Jimmy Garoppolo, QB, Los Angeles Rams

Originally posted by LottDMontanaO:

Originally posted by elguapo:
Just like you ignored the rest of my post how poorly Goff played and his own coach even called him out. You disregarded team health and supporting cast. You do realize that when an offense is hammered with injuries qbs tend to not do as well. I used that in my argument when comparing the qbs similar turnover rate and showed reason why they were even close. But then again that's common sense. Way to provide some stats WITHOUT ANY CONTEXT whatsoever.

Stats are for losers, especially without context. Here's a prime example. Last year Tom Brady had his worst year EVER td% and 3rd worst year ever in completion %, and many categories were indicative of a decline. A lot of people were saying he's finally going downhill. What they didn't realize or care to is his OL wasn't protecting him and he didn't have weapons at his disposal due to the lack of talent and injuries. That's exactly why you have to have context. But hey, sometimes ignorance is bliss and needed to support a failing argument.

Now that's disingenuous af. As Jim Rome would say.....Good night now

Thank you, elguapo. I don't get some of these other posters' "takes."

So its a "take" when I want to compare turnovers per game rather than total turnovers (considering the two QBs who are being compared had a difference of more than half a seasons worth of games played in 2 years)? Cmon Lott. I thought you had more sense than this. One guy played 31 games in 2 years and the other played 22. The guy who played 22 games turned the ball over at a higher rate than the guy who played 31. But because there was a 9 game difference (not even to mention the difference in attempts), the guy who played more turned the ball over in total more.

I swear this shouldnt be difficult.

Originally posted by 808niner4lyphe:

Originally posted by 49ers808:
He tends to do it in every game, that's often. Or do you mean multiple times in a game? Yeah hopefully it gets cleaned up, I think the Mack signing in itself will be huge compared to the s**t show circus gymnastics we've had at C

A huge understatement right there mah braddah!! Mack's signing imo is the key to success for this offense this year. Well, and health ofcourse. 🤙

Yup, all I ask is for health, we healthy I put this team whether it's Jimmy or Trey against anybody brah 🤙🏾🤙🏾🤙🏾

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by LottDMontanaO:

Originally posted by elguapo:
Just like you ignored the rest of my post how poorly Goff played and his own coach even called him out. You disregarded team health and supporting cast. You do realize that when an offense is hammered with injuries qbs tend to not do as well. I used that in my argument when comparing the qbs similar turnover rate and showed reason why they were even close. But then again that's common sense. Way to provide some stats WITHOUT ANY CONTEXT whatsoever.

Stats are for losers, especially without context. Here's a prime example. Last year Tom Brady had his worst year EVER td% and 3rd worst year ever in completion %, and many categories were indicative of a decline. A lot of people were saying he's finally going downhill. What they didn't realize or care to is his OL wasn't protecting him and he didn't have weapons at his disposal due to the lack of talent and injuries. That's exactly why you have to have context. But hey, sometimes ignorance is bliss and needed to support a failing argument.

Now that's disingenuous af. As Jim Rome would say.....Good night now

Thank you, elguapo. I don't get some of these other posters' "takes."

So its a "take" when I want to compare turnovers per game rather than total turnovers (considering the two QBs who are being compared had a difference of more than half a seasons worth of games played in 2 years)? Cmon Lott. I thought you had more sense than this. One guy played 31 games in 2 years and the other played 22. The guy who played 22 games turned the ball over at a higher rate than the guy who played 31. But because there was a 9 game difference (not even to mention the difference in attempts), the guy who played more turned the ball over in total more.

I swear this shouldnt be difficult.

I like context plus stats, SWH. Context you get from watching each guy play throughout entire games (not highlights, not partial games).

Instead of writing you a big unnecessary response, I'll just ask you this and I want an honest answer: From what you saw in Goff's play as a pro up through the 2019 season and from what you saw in Garoppolo's play from NE days through the 2019 season, which of the two would you have wanted as the Niners' starting QB after 2019?

I'm assuming you have watched a lot of Goff's games like I have - I'm a Cal Bears fan so I've followed him there and in the NFL.

Edit: Just went back and read the whole exchange and what I mentioned...wasn't necessarily referring to you as one of those "other posters" b/c I'm pretty sure you get the "context matters" thing.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

If they release Jimmy after camp how much would he get paid? If if makes financial sense to JG I could see it.
That would be a ballsy move by Kyle and it would be a sign of Trey being ready which would be awesome.

