Mac Jones-QB-Jaguars

Originally posted by Nastastical:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CLIvPK1gFz4/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Lol I know he has Brady like film room work ethic, but if he gets his body in shape too and let that become his next obsession, it would be big time.

still got those chicken legs lol. I don't see him being big time but like we've done all throughout this process.

agree to disagree

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Nastastical:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CLIvPK1gFz4/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Lol I know he has Brady like film room work ethic, but if he gets his body in shape too and let that become his next obsession, it would be big time.

still got those chicken legs lol. I don't see him being big time but like we've done all throughout this process.

agree to disagree

Have you seen Matt Ryan?

Originally posted by Nastastical:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Nastastical:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CLIvPK1gFz4/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Lol I know he has Brady like film room work ethic, but if he gets his body in shape too and let that become his next obsession, it would be big time.

still got those chicken legs lol. I don't see him being big time but like we've done all throughout this process.

agree to disagree

Have you seen Matt Ryan?

Matt Ryan was also 6-5 230 coming into the league.

https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/matt-ryan

Mac just gotta firm up his base and strengthen his hips with some squats, cleans and deadlifts.

Originally posted by krizay:

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:
I think you're right, and it scares the hell out of me. A dumbed down offense run by a smart but limited QB? No thanks.

My point is that by the time I think Mac is actually successful, year 2 or 3, I think the other QB's we'd have passed on because they aren't as good year 1, would then be better than him.

So you are saying Mac is more ready now but wont be successful until year 2 or 3. Yet the guys whom you would think needs the offense "dumbed down" even more will be better than him by the time he's successful.

Yes, because for me I have definitely Lance and probably Fields sitting on the bench that 1st year. Year 2 would be close for me, and I may even lean Mac, by Year 3 I have Fields and Lance ahead.

Originally posted by Nastastical:
Or those guys might be another Mariota/Winston type bust. None of us know how any of these guys will turn out. You call Mac limited, but being an elite athlete isn't a requirement for a QB, it's just a helpful tool if combined with the real skills you need to be successful at the position. Shanny has had success with guys like Mac. He values IQ and accuracy over athleticism.

2021 I see us competing for a playoff spot with Jones starting, and then in 2022 we really take off having loads of cap space with the salary cap going back up and many bad contracts gone from the team, allowing us to attack free agency, which should be loaded since many guys will sign 1 year deals when 2021 free agency begins soon.

I don't care about the mobility as that's a bonus trait for me, but you put it together with the arm strength disparity between him and those guys and that's why I have them rated so much higher.

Success for all college players to the NFL is not a given, the speed and complexity factors are far and away above college.

I agree that Mac has a higher floor, 4 years experience in the SEC and specifically at Alabama stands him in good stead, but I'm not aiming to hit a double when it comes to QB.

I'm swinging for the fence, and if I strike out, I'll swing again.

To be fair, that mentality is partially fuelled by the fact that I still believe that Jimmy may become the QB we need anyway, so I'm happy to take a risk. I understand others who may want to play it safer.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Nastastical:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Nastastical:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CLIvPK1gFz4/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Lol I know he has Brady like film room work ethic, but if he gets his body in shape too and let that become his next obsession, it would be big time.

still got those chicken legs lol. I don't see him being big time but like we've done all throughout this process.

agree to disagree

Have you seen Matt Ryan?

Matt Ryan was also 6-5 230 coming into the league.

https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/matt-ryan

Ryan still didn't have a solid build early on. The guy worked his behind off over the years to improve his arm strength. Most pocket QB's don't have great builds during their rookie season. Mac has more than enough time to improve that if he puts in the work... like many before him have done.

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

Originally posted by Nastastical:
Or those guys might be another Mariota/Winston type bust. None of us know how any of these guys will turn out. You call Mac limited, but being an elite athlete isn't a requirement for a QB, it's just a helpful tool if combined with the real skills you need to be successful at the position. Shanny has had success with guys like Mac. He values IQ and accuracy over athleticism.

2021 I see us competing for a playoff spot with Jones starting, and then in 2022 we really take off having loads of cap space with the salary cap going back up and many bad contracts gone from the team, allowing us to attack free agency, which should be loaded since many guys will sign 1 year deals when 2021 free agency begins soon.

I don't care about the mobility as that's a bonus trait for me, but you put it together with the arm strength disparity between him and those guys and that's why I have them rated so much higher.

Success for all college players to the NFL is not a given, the speed and complexity factors are far and away above college.

I agree that Mac has a higher floor, 4 years experience in the SEC and specifically at Alabama stands him in good stead, but I'm not aiming to hit a double when it comes to QB.

I'm swinging for the fence, and if I strike out, I'll swing again.

