Jimmy Garoppolo, QB, Los Angeles Rams

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
What injuries, he stank

Torn labrum in shoulder. Missed half of 2015.

2012 Kap was better than Jimmy ever was. So again if we wanna talk about what players can be based on small sample sizes then we can lament him too. But you only want to do that for Jimmy and Sam. Anyone else that was uber successful for a short time needs to be judged by the entirety of their careers.

Kaep was a joke, look at RG3 that season, NFL didn't catch up to that stuff, until they did. Then he stank. 3 TOs in Q4 with the SB on the line is a bigger playoff choke job than anything Jimmy did. So NFL caught up to him and he had no adjustment.

That's the dif on CK vs JG, JG was doing well from 2016-2022 that's 7 years, NFL trying to throw every curve ball in the book, so he wasn't a one year wonder like CK.

Equivocating a towel boy to arguably the the most important position in any sport literally might be the dumbest sports take I've heard lol. And we're supposed to take you Stans seriously....

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
Kaep was a joke, look at RG3 that season, NFL didn't catch up to that stuff, until they did. Then he stank. 3 TOs in Q4 with the SB on the line is a bigger playoff choke job than anything Jimmy did. So NFL caught up to him and he had no adjustment.

That's the dif on CK vs JG, JG was doing well from 2016-2022 that's 7 years, NFL trying to throw every curve ball in the book, so he wasn't a one year wonder like CK.

Kap didn't have Kyle to hide him like Jimmy. Greg Roman showed how mediocre he was in Buffalo and Baltimore.

Kap never developed properly but he also had far more responsibility within the offense on his shoulders. But he also won multiple playoff road games because of his play, not because of blocked punts or the offense running the ball so well he never had to throw.

Kap was every bit league average in 2013 and 2014 just like Jimmy. He just wasn't the same player he was in 2012 after he was figured out. JUST LIKE JIMMY.

Kap also never looked like Jimmy did with the Raiders this year.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
Kaep was a joke, look at RG3 that season, NFL didn't catch up to that stuff, until they did. Then he stank. 3 TOs in Q4 with the SB on the line is a bigger playoff choke job than anything Jimmy did. So NFL caught up to him and he had no adjustment.

That's the dif on CK vs JG, JG was doing well from 2016-2022 that's 7 years, NFL trying to throw every curve ball in the book, so he wasn't a one year wonder like CK.

The three turnovers were obviously not good, but his playmaking ability was the only reason we had a chance in that game at all on the offensive side of the ball. That was one of the greatest defenses of all time, in one of the most difficult environments to play in all time.

Playmaking ability was completely absent from Jimmy's game at any point of his career.

Does that mean that Kaepernick was better than Jimmy? It's hard to say for me. Jimmy could be counted on to execute in rhythm better than Kaep could… but Kaep was a big play QB that could threaten defenses with the run. Neither were complete players. Jimmy was always in a better situation, both scheme and talent around him.

Kap was exceptional until teams took away his running ability. With that said I think his best year as a QB was under Chip Kellt when he stopped forcing the ball and started managing the game. I would've liked to see him play elsewhere but we all know what happened.

As far as pure passing, Kap was not even remotely close to Jimmy. Not even an iota. As far as playmaking ability and explosiveness Kaep was hands down the better QB im thelar regard. At the end of the day both QBs had some very good qualities but unfortunately both had tremendous flaws that held them back. Like Jimmy, I appreciated Kaps time here and what Kap brought. I know appreciating past players triggers the King of Stans immensely but whatever.

I think it's hilarious that some use the injury excuse for Jimmy and not players like RG3 and Kaepernick.

Everyone saw RG3 tear his ACL multiple times and Kaep was noticeably thinner with less muscle after his peak years. Both players relied heavily on their athleticism to make plays and when they didn't have that, they regressed significantly. You could literally see how both players were affected by their injuries, yet with Jimmy it's not noticeable at all.

Miss me with the "defenses figured him out" narrative… the weapons that Kaep played with around 2015-2016 was some of the worst I've ever seen as a 49ers fan, not to mention his head coach was a guy who farts at his press conferences and Chip Kelly.

And even with that Kaep scored 16 TDs with only 4 Ints with nobody around him.

Kaepernick wasn't a great processor, but with any help he was more dangerous than Jimmy ever was.

Originally posted by Waterbear:
I think it's hilarious that some use the injury excuse for Jimmy and not players like RG3 and Kaepernick.

Everyone saw RG3 tear his ACL multiple times and Kaep was noticeably thinner with less muscle after his peak years. Both players relied heavily on their athleticism to make plays and when they didn't have that, they regressed significantly. You could literally see how both players were affected by their injuries, yet with Jimmy it's not noticeable at all.

