Los Angeles Chargers QB Trey Lance Thread

Originally posted by krizay:

Originally posted by genus49:
He may have a better understanding of football than your causal WZ poster but that doesn't make him psychic which is what he needs to be in order to make any damn claim on who will win the job assuming it's even a competition between the two of them.

There are very few examples of guys switching teams and suddenly becoming a stud. Darnold got his "change of scenery" and wasn't very good. You can claim the coaching sucked but the talent he had to throw to wasn't awful. DJ Moore is a WR1, CMC is a playmaker. Robby Anderson was a big threat down the field. People acting like poor Darnold was throwing to Arnaz Battle as his WR1.

This is no different than that stupid report about how Brock would need TJ surgery because a former player and orthopedic surgeon said it on a tv show. Surely he knows more about surgery than your casual WZ poster and yet he was speculating based on no actual inside information and he was wrong.

Carr doesn't know Lance, he hasn't been in the 49ers locker room he doesn't know how Darnold will do here. His opinion doesn't count any extra because he was a player.

yet the constant moaning about no kittle or CMC for Trey

Man you guys are champs of mental gymnastics.

Nobody ever said Trey played with garbage. The comparison was to what Brock had to play with. It's not that complicated.

But if you want to take it there then why is the idea that Sam Darnold turns into a swan if surrounded by better players but Lance can't improve if he actually has CMC and Kittle on the field with him?

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
How many experts gotta say this is a comp between Sam and Trey before you come to believe it?

You got Rapsheet and David Carr, who wore our uni and played QB in the league saying not only is it a comp but Sam wins the comp. Jack is saying TL has the slight edge. Which is how I see it.

Oh damn David Carr said that? If he said it then it must be true.

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I was told zero chance of a comp with a FA and TL, yet here we are and the entire football universe is talking about it, including the 3 guys who talk football for a living mentioned above. I thought Carr was pretty good he was a #1 overall pick, probably has a 1000x better understanding of the game of football than your casual WZ poster.

He may have a better understanding of football than your causal WZ poster but that doesn't make him psychic which is what he needs to be in order to make any damn claim on who will win the job assuming it's even a competition between the two of them.

There are very few examples of guys switching teams and suddenly becoming a stud. Darnold got his "change of scenery" and wasn't very good. You can claim the coaching sucked but the talent he had to throw to wasn't awful. DJ Moore is a WR1, CMC is a playmaker. Robby Anderson was a big threat down the field. People acting like poor Darnold was throwing to Arnaz Battle as his WR1.

This is no different than that stupid report about how Brock would need TJ surgery because a former player and orthopedic surgeon said it on a tv show. Surely he knows more about surgery than your casual WZ poster and yet he was speculating based on no actual inside information and he was wrong.

Carr doesn't know Lance, he hasn't been in the 49ers locker room he doesn't know how Darnold will do here. His opinion doesn't count any extra because he was a player.

Why do you say he wasn't very good?... he was 92 rated last year, set career highs across the board. Carr currently works for NFL Network, he's been reviewing / discussing TL since his rook season.

He wasn't very good. He was better than his usual self. He had one game that would be considered good by some people here and finished off the season that would have people calling for him to be cut on the spot.

And once again Carr doesn't know anything more than us about the 49ers QB situation. How many in NFL media had us taking Mac Jones?

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Lol completed 60% of his passes for 9 TDs 13INTs off of 400+ passing attempts! Hey man Sam just needs to develop. It's only been 1,800 passing attempts and over 50 starts in the NFL. Lance however…pshhh seen enough man lol

I don't know how bad experience suddenly became better than no experience. Bad experience means you have many more bad habits to break. If Gase and Rhule were so bad as people want to say then theres a whole lot Kyle needs to fix. Took Steve multple years to become functional.

Yet having him start week 1 seems reasonable to people.

I don't even think Rhule/Gase are bad offensive coaches. HCs in the NFL, not so much. The only thing Kyle will do for Sam is give him easy passes to complete. He's not gonna improve him as a passer overall…that's something only Sam can do. Overall he's failed there.

