Dallas Cowboys QB Trey Lance Thread

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by tankle104:
The darnold signing and announcing Brock as QB1 is what makes me think they're going to move on from Him. If it wasn't for the darnold signing, especially his contract, I wouldn't think they want to trade him.

i expected the team to not say anything and let them compete it out.

His contract 😂 I know that $3.5M is just killing us. They cut Sudfield and his $2M as soon as Jimmy took a pay cut.

First of all, his cap hit is $5.1M with the potential of making $10M and Regardless of what you think is a lot of money or not, that's on the higher end of QB2 in the nfl. It's by far and large the most for any QB3. Couple that with if we keep all three, we have to sacrifice a roster spot that would help us a lot on game days. What happened to us last season by going through four QBs is extremely unlikely. It's unlikely we lose 2 in a season.

i don't think the team hates or dislikes Trey etc. but this move does show a lack of confidence in him, in my opinion. A handful of teams (Bucs/Texans etc) would have signed darnold and he could of competed for the starting job or had a guaranteed QB2 spot, so I highly doubt he came here with the idea of it being cool being QB3.

idc if we trade him or not, it's just an odd situation move that suggest lack of confidence in Trey, in my opinion. I also think Trey has the chance in camp to prove them wrong and regain their confidence.

ill be bummed if darnold or Lance see the field this season because it would mean that something didn't go well with Purdys recovery. I want to see him play and show if he was for real or not exponentially more than I care to ever see Lance play again.

they also didn't plan on cutting sudfield. They let him go because Purdy was so impressive in camp. That's different. They didn't expect that to happen.

Originally posted by tankle104:
First of all, his cap hit is $5.1M with the potential of making $10M and Regardless of what you think is a lot of money or not, that's on the higher end of QB2 in the nfl.

First off his cap hit is not $5.1M, it's $3.8M

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/san-francisco-49ers/sam-darnold-25098/

second, in no world do you talk about "potential" when discussing NFL contracts or that being a reason for anything…The ONLY thing that matters is the GTD cash (especially with 1 yr deals). They can cut him tomorrow and it's only $3.5M gone…they cut Sudfield who had $2M just last yr.

the freaking eagles moved Wentz who had a $34M dead money hit. Matt Ryan had a $40 DM hit etc etc.

The only thing that contract shows is that they are not confident in Brock being healthy enough to start Wk1 AND that they will carry 3 QBs on the roster like they've done for multiple years. We go through QBs like water and they don't want to see a dude like Josh Johnson having to start any meaningful games.

You can not roll into training camp with Lance off a broken ankle and Brock having a shredded elbow (who won't be able to do anything for months).

Acting like signing Sam. Who been downright awful for years as some proof of anything is wildly subjective and grasping at straws.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by tankle104:
First of all, his cap hit is $5.1M with the potential of making $10M and Regardless of what you think is a lot of money or not, that's on the higher end of QB2 in the nfl.

First off his cap hit is not $5.1M, it's $3.8M

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/san-francisco-49ers/sam-darnold-25098/

second, in no world do you talk about "potential" when discussing NFL contracts or that being a reason for anything…The ONLY thing that matters is the GTD cash (especially with 1 yr deals). They can cut him tomorrow and it's only $3.5M gone…they cut Sudfield who had $2M just last yr.

the freaking eagles moved Wentz who had a $34M dead money hit. Matt Ryan had a $40 DM hit etc etc.

The only thing that contract shows is that they are not confident in Brock being healthy enough to start Wk1 AND that they will carry 3 QBs on the roster like they've done for multiple years. We go through QBs like water and they don't want to see a dude like Josh Johnson having to start any meaningful games.

You can not roll into training camp with Lance off a broken ankle and Brock having a shredded elbow (who won't be able to do anything for months).

Acting like signing Sam. Who been downright awful for years as some proof of anything is wildly subjective and grasping at straws.

Yes it is, it just came out the other day that because of "likely to earn incentives", his cap his $5.1

https://overthecap.com/player/sam-darnold/6888

honestly, if you take emotions out of this, which you clearly have regarding Lance, the signing/ contract given to darnold is odd. We could of signed 3-4 vets with that money we gave darnold to just have him on the bench inactive every game? That just doesn't make much sense.

i think they're using him as motivation and insurance if Lance comes in this year and stinks up camp again. I hope he doesn't but they didn't sign darnold to that contract for fun.

Originally posted by JTB1974:

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

"We like Trey here "at the moment""

"Trey needs to play and that's the challenge for us"

"Hahaha Id trade myself if I got the right offer!"

