Mac Jones-QB-Jaguars

Originally posted by Bloodless:

Originally posted by gold49digger:
I'm starting to feel for the kid. If we do draft him he's gonna get booed hard and I bet some niner fans are hoping he fails so they can be proven right. It's getting to the point now where I hope we get him and he balls the f**k out to prove us all wrong.

At least people have a month to get used to the idea before draft night. Could you have imagined if we traded up and drafted him on draft night? He is not the first highly picked Qb who will have to go through this. It will be annoying though, hearing him getting bashed for months before he even gets the chance to prove them right or wrong.

This site would have crashed for sure.

Shanahan wants 'his' guy, if it's Jones and everyone thinks he overpaid for him (he did btw), he's gonna pick him under the assumption he can win with him because of the system and everyone else can f**k off. Got some balls that's for sure, kinda gotta admire that.. IMO, career defining move for him. Maybe he thinks if I just had a better version of JG I could still win it, don't need all those overlyvathletic, special trait having mofos... I'm Kyle Shanahan. Go for it, man.

(I'd still go with one of the other guys)

Originally posted by Bloodless:

Originally posted by Waterbear:

Originally posted by DoseOfBosa:
anyone else notice that the posters who can't wrap their heads around Mac Jones, resort to memes and gifs? as opposed to using logic

Or you know... pointing to the fact that the only great QBs this system has had were mobile?

or the months of interviews Shanahan has described how he would love to have a QB who can run.

only memes though, right?

What are you even talking about. Matt Ryan, Jimmy G, and Goff. Have all very recently taken their teams to the Superbowl in this offense. What are you talking about Elway in the 90s? If Jimmy G and Goff can put up monster numbers in this offense and take their teams to the Superbowl...... Then Imagine what Mac Jones will do with it.

Great points! That makes me feel better. Much better. I'm still a Fields fan, but that *does* make me sleep better at night.

Originally posted by Hopper:

Originally posted by Bloodless:

Originally posted by gold49digger:
I'm starting to feel for the kid. If we do draft him he's gonna get booed hard and I bet some niner fans are hoping he fails so they can be proven right. It's getting to the point now where I hope we get him and he balls the f**k out to prove us all wrong.

At least people have a month to get used to the idea before draft night. Could you have imagined if we traded up and drafted him on draft night? He is not the first highly picked Qb who will have to go through this. It will be annoying though, hearing him getting bashed for months before he even gets the chance to prove them right or wrong.

This site would have crashed for sure.

I disagree

the public is always late on the truth during the months leading up to the draft... and without fail every year they freak out when things don't exactly how ESPN said they were going to go

I don't remember exactly when, but it was deep into the draft process when Baker Mayfield was finally thought of as a possibility for the #1 pick... for the longest time he was #4 in that group after Darnold, Rosen and Allen

that's just one example, I seem to remember Bruce Irvin going from 4th round pick, to second round pick, to late first, to possible top 10... all in the three day right before the draft

I think Mac Jones eventually, organically, would've risen to #3...

but I don't know how things are going to play out if we draft him, with 80% of the fanbase hating his guts

Originally posted by Rathof44:
Shanahan wants 'his' guy, if it's Jones and everyone thinks he overpaid for him (he did btw), he's gonna pick him under the assumption he can win with him because of the system and everyone else can f**k off. Got some balls that's for sure, kinda gotta admire that.. IMO, career defining move for him. Maybe he thinks if I just had a better version of JG I could still win it, don't need all those overlyvathletic, special trait having mofos... I'm Kyle Shanahan. Go for it, man.

(I'd still go with one of the other guys)

Totally agree, I think our offense would be special with Fields, but I understand Kyle if he picks Mac. My feelings won't be too hurt. Again, Mac isn't a statute that everybody portrays him to be. He's a decent scrambler too, just as Fields and Lance are decent pocket passers.

Originally posted by Squash:

Originally posted by Waterbear:
Or you know... pointing to the fact that the only great QBs this system has had were mobile?

or the months of interviews Shanahan has described how he would love to have a QB who can run.

only memes though, right?

He's said it'd be nice to have, but not at the expense of pocket play. It's quite similar to how he feels about 6'4 receivers and having separation skills.

I misspoke. I meant to imply his interview about being open to a running qb has been out for months. He's clearly not pigeonholed to a "pocket qb" like many of you still assume. I think it's clear to me that with this trade he's not taking Jones and I'd bet good money it's because he believes whether is Fields or Lance that he can utilize their mobility. An aspect in which many still think KS undervalues even though he's said in an interview he's more than open to the new age type of QB.