Originally posted by genus49:
Man you guys are champs of mental gymnastics.

Nobody ever said Trey played with garbage. The comparison was to what Brock had to play with. It's not that complicated.

But if you want to take it there then why is the idea that Sam Darnold turns into a swan if surrounded by better players but Lance can't improve if he actually has CMC and Kittle on the field with him?

Kirzay knows Sam is butt

Originally posted by genus49:
Man you guys are champs of mental gymnastics.

Nobody ever said Trey played with garbage. The comparison was to what Brock had to play with. It's not that complicated.

But if you want to take it there then why is the idea that Sam Darnold turns into a swan if surrounded by better players but Lance can't improve if he actually has CMC and Kittle on the field with him?

I have already stated that I think we can with both but both will struggle with consistency. Sam will still be inaccurate and turn the ball over. Trey will still be inaccurate and inconsistent as well.

As I have stated before, Trey didn't have a talent problem. He's had open guys. He's not hitting them. Hell He's 1 for 5 throwing to Kittle. And the one he did catch he had to stretch/dive for and I believe took a shot while catching it.

Plus, my thinking on Darnold improving is more to do with Kyle and the system not so much the players.

I'm not naive to think Purdy could go to any team and do what he did here. I truly believe he was put in the perfect situation. And by that I too mean Kyle and the system. Sure the players help. But think Purdy would still look good if he had to play without Kittle or CMC. Like he did playing without Deebo

Originally posted by genus49:
Man you guys are champs of mental gymnastics.

Nobody ever said Trey played with garbage. The comparison was to what Brock had to play with. It's not that complicated.

But if you want to take it there then why is the idea that Sam Darnold turns into a swan if surrounded by better players but Lance can't improve if he actually has CMC and Kittle on the field with him?

I've put up maybe 100s of posts saying TL can improve. This notion TL can't improve is not one I hold.

Sam has demonstrated he's a functional QB in the league. 92 rated last year quarterbacking a dumpster fire. KS sees something in him, which is more than a draft projection, KS sees what he's done in the NFL and signed up for Sam.

Put Sam in this O, with KS and mega weapons and I can see him bettering his 92 rating of last season.

TL is a question mark. So all the weapons in the world, if he can't hit with accuracy, consistency, see the field well, lacks confidence or LR voice, he will struggle. TL needs to flip the switch to on, and have a great summer, play with some edge to him. He can do it, just not sure he will, but if he doesn't or struggles, we are in a good spot with Sam.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Lol completed 60% of his passes for 9 TDs 13INTs off of 400+ passing attempts! Hey man Sam just needs to develop. It's only been 1,800 passing attempts and over 50 starts in the NFL. Lance however…pshhh seen enough man lol

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I don't know how bad experience suddenly became better than no experience. Bad experience means you have many more bad habits to break. If Gase and Rhule were so bad as people want to say then theres a whole lot Kyle needs to fix. Took Steve multple years to become functional.

Yet having him start week 1 seems reasonable to people.

It's an amazing leap in logic.

Lance can't win here but Darnold whose worse games are WAY worse than Trey's will surely come alive under Kyle.

Again, you misstate positions. It's not TL 'can't' win here. He has won here, albeit 2 games, which is not a ton, but right now he's 50% W/L.

it's a question of who is the best QB for our team, while BP is out.. that's the question. Are you saying it's TL, without even seeing what Sam looks like in our O?

I have an open mind on this question.. could go either way, probably advantage Lance. Anyone else have an open mind on this one?

No I'm not. I've said the same thing the whole time - I want a competition between the guys to see who gives us the best chance to win now but also with the look ahead to the future.

Sam Darnold has 55 starts under his belt. I have seen him play in this league for several seasons. He is a known product. I guess if he comes in and just blows the roof off with how well he plays it is what it is...I just don't see it.

I don't see him improving with a change of scenery. If anything his propensity for turnovers would scare me a lot more than Trey's rawness in the offense. I simply don't understand why people are projecting Darnold to be magically turned around.

