicago:

Absolutely LOVE it.

How many people were murdered in Chicago last year? 762. (In one year) Over 4000 people were shot in 2016.

Chicago doesn't even have the highest murder rate per capita. It's not even top ten.

More people have been killed in Chicago over the last ten years than troops in the Iraq/Afghan wars.

Cities with warzone murder rates are spread across the USA. What does this generate? Well, murder is the leading cause of death for all black people age 14-35. That age group was also responsible for committing 53% of this nations murders for 20+ years. This also generates higher levels of police contact.

Unlawful police shootings make up less than 1% of black homicides. The "black community" in America is under siege and we should be taking a knee but not to protest cops we should be protesting these warzone murder rates. Conditions cops have to work in. Black cops, White, Latino and otherwise.

ON AVERAGE black males age 14-45 are FAR more likley to commit gun violence compared to all other demographics. This is why they experience more police contact. Police contact can be dangerous, especially when you don't follow orders. Cops have killed people even when they do follow orders but it's by far not the norm.

Your city is a shining example of why police have become militarized in the US. They're mirroring the brutality in the streets of the USA.

Drug sales and gun violence along with armed robbery and pimping plague large cities and police have to jump into the middle of it all each and every day. You want to minimize police contact? Minimize street violence. Especially gun violence.

Bad cops have abused all races and age groups. Police brutality is an issue but it pales in comparison to this warzone murder culture. Police brutality is actually fed by this culture and by violence from all racial groups but life in the suburbs is far different than life in East Oakland or Garfield Park (Chicago). It's undeniable.


Also, the vast majority of police shooting victims are men. Are cops sexist murderers or are men out there committing more serious violent crime compared to women?

I'll give you Chicago is bad but it still doesn't explain the problem in other areas of the country, which adds to the false narrative, we are not talking about the good officers..

We are talking about a system that is targeting minorities

Chicago doesn't even have the highest murder rate per capita. These same conditions are in smaller cities and towns across the nation. It's just more obvious in larger cities but the per capita homicide rates are bad in many places.

The rest of your post tells me you didn't even read my post. Also, I'm not going to read anything from VICE, Huffington Post, the Washington Post etc. The same media that pushed the "hands up don't shoot" lie. And it was a lie.

I deal in facts not excuses, obfuscation and blame shifting. The fact is- on average black people age 14-45 are far more likley to commit gun violence, armed robbery and murder. That's why they have more police contact.

If you want to help the black community you should be focused on the #1 threat to black lives and it's not cops. The vast majority of black lives lost are lost at the hands of black males age 14-45. Usually via gun violence. This culture is also generating higher levels of police contact.

All of this should be common sense.

Originally posted by LeProfessionnel:

Chicago doesn't even have the highest murder rate per capita. These same conditions are in smaller cities and towns across the nation. It's just more obvious in larger cities but the per capita homicide rates are bad in many places.

The rest of your post tells me you didn't even read my post. Also, I'm not going to read anything from VICE, Huffington Post, the Washington Post etc. The same media that pushed the "hands up don't shoot" lie. And it was a lie.

I deal in facts not excuses, obfuscation and blame shifting. The fact is- on average black people age 14-45 are far more likley to commit gun violence, armed robbery and murder. That's why they have more police contact.

If you want to help the black community you should be focused on the #1 threat to black lives and it's not cops. The vast majority of black lives lost are lost at the hands of black males age 14-45. Usually via gun violence. This culture is also generating higher levels of police contact.

All of this should be common sense.

Your changing the narrative, common sense is what they are protesting, not what we think the African American community should. There is a problem and should be addressed.

I also deal with facts and not narrative changing as shoukd you. Huge difference

The fact is accross America the killings of unarmed men is alarming which the Police should be serving and protecting and not acting like animals themselves..

Police need to set a precedent not add to the problem with taxpayers money...Don't change the narrative...

Originally posted by strickac:

When certain people portray a specific lifestyle more regularly than others, don't you think they're going to garner the most attention?

A person should not be under more scrutiny and contact based on their skin tone, 4th Amendment should protect us from profiling, as should the 14th.

Originally posted by Wu-5Rings:

"Handcuffed teenagers beaten bloody with guns. Unarmed people shot and killed in their cars. Cops firing guns carelessly into busy streets. Mentally ill people tasered in ambulances. Supervisors refusing to challenge a brutal status quo.

