Dallas Cowboys QB Trey Lance Thread

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
No. It was because broken tackles happen very rarely for QBs (almost every QB is in the single digits each year), and you can have ten rushing yards off of 1 broken tackle, and consequently it felt stupid to include a year in which Trey didn't even have a single broken tackle. Especially considering that DIVIDING BY ZERO IS MATHEMATICALLY IMPOSSIBLE in the ring of real numbers.

When I talk about math I try to avoid dividing by zero. Just not my thing. Some people are comfortable with things that are mathematically undefined. I am not. Usually.

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Regardless, the more important number is by far YAC.

So then why use that argument at all? You used the one year that suited your argument. Since it was mathematically impossible then you should have used their career BT/ATT if you were going to use that argument at all.

Then there's the fact that Jalen Hurts had 41 QB shoves/sneaks and more than 15 kneel downs that count as rushing attempts. Where does that factor into your YAC/att?

Originally posted by Tigerlaw:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:
Nice article on him in the athletic and how he is impressing coaching staff

That's great to hear. Good on him!

Any cliff notes?

49ers coaches like what they're seeing with Trey Lance's feetThough outside observers have been obsessed with Trey Lance's right arm during OTAs, his coaches have been focused on his feet.

They like what they've seen.

"Getting to know Trey and watching his film from previous years, I see a lot of improvement in his overall mechanics," passing game specialist Klint Kubiak said. "What stands out is his footwork. And I think that's stuff that (quarterbacks coach) Brian (Griese) and (assistant quarterbacks coach) Klay (Kubiak) definitely have worked on. He just seems really comfortable with what you're asking him to do. I love how his feet have progressed at this point of his career."

That is f**king fantastic. Feet were BW's #1 focus. It's great our coaches are honed in on that. And it's even better Trey's made big strides in those. Thank you!

I hope Trey develops and maxes that potential but i dont put much stock in stories like this at this point of the year

We are in the dead period before official camp opens

This is when we get fluff pieces about Player X being in the best shape of his life

Everything is BS hopes and dreams right now...better off ignoring all these reports and not paying attention until July

You're right nobody should put much stock in any hype stories from OTAs and even training camp isn't always a recipe for someone looking great and then having it translate to real games.

However in this case you can actually see the improvement yourself. Biggest question however is how does it translate to game reps, will he revert back to old habits once the game speeds up and guys are coming for you? Or will they stick? Time will tell but rather see that now vs not.

I gotta say the last few pages of discussion related to Hurts vs Trey are the perfect reminder of the webzone forum magic.

"I love pizza it tastes good just like tacos"
"How in the world is pizza better than tacos!?"

Brock has a higher percentage of attempts of 20+ yards or more than Pat Mahomes yet somehow Kyle wants to be conservative. Makes perfect sense.

Jimmy was the one that was conservative. There is ZERO chance Brock or Lance will be 48th in attempts over 20+ yards the next 5 years.

Originally posted by genus49:
I gotta say the last few pages of discussion related to Hurts vs Trey are the perfect reminder of the webzone forum magic.

"I love pizza it tastes good just like tacos"
"How in the world is pizza better than tacos!?"

Everyone knows Philly pizza is the best. Well except that Philly pizzeria that was trying to trade their pizza for a filet of fish

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by genus49:
I gotta say the last few pages of discussion related to Hurts vs Trey are the perfect reminder of the webzone forum magic.

"I love pizza it tastes good just like tacos"
"How in the world is pizza better than tacos!?"

Everyone knows Philly pizza is the best. Well except that Philly pizzeria that was trying to trade their pizza for a filet of fish

Everyone? never knew Philly had pizza stye

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Everyone? never knew Philly had pizza stye

LIke Jalen Hurts, it's uniquely special. Can't possibly suggest anything else is comparable.

Originally posted by krizay:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
No. It was because broken tackles happen very rarely for QBs (almost every QB is in the single digits each year), and you can have ten rushing yards off of 1 broken tackle, and consequently it felt stupid to include a year in which Trey didn't even have a single broken tackle. Especially considering that DIVIDING BY ZERO IS MATHEMATICALLY IMPOSSIBLE in the ring of real numbers.

When I talk about math I try to avoid dividing by zero. Just not my thing. Some people are comfortable with things that are mathematically undefined. I am not. Usually.

.
.
Regardless, the more important number is by far YAC.