Matt Ryan had a great season with arguably the best WR of our generation. He's a very good QB but I believe KS knows he can take Fields or Lance to another level.

I don't hate Mac Jones I think he's pretty damn good. But pretty damn good isn't what we're trading up 3 first round picks for. I'm sorry but it's not.

I'll eat crow if I'm wrong. But I think this thread will be over very soon.

"It gives you a huge advantage when the quarterback's a threat to run. If you have to pick one way or the other, I always feel no matter who you are, especially when you get in those playoffs, eventually a team's going to make you sit in that pocket and make you make some big throws to win a game. So, you have to have that ability, but anyone who has both always has the chance to exceed everybody.

"Tom Brady's the best to ever play the game and if he could run and do all that other stuff and still be the same way he is, that would be impossible to stop. The more you can have both, the more things you can do as an offense and the less things the defense can do just having to defend everything.

"I think there are a lot more coming up, guys who have seen guys run around and make plays and have stayed at the quarterback position their entire career, starting in Pop Warner to high school, to college. I think more offenses have incorporated a bunch of things that allow guys to develop as pocket passers, even though they're unbelievable athletes and can make plays.

"I think some of the challenges over the last, at least in my career, is you get some of these unbelievable athletes who've never had to sit in a pocket and really go through that because they could just win games in Pop Warner just running around. They can win it in high school just running around. They can win Heismans and do whatever, just running around in college.

"Then eventually you get in the NFL and there's times that you've got to do that and it's really tough, but I think there's more and more guys coming out who have been doing both forever. When you have that, then you've got a chance to do both and that's why you can see that the league is finding more and more of those guys."

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by jcs:
Difference is Josh Rosen was an F up in college and the NFL.

Dude couldn't keep his mouth shut if it was sewn tight. His arrogance didn't match his output at all.

So getting fake IDs and getting a DUI as a Freshman in college is what?

Different kind of F up. Mac's was a lack of maturity at 19. Rosen on the other hand is a permanent Douche bag.

Originally posted by DoseOfBosa:

Originally posted by Hopper:

Originally posted by Bloodless:

Originally posted by gold49digger:
I'm starting to feel for the kid. If we do draft him he's gonna get booed hard and I bet some niner fans are hoping he fails so they can be proven right. It's getting to the point now where I hope we get him and he balls the f**k out to prove us all wrong.

At least people have a month to get used to the idea before draft night. Could you have imagined if we traded up and drafted him on draft night? He is not the first highly picked Qb who will have to go through this. It will be annoying though, hearing him getting bashed for months before he even gets the chance to prove them right or wrong.

This site would have crashed for sure.

I disagree

the public is always late on the truth during the months leading up to the draft... and without fail every year they freak out when things don't exactly how ESPN said they were going to go

I don't remember exactly when, but it was deep into the draft process when Baker Mayfield was finally thought of as a possibility for the #1 pick... for the longest time he was #4 in that group after Darnold, Rosen and Allen

that's just one example, I seem to remember Bruce Irvin going from 4th round pick, to second round pick, to late first, to possible top 10... all in the three day right before the draft

I think Mac Jones eventually, organically, would've risen to #3...

but I don't know how things are going to play out if we draft him, with 80% of the fanbase hating his guts

I think there have been some NFL teams who have always seen Mac Jones as a top 5 Qb prospect . I think the media and the fans were starting to get caught up with this fact. Which was why he was quickly rising. I personally have viewed Mac Jones as a top 5 QB prospect before we made this trade. But it is hard to say where NFL fans and the media would have landed on him. Still is. If niner fans are given a month to get used to the idea of Mac at #3 and they still freak out come draft night. Then The freakout would have been way worse if on draft night we traded two future 1s to move up to land him.

I think some Fans who currently don't want him will get behind him once we draft him. this has always been the way of things for many. Others will hate him until he proves them wrong. But again, this is not the first time a fandom has not been united behind a pick. Hopefully things will not get nasty.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by Rathof44:
Shanahan wants 'his' guy, if it's Jones and everyone thinks he overpaid for him (he did btw), he's gonna pick him under the assumption he can win with him because of the system and everyone else can f**k off. Got some balls that's for sure, kinda gotta admire that.. IMO, career defining move for him. Maybe he thinks if I just had a better version of JG I could still win it, don't need all those overlyvathletic, special trait having mofos... I'm Kyle Shanahan. Go for it, man.

