Dallas Cowboys QB Trey Lance Thread

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
It was pure crap NY, their pass D was total crap..

It was actually the 14th overall pass D. That's a fact regardless of what confirmation bias you want to add to your little rant.

I mean unless we're not gonna use Dallas and their 3rd overall pass D for Brock, which you had no problem with. Shocker.

Your 14th, that's you going to www dot what stat can i find to pump up this crap HOU D dot com

It's dumb how some will discount Lance's performance against the Texans because of the team's record.

Regardless of their record, the team is full of NFL players who'd most likely thrive elsewhere like safety Justin Reid who would go onto win the SB next year as a starter for the Chiefs.

And that game was important, no win, no playoffs. The Texans beat Justin Herbert the week before intercepting him twice, that loss contributed to the Chargers missing the playoffs by 1 game.

Trey had a really great game for a rookie considering the stakes and him coming back from an injury and a rough outing in AZ.

Of his 16 completions, 10 were really impressive throws.

16 for 23 69.6% 249 yards 10.8 yard avg 2 tds 1 int 1 8 yard sack 116.0 QB rating.

8 rushes 31 yards.

And it's nonsense to claim he had a bad 1st half when he was 10-13 76.9% 103 yards 1 int and one scoring drive to close out the half.

Just dumb biased takes repeated ad naseum. "Texans game doesn't really count.." It does in the win-loss columns, losers.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Football outsiders DVOA is about as good as it gets with stat.

Houston's pass D was actually 14th overall. Sorry I'll use a source that we use all the time in here and is about as unbiased as it gets.

again I never said they were great. Just not as s**tty as some 49er fans think

I think football outsiders is solid, but anytime you use a single stat to make a definitive conclusion about performance it's going to be a stretch. And they'll be the first to tell you that the stats aren't perfect. You think the '91 Redskins were the greatest team in the modern era? Does anybody? Look at as many stats as you can and watch as much actual gameplay as possible.

It is entirely common to see stats on the same performance that contradict each other. See Houston's DVOA ranking and other stats that would measure their performance. See Trey's passer rating in the Texans game in comparison to his QBR.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
It was pure crap NY, their pass D was total crap..

It was actually the 14th overall pass D. That's a fact regardless of what confirmation bias you want to add to your little rant.

I mean unless we're not gonna use Dallas and their 3rd overall pass D for Brock, which you had no problem with. Shocker.

Your 14th, that's you going to www dot what stat can i find to pump up this crap HOU D dot com

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
Your 14th, that's you going to www dot what stat can i find to pump up this crap HOU D dot com

Lol so what people in here need to DM you first when we can and can't use Football outsiders DVOA. A quality source we've been using in here for years.

Originally posted by SinceXVI:
It's dumb how some will discount Lance's performance against the Texans because of the team's record.

Regardless of their record, the team is full of NFL players who'd most likely thrive elsewhere like safety Justin Reid who would go onto win the SB next year as a starter for the Chiefs.

And that game was important, no win, no playoffs. The Texans beat Justin Herbert the week before intercepting him twice, that loss contributed to the Chargers missing the playoffs by 1 game.

Trey had a really great game for a rookie considering the stakes and him coming back from an injury and a rough outing in AZ.

Of his 16 completions, 10 were really impressive throws.

16 for 23 69.6% 249 yards 10.8 yard avg 2 tds 1 int 1 8 yard sack 116.0 QB rating.

8 rushes 31 yards.

And it's nonsense to claim he had a bad 1st half when he was 10-13 76.9% 103 yards 1 int and one scoring drive to close out the half.

Just dumb biased takes repeated ad naseum. "Texans game doesn't really count.." It does in the win-loss columns, losers.

You don't think it's at least a little biased to frame his play in the first half in the manner you did?

The team scored 3 points against one of the worst defenses in football, at home. Had at least two 3-and-outs, and I believe they went 0-for on 3rd downs. The Texans scored 7 after being gifted an extra possession on what was an egregious interception by Lance. An absolutely can't have it type of interception. His play was bad. The offense overall was bad.