So then why use that argument at all? You used the one year that suited your argument. Since it was mathematically impossible then you should have used their career BT/ATT if you were going to use that argument at all.

Then there's the fact that Jalen Hurts had 41 QB shoves/sneaks and more than 15 kneel downs that count as rushing attempts. Where does that factor into your YAC/att?

Dude sneaking became so OP that the NFL contemplated a rule change. One of his highlight reel runs, where he literally carries a Viking on his back, into the endzone, I question if that would qualify as a broken tackle, as he didn't so much break the tackle and disengage. Depends who is calculating the broken tackle stat, and their methodology. Hurts has as much power as a runner as I have seen from the QB position, the 600 lbs squats, you can see it in his play.

On the above with 5GR, it's a lil shady imo. If TL had zero broken tackles during a season, he could have just said so, he didn't need to omit the data, then play the well I can't divide by zero cuz it's impossible cuz math card, when called on it.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by krizay:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
No. It was because broken tackles happen very rarely for QBs (almost every QB is in the single digits each year), and you can have ten rushing yards off of 1 broken tackle, and consequently it felt stupid to include a year in which Trey didn't even have a single broken tackle. Especially considering that DIVIDING BY ZERO IS MATHEMATICALLY IMPOSSIBLE in the ring of real numbers.

When I talk about math I try to avoid dividing by zero. Just not my thing. Some people are comfortable with things that are mathematically undefined. I am not. Usually.

.
.
Regardless, the more important number is by far YAC.

So then why use that argument at all? You used the one year that suited your argument. Since it was mathematically impossible then you should have used their career BT/ATT if you were going to use that argument at all.

Then there's the fact that Jalen Hurts had 41 QB shoves/sneaks and more than 15 kneel downs that count as rushing attempts. Where does that factor into your YAC/att?

Dude sneaking became so OP that the NFL contemplated a rule change. One of his highlight reel runs, where he literally carries a Viking on his back, into the endzone, I question if that would qualify as a broken tackle, as he didn't so much break the tackle and disengage. Depends who is calculating the broken tackle stat, and their methodology. Hurts has as much power as a runner as I have seen from the QB position, the 600 lbs squats, you can see it in his play.

On the above with 5GR, it's a lil shady imo. If TL had zero broken tackles during a season, he could have just said so, he didn't need to omit the data, then play the well I can't divide by zero cuz it's impossible cuz math card, when called on it.

You should look at Jimmy G's QB sneak conversion %. He must be a running threat unrivaled by any right?

Hurts is a special talent and a great runner, but let's not overlook how good that OL is or that Hurts became truly special once the team allowed him to play and develop. The fact that they were looking to trade him before his MVP level season last year just shows that teams don't always understand what they have.

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by krizay:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
No. It was because broken tackles happen very rarely for QBs (almost every QB is in the single digits each year), and you can have ten rushing yards off of 1 broken tackle, and consequently it felt stupid to include a year in which Trey didn't even have a single broken tackle. Especially considering that DIVIDING BY ZERO IS MATHEMATICALLY IMPOSSIBLE in the ring of real numbers.

When I talk about math I try to avoid dividing by zero. Just not my thing. Some people are comfortable with things that are mathematically undefined. I am not. Usually.

.
.
Regardless, the more important number is by far YAC.

So then why use that argument at all? You used the one year that suited your argument. Since it was mathematically impossible then you should have used their career BT/ATT if you were going to use that argument at all.

Then there's the fact that Jalen Hurts had 41 QB shoves/sneaks and more than 15 kneel downs that count as rushing attempts. Where does that factor into your YAC/att?

Dude sneaking became so OP that the NFL contemplated a rule change. One of his highlight reel runs, where he literally carries a Viking on his back, into the endzone, I question if that would qualify as a broken tackle, as he didn't so much break the tackle and disengage. Depends who is calculating the broken tackle stat, and their methodology. Hurts has as much power as a runner as I have seen from the QB position, the 600 lbs squats, you can see it in his play.

On the above with 5GR, it's a lil shady imo. If TL had zero broken tackles during a season, he could have just said so, he didn't need to omit the data, then play the well I can't divide by zero cuz it's impossible cuz math card, when called on it.

You should look at Jimmy G's QB sneak conversion %. He must be a running threat unrivaled by any right?

Hurts is a special talent and a great runner, but let's not overlook how good that OL is or that Hurts became truly special once the team allowed him to play and develop. The fact that they were looking to trade him before his MVP level season last year just shows that teams don't always understand what they have.