There isn't a team right now that's gonna pay him $12M for one yr of play…that's the point. It's not about making sense for him right now. He's one of the highest paid football players in the league and has absolutely no business being. Also if Jimmy wants a new contract and freedom of free agency in 2022 he would do this.

Why not answer my question?
How much money will JG get if he is cut after TC?

He should take whatever money he can, that is what would be in his best interest.

What business he has being paid whatever and how much he has made is completely irrelevant.

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by TheWooLick:
If they release Jimmy after camp how much would he get paid? If if makes financial sense to JG I could see it.
That would be a ballsy move by Kyle and it would be a sign of Trey being ready which would be awesome.

There isn't a team right now that's gonna pay him $12M for one yr of play…that's the point. It's not about making sense for him right now. He's one of the highest paid football players in the league and has absolutely no business being. Also if Jimmy wants a new contract and freedom of free agency in 2022 he would do this.

Why not answer my question?
How much money will JG get if he is cut after TC?

He should take whatever money he can, that is what would be in his best interest.

What business he has being paid whatever and how much he has made is completely irrelevant.

Odds are he won't be cut and if it happens, he won't sign until FA next year unless a major injury happens this year

Originally posted by LottDMontanaO:

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by LottDMontanaO:

Originally posted by elguapo:
Just like you ignored the rest of my post how poorly Goff played and his own coach even called him out. You disregarded team health and supporting cast. You do realize that when an offense is hammered with injuries qbs tend to not do as well. I used that in my argument when comparing the qbs similar turnover rate and showed reason why they were even close. But then again that's common sense. Way to provide some stats WITHOUT ANY CONTEXT whatsoever.

Stats are for losers, especially without context. Here's a prime example. Last year Tom Brady had his worst year EVER td% and 3rd worst year ever in completion %, and many categories were indicative of a decline. A lot of people were saying he's finally going downhill. What they didn't realize or care to is his OL wasn't protecting him and he didn't have weapons at his disposal due to the lack of talent and injuries. That's exactly why you have to have context. But hey, sometimes ignorance is bliss and needed to support a failing argument.

Now that's disingenuous af. As Jim Rome would say.....Good night now

Thank you, elguapo. I don't get some of these other posters' "takes."

So its a "take" when I want to compare turnovers per game rather than total turnovers (considering the two QBs who are being compared had a difference of more than half a seasons worth of games played in 2 years)? Cmon Lott. I thought you had more sense than this. One guy played 31 games in 2 years and the other played 22. The guy who played 22 games turned the ball over at a higher rate than the guy who played 31. But because there was a 9 game difference (not even to mention the difference in attempts), the guy who played more turned the ball over in total more.

I swear this shouldnt be difficult.

I like context plus stats, SWH. Context you get from watching each guy play throughout entire games (not highlights, not partial games).

Instead of writing you a big unnecessary response, I'll just ask you this and I want an honest answer: From what you saw in Goff's play as a pro up through the 2019 season and from what you saw in Garoppolo's play from NE days through the 2019 season, which of the two would you have wanted as the Niners' starting QB after 2019?

I'm assuming you have watched a lot of Goff's games like I have - I'm a Cal Bears fan so I've followed him there and in the NFL.

Edit: Just went back and read the whole exchange and what I mentioned...wasn't necessarily referring to you as one of those "other posters" b/c I'm pretty sure you get the "context matters" thing.

Assuming optimal health and gun to my head, I would pick Jimmy. But having said that, I also believe they are in the same tier of QB. The fact that these posts present the idea that Jimmy is substantially better than Goff is actually laughable to me. IMO a healthy Jimmy is slightly better than Goff.

As far as context goes, yes, context is very important. Stats dont tell the entire story. But I also believe the "context" provided by Guapo is incredibly skewed to make Goff's situation sound substantially better than it was and incredibly skewed to make Jimmy's situation sound substantially worse than it was.

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by LottDMontanaO:

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by LottDMontanaO:

Originally posted by elguapo:
Just like you ignored the rest of my post how poorly Goff played and his own coach even called him out. You disregarded team health and supporting cast. You do realize that when an offense is hammered with injuries qbs tend to not do as well. I used that in my argument when comparing the qbs similar turnover rate and showed reason why they were even close. But then again that's common sense. Way to provide some stats WITHOUT ANY CONTEXT whatsoever.

