Jimmy Garoppolo, QB, Los Angeles Rams

Originally posted by jersey49er:

Keep reading throwing some cash on Jimmy G for MVP would be smart, gotta see his odds, I'm assuming something like +3500

I got $25 on him for mvp at 40 to 1

Originally posted by JTsBiggestFan:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Massive difference in the "quality" of their passes though. Mullen doesn't attempt difficult passes, JG does (and is affective)....Mullen is awful when it comes to making plays under pressure vs what JG does.

The thing I notice is if you can understand and run Kyle's offense (Mullens knows it inside and out) you will have success regardless of talent...IF you can get a QB that can run his offense well AND they have talent to back it up, you will have an elite offense (Matt Ryan yr 2 MVP under kyle).

It really sucks, this past season was suppose to be JG's first full yr under kyle learning and getting reps and that was taken away...there will be growing pains at the beginning of the yr imo, hopefully the D can help a little until our offense can get rolling...Once that happens, I think they can be a top 6-7 offense.

All solid points.

Eye test tells you so much.

Stats alone would indicate Wilson is the best QB in the NFL or top 3 (usually top 3 in TD passes, usually top 5 in passer rating) but watching him depicts a different story.

Steve Young with similar stats looked a hell of a lot different. Or most any other QB.

Much as I hate the hobbit, I have to respect Wilson. His career QBR is 100 and he has 3651 career rushing yards with 16 TDs on the ground. He led the Seahawks in rushing in 2017 by a whole bunch, when they had no OLine or rushing attack. He is a great QB.

Originally posted by BOI49er:

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:

Originally posted by Heroism:

Yeah, the Deebo pick was the easiest pick to predict in the Shanny era thus far. And I agree with NY about Kyle undervaluing OG. It certainly feels that way.

Unfortunately, i agree with you. Kyle doesn't care about OGs, and for some reason doesn't mind seeing his QBs get beaten up. As good as he is at OCing, it has been strange to watch him watch his QBs get pounded, and somehow, not worry about it. If he has a shortcoming, that's it. Hard for me to understand not having more concern for his QBs than he does.

The WCO since it's inception has always valued mobile guards that can hit a moving target on the run. That fact over the decades has usually resulted in smaller and less powerful men. I think the scheme helps the run game, which reduces the number of passing drop backs, and makes the rush more tentative. It scheme also likes mobile quarterbacks, and quick short passes, further frustrating the pass rush. Also, interior linemen teamwork is often more critical than the one on one matchups OT's often must face.

I think you are correct that Kyle does think a quarterback is going to take some hits if he is to play winning football, and he therefor does value a tough quarterback that can do that, get up, and not have it effect his play.

In short, the "good" guards you are looking for are found in Harbaugh type teams that predominately like to run "power". It ain't gonna happen, and you're gonna be disappointed.

Kyle's quarterbacks are going to take hits. Kyle's receivers are going to take hits. Kyle's running backs are going to take hits. It's football.

JG should not have torn his ACL on that sideline scramble hit from my perspective. Fluky things do happen. If it was a fluke, Jimmy's going to have a great career. If he really is delicate, or can't learn how to protect himself taking a hit, we'll be going forward with Cousins, or some other quarterback.

I'll agree with most of that except for two things.

1. QBs have to take hits... but not like our QBs got hit last yr, and i'll Add a bunch of those were questionable, and i was hacked off a number of times when kyle didn't storm the 'ref and say "WTF are you doing letting my QBs get pounded like that...well after the ball was gone"? Nonetheless, QBs DO NOT usually take the kind of punishment our 3 took. JimmyG only got hit for just under 3 games but he got hit way more than should have been.

2. Sure OGs need to be mobile here and i never said we needed a 330 lb OG. But if kyle is going to get OGs for ZBS, at least don't take them if they can't pass block at all...and that happened last yr ...a LOT.