These examples didn't come from the New York City Police Department or Ferguson, Missouri, where the killing of unarmed black men by white cops has created a national outcry over institutional racism and excessive force. They were from Ohio, where the U.S. Department of Justice just finished an investigation and report on abusive and often unconstitutional policing by Cleveland Division of Police between 2010 and 2013. They were compiled before November 22, when a rookie officer shot and killed a 12-year-old African-American boy, Tamir Rice, for waving a toy gun around on a playground."

https://www.google.com/amp/www.alternet.org/civil-liberties/15-reasons-americas-police-are-so-brutal%3Famp

Tiny microcosm huh? Interesting.

Well, it's far more common for a 13 year old black kid to commit murder with a handgun compared to all other racial groups of the same age. People don't want to admit it but Rice was pointing the replica gun at people in a threatening manner. You can't just ignore the overall background in cities across the nation where kids as young as 12 years old have real guns and use them to kill people in the streets.

Again, if this warzone murder culture didn't exist Rice would likley be alive.

https://youtu.be/wzlU0Xypur4


The statistics also speak for themselves. Black kids are 10x+ more likley to get shot/killed compared to white kids. (By people in the streets not by cops) Kids 13 and 14 years old are being introduced to this street culture every day. Some as young as 9 or 10 years old.

And Rice is a very small example compared to all the kids that have been killed via street violence. White kids have been shot by police as well. You just didn't hear about it in the media 24/7. There are in fact cops out there that shouldn't be cops but is it some system of "white supremacy"? No. You think that cop woke up in the morning and said "I'm going to murder a black kid today"? Of course not.


Also, unarmed black people are more likley to be shot by black cops than by white cops. It's about threat perception and I'm sorry to say when 4% of the population (black males age 14-45) commit 53% of the nations murders for 20+ years threat perception for that demographic will be tilted.

If people in wheel chairs were only 4% of the population and that demographic was responsible for 53% of the nations murders then people in wheel chairs would get more attention from police. This doesn't mean everyone in a wheel chair is dangerous it's about averages.

In that case the goal should be to get people in wheel chairs to stop killing so many people.

Originally posted by Wu-5Rings:

Originally posted by LeProfessionnel:

Chicago doesn't even have the highest murder rate per capita. These same conditions are in smaller cities and towns across the nation. It's just more obvious in larger cities but the per capita homicide rates are bad in many places.

The rest of your post tells me you didn't even read my post. Also, I'm not going to read anything from VICE, Huffington Post, the Washington Post etc. The same media that pushed the "hands up don't shoot" lie. And it was a lie.

I deal in facts not excuses, obfuscation and blame shifting. The fact is- on average black people age 14-45 are far more likley to commit gun violence, armed robbery and murder. That's why they have more police contact.

If you want to help the black community you should be focused on the #1 threat to black lives and it's not cops. The vast majority of black lives lost are lost at the hands of black males age 14-45. Usually via gun violence. This culture is also generating higher levels of police contact.

All of this should be common sense.

Your changing the narrative, common sense is what they are protesting, not what we think the African American community should. There is a problem and should be addressed.

I also deal with facts and not narrative changing as shoukd you. Huge difference

The fact is accross America the killings of unarmed men is alarming which the Police should be serving and protecting and not acting like animals themselves..

Police need to set a precedent not add to the problem with taxpayers money...Don't change the narrative...

I'm right on target. You just don't like what I'm saying.

Originally posted by LeProfessionnel:

I'm right on target. You just don't like what I'm saying.

"According to the most recent census data, there are nearly 160 million more white people in America than there are black people. White people make up roughly 62 percent of the U.S. population but only about 49 percent of those who are killed by police officers. African Americans, however, account for 24 percent of those fatally shot and killed by the police despite being just 13 percent of the U.S. population. As The Post noted in a new analysis published last week, that means black Americans are 2.5 times as likely as white Americans to be shot and killed by police officers."

I guess I should listen to you and disregard the facts?

To me, I don't care if the officers were green with pink hair, to me, personally don't shoot unarmed men. That's it... Stop changing the narrative!!

Whether the men were white, orange, black and or green.