Stats are for losers, especially without context. Here's a prime example. Last year Tom Brady had his worst year EVER td% and 3rd worst year ever in completion %, and many categories were indicative of a decline. A lot of people were saying he's finally going downhill. What they didn't realize or care to is his OL wasn't protecting him and he didn't have weapons at his disposal due to the lack of talent and injuries. That's exactly why you have to have context. But hey, sometimes ignorance is bliss and needed to support a failing argument.

Now that's disingenuous af. As Jim Rome would say.....Good night now

Thank you, elguapo. I don't get some of these other posters' "takes."

So its a "take" when I want to compare turnovers per game rather than total turnovers (considering the two QBs who are being compared had a difference of more than half a seasons worth of games played in 2 years)? Cmon Lott. I thought you had more sense than this. One guy played 31 games in 2 years and the other played 22. The guy who played 22 games turned the ball over at a higher rate than the guy who played 31. But because there was a 9 game difference (not even to mention the difference in attempts), the guy who played more turned the ball over in total more.

I swear this shouldnt be difficult.

I like context plus stats, SWH. Context you get from watching each guy play throughout entire games (not highlights, not partial games).

Instead of writing you a big unnecessary response, I'll just ask you this and I want an honest answer: From what you saw in Goff's play as a pro up through the 2019 season and from what you saw in Garoppolo's play from NE days through the 2019 season, which of the two would you have wanted as the Niners' starting QB after 2019?

I'm assuming you have watched a lot of Goff's games like I have - I'm a Cal Bears fan so I've followed him there and in the NFL.

Edit: Just went back and read the whole exchange and what I mentioned...wasn't necessarily referring to you as one of those "other posters" b/c I'm pretty sure you get the "context matters" thing.

Assuming optimal health and gun to my head, I would pick Jimmy. But having said that, I also believe they are in the same tier of QB. The fact that these posts present the idea that Jimmy is substantially better than Goff is actually laughable to me. IMO a healthy Jimmy is slightly better than Goff.

Fair enough. And I do agree with you about both being in the same QB tier - one of the biggest reasons for that is Garoppolo has a smaller sample size of games than Goff and just hasn't done it enough. So I agree, Garoppolo is better than Goff but only by so much until he plays more and proves it out.

Originally posted by TheWooLick:
Why not answer my question?
How much money will JG get if he is cut after TC?

He should take whatever money he can, that is what would be in his best interest.

What business he has being paid whatever and how much he has made is completely irrelevant.

I mean Dalton and Teddy each got around $4.5-$5m and that was at the beginning of free agency when when teams didn't have rosters in place and whatever little was available was well available. I don't see any team giving him anything more than that in July.

if SF asked him to take a pay cut to $12M for one yr, he's still making the 12th highest amount of cash at the QB position in 2021. He's also gets to compete to start on a SB roster and be a FA in 2022…imo he should worry about his next contract and what spot will give him the best odds at increasing his market.

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Odds are he won't be cut and if it happens, he won't sign until FA next year unless a major injury happens this year

Right so he would lose out on millions and not play for a year…only dropping his stock even more for FA in 2022.

I mean it's not that far fetched of an idea to ask him to take a pay cut if they feel like Lance is gonna start at some point.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Odds are he won't be cut and if it happens, he won't sign until FA next year unless a major injury happens this year

Right so he would lose out on millions and not play for a year…only dropping his stock even more for FA in 2022.

I mean it's not that far fetched of an idea to ask him to take a pay cut if they feel like Lance is gonna start at some point.

Only if he's cut would he lose, but I don't think Jimmy is that desperate to feel like he's losing out.

Saints will def pay more than 12 for him

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by TheWooLick:
If they release Jimmy after camp how much would he get paid? If if makes financial sense to JG I could see it.
That would be a ballsy move by Kyle and it would be a sign of Trey being ready which would be awesome.

There isn't a team right now that's gonna pay him $12M for one yr of play…that's the point. It's not about making sense for him right now. He's one of the highest paid football players in the league and has absolutely no business being. Also if Jimmy wants a new contract and freedom of free agency in 2022 he would do this.

Why not answer my question?
How much money will JG get if he is cut after TC?

He should take whatever money he can, that is what would be in his best interest.