Miss me with the "defenses figured him out" narrative… the weapons that Kaep played with around 2015-2016 was some of the worst I've ever seen as a 49ers fan, not to mention his head coach was a guy who farts at his press conferences and Chip Kelly.

And even with that Kaep scored 16 TDs with only 4 Ints with nobody around him.

Kaepernick wasn't a great processor, but with any help he was more dangerous than Jimmy ever was.

So an ACL hurt RG3 but not Jimmy. Seems rather hypocritical to me. A injury to the throwing hand means nothing...

And yeah from 9 rushing tds in 2 seasons to 2 in his next 2 seasons(1 rushing TD a year)... The defense figure him out.

Originally posted by MucketyMuck:

Originally posted by Waterbear:
I think it's hilarious that some use the injury excuse for Jimmy and not players like RG3 and Kaepernick.

Everyone saw RG3 tear his ACL multiple times and Kaep was noticeably thinner with less muscle after his peak years. Both players relied heavily on their athleticism to make plays and when they didn't have that, they regressed significantly. You could literally see how both players were affected by their injuries, yet with Jimmy it's not noticeable at all.

Miss me with the "defenses figured him out" narrative… the weapons that Kaep played with around 2015-2016 was some of the worst I've ever seen as a 49ers fan, not to mention his head coach was a guy who farts at his press conferences and Chip Kelly.

And even with that Kaep scored 16 TDs with only 4 Ints with nobody around him.

Kaepernick wasn't a great processor, but with any help he was more dangerous than Jimmy ever was.

So an ACL hurt RG3 but not Jimmy. Seems rather hypocritical to me. A injury to the throwing hand means nothing...

And yeah from 9 rushing tds in 2 seasons to 2 in his next 2 seasons(1 rushing TD a year)... The defense figure him out.

I'm not the one claiming one was "figured out" and the other one's poor play can be explained solely due to an accumulation of injuries.

That's the hypocrisy I'm pointing out.

If we're going to be fair, multiple ACL's to a running QB is worse than a ACL tear to a pocket QB. Jimmy was not a running QB. Not sure why that's hard to understand.

Originally posted by Waterbear:
I think it's hilarious that some use the injury excuse for Jimmy and not players like RG3 and Kaepernick.

Everyone saw RG3 tear his ACL multiple times and Kaep was noticeably thinner with less muscle after his peak years. Both players relied heavily on their athleticism to make plays and when they didn't have that, they regressed significantly. You could literally see how both players were affected by their injuries, yet with Jimmy it's not noticeable at all.

Miss me with the "defenses figured him out" narrative… the weapons that Kaep played with around 2015-2016 was some of the worst I've ever seen as a 49ers fan, not to mention his head coach was a guy who farts at his press conferences and Chip Kelly.

And even with that Kaep scored 16 TDs with only 4 Ints with nobody around him.

Kaepernick wasn't a great processor, but with any help he was more dangerous than Jimmy ever was.

Because everything is a narrative. Kap got figured out but Jimmy didn't. Geno hasn't been a good QB so he's not good but Sam was actually good and the Jets held him back.

It's all patently absurd. No consistency.

I didn't bring Kap up for a Jimmy vs Kap debate. It was to show a small sample doesn't mean the guy was destined to be great. But apparently 6 game samples of Jimmy and Sam showed more about who they are then the entirety of the rest of their careers. Not so much for Kap and Geno.

Originally posted by MucketyMuck:
Kap was exceptional until teams took away his running ability. With that said I think his best year as a QB was under Chip Kellt when he stopped forcing the ball and started managing the game. I would've liked to see him play elsewhere but we all know what happened.

As far as pure passing, Kap was not even remotely close to Jimmy. Not even an iota. As far as playmaking ability and explosiveness Kaep was hands down the better QB im thelar regard. At the end of the day both QBs had some very good qualities but unfortunately both had tremendous flaws that held them back. Like Jimmy, I appreciated Kaps time here and what Kap brought. I know appreciating past players triggers the King of Stans immensely but whatever.

That's a fair take. Whats not a fair take is to say one guy got completely figured out and the other guy was only ruined by injuries. It's just not remotely accurate.

As you said both had tremendous flaws in their games. One person in particular is in denial about that simply because Jimmy won a Fed Ex Air of the week award or got a big contract (As if Kap didn't).

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Waterbear:
I think it's hilarious that some use the injury excuse for Jimmy and not players like RG3 and Kaepernick.

Everyone saw RG3 tear his ACL multiple times and Kaep was noticeably thinner with less muscle after his peak years. Both players relied heavily on their athleticism to make plays and when they didn't have that, they regressed significantly. You could literally see how both players were affected by their injuries, yet with Jimmy it's not noticeable at all.