Originally posted by Wu-5Rings:

Listen man, no one is attacking you or your brother.. Statistics doesn't show its only the older vets.. I'm looking at the facts.

"Among the 1.8 million uninsured veterans, 12.7 percent are under 65. In addition, the number of uninsured veterans has increased by 290,000 between 2000 and 2004, according to the report in the Oct. 30 online edition of the American Journal of Public Health.


"The Bush Administration has been sending Americans overseas asking them to fight for their country, and yet, when people come home, they have no guarantee of health care," said study co-author Dr. Steffie Woolhandler, an associate professor of medicine at Harvard Medical School and a member of the advocacy group Physicians for a National Health Program. "The most basic human right of health care is being denied to our veterans, along with other Americans -- and that's a disgrace."

"Over 1 million veterans have no health insurance and no access to veterans' hospitals," Woolhandler added. "I think that's shocking to most people. It was certainly shocking to us."

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/Healthday/story?id=4509219&page=1

So....one might say that we should ignore Kaepernicks protests since cops are involved in an insignificant percentage in the shootings of black men.

I mean, I apparently shouldn't be offended by NFL players disrespect of our vets because the real assault on our vets is by the government.

Did I summarize your logic sufficiently?

Originally posted by Wu-5Rings:

Originally posted by LeProfessionnel:

I'm right on target. You just don't like what I'm saying.

"According to the most recent census data, there are nearly 160 million more white people in America than there are black people. White people make up roughly 62 percent of the U.S. population but only about 49 percent of those who are killed by police officers. African Americans, however, account for 24 percent of those fatally shot and killed by the police despite being just 13 percent of the U.S. population. As The Post noted in a new analysis published last week, that means black Americans are 2.5 times as likely as white Americans to be shot and killed by police officers."

I guess I should listen to you and disregard the facts?

To me, I don't care if the officers were green with pink hair, to me, personally don't shoot unarmed men. That's it... Stop changing the narrative!!

Black males age 14-45 committed 53% of this nations murders for 20+ years. That age/racial group only makes up about 4% of the total US population.

What does that tell you?

Why are 95% of police shooting victims men? Are cops all sexist murderers or are men out there committing more violence compared to women?

This is not me "changing the narrative" it's me clearing the fog.

Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:

You don't want politics invading your sports? Fine. They're not. It's all happening before the game even starts, and during a "tradition" that isn't even a tradition in the NFL. Players weren't even out on the field for the anthem until 2009. If you don't like it do what everyone else does and just tune in for kickoff time. Heck, I just tune in for kickoff time like I always have.

That would be fine if the announcers didn't go back and show the players protesting 8-10 times each game. This was true before everyone got their feelings hurt by Donald Trump and decided to kneel even though they had no interest in doing so prior. After last weekend, the broadcast forced it upon us more than ever.

I don't give a damn what the players are doing. Never have. They're athletes, nothing more. Their political stances are irrelevant to me. If they want to take a knee, I really wouldn't care if the broadcast would concentrate only on football like they're supposed to. If I want to watch somebody protest or relay their political stance, I'd watch CNN and let them tell me how to feel. I don't need the NFL doing it.

By the way, I do agree with their message. I just don't want it invading my football game. I tune in to watch football. Nothing more. You can say it's happening before the game, but the broadcast doesn't leave it there. They bring it right into the middle of the game and shove it down your throat.

Originally posted by Born9erFan:

So....one might say that we should ignore Kaepernicks protests since cops are involved in an insignificant percentage in the shootings of black men.

I mean, I apparently shouldn't be offended by NFL players disrespect of our vets because the real assault on our vets is by the government.

Did I summarize your logic sufficiently?

His protest since the beginning was injustice and killing of black unarmed minorities.. Since the beginning the false narratives started instead of being concerned or awareness in what he is actually doing it for..

He kneeled and America got offended, I think thats a hypocrisy because we didn't get offended when officers and firefighters were denied health care in 911? We show more love to the flag then the people that actually represent it.. Thats sad..

Where was this outrage when we deny our military healthcare when they mention flag and military Is what im saying.. Like someone else said the topic constantly gets highjacked.. I don't think it's coincidental.

Originally posted by LasVegasWally:

Originally posted by blizzuntz:

Originally posted by LasVegasWally:

No I dislike it.