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

He's trying wayyyyy too hard to argue lol. Sometimes you're just flat out wrong and that's okay. Happens to everyone in here. I was providing context and he didn't like that. Not a peep about me providing the same stat with Brock. Weird how that works.

I mean it's not like the Texans were top 5 or anything

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
Your 14th, that's you going to www dot what stat can i find to pump up this crap HOU D dot com

Lol so what people in here need to DM you first when we can and can't use Football outsiders DVOA. A quality source we've been using in here for years.

No it's that you chose to use that, instead of reality.. there is no one on planet earth, outside of maybe a handful of ppl in this thread, who are pumping up the 2021 HOU pass D. They were terrible. Why do you think they burned a top 3 pick on a DB, then followed it up with a high end round 2 again on DB, right after that season, and fired their HC?

You found whatever can possibly paint them in as good as light as you could possibly find, this terrible pass D, and passed it off as you being 'objective'.

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:
You don't think it's at least a little biased to frame his play in the first half in the manner you did?

The team scored 3 points against one of the worst defenses in football, at home. Had at least two 3-and-outs, and I believe they went 0-for on 3rd downs. The Texans scored 7 after being gifted an extra possession on what was an egregious interception by Lance. An absolutely can't have it type of interception. His play was bad. The offense overall was bad.

Was that solely his fault? And it was the 14th pass D not the worst. I mean he clearly doesn't get credit for rushing yards….I brought up the Seattle game when he got hurt and they avg something like 15 yard per play over his 17 snaps that game. Boy did people get upset saying that.

He had 250 yards completed 70% of his passes had 2 TDs 1INTs with a 113.5 QB rating…that equals bad lol. So Brock's games vs DC, Seattle, LV and Miami were "bad" all the same (with CMC and our D avg 2.5 TOs a game).

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by SinceXVI:
It's dumb how some will discount Lance's performance against the Texans because of the team's record.

Regardless of their record, the team is full of NFL players who'd most likely thrive elsewhere like safety Justin Reid who would go onto win the SB next year as a starter for the Chiefs.

And that game was important, no win, no playoffs. The Texans beat Justin Herbert the week before intercepting him twice, that loss contributed to the Chargers missing the playoffs by 1 game.

Trey had a really great game for a rookie considering the stakes and him coming back from an injury and a rough outing in AZ.

Of his 16 completions, 10 were really impressive throws.

16 for 23 69.6% 249 yards 10.8 yard avg 2 tds 1 int 1 8 yard sack 116.0 QB rating.

8 rushes 31 yards.

And it's nonsense to claim he had a bad 1st half when he was 10-13 76.9% 103 yards 1 int and one scoring drive to close out the half.

Just dumb biased takes repeated ad naseum. "Texans game doesn't really count.." It does in the win-loss columns, losers.

You don't think it's at least a little biased to frame his play in the first half in the manner you did?

The team scored 3 points against one of the worst defenses in football, at home. Had at least two 3-and-outs, and I believe they went 0-for on 3rd downs. The Texans scored 7 after being gifted an extra possession on what was an egregious interception by Lance. An absolutely can't have it type of interception. His play was bad. The offense overall was bad.

Oh please. What a load of crap. "An absolutely can't have it type of interception" as if it wasn't just a underthrown pass in his second start early in the game. We've watched Jimmy throw it directly to linebackers with no other player in sight for years, but somehow this is the one that's unforgivable.

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by SinceXVI:
It's dumb how some will discount Lance's performance against the Texans because of the team's record.

Regardless of their record, the team is full of NFL players who'd most likely thrive elsewhere like safety Justin Reid who would go onto win the SB next year as a starter for the Chiefs.

And that game was important, no win, no playoffs. The Texans beat Justin Herbert the week before intercepting him twice, that loss contributed to the Chargers missing the playoffs by 1 game.

Trey had a really great game for a rookie considering the stakes and him coming back from an injury and a rough outing in AZ.

Of his 16 completions, 10 were really impressive throws.

16 for 23 69.6% 249 yards 10.8 yard avg 2 tds 1 int 1 8 yard sack 116.0 QB rating.

8 rushes 31 yards.