Then the Darnold signing to back it up? Plan A is get something for Trey this offseason, because I think they know his value will drop if they don't

I took Lynch's comment as "Sure we will listen to offers if somebody wants to blow us away"

They aren't just going to give Trey away after what they invested in to get him. A 2nd RD pick would be giving him away. Remember that Trey is a high character guy and so even if they decide to go with Brock there is no need to get rid of Trey. Also it makes no sense from a business stand point as it will cost them more to trade him than it would be to keep him. The dead cap is worth more than his salary cap. Now it's cheaper post june 1st but then they aren't getting picks this year and the cap hit is still like $5 Million or so. And thirdly they don't even know when Brock will be ready or if he will even be the same. Or if he will have any setback with his recovery. Imagine trading Trey, Then Brock has a setback that will have him miss half the season. Now you have to count on Sam Darnold as your #1 QB for the 1st half of the season. With no backup QB to count on also. It would be a disaster. And worse if Trey hits the ground running with his new team.

That's exactly how Lynch wanted people to take his comments. He can't sound desperate if he wants to get what he's looking for. They are prepared for Darnold to be the guy if they get rid of Trey, that's how his contract is structured. They have it all set up to trade Trey

Originally posted by tankle104:
Yes it is, it just came out the other day that because of "likely to earn incentives", his cap his $5.1

https://overthecap.com/player/sam-darnold/6888

honestly, if you take emotions out of this, which you clearly have regarding Lance, the signing/ contract given to darnold is odd. We could of signed 3-4 vets with that money we gave darnold to just have him on the bench inactive every game? That just doesn't make much sense.

i think they're using him as motivation and insurance if Lance comes in this year and stinks up camp again. I hope he doesn't but they didn't sign darnold to that contract for fun.

He only earns those incentives if he sticks.

For anyone that thinks we signed Sam darnold for no good reason and his contract is Pennie's?

you realize he has the 13th highest cap hit on the team? A team that is super disciplined with what they spend and rarely waste a penny? They just signed him for fun and they don't expect him to make the team?

im not saying Lance will be traded, no idea what will happen, but they signed him for a reason. Idk what the reason but the fact they did and they formally announced he will have to compete for his job with darnold (who hasn't been good in his career) says a lot about their confidence in Lance in my opinion.

No one in their right mind would do that. I think it's obvious they wanted to feel more comfortable at the qb position if Purdy isn't healed in time. Which once again, says a lot about how confident they are in Lance currently.

i hope that Lance comes into camp much improved and they do have to burn $3.5M on darnold but to act like it isn't a big deal or doesn't speak volumes about their current confidence in Lance… gotta get your head out of the sand.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by tankle104:
Yes it is, it just came out the other day that because of "likely to earn incentives", his cap his $5.1

https://overthecap.com/player/sam-darnold/6888

honestly, if you take emotions out of this, which you clearly have regarding Lance, the signing/ contract given to darnold is odd. We could of signed 3-4 vets with that money we gave darnold to just have him on the bench inactive every game? That just doesn't make much sense.

i think they're using him as motivation and insurance if Lance comes in this year and stinks up camp again. I hope he doesn't but they didn't sign darnold to that contract for fun.

He only earns those incentives if he sticks.

Right, only $3.5M is guaranteee but still locks up $5.1M of the cap this year. Which is a lot when you only have a few mil to spend. Limits what we can do regarding signings if people get injured outside of qb.

which coincidentally, is the exact amount we would save in a post June 1 trade of Lance…

Originally posted by tankle104:
Right, only $3.5M is guaranteee but still locks up $5.1M of the cap this year. Which is a lot when you only have a few mil to spend. Limits what we can do regarding signings if people get injured outside of qb.

which coincidentally, is the exact amount we would save in a post June 1 trade of Lance…

I see it differently. It's guarding against Brock injury being more serious than they are hoping. Having Lance and Darnold there just in case would be a smarter bet than Darnold and some rook or other cheap vet.

Originally posted by tankle104:
im not saying Lance will be traded, no idea what will happen, but they signed him for a reason. Idk what the reason but the fact they did and they formally announced he will have to compete for his job with darnold (who hasn't been good in his career) says a lot about their confidence in Lance in my opinion.

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:
That's exactly how Lynch wanted people to take his comments. He can't sound desperate if he wants to get what he's looking for. They are prepared for Darnold to be the guy if they get rid of Trey, that's how his contract is structured. They have it all set up to trade Trey

A) The 49ers' brass said Trey and Darnold will have to compete, thereby implying they are not confident in Lance (summary of Tank's statement).
B) Lynch said what he said so he does not sound desperate in order to maximize Trey's trade value (summary of Sheen's statement).