It almost feels like people are giving Kyle so much credit that whoever he "picks" can be turned into gold. I mean that was the talking point with Mac Jones to us at 3. Almost every person talking about us taking him there prefaced their point with "anyone but Shanahan takes Mac Jones top 5 and it's crazy, but with Shanahan it makes sense"

But let me ask you this...why can't he make Trey work? They did their evaluation of the kid, they made the move for him, they brought him in but now he's out? But Darnold will be all good?

That's my thing...I don't trust a reclamation project with so much negative on tape.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by genus49:
Man you guys are champs of mental gymnastics.

Nobody ever said Trey played with garbage. The comparison was to what Brock had to play with. It's not that complicated.

But if you want to take it there then why is the idea that Sam Darnold turns into a swan if surrounded by better players but Lance can't improve if he actually has CMC and Kittle on the field with him?

I've put up maybe 100s of posts saying TL can improve. This notion TL can't improve is not one I hold.

Sam has demonstrated he's a functional QB in the league. 92 rated last year quarterbacking a dumpster fire. KS sees something in him, which is more than a draft projection, KS sees what he's done in the NFL and signed up for Sam.

Put Sam in this O, with KS and mega weapons and I can see him bettering his 92 rating of last season.

TL is a question mark. So all the weapons in the world, if he can't hit with accuracy, consistency, see the field well, lacks confidence or LR voice, he will struggle. TL needs to flip the switch to on, and have a great summer, play with some edge to him. He can do it, just not sure he will, but if he doesn't or struggles, we are in a good spot with Sam.

Put Darnold in a monsoon game when penalties are rampant and we have 3 new starter on the OL and the veteran OTs are playing poorly and unable to get solid footing.

How well do you think he does even with our full compliment of weapons?

Once again...the games we lost with Trey were very close games where a couple of plays were the difference. Darnold's garbage games absolutely burry teams.

Originally posted by genus49:
Oh damn David Carr said that? If he said it then it must be true.

David Carr give me a break haha

Originally posted by genus49:
He wasn't very good. He was better than his usual self. He had one game that would be considered good by some people here and finished off the season that would have people calling for him to be cut on the spot.

And once again Carr doesn't know anything more than us about the 49ers QB situation. How many in NFL media had us taking Mac Jones?

Love how he keeps tossing our QB rating... Like he even knows how that stats comes about. I've asked him multiple time to tell me how that number of figured out…crickets. But you know if anyone tosses out PFF data it's a lie. We can show the countless other data points over the course of his whole career…nope that doesn't matter. It's a joke dude.

what's even funnier is if Sam ended up anyone else in the NFCW faithful would be laughing about it.

it's cool though, this time last yr he was running around here telling us how Lance was gonna throw for 5,000 yards and have 40 TDs. Only took him 30 passes and a little over 4QRs to completely change his opinion there lol.

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Lol completed 60% of his passes for 9 TDs 13INTs off of 400+ passing attempts! Hey man Sam just needs to develop. It's only been 1,800 passing attempts and over 50 starts in the NFL. Lance however…pshhh seen enough man lol

I don't know how bad experience suddenly became better than no experience. Bad experience means you have many more bad habits to break. If Gase and Rhule were so bad as people want to say then theres a whole lot Kyle needs to fix. Took Steve multple years to become functional.

Yet having him start week 1 seems reasonable to people.

+ Show all quotes
It's an amazing leap in logic.

Lance can't win here but Darnold whose worse games are WAY worse than Trey's will surely come alive under Kyle.

Again, you misstate positions. It's not TL 'can't' win here. He has won here, albeit 2 games, which is not a ton, but right now he's 50% W/L.

it's a question of who is the best QB for our team, while BP is out.. that's the question. Are you saying it's TL, without even seeing what Sam looks like in our O?

I have an open mind on this question.. could go either way, probably advantage Lance. Anyone else have an open mind on this one?

But let me ask you this...why can't he make Trey work?