Once we jettisoned Big Trent, it was obvious Kyle was going with way smaller guys, (and guys who got in shape prior to season)...but after watching BB ZBS and power game, i wondered if kyle SHOULD have gone with a bigger OG, as long as he can zone block? It sure would have been nice when we settled for a FG instead of going for it.

And it is no secret that when in close (say inside the 5)...we could not punch it in.

Nor is it a secret that kyle;s ZBS works great between the 20s....just not inside them. I hope Deebo and Hurd can change that around by getting open quick in close. But if not, then we need to have a ZBS OG who can pass block like a mutha.

What's strange to me is that kyle saw what it was like to be without his FR QB. GRanted that ACL injury was all on JG, who was trying for a last few pathetic yards in a losing effort. I would have thot after that Kyle would have been super sensitive to his FR Qb getting injured. But based on this draft, that is definitely not the case....and THAT is puzzling.

Originally posted by KittleSkittle:

🤔 pic.twitter.com/Ocm2qwWKiu

— Bill Barnwell (@billbarnwell) July 21, 2019

Stats are almost identical after their first 8 games with the niners. I don't think anything can really be read from that, but it is mildly interesting.

Jimmy was throwing to louis murphy, aldrick robinson + 3 rookies (taylor, kittle, bourne)

he also came in mid-season with no tc or preseason to prepare

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:

Originally posted by BOI49er:

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:

Originally posted by Heroism:

Yeah, the Deebo pick was the easiest pick to predict in the Shanny era thus far. And I agree with NY about Kyle undervaluing OG. It certainly feels that way.

Unfortunately, i agree with you. Kyle doesn't care about OGs, and for some reason doesn't mind seeing his QBs get beaten up. As good as he is at OCing, it has been strange to watch him watch his QBs get pounded, and somehow, not worry about it. If he has a shortcoming, that's it. Hard for me to understand not having more concern for his QBs than he does.

The WCO since it's inception has always valued mobile guards that can hit a moving target on the run. That fact over the decades has usually resulted in smaller and less powerful men. I think the scheme helps the run game, which reduces the number of passing drop backs, and makes the rush more tentative. It scheme also likes mobile quarterbacks, and quick short passes, further frustrating the pass rush. Also, interior linemen teamwork is often more critical than the one on one matchups OT's often must face.

I think you are correct that Kyle does think a quarterback is going to take some hits if he is to play winning football, and he therefor does value a tough quarterback that can do that, get up, and not have it effect his play.

In short, the "good" guards you are looking for are found in Harbaugh type teams that predominately like to run "power". It ain't gonna happen, and you're gonna be disappointed.

Kyle's quarterbacks are going to take hits. Kyle's receivers are going to take hits. Kyle's running backs are going to take hits. It's football.

JG should not have torn his ACL on that sideline scramble hit from my perspective. Fluky things do happen. If it was a fluke, Jimmy's going to have a great career. If he really is delicate, or can't learn how to protect himself taking a hit, we'll be going forward with Cousins, or some other quarterback.

I'll agree with most of that except for two things.

1. QBs have to take hits... but not like our QBs got hit last yr, and i'll Add a bunch of those were questionable, and i was hacked off a number of times when kyle didn't storm the 'ref and say "WTF are you doing letting my QBs get pounded like that...well after the ball was gone"? Nonetheless, QBs DO NOT usually take the kind of punishment our 3 took. JimmyG only got hit for just under 3 games but he got hit way more than should have been.

2. Sure OGs need to be mobile here and i never said we needed a 330 lb OG. But if kyle is going to get OGs for ZBS, at least don't take them if they can't pass block at all...and that happened last yr ...a LOT.

Once we jettisoned Big Trent, it was obvious Kyle was going with way smaller guys, (and guys who got in shape prior to season)...but after watching BB ZBS and power game, i wondered if kyle SHOULD have gone with a bigger OG, as long as he can zone block? It sure would have been nice when we settled for a FG instead of going for it.

And it is no secret that when in close (say inside the 5)...we could not punch it in.

Nor is it a secret that kyle;s ZBS works great between the 20s....just not inside them. I hope Deebo and Hurd can change that around by getting open quick in close. But if not, then we need to have a ZBS OG who can pass block like a mutha.