That's the thing though, we don't need to swing for the fences when you are down 1 and have the bases loaded with 1 out. Why risk chasing the homerun and it might lead into a double play that ends the game? We don't need a homerun to win it. We came extremely close by having multiple contributors, and not being reliant on any single player.

This team is well coached and were competitive this past season, while missing so many players, so they just need to not screw it up with bad picks, signings, or having another injury plagued season. Guys like Mac Jones and Slater are probably 2 of the most sure things in the draft imo because of their high floors. That's all we really need. Everyone talks about missing on Mahomes, but the safe picks in that draft were Watson and Adams at #3 and Watt later in the 1st because of their floors, and this isn't hindsight either, we had many discussions in here during that draft about the guys with high floors, but not the highest ceilings. We went with the more risky picks in year 1 and paid for it, but it made sense then because of how trash the roster was back then.

Originally posted by Nastastical:
Ryan still didn't have a solid build early on. The guy worked his behind off over the years to improve his arm strength. Most pocket QB's don't have great builds during their rookie season. Mac has more than enough time to improve that if he puts in the work... like many before him have done.

He was like 15lbs bigger and his velocity in this throws was much better than Jones.

Jones imo is more Andy Dalton than Ryan coming out of college. Both guys were super smart "heady" QBs, accurate, both had decent not great arms, both were leaders on their teams and won in college. Dalton did have more experience though. They're right around the same size as well.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Nastastical:
Ryan still didn't have a solid build early on. The guy worked his behind off over the years to improve his arm strength. Most pocket QB's don't have great builds during their rookie season. Mac has more than enough time to improve that if he puts in the work... like many before him have done.

He was like 15lbs bigger and his velocity in this throws was much better than Jones.

You say that, but Ryan was never praised for having a big arm coming out of BC. This is something he improved while in the league and it's still no where close to top tier.

Originally posted by Nastastical:
You say that, but Ryan was never praised for having a big arm coming out of BC. This is something he improved while in the league and it's still no where close to top tier.

Ryan had good velocity on his throws, that's what I care more about...tight window throws. All NFL caliber QBs can throw the ball deep enough, imo that's not "arm strength" how fast and hard can you get it from point A to point B.

Like I said Jones is more Dalton to me coming out of college.

heady QBs, great football IQ, good inside the pocket, decent not great arm strength, Dalton might be more athletic, both are leaders and won a ton in college games, Dalton had a lot more starts though. Same size etc etc.

Originally posted by krizay:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Anyone know who he's training with?

I know Fields and Wilson are working together with train3DQB and Joe Beck.

Lance has been working with Quincy Avery and QB takeover or about 5 months (tightening up that release)

QBcountry

QBcountryfriedsteak?

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Nastastical:
You say that, but Ryan was never praised for having a big arm coming out of BC. This is something he improved while in the league and it's still no where close to top tier.

Ryan had good velocity on his throws, that's what I care more about...tight window throws. All NFL caliber QBs can throw the ball deep enough, imo that's not "arm strength" how fast and hard can you get it from point A to point B.

Like I said Jones is more Dalton to me coming out of college.

heady QBs, great football IQ, good inside the pocket, decent not great arm strength, Dalton might be more athletic, both are leaders and won a ton in college games, Dalton had a lot more starts though. Same size etc etc.

Go check every single scouting report on Ryan coming out or find his clips on YouTube. He did not have a bunch of tight window throws. He was a smart QB, but he was questioned by many for his gunslinger mindset, but not having the arm to always get away with those risky tight window throws and it led to a lot of interceptions. Jones imo has better accuracy and similar zip on his throws if you compare him to Ryan coming out, but he protects the ball much better and has a better deep ball because Ryan used to sail a ton of deep passes in college. This was a legit knock on him coming out, but he was still taken high because the game still loved pocket passers back then and he was a heady/accurate QB that just needed to be reigned in a little.

Andy dalton was/is a turnover machine though. I don't see that with Mac yet.

Originally posted by Nastastical:
Go check every single scouting report on Ryan coming out or find his clips on YouTube. He did not have a bunch of tight window throws. He was a smart QB, but he was questioned by many for his gunslinger mindset, but not having the arm to always get away with those risky tight window throws and it led to a lot of interceptions. Jones imo has better accuracy and similar zip on his throws if you compare him to Ryan coming out, but he protects the ball much better and has a better deep ball because Ryan used to sail a ton of deep passes in college. This was a legit knock on him coming out, but he was still taken high because the game still loved pocket passers back then and he was a heady/accurate QB that just needed to be reigned in a little.

Meh you can find draft profiles saying both things good and bad.

just watched the highlights from that VT game back in 2008, ryan was throwing with plenty of velocity.

one play, which you never want the QB doing, he scrambled and threw it across his body, across the field like 30 yards off his back foot for a TD. Plenty of arm. I was actually surprised to see how athletic ryan was at BC.