I have said TL can improve
I have said we shouldn't trade TL
I have said TL can do it, he just needs to get more consistent
Martz, who ppl don't really listen to his take if they don't agree with most of it, said TL can make the HOF

i think the reason he said that is he wanted to illustrate, he's not writing off TLs career, he's not making a forward looking prediction, he's saying he needs a lot of work / improvement of what he has shown so far

so to answer, TL can work here

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Love how he keeps tossing our QB rating... Like he even knows how that stats comes about. I've asked him multiple time to tell me how that number of figured out…crickets. But you know if anyone tosses out PFF data it's a lie. We can show the countless other data points over the course of his whole career…nope that doesn't matter. It's a joke dude.

what's even funnier is if Sam ended up anyone else in the NFCW faithful would be laughing about it.

it's cool though, this time last yr he was running around here telling us how Lance was gonna throw for 5,000 yards and have 40 TDs. Only took him 30 passes and a little over 4QRs to completely change his opinion there lol.

I don't know how anyone can assert we are in a good spot with Sam starting. Might as well bring Blaine Gabbert back and let him start week 1 again.

I don't doubt Kyle could turn Sam around if given time but it's gonna take a lot more than one off-season.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Love how he keeps tossing our QB rating... Like he even knows how that stats comes about. I've asked him multiple time to tell me how that number of figured out…crickets. But you know if anyone tosses out PFF data it's a lie. We can show the countless other data points over the course of his whole career…nope that doesn't matter. It's a joke dude.

what's even funnier is if Sam ended up anyone else in the NFCW faithful would be laughing about it.

it's cool though, this time last yr he was running around here telling us how Lance was gonna throw for 5,000 yards and have 40 TDs. Only took him 30 passes and a little over 4QRs to completely change his opinion there lol.

I don't know how anyone can assert we are in a good spot with Sam starting.

KS probably disagrees. You don't add guys and dress them if you think they are chumps. If they felt Sam was a chump, they wouldn't have inked him to a contract, there were dozens of other QBs avail in FA, and dozens in the draft, they chose Sam Darnold. Just have to ask yourself why that is, or what KS is seeing there. Comp for TL is a good thing.

Originally posted by genus49:
No I'm not. I've said the same thing the whole time - I want a competition between the guys to see who gives us the best chance to win now but also with the look ahead to the future.

Sam Darnold has 55 starts under his belt. I have seen him play in this league for several seasons. He is a known product. I guess if he comes in and just blows the roof off with how well he plays it is what it is...I just don't see it.

I don't see him improving with a change of scenery. If anything his propensity for turnovers would scare me a lot more than Trey's rawness in the offense. I simply don't understand why people are projecting Darnold to be magically turned around.

It almost feels like people are giving Kyle so much credit that whoever he "picks" can be turned into gold. I mean that was the talking point with Mac Jones to us at 3. Almost every person talking about us taking him there prefaced their point with "anyone but Shanahan takes Mac Jones top 5 and it's crazy, but with Shanahan it makes sense"

But let me ask you this...why can't he make Trey work? They did their evaluation of the kid, they made the move for him, they brought him in but now he's out? But Darnold will be all good?

That's my thing...I don't trust a reclamation project with so much negative on tape.

See now that there is the gray area we are in. People think Kyle can develop Trey because they think he can turn anyone to gold.

The reason I never wanted Trey because his traits don't fit what makes this offense go.

Mac Jones' strengths fit perfectly. That is why most people assumed it would be him. Purdy's strengths fits perfectly. That is why he excelled.

While Trey has great physical ability, his accuracy, feet, processing all of that lacks to run Kyle's offense. IN MY OPINION.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
KS probably disagrees. You don't add guys and dress them if you think they are chumps. If they felt Sam was a chump, they wouldn't have inked him to a contract, there were dozens of other QBs avail in FA, and dozens in the draft, they chose Sam Darnold. Just have to ask yourself why that is, or what KS is seeing there. Comp for TL is a good thing.

You add them because you think you can work with them and the value matches. Starting Sam Darnold week 1 with a rook backup with a traded Trey Lance is a recipe for disaster.