(I'd still go with one of the other guys)

Totally agree, I think our offense would be special with Fields, but I understand Kyle if he picks Mac. My feelings won't be too hurt. Again, Mac isn't a statute that everybody portrays him to be. He's a decent scrambler too, just as Fields and Lance are decent pocket passers.

Like I told my friends right when the trade happened:

it doesn't matter who we pick, I'm just ecstatic that this team is taking a real swing on a QB and I trust Shanahan to get his guy, he's never really hand-picked a QB before, so whoever he picks I'm good with. I can see the positives and potential in Fields, Lance and Jones. I won't be upset with any of those guys, or Wilson if he's somehow there. But assuming Shanahan nails this pick, we'll have a rookie QB under contract for 5 years, which means extending some core team leaders.

but when the news broke last Friday, my initial gut reaction was that this was for Mac Jones. I always wanted us to trade up, I was previously all about Fields, but about 2 weeks ago I started warming up to Mac Jones. By last Thursday I was 50/50 on Mac and Fields up until the trade, and was actually thinking Jones would go before Fields and we would have to get to 7 to secure Jones - because 8 is Carolina and Jones is very similar to Burrow who Carolina's OC had worked with at LSU.

And then post-trade I dove deep into Mac Jones' tape, loved him the more and more that I watched, and re-listened to some Shanahan talk about QBs, and Mac Jones just makes too much sense that I'm convinced it's him

... but if I'm way off and we draft Lance or Fields instead, then I'm just as excited and won't be disappointed like all of these anti-Mac people who will hold a grudge into the season if they don't get their guy

So I used to be on the jones train but I think I am off now. I thought watching him early he was similar to borrow and had potential because of his quick sliding feet and movement in the pocket. Watching burrow more you can clearly see the difference that he was a play maker and made plays out of nothing. That is not jones and what he is is an extremely well managed player. I don't think a managed player is deserving of the #3 pick.

if you watch jones's throws you will notice a pattern of him completing a lot of passes to his first read. You will then think he is very good at going through his progressions because he has a high completion percent. What I noticed was a pattern... a lot of those passes were deep safer (safer in college with elite talent) passes around or outside the numbers. If that wasn't his read more often than not it was a check down. Essentially this wasn't a progression but a safety outlet.

I have watched several of his games and every pass thrown so I would challenge someone that disagrees to tell me what game to watch. I really want to like him but I'm not seeing it now.

Originally posted by Bloodless:

Originally posted by DoseOfBosa:

Originally posted by Hopper:

Originally posted by Bloodless:

Originally posted by gold49digger:
I'm starting to feel for the kid. If we do draft him he's gonna get booed hard and I bet some niner fans are hoping he fails so they can be proven right. It's getting to the point now where I hope we get him and he balls the f**k out to prove us all wrong.

At least people have a month to get used to the idea before draft night. Could you have imagined if we traded up and drafted him on draft night? He is not the first highly picked Qb who will have to go through this. It will be annoying though, hearing him getting bashed for months before he even gets the chance to prove them right or wrong.

This site would have crashed for sure.

I disagree

the public is always late on the truth during the months leading up to the draft... and without fail every year they freak out when things don't exactly how ESPN said they were going to go

I don't remember exactly when, but it was deep into the draft process when Baker Mayfield was finally thought of as a possibility for the #1 pick... for the longest time he was #4 in that group after Darnold, Rosen and Allen

that's just one example, I seem to remember Bruce Irvin going from 4th round pick, to second round pick, to late first, to possible top 10... all in the three day right before the draft

I think Mac Jones eventually, organically, would've risen to #3...

but I don't know how things are going to play out if we draft him, with 80% of the fanbase hating his guts

I think there have been some NFL teams who have always seen Mac Jones as a top 5 Qb prospect . I think the media and the fans were starting to get caught up with this fact. Which was why he was quickly rising. I personally have viewed Mac Jones as a top 5 QB prospect before we made this trade. But it is hard to say where NFL fans and the media would have landed on him. Still is. If niner fans are given a month to get used to the idea of Mac at #3 and they still freak out come draft night. Then The freakout would have been way worse if on draft night we traded two future 1s to move up to land him.