Miss me with the "defenses figured him out" narrative… the weapons that Kaep played with around 2015-2016 was some of the worst I've ever seen as a 49ers fan, not to mention his head coach was a guy who farts at his press conferences and Chip Kelly.

And even with that Kaep scored 16 TDs with only 4 Ints with nobody around him.

Kaepernick wasn't a great processor, but with any help he was more dangerous than Jimmy ever was.

Because everything is a narrative. Kap got figured out but Jimmy didn't. Geno hasn't been a good QB so he's not good but Sam was actually good and the Jets held him back.

It's all patently absurd. No consistency.

I didn't bring Kap up for a Jimmy vs Kap debate. It was to show a small sample doesn't mean the guy was destined to be great. But apparently 6 game samples of Jimmy and Sam showed more about who they are then the entirety of the rest of their careers. Not so much for Kap and Geno.

Kyle can't win without Jimmy
Kaepernick was figured out
Aldon Smith wasn't good without Justin

Just stupid narratives that many 49ers fans believed because they refused to see the context.

Originally posted by Waterbear:

Originally posted by MucketyMuck:

Originally posted by Waterbear:
I think it's hilarious that some use the injury excuse for Jimmy and not players like RG3 and Kaepernick.

Everyone saw RG3 tear his ACL multiple times and Kaep was noticeably thinner with less muscle after his peak years. Both players relied heavily on their athleticism to make plays and when they didn't have that, they regressed significantly. You could literally see how both players were affected by their injuries, yet with Jimmy it's not noticeable at all.

Miss me with the "defenses figured him out" narrative… the weapons that Kaep played with around 2015-2016 was some of the worst I've ever seen as a 49ers fan, not to mention his head coach was a guy who farts at his press conferences and Chip Kelly.

And even with that Kaep scored 16 TDs with only 4 Ints with nobody around him.

Kaepernick wasn't a great processor, but with any help he was more dangerous than Jimmy ever was.

So an ACL hurt RG3 but not Jimmy. Seems rather hypocritical to me. A injury to the throwing hand means nothing...

And yeah from 9 rushing tds in 2 seasons to 2 in his next 2 seasons(1 rushing TD a year)... The defense figure him out.

I'm not the one claiming one was "figured out" and the other one's poor play can be explained solely due to an accumulation of injuries.

That's the hypocrisy I'm pointing out.

If we're going to be fair, multiple ACL's to a running QB is worse than a ACL tear to a pocket QB. Jimmy was not a running QB. Not sure why that's hard to understand.

I think it affects anybody no matter what style they play. I know you weren't talking directly to me but I mean...that's not hard to understand either. It's a major injury. Sure it might hurt RG3 more but a torn ligament in the hand and a injury that needed surgery in the shoulder affects a QB too. Let's not talk about his foot injury, concussions and back injury too. It's a terrible argument imo. Injuries no matter the QB have consequences not just for Kaepernick and RG3

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
That's a fair take. Whats not a fair take is to say one guy got completely figured out and the other guy was only ruined by injuries. It's just not remotely accurate.

As you said both had tremendous flaws in their games. One person in particular is in denial about that simply because Jimmy won a Fed Ex Air of the week award or got a big contract (As if Kap didn't).

If an argument is going to use QBR as a basis, Kaep's last season was on par with Jimmy's last three seasons played in SF (between 4-7 points lower depending on year) and significantly better than Jimmy's number with the Raiders. That 2016 Niners team was miles worse than the Shanahan Niners, and not as good as this year's Raiders team either (though obviously closer).

Comparison aside it's not really an argument that holds water.

Originally posted by MucketyMuck:
I think it affects anybody no matter what style they play. I know you weren't talking directly to me but I mean...that's not hard to understand either. It's a major injury. Sure it might hurt RG3 more but a torn ligament in the hand and a injury that needed surgery in the shoulder affects a QB too. Let's not talk about his foot injury, concussions and back injury too. It's a terrible argument imo. Injuries no matter the QB have consequences not just for Kaepernick and RG3

One key difference is you saw Jimmy recover from that hand injury and actually improve statistically the following season. His recovery was proven and again there isn't any evidence to suggest his current struggles are the result of physical decline. It's very obviously mental mistakes.

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:
If an argument is going to use QBR as a basis, Kaep's last season was on par with Jimmy's last three seasons played in SF (between 4-7 points lower depending on year) and significantly better than Jimmy's number with the Raiders. That 2016 Niners team was miles worse than the Shanahan Niners, and not as good as this year's Raiders team either (though obviously closer).

Comparison aside it's not really an argument that holds water.

I mean I don't think the 23 Raiders and 16 9ers on the offensive side are remotely close.