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Originally posted by 49ersRing:
Originally posted by Alfienator:
He's better than Dwayne Haskins
Haskins at least had the courtesy to flame out quickly. The worst is a guy who's just good enough to stick around and you keep expecting him to turn the corner, but he never does.
Originally posted by roasthawg:
Donovan McNabb comes to mind as one of the most hated picks by the fanbase ever. They wanted Ricky Williams so badly they lost their minds when Donovan was the pick.
Another one was JJ Watt. Texans fans freaked when his name was announced. They were outraged. Didn't last long lol.
Originally posted by JTB1974:
If we were drafting a QB for the next year or two, Then Yes maybe Mac Should be the pick but this is about getting your franchise QB for the next decade. Is Fields or Lance as good as Mac right now at proccessing and accuracy? Probally not but they could be in the future and if that happens you got yourselves a top 3 QB based on all their other Physical tools. The stuff Mac Jones can't do he will never be able to. I don't think anybody is denying can't be a good QB but when you are trading two future 1st RD picks and a 3rd you are looking for a guy who can be the best of the best. That should be the players ceiling and potential. Even the Jones supporters such as Simms don't even mention him being among the best if he reaches his potential. They just say he could be a really good QB. But what is really good? Cousins is a good QB but he isn't elite. There is reason Cousins hasn't been able to take the Vikings to the next level despite being decent and being part of many decent Vikings teams. He just doesn't have that extra level that is needed.
Originally posted by Nastastical:
Originally posted by roasthawg:
Donovan McNabb comes to mind as one of the most hated picks by the fanbase ever. They wanted Ricky Williams so badly they lost their minds when Donovan was the pick.
Another one was JJ Watt. Texans fans freaked when his name was announced. They were outraged. Didn't last long lol.
Nothing new. Many fans love this time of year because they get to try and earn their make-believe GM badge.
We have no access to ALL the information teams have. No access to medicals, background history, highschool and college coaches/teammates, or interviews with the players where you get to pick their brains. We only get to see the players play and most of us don't even have access to All-22 film, but somehow some feel like they're informed enough to call for Kyle and John's head because draft sites didn't have Jones ranked higher during the college season. Even KC took heat from fans and draft analyst for trading up to select Mahomes. Hell, look at the complaining in here after we selected Aiyuk. Some even complained about Kittle because they thought we wasted a 5th on a blocking TE.
The silliness of all this is mind boggling.
Originally posted by Zealot:
Originally posted by JTB1974:
If we were drafting a QB for the next year or two, Then Yes maybe Mac Should be the pick but this is about getting your franchise QB for the next decade. Is Fields or Lance as good as Mac right now at proccessing and accuracy? Probally not but they could be in the future and if that happens you got yourselves a top 3 QB based on all their other Physical tools. The stuff Mac Jones can't do he will never be able to. I don't think anybody is denying can't be a good QB but when you are trading two future 1st RD picks and a 3rd you are looking for a guy who can be the best of the best. That should be the players ceiling and potential. Even the Jones supporters such as Simms don't even mention him being among the best if he reaches his potential. They just say he could be a really good QB. But what is really good? Cousins is a good QB but he isn't elite. There is reason Cousins hasn't been able to take the Vikings to the next level despite being decent and being part of many decent Vikings teams. He just doesn't have that extra level that is needed.
Yeah, but that extra level doesn't need to be a cannon arm and the ability to run around like a march hare. Maybe Jones already has the extra level and it resides between his ears rather than in his limbs.
Originally posted by roasthawg:
Originally posted by Nastastical:
Originally posted by roasthawg:
Donovan McNabb comes to mind as one of the most hated picks by the fanbase ever. They wanted Ricky Williams so badly they lost their minds when Donovan was the pick.
Another one was JJ Watt. Texans fans freaked when his name was announced. They were outraged. Didn't last long lol.
Nothing new. Many fans love this time of year because they get to try and earn their make-believe GM badge.
We have no access to ALL the information teams have. No access to medicals, background history, highschool and college coaches/teammates, or interviews with the players where you get to pick their brains. We only get to see the players play and most of us don't even have access to All-22 film, but somehow some feel like they're informed enough to call for Kyle and John's head because draft sites didn't have Jones ranked higher during the college season. Even KC took heat from fans and draft analyst for trading up to select Mahomes. Hell, look at the complaining in here after we selected Aiyuk. Some even complained about Kittle because they thought we wasted a 5th on a blocking TE.
The silliness of all this is mind boggling.
Well put. It's so easy to get frustrated with the ridiculous takes and get caught up in it. I came in here without a dog in the fight, just interested in trying to figure out who Shannahan was gonna take. Now I've spent so much time defending Jones that I'm starting to hope he's the pick lol. Really I'm excited with whoever Kyle chooses. The drama is watching how it plays out over the next several seasons. Good stuff.
Originally posted by Nastastical:
Originally posted by roasthawg:
Originally posted by Nastastical:
Originally posted by roasthawg:
Donovan McNabb comes to mind as one of the most hated picks by the fanbase ever. They wanted Ricky Williams so badly they lost their minds when Donovan was the pick.
Another one was JJ Watt. Texans fans freaked when his name was announced. They were outraged. Didn't last long lol.
Nothing new. Many fans love this time of year because they get to try and earn their make-believe GM badge.