What's strange to me is that kyle saw what it was like to be without his FR QB. GRanted that ACL injury was all on JG, who was trying for a last few pathetic yards in a losing effort. I would have thot after that Kyle would have been super sensitive to his FR Qb getting injured. But based on this draft, that is definitely not the case....and THAT is puzzling.

Many valid points here.

I think we might recognize a difference in perspective.

Fans love their winning quarterbacks. They usually have a much stronger bond to the qb than the coach, and most importantly, they don't think they can win without him.

Coaches know that some point, everybody is going to get hurt playing this game. They have a plan to win without anybody, and believe the team success is more a result of their vision, preparation, and game plan. They know their quarterback is going to take hits anyway, so do you leave two guys in to block and only send three out, when you can't scheme them open, or do you send all five out with a scheme that they won't be able to cover them all. We score and win. Which guy got to that job?

Like I heard my old high school coach say many years later, when Trent Green went down, "we're going to rally around Kurt, and we're going to win".

Originally posted by BOI49er:
Many valid points here.

I think we might recognize a difference in perspective.

Fans love their winning quarterbacks. They usually have a much stronger bond to the qb than the coach, and most importantly, they don't think they can win without him.

Coaches know that some point, everybody is going to get hurt playing this game. They have a plan to win without anybody, and believe the team success is more a result of their vision, preparation, and game plan. They know their quarterback is going to take hits anyway, so do you leave two guys in to block and only send three out, when you can't scheme them open, or do you send all five out with a scheme that they won't be able to cover them all. We score and win. Which guy got to that job?

Like I heard my old high school coach say many years later, when Trent Green went down, "we're going to rally around Kurt, and we're going to win".

Dick Vermeil was your coach??? Now, that's a memory for the ages.

Originally posted by RTFirefly:

Originally posted by BOI49er:

Many valid points here.

I think we might recognize a difference in perspective.

Fans love their winning quarterbacks. They usually have a much stronger bond to the qb than the coach, and most importantly, they don't think they can win without him.

Coaches know that some point, everybody is going to get hurt playing this game. They have a plan to win without anybody, and believe the team success is more a result of their vision, preparation, and game plan. They know their quarterback is going to take hits anyway, so do you leave two guys in to block and only send three out, when you can't scheme them open, or do you send all five out with a scheme that they won't be able to cover them all. We score and win. Which guy got to that job?

Like I heard my old high school coach say many years later, when Trent Green went down, "we're going to rally around Kurt, and we're going to win".

Dick Vermeil was your coach??? Now, that's a memory for the ages.

That's nothing. He was my wife's drivers education instructor.

Originally posted by BOI49er:

Originally posted by RTFirefly:

Originally posted by BOI49er:
Many valid points here.

I think we might recognize a difference in perspective.

Fans love their winning quarterbacks. They usually have a much stronger bond to the qb than the coach, and most importantly, they don't think they can win without him.

Coaches know that some point, everybody is going to get hurt playing this game. They have a plan to win without anybody, and believe the team success is more a result of their vision, preparation, and game plan. They know their quarterback is going to take hits anyway, so do you leave two guys in to block and only send three out, when you can't scheme them open, or do you send all five out with a scheme that they won't be able to cover them all. We score and win. Which guy got to that job?

Like I heard my old high school coach say many years later, when Trent Green went down, "we're going to rally around Kurt, and we're going to win".

Dick Vermeil was your coach??? Now, that's a memory for the ages.

That's nothing. He was my wife's drivers education instructor.

LOL I can just see that. "HIT IT HARDER! HARDER!!!"

Originally posted by RTFirefly:

Originally posted by BOI49er:

Originally posted by RTFirefly:

Originally posted by BOI49er:

Many valid points here.

I think we might recognize a difference in perspective.

Fans love their winning quarterbacks. They usually have a much stronger bond to the qb than the coach, and most importantly, they don't think they can win without him.