I think some Fans who currently don't want him will get behind him once we draft him. this has always been the way of things for many. Others will hate him until he proves them wrong. But again, this is not the first time a fandom has not been united behind a pick. Hopefully things will not get nasty.

yeah, you're right

the price we paid to move up to #3 is the thing I didn't take into consideration - and yeah, it would've been a major shock on draft day... I suppose for many it will take a long time, and a lot of production on Sundays to justify that price of the trade, no matter who we take

Originally posted by gored49:
So I used to be on the jones train but I think I am off now. I thought watching him early he was similar to borrow and had potential because of his quick sliding feet and movement in the pocket. Watching burrow more you can clearly see the difference that he was a play maker and made plays out of nothing. That is not jones and what he is is an extremely well managed player. I don't think a managed player is deserving of the #3 pick.

if you watch jones's throws you will notice a pattern of him completing a lot of passes to his first read. You will then think he is very good at going through his progressions because he has a high completion percent. What I noticed was a pattern... a lot of those passes were deep safer (safer in college with elite talent) passes around or outside the numbers. If that wasn't his read more often than not it was a check down. Essentially this wasn't a progression but a safety outlet.

I have watched several of his games and every pass thrown so I would challenge someone that disagrees to tell me what game to watch. I really want to like him but I'm not seeing it now.

Jones being a well-managed player shouldn't be a knock, especially under Shanahan

and completing a pass to his first read all the time shouldn't be a knock either, that's what you're supposed to do

You say "deeper-safer throws with elite talent" -- Alabama still plays in the SEC, those are still future-NFL CBs in a lot of those games Mac played in. And I disagree about the majority of his after-1st reads being check-downs, there's plenty of times he's connecting with the second or third read on a non-check-down. And again, hitting a check-down isn't a negative either, Jimmy has had trouble hitting check-downs. We need a QB who can be accurate on all levels. You seem to be concerned over a lot of completed passes.

Watch his tape against Ohio St. in the NCG earlier this year, his most recent game

Look Matt Jones is a statue that reads defense as well and goes to his Progressions well. But everybody's comparing him to Matt Ryan I don't think he'll ever compare to Matt Ryan because Matt Ryan can throw that deep ball. At the pro day Mac Jones deep ball looked horrible. I will be truly truly bummed out if we get back Jones and traded those first rounders for him. His ceiling is so low and there's no way that equals the pics we traded

Jones ceiling is game manager

Originally posted by DoseOfBosa:

Originally posted by gored49:
So I used to be on the jones train but I think I am off now. I thought watching him early he was similar to borrow and had potential because of his quick sliding feet and movement in the pocket. Watching burrow more you can clearly see the difference that he was a play maker and made plays out of nothing. That is not jones and what he is is an extremely well managed player. I don't think a managed player is deserving of the #3 pick.

if you watch jones's throws you will notice a pattern of him completing a lot of passes to his first read. You will then think he is very good at going through his progressions because he has a high completion percent. What I noticed was a pattern... a lot of those passes were deep safer (safer in college with elite talent) passes around or outside the numbers. If that wasn't his read more often than not it was a check down. Essentially this wasn't a progression but a safety outlet.

I have watched several of his games and every pass thrown so I would challenge someone that disagrees to tell me what game to watch. I really want to like him but I'm not seeing it now.

Jones being a well-managed player shouldn't be a knock, especially under Shanahan

and completing a pass to his first read all the time shouldn't be a knock either, that's what you're supposed to do

You say "deeper-safer throws with elite talent" -- Alabama still plays in the SEC, those are still future-NFL CBs in a lot of those games Mac played in. And I disagree about the majority of his after-1st reads being check-downs, there's plenty of times he's connecting with the second or third read on a non-check-down. And again, hitting a check-down isn't a negative either, Jimmy has had trouble hitting check-downs. We need a QB who can be accurate on all levels. You seem to be concerned over a lot of completed passes.

Watch his tape against Ohio St. in the NCG earlier this year, his most recent game

This. I see plenty of him going through multiple reads. I think his film shows he is capable of making NFL throws. Also, I don't think it is a bad thing to go to a wide-open check down after your first or second read is covered. It is smart actually. In the NFL you want the ball coming out as soon as possible. This is assuming the RB is open of course. You know who finds open RBs out of the backfield. A guy named Brady. One of the things that drive me crazy about Jimmy is he never finds the open check down. You cannot fault Mac for making the right decision with the football on the field. I don't care if it is his first read or a check-down as long as he is throwing to open players. That is a positive in my book.