These are two contradicting statements (I realize by two different people, but two people in alignment on their perception of things). Why would A occur if B? Or, why would B occur if A?

Further, can we move beyond the whole "Lynch is saying stuff to get more in a trade"? It doesn't work like that in the real world. I question if any of you proposing such a thing have ever been involved in a high-stakes trade. Everyone knows everything. You don't have cards yet to be flipped by the time the rubber meets the road, all the information is known. Anything Lynch is saying isn't for the professionals, it's for the media and the fans who eat it up. The professionals are professionals for the primary reason they don't eat that stuff up.

If Darnold is getting (an an example) 90% of the first team reps, it doesn't matter what Lynch says, everyone who matters sees the writing on the wall. The same is true if Trey is getting (again, as an example) 90% of the first team reps.

Originally posted by Polkadots:

Originally posted by tankle104:

im not saying Lance will be traded, no idea what will happen, but they signed him for a reason. Idk what the reason but the fact they did and they formally announced he will have to compete for his job with darnold (who hasn't been good in his career) says a lot about their confidence in Lance in my opinion.

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

That's exactly how Lynch wanted people to take his comments. He can't sound desperate if he wants to get what he's looking for. They are prepared for Darnold to be the guy if they get rid of Trey, that's how his contract is structured. They have it all set up to trade Trey

A) The 49ers' brass said Trey and Darnold will have to compete, thereby implying they are not confident in Lance (summary of Tank's statement).
B) Lynch said what he said so he does not sound desperate in order to maximize Trey's trade value (summary of Sheen's statement).

These are two contradicting statements (I realize by two different people, but two people in alignment on their perception of things). Why would A occur if B? Or, why would B occur if A?

Further, can we move beyond the whole "Lynch is saying stuff to get more in a trade"? It doesn't work like that in the real world. I question if any of you proposing such a thing have ever been involved in a high-stakes trade. Everyone knows everything. You don't have cards yet to be flipped by the time the rubber meets the road, all the information is known. Anything Lynch is saying isn't for the professionals, it's for the media and the fans who eat it up. The professionals are professionals for the primary reason they don't eat that stuff up.

If Darnold is getting (an an example) 90% of the first team reps, it doesn't matter what Lynch says, everyone who matters sees the writing on the wall. The same is true if Trey is getting (again, as an example) 90% of the first team reps.

Signing Darnold does show a lack of confidence. John's public comments do sound like they are opening the door. I don't think he made those comments for the fans to eat them up lol. If I were in the high stakes trade world I'd try to lure the offer to me before I went around offering

Why would anyone think that Kyle and John do not have a pretty good idea of Trey's ability to execute Kyle's offense after two full years. I can evaluate someone I work closely with for 2 years. I appreciate the fan's haven't seen much of him, but I would bet a lot of money that Kyle has a pretty firm opinion by now how that's going to go.

What we've seen of Lance has not been pretty.

They brought in Sam Darnold. Like Lance, he was a 3rd overall pick, he was reportedly a Kyle favorate coming out, it was reported we tried to trade our 12 overall for him before trading up for Lance, and they've given him a contract that you have to be Nuts to think he doesn't make the team. In fact, I'd question your judgement if you think he'd even take this job if he thought he'd be qb3. He might have had an idea about the packing order and where he sat. He could get a starting gig elsewhere.

If everybody's theory is that Lance just needs more experience, it seems less than likely that is going to happen. Last we saw, Lance is not playing well, and Sam just won 4 out of 6 on the average at best Panthers without CMC and with a defensive coach that they fired, and who is now our DC. Sam will very likely start off as qb2.

If Trey is demoted to qb3, is trade value goes Down, and he will not improve with game experience. If he's traded after another year, the new team will have to decide on the $20m 5th year option with no more information than we have right now, except he failed to break through on this smart offensive team.

We are unlikely to Have a qb3 on the 53, and Trey can't stick on the PS.

If Brock is not ready to go, he is still scheduled to be throwing for 3 months by then. He should be cleared to play. The downside would be lack of reps so he might not start, but being the phenom that he is, that still doesn't necessarily make him a worse backup option than Trey or a draftee.

We are soliciting trade offers with telling everyone Brock is the starter and we've got Sam.

These guys are nothing short of giddy over Brock. That's a done deal. He's going to have to prove himself out of the job to lose it, and since his strong suit is headwork, that's just not likely. You don't grow stupid.