Coaches know that some point, everybody is going to get hurt playing this game. They have a plan to win without anybody, and believe the team success is more a result of their vision, preparation, and game plan. They know their quarterback is going to take hits anyway, so do you leave two guys in to block and only send three out, when you can't scheme them open, or do you send all five out with a scheme that they won't be able to cover them all. We score and win. Which guy got to that job?

Like I heard my old high school coach say many years later, when Trent Green went down, "we're going to rally around Kurt, and we're going to win".

Dick Vermeil was your coach??? Now, that's a memory for the ages.

That's nothing. He was my wife's drivers education instructor.

LOL I can just see that. "HIT IT HARDER! HARDER!!!"

She's never had an accident. I ain't too good at football.

And I've been hearing about the English Leather he wore ever since.

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:

I'll agree with most of that except for two things.

1. QBs have to take hits... but not like our QBs got hit last yr, and i'll Add a bunch of those were questionable, and i was hacked off a number of times when kyle didn't storm the 'ref and say "WTF are you doing letting my QBs get pounded like that...well after the ball was gone"? Nonetheless, QBs DO NOT usually take the kind of punishment our 3 took. JimmyG only got hit for just under 3 games but he got hit way more than should have been.

2. Sure OGs need to be mobile here and i never said we needed a 330 lb OG. But if kyle is going to get OGs for ZBS, at least don't take them if they can't pass block at all...and that happened last yr ...a LOT.

Once we jettisoned Big Trent, it was obvious Kyle was going with way smaller guys, (and guys who got in shape prior to season)...but after watching BB ZBS and power game, i wondered if kyle SHOULD have gone with a bigger OG, as long as he can zone block? It sure would have been nice when we settled for a FG instead of going for it.

And it is no secret that when in close (say inside the 5)...we could not punch it in.

Nor is it a secret that kyle;s ZBS works great between the 20s....just not inside them. I hope Deebo and Hurd can change that around by getting open quick in close. But if not, then we need to have a ZBS OG who can pass block like a mutha.

What's strange to me is that kyle saw what it was like to be without his FR QB. GRanted that ACL injury was all on JG, who was trying for a last few pathetic yards in a losing effort. I would have thot after that Kyle would have been super sensitive to his FR Qb getting injured. But based on this draft, that is definitely not the case....and THAT is puzzling.

I dont think you need a big strong 1st rounder at the guard position in Kyle's ZBS. The guards aren't pulling like Randy Cross on a green bay sweep. It's all angles, and usually the guards have good angles on the DT's most of the time if you are going left or right. Where you need that top OLine athlete is at the center and OT's where the OLine is more heads up on the defender.

As for the red zone, I would like to also put some of the blame on the QB and not all of it in the OLine.

As for pass protection, again, I'd like the QB to share some of that blame, and not put it all on the OLinemen.

This survey of NFL coaches and execs says Garoppolo is the 19th best QB in the NFL -- in the 3rd tier (of 4).

https://theathletic.com/1082093/2019/07/22/2019-nfl-quarterback-tiers-rankings/

HATE to say they're right, but he's really done nothing.. only have shown potential..

Originally posted by 9moon:

HATE to say they're right, but he's really done nothing.. only have shown potential..

I think he's shown off the charts leadership. I think he's shown exceptional ability as a quick learner. I think he's shown an incredible ability to read defenses both prior and post snap. I think he's shown a quick release. I think he's shown reasonable accuracy on all but the long routes. I think he has proven he has a quick mind and will make quick, accurate decisions. I think his floor is very high.

I think he's never been able to play more than five games in a row without landing in the hospital.

Originally posted by 9moon:

HATE to say they're right, but he's really done nothing.. only have shown potential..

The games that he played clearly showed the talent and leadership at the QBs position. The problem with Jimmy so far is people want more of what he has shown, but the injury curbed that.

Compared to what other qb have accomplished,
Jimmy have 0 along with the Niners the last few years. Not counting his back up period with the Pats.

Jimmy G will be a top 5 QB by the end of the season