The players say it isn't about our military and isn't disrespecting the flag.

Many of the people against this so called protest say it is about the military and disrespecting the flag.

IMO, w/all the college grads and smart people out there; they could come up w/something MUCH BETTER to get their point across.

It isn't about the flag , anthem , or military.

It is just a vehicle.

You think Rosa Parks was about bus service?

You think cafeteria sit ins are about the food?

You think the sit ins at dept stores in the 60s were about the clothes?

HEY Runtz - DID you read what I wrote!

I said they should come up w/something better!!!

That means if their concern is about social justice - find a better way to do it that won't be misconstrued as anti-military or anti American.

IMO, what they're doing is part of the problem and not part of the solution.

And PLEASE - don't equate what these people are doing to Rosa Parks or those brave souls who got severely beaten in the cafeterias!!!!

What she and they did was truly heroic!

So, get off your soap box and read what I actually wrote.

Yes I read what you wrote.

You obviously missed what I wrote

Not sure if your are mad Bc you understand you missed my point or mad Bc you don't even know that you missed my point.

Lighten up tough guy

Originally posted by Wu-5Rings:

Originally posted by Born9erFan:

So....one might say that we should ignore Kaepernicks protests since cops are involved in an insignificant percentage in the shootings of black men.

I mean, I apparently shouldn't be offended by NFL players disrespect of our vets because the real assault on our vets is by the government.

Did I summarize your logic sufficiently?

His protest since the beginning was injustice and killing of black unarmed minorities.. Since the beginning the false narratives started instead of being concerned or awareness in what he is actually doing it for..

He kneeled and America got offended, I think thats a hypocrisy because we didn't get offended when officers and firefighters were denied health care?

Where was this outrage? Is what im saying.. Lije someone else said the topic constantly gets highjacked..

Yes, America got offended. He pissed off people that would have been on his side because he was ignorant in his protest. When we told him that he didn't listen. The conversations haven't been about his protest ever, because he chose a venue that IS disrespectful to our military. Just because you say I didn't mean to disrespect doesn't mean it isn't disrespectful. Frankly the closed minded people in this debate are the NFL players that won't listen to the people who have repeatedly told them it offends them when you kneel.

Originally posted by Born9erFan:

Yes, America got offended. He pissed off people that would have been on his side because he was ignorant in his protest. When we told him that he didn't listen. The conversations haven't been about his protest ever, because he chose a venue that IS disrespectful to our military. Just because you say I didn't mean to disrespect doesn't mean it isn't disrespectful. Frankly the closed minded people in this debate are the NFL players that won't listen to the people who have repeatedly told them it offends them when you kneel.

And that's my problem we get outraged for him kneeling drag flag and military into the topic but don't get outraged when we deny the military health care when they come home.

Don't you see a problem with this?

We as Americans rather look good than actually doing good or why not get ouraged for a real issue with the military or our government ? At least thats the message we are sending..

I rather do good, than be concerned with looking good..

It's hypocrisy imo.

Originally posted by Wu-5Rings:

And that's my problem we get outraged for him kneeling drag flag and military into the topic but don't get outraged when we deny the military health care when they come home.

Don't you see a problem with this?

We as Americans rather look good than actually doing good or why not get ouraged for a real issue with the military or our government ? At least thats the message we are sending..

I rather do good, than be concerned with looking good..

It's hypocrisy imo.

I couldn't agree with you more. Honestly, I didn't know most of the things you brought up about our vets. That being said, if Kaeps protest was about the treatment of our vets then he would have gotten traction because kneeling at the flag would have had some connection. The problem is, the players spend all of their time defending their method of protest because it IS offensive and has NOTHING to do with what their issues are.

Someone brought up Rosa Parks, her protest was about inequality and her avenue was the segregation on a bus. Both are very connected. Kaepernicks protest is police brutality and his avenue is insulting vets and people who love this country. No connection. He chose it because it gets attention, nothing else. He could have worn something on his jersey and taken the fine every week, it would have gotten attention and not distract from his goal.

Honestly, I do question HIS love for this country. I don't think he is very bright when it comes to world issues and has been manipulated by his activist girlfriend. If the media wasn't so liberal he would not have gotten so far with this.