And it's nonsense to claim he had a bad 1st half when he was 10-13 76.9% 103 yards 1 int and one scoring drive to close out the half.

Just dumb biased takes repeated ad naseum. "Texans game doesn't really count.." It does in the win-loss columns, losers.

You don't think it's at least a little biased to frame his play in the first half in the manner you did?

The team scored 3 points against one of the worst defenses in football, at home. Had at least two 3-and-outs, and I believe they went 0-for on 3rd downs. The Texans scored 7 after being gifted an extra possession on what was an egregious interception by Lance. An absolutely can't have it type of interception. His play was bad. The offense overall was bad.

The offense put up 424 yards in the game & would have scored 30 points if not for a holding call on a TL TD run.

He made two critical mistakes in the 1st half, the interception on a play action pass in which he not only stared down Kittle and delivered a flat ball, but also failed to roll out to his right per the play design.

He also made a bad decision on 4th and 1 to not hit Kittle 2 yards short of stick and letting him fight for the 1st down (that's kind of Kittle's thing) but instead threw an incompletion 10 yards downfield to a well covered Aiyuk.

Rookie mistakes, but still had 5 nice throws during that half, especially on the last drive.

Originally posted by 49ersRing:
Oh please. What a load of crap. "An absolutely can't have it type of interception" as if it wasn't just a slightly underthrown pass. We've watched Jimmy throw it directly to linebackers with no other player in sight for years, but somehow this is the one that's unforgivable.

It was a lot more than a slightly underthrown pass. It was a playaction fake he telegraphed so badly that he pulled the defender right into his passing lane. He was staring at the receiver before he completed the fake. Then with the defender clearly in his line of sight and no pressure, he inexplicably decided to attempt the pass anyway. It was failure on multiple levels and it was about as easy a downfield play to execute as we have in our playbook. Just bad execution.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:
You don't think it's at least a little biased to frame his play in the first half in the manner you did?

The team scored 3 points against one of the worst defenses in football, at home. Had at least two 3-and-outs, and I believe they went 0-for on 3rd downs. The Texans scored 7 after being gifted an extra possession on what was an egregious interception by Lance. An absolutely can't have it type of interception. His play was bad. The offense overall was bad.

Was that solely his fault? And it was the 14th pass D not the worst. I mean he clearly doesn't get credit for rushing yards….I brought up the Seattle game when he got hurt and they avg something like 15 yard per play over his 17 snaps that game. Boy did people get upset saying that.

He had 250 yards completed 70% of his passes had 2 TDs 1INTs with a 113.5 QB rating…that equals bad lol. So Brock's games vs DC, Seattle, LV and Miami were "bad" all the same.

No it wasn't 14th, by conventional metrics, which for a long while has been yards, they were 23rd. Let's realize how game flow works. That HOU team was getting trucked all season. They were 31st in total D (yards). And 31st in rush attempts allowed. They were 8th in pass attempts allowed. This means teams elected to run all over HOU. Which makes sense as if you are up big, you tend to run more, and teams were often up big, on HOU. If you look at net yards allowed per pass attempt, they were at 7.1. The two worst teams, were at 7.2. So HOU was .1 away, from dead last, in pass D, on a per play basis.

A person who uses qb rating as a valuable stat shouldn't lecture anyone on the value of other stats

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by 49ersRing:
Oh please. What a load of crap. "An absolutely can't have it type of interception" as if it wasn't just a slightly underthrown pass. We've watched Jimmy throw it directly to linebackers with no other player in sight for years, but somehow this is the one that's unforgivable.

It was a lot more than a slightly underthrown pass. It was a playaction fake he telegraphed so badly that he pulled the defender right into his passing lane. He was staring at the receiver before he completed the fake. Then with the defender clearly in his line of sight and no pressure, he inexplicably decided to attempt the pass anyway. It was failure on multiple levels and it was about as easy a downfield play to execute as we have in our playbook. Just bad execution.

LOL. Ring is absolutely correct. We had to deal with plays like this for 5 years, but as long as we won the game, Jimmy was excused by his fans. It was an underthrown/bad pass by Trey.