We have no access to ALL the information teams have. No access to medicals, background history, highschool and college coaches/teammates, or interviews with the players where you get to pick their brains. We only get to see the players play and most of us don't even have access to All-22 film, but somehow some feel like they're informed enough to call for Kyle and John's head because draft sites didn't have Jones ranked higher during the college season. Even KC took heat from fans and draft analyst for trading up to select Mahomes. Hell, look at the complaining in here after we selected Aiyuk. Some even complained about Kittle because they thought we wasted a 5th on a blocking TE.
The silliness of all this is mind boggling.
Well put. It's so easy to get frustrated with the ridiculous takes and get caught up in it. I came in here without a dog in the fight, just interested in trying to figure out who Shannahan was gonna take. Now I've spent so much time defending Jones that I'm starting to hope he's the pick lol. Really I'm excited with whoever Kyle chooses. The drama is watching how it plays out over the next several seasons. Good stuff.
Completely agree. I don't hate any of the top 5 QB's. Shanny is finally getting to hand pick and groom the QB he thinks will unlock his offense. I'm going to fully support his choice, no matter who he selects. This pick is going to define Kyle and John's career, so you can bet that both are doing everything possible to make the correct choice. They tore the roster down and rebuilt it into a contender in just 3 years, so it's unreasonable to not support their decision.
Originally posted by JTB1974:
If we were drafting a QB for the next year or two, Then Yes maybe Mac Should be the pick but this is about getting your franchise QB for the next decade. Is Fields or Lance as good as Mac right now at proccessing and accuracy? Probally not but they could be in the future and if that happens you got yourselves a top 3 QB based on all their other Physical tools. The stuff Mac Jones can't do he will never be able to. I don't think anybody is denying can't be a good QB but when you are trading two future 1st RD picks and a 3rd you are looking for a guy who can be the best of the best. That should be the players ceiling and potential. Even the Jones supporters such as Simms don't even mention him being among the best if he reaches his potential. They just say he could be a really good QB. But what is really good? Cousins is a good QB but he isn't elite. There is reason Cousins hasn't been able to take the Vikings to the next level despite being decent and being part of many decent Vikings teams. He just doesn't have that extra level that is needed.
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Man.. I've liked Jones since the beginning and I still like Mac Jones, but I do see the argument about arm strength rewatching him again after a long time since watching him previously. Unless he improves his arm strength, the tight windows throws he made in college may wind up picks in the NFL.
In terms of all-around natural talent, Fields is clearly superior. His recognition is not on Macs level, and that's more a credit to Mac than a knock on Fields because Mac is probably the best in this class in that regard. But all that said, I don't think that one area is significantly different enough to take Mac over him.
You cannot judge a player solely by their school. Plenty of instances where people were afraid because of the history at a particular position at a particular school and then there's a player the next year that goes on to be a star. I obviously don't think you can say Fields is Haskins or Jones is going to be a McCarron.
Originally posted by roasthawg:
Originally posted by 49ersRing:
Originally posted by Alfienator:
He's better than Dwayne Haskins
Haskins at least had the courtesy to flame out quickly. The worst is a guy who's just good enough to stick around and you keep expecting him to turn the corner, but he never does.
Really writing off Jones already? Josh Allen had a similar first couple of seasons before exploding last year. Gotta give a young guy some time. It's not like that Giants team is any good.
Originally posted by Zealot:
Originally posted by JTB1974:
If we were drafting a QB for the next year or two, Then Yes maybe Mac Should be the pick but this is about getting your franchise QB for the next decade. Is Fields or Lance as good as Mac right now at proccessing and accuracy? Probally not but they could be in the future and if that happens you got yourselves a top 3 QB based on all their other Physical tools. The stuff Mac Jones can't do he will never be able to. I don't think anybody is denying can't be a good QB but when you are trading two future 1st RD picks and a 3rd you are looking for a guy who can be the best of the best. That should be the players ceiling and potential. Even the Jones supporters such as Simms don't even mention him being among the best if he reaches his potential. They just say he could be a really good QB. But what is really good? Cousins is a good QB but he isn't elite. There is reason Cousins hasn't been able to take the Vikings to the next level despite being decent and being part of many decent Vikings teams. He just doesn't have that extra level that is needed.
Yeah, but that extra level doesn't need to be a cannon arm and the ability to run around like a march hare. Maybe Jones already has the extra level and it resides between his ears rather than in his limbs.
Originally posted by Rathof44:
Originally posted by roasthawg:
Originally posted by 49ersRing:
Originally posted by Alfienator:
He's better than Dwayne Haskins
Haskins at least had the courtesy to flame out quickly. The worst is a guy who's just good enough to stick around and you keep expecting him to turn the corner, but he never does.
Really writing off Jones already? Josh Allen had a similar first couple of seasons before exploding last year. Gotta give a young guy some time. It's not like that Giants team is any good.
Yet Herbert threw for 4330 and 31tds, Burrow was on pace for 4300 and 21tds. Mac is the pick, he should produce similar numbers immediately. He's got a better roster than either of those guys, he's the most pro-ready, and ridiculous people comp him to Burrow.
4300 and 25 should be expected in 2021.
Originally posted by Rathof44:
Yet Herbert threw for 4330 and 31tds, Burrow was on pace for 4300 and 21tds. Mac is the pick, he should produce similar numbers immediately. He's got a better roster than either of those guys, he's the most pro-ready, and ridiculous people comp him to Burrow.
4300 and 25 should be expected in 2021.