What business he has being paid whatever and how much he has made is completely irrelevant.

too many what-ifs. let's just see what happens

Originally posted

Originally posted by Jack49ers84:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
he does tend to have a bone head play.. but he doesn't do that often in a game or we wouldn't have won a game

Will he clean it up this year? He should be able to with the additions to the OL (more time to throw)

He tends to do it in every game, that's often. Or do you mean multiple times in a game? Yeah hopefully it gets cleaned up, I think the Mack signing in itself will be huge compared to the s**t show circus gymnastics we've had at C

often in a game like Mulens did last year. Jimmy was good enough where our defense didn't have to win games like it did in 2011

You don't think our defense had to win the game against Pittsburgh when the offense turned the ball over five times? Or against the Rams in week 5 when the offense averaged under 4 yards a play? Or against Washington when they put up 9 points? Or in the second game against the Cardinals when Jimmy threw a pick with about 4 minutes left in the game? Or in the playoffs against Minnesota when our passing offense was struggling badly? The defense had to carry the team in a lot of games in 2019.

and yet, in several of those games Jimmy threw the winning TD pass, and made crucial clutch 3rd down conversions in crunch time when it mattered. despite the ups and downs of the game. that's why losing the SB hurt so bad. because jimmy in his history with us has always been money on 3rd down and pretty clutch in the 4th for the most part. the only times I can ever recall him failing to get it done in the 4th was the SB, and the opening game vs the Cards in 2020.

Some team is bound to lose their starter - then we can think about unloading Jimmy.

Originally posted by SkyZer0:

Originally posted

Originally posted by Jack49ers84:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
he does tend to have a bone head play.. but he doesn't do that often in a game or we wouldn't have won a game

Will he clean it up this year? He should be able to with the additions to the OL (more time to throw)

He tends to do it in every game, that's often. Or do you mean multiple times in a game? Yeah hopefully it gets cleaned up, I think the Mack signing in itself will be huge compared to the s**t show circus gymnastics we've had at C

often in a game like Mulens did last year. Jimmy was good enough where our defense didn't have to win games like it did in 2011

You don't think our defense had to win the game against Pittsburgh when the offense turned the ball over five times? Or against the Rams in week 5 when the offense averaged under 4 yards a play? Or against Washington when they put up 9 points? Or in the second game against the Cardinals when Jimmy threw a pick with about 4 minutes left in the game? Or in the playoffs against Minnesota when our passing offense was struggling badly? The defense had to carry the team in a lot of games in 2019.

and yet, in several of those games Jimmy threw the winning TD pass, and made crucial clutch 3rd down conversions in crunch time when it mattered. despite the ups and downs of the game. that's why losing the SB hurt so bad. because jimmy in his history with us has always been money on 3rd down and pretty clutch in the 4th for the most part. the only times I can ever recall him failing to get it done in the 4th was the SB, and the opening game vs the Cards in 2020.

I think against the falcons also?

but you're right, that year you knew if we had the ball we can score when needed

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by SkyZer0:

Originally posted

Originally posted by Jack49ers84:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
he does tend to have a bone head play.. but he doesn't do that often in a game or we wouldn't have won a game

Will he clean it up this year? He should be able to with the additions to the OL (more time to throw)

He tends to do it in every game, that's often. Or do you mean multiple times in a game? Yeah hopefully it gets cleaned up, I think the Mack signing in itself will be huge compared to the s**t show circus gymnastics we've had at C

often in a game like Mulens did last year. Jimmy was good enough where our defense didn't have to win games like it did in 2011

You don't think our defense had to win the game against Pittsburgh when the offense turned the ball over five times? Or against the Rams in week 5 when the offense averaged under 4 yards a play? Or against Washington when they put up 9 points? Or in the second game against the Cardinals when Jimmy threw a pick with about 4 minutes left in the game? Or in the playoffs against Minnesota when our passing offense was struggling badly? The defense had to carry the team in a lot of games in 2019.

and yet, in several of those games Jimmy threw the winning TD pass, and made crucial clutch 3rd down conversions in crunch time when it mattered. despite the ups and downs of the game. that's why losing the SB hurt so bad. because jimmy in his history with us has always been money on 3rd down and pretty clutch in the 4th for the most part. the only times I can ever recall him failing to get it done in the 4th was the SB, and the opening game vs the Cards in 2020.

I think against the falcons also?

but you're right, that year you knew if we had the ball we can score when needed

Except in the Super Bowl.