The reason you love brains over brawn in this league is that unlike in college, you can never stay physically ahead of the super talented dudes on the other side of the ball. Defenses coordinators are smart, and they can stop Anything. If you're smart and can adjust mid play and have a full tool bag, they can't stop Everything. Now we're playing Kyle's game, and that's what he's been looking for his entire career. I think they Know Brock can do that. I think they Think Sam can. They know Jimmy can't do that. Trey? Still searching. Do you see it? Oh, that's right, he needs more experience. How much experience did Brock have against NFL speed and defenses when he came in mid game for an injured Jimmy? When you've got it, you've got it.

If we only got a 2nd for him, how could that really help? I'll say an offensive tight end to go with George, which would make the D play heavy, and we'd kill them. Just one suggestion.

We just can not afford to lose games to give Trey experience like a rebuilding team can. We're saying he can't get better if he doesn't play games. If he's qb3, he has almost no chance of gaining that experience. If he's qb3, there is almost no chance he sticks on the team, and we lose him for nothing.

I'm not saying Trey Lance is not any good. I'm saying we're not in a position to develop him, and I'm saying all signs are that John and Kyle think that they have better options. And I'm saying Trey is a depreciating asset.

It's the same people over and over again... downplaying the same type of QBs.

Originally posted by Afrikan:
It's the same people over and over again... downplaying the same type of QBs.

Yes, I think history has shown that what separates the great quarterbacks from the good ones is always headwork. Sue me.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
My biggest reason for not trding Trey is that we haven't seen enough of him to make a real decision. I just don't want to see the Niners move on from him too soon and then have him go to another team and become the QB that they thought they were drafting.

There's another reason as well. People who want to see him traded are assuming that Purdy will be as good next season as he was in those last few games. We don't know at this point when he will be completely healthy. Most projections say somewhere near the beginning of the season but he could miss a couple of starts. That's assuming his recovery and rehab go well. Even then we don't know for sure that he's going to continue to led the team to win after win. He could come back down to earth and become the guy that every team passed on during the draft. He certainly wouldn't be the first QB that started off like a rocked and then fell back to earth once the league got a good look at his strengths and weaknesses. DCs are expert at exposing flaws in the opposition.

I hope he can continue to be the guy we saw last season but just like Trey, I don't think we've sen enough to make a final decision.

There's a whole lot of this going around in this thread. Purdy had a great stretch of games, but so did Jimmy and Kap, and we saw how that turned out in the end. Overall, he's still not a proven commodity in the NFL yet. And now he has to overcome a serious elbow injury?

Our best bet is to hope Trey makes that huge jump and balls out and Purdy's arm comes back stronger than ever. Trey taking that next step and Brock coming back with a healthy elbow for this season is the best scenario for this team.

Originally posted by swoosh6996:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
My biggest reason for not trding Trey is that we haven't seen enough of him to make a real decision. I just don't want to see the Niners move on from him too soon and then have him go to another team and become the QB that they thought they were drafting.

There's another reason as well. People who want to see him traded are assuming that Purdy will be as good next season as he was in those last few games. We don't know at this point when he will be completely healthy. Most projections say somewhere near the beginning of the season but he could miss a couple of starts. That's assuming his recovery and rehab go well. Even then we don't know for sure that he's going to continue to led the team to win after win. He could come back down to earth and become the guy that every team passed on during the draft. He certainly wouldn't be the first QB that started off like a rocked and then fell back to earth once the league got a good look at his strengths and weaknesses. DCs are expert at exposing flaws in the opposition.

I hope he can continue to be the guy we saw last season but just like Trey, I don't think we've sen enough to make a final decision.

There's a whole lot of this going around in this thread. Purdy had a great stretch of games, but so did Jimmy and Kap, and we saw how that turned out in the end. Overall, he's still not a proven commodity in the NFL yet. And now he has to overcome a serious elbow injury?

Our best bet is to hope Trey makes that huge jump and balls out and Purdy's arm comes back stronger than ever. Trey taking that next step and Brock coming back with a healthy elbow for this season is the best scenario for this team.

I don't want Trey traded, I'm just saying it looks like the team is moving in that direction. I can't imagine the team would make any moves like that with Trey until they were very confident in Purdy making a full comeback. Then again, I was shocked the team made announcements on who will be QB1 when healthy.

regarding Purdy being unknown is true, but Lance is even more unknown. Which is a big reason why I'd rather push forward with the guy who's shown a ton in his 7-8 games (very little to even criticize in his play) vs how Lance has played in his few games. How they've played doesn't mean they'll always play that way, but I'd rather move forward with the guy who has done some special things in his limited time. See if he's the real deal before I'd even consider making Lance a starter.

where I differ from some on here is I never thought we should of drafted him. At the end of the day, doesn't matter what I want, kyle and injuries will determine what happens. As long as we get a FQB, who cares. I just think that guy is Purdy - what his contract offers us is an added bonus.