Sure TB12 sneaks well, I think JG picked that up from TB (I wish he picked up a lil more than that tbh )

Hurts is on another level. It got to a point where 3rd or 4th and short, you absolutely know what is coming, and you can't stop it. He adds a level of physical force, that those guys just don't have. You see Philly get into those scrums, with the backs shoving, I don't think you want JG or TB in that situation, with Hurts power, it works.

Originally posted by genus49:
I gotta say the last few pages of discussion related to Hurts vs Trey are the perfect reminder of the webzone forum magic.

"I love pizza it tastes good just like tacos"
"How in the world is pizza better than tacos!?"

When tacos are not authentic.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
Sure TB12 sneaks well, I think JG picked that up from TB (I wish he picked up a lil more than that tbh )

Hurts is on another level. It got to a point where 3rd or 4th and short, you absolutely know what is coming, and you can't stop it. He adds a level of physical force, that those guys just don't have. You see Philly get into those scrums, with the backs shoving, I don't think you want JG or TB in that situation, with Hurts power, it works.

Once again you're dismissing the fact that they have the best OL in the game. Cam Newton was even more powerful than Hurts and the Panthers didn't have that level of success(granted they didn't think to do the rugby scrum thing)

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
Sure TB12 sneaks well, I think JG picked that up from TB (I wish he picked up a lil more than that tbh )

Hurts is on another level. It got to a point where 3rd or 4th and short, you absolutely know what is coming, and you can't stop it. He adds a level of physical force, that those guys just don't have. You see Philly get into those scrums, with the backs shoving, I don't think you want JG or TB in that situation, with Hurts power, it works.

Once again you're dismissing the fact that they have the best OL in the game. Cam Newton was even more powerful than Hurts and the Panthers didn't have that level of success(granted they didn't think to do the rugby scrum thing)

I'm not dismissing that, where did I dismiss it? Hurts squats 600 lbs, that translates to his play, no matter what helmet he wears. So while the line helps sure, his power comes from within, and you can see that power, when he squares up defenders 1 v 1. I was a big Newton fan as well

I've posted on here, months ago, that it would serve TL to either add power (bulk) or lose weight if he wants to go that direction, maybe add quickness, lose the heavy first step.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
Sure TB12 sneaks well, I think JG picked that up from TB (I wish he picked up a lil more than that tbh )

Hurts is on another level. It got to a point where 3rd or 4th and short, you absolutely know what is coming, and you can't stop it. He adds a level of physical force, that those guys just don't have. You see Philly get into those scrums, with the backs shoving, I don't think you want JG or TB in that situation, with Hurts power, it works.

Once again you're dismissing the fact that they have the best OL in the game. Cam Newton was even more powerful than Hurts and the Panthers didn't have that level of success(granted they didn't think to do the rugby scrum thing)

I'm not dismissing that, where did I dismiss it? Hurts squats 600 lbs, that translates to his play, no matter what helmet he wears. So while the line helps sure, his power comes from within, and you can see that power, when he squares up defenders 1 v 1. I was a big Newton fan as well

I've posted on here, months ago, that it would serve TL to either add power (bulk) or lose weight if he wants to go that direction, maybe add quickness, lose the heavy first step.

And i've said for a while and still stand by that, that Trey's issue running isn't speed or agility. I believe you can see a clear difference in how confidently he runs when doing a QB scramble vs a designed run.

I bring up the Seattle game where he came in for Jimmy in the 2nd half. Those were some of his best runs because most of them were off scramble plays vs the runs we saw in Arizona/Houston where most of them were designed runs. I think if he got more experience and got a handle on game speed the designed runs would look better as a result as well.

He'll never be a Justin Fields or Lamar Jackson but he absolutely can hurt teams if they don't account for his legs.

Originally posted by genus49:
And i've said for a while and still stand by that, that Trey's issue running isn't speed or agility. I believe you can see a clear difference in how confidently he runs when doing a QB scramble vs a designed run.

I bring up the Seattle game where he came in for Jimmy in the 2nd half. Those were some of his best runs because most of them were off scramble plays vs the runs we saw in Arizona/Houston where most of them were designed runs. I think if he got more experience and got a handle on game speed the designed runs would look better as a result as well.

He'll never be a Justin Fields or Lamar Jackson but he absolutely can hurt teams if they don't account for his legs.

So if I understand you correct, his issue as a runner, is he lacks confidence?