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Dallas Cowboys QB Trey Lance Thread

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Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:
Prepping players that might contribute to the team first? Trey's development just can't be a priority in any fashion (at the cost of what's best for the team), and I've argued myself that he should get the bulk of the reps.

If Darnold is going to be QB2, giving him as much reps as possible is going to give him a better chance to play well if we need him.

Darnold has been in the league 6 years and has started 55 games. He doesn't need pre-season reps. If that is the case why doesn't every team give their starting QB a bunch of reps in the pre-season? Hell yoiu can make the argument that Purdy can use reps more than Darnold because it's only his 2nd year and has only started 8 games but he might not play at all in the pre-season. So why does Darnold need to play?
Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
All the reports from camp are Darnold is terrible when the first read isn't open. Brock was excellent going through progressions last year. That alone will keep it from happenning.

ah yes, the infamous camp reports
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by Dshearn:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:

When I went back and watched, yes while it wasn't as bad as my emotions told me, it was still REALLY bad IMO.

There could be reasons for that that I can admit I wasn't giving enough consideration to, but that said, I've got to see him do much better than this by the end of preseason at minimum. Ideally bouncing back asap on Saturday.

There was errors that were not on Trey, mistakes were made in routs....almost certainly....

Having said that... there was more then 3 bad throws...my 8 am brain just woke up brain can think of at least 4. The overthrow on check down, the one handed catch in the middle of the field, and the two near INT.

Those are on top of his timing issues, missed plays and likely confusion with coverage.

We can give him credit for his three "high level completions", but 2 of them are against a prevent defense with less then 30 seconds before half time needing to drive the length of the field.....

Nah, that game was bad.... Trey will live to fight another day. but he has to learn from that game and push forward.

To me the biggest issue is he still has almost a complete lack of anticipation, and really does not progress well down the passing chart.

Some posters have been upset that Trey never got a shot this year to compete for QB1.....yeah....if this game is indicative of what the 49ers have seen in practice.... I get it.... I get why he is not competing for QB1.

This game Trey had a hard time processing down the passing chart. He is slow to do it, and has no anticipation of where the defender will be in relation to his targets. You contrast that with Brock finding Kittle in the playoffs making up his own routs and being somewhat open somewhere he is not suppose to be and hitting him for a crucial chunk play....it does look like these two have completely different abilities to see what is taking place in front of them.

There's an element of cleverness that is missing from Lance's game and jonnydel pointed it out well in his video breakdown - eye manipulation versus zone coverage. I don't know at what point a QB starts doing this but it must be done at the NFL level. Trust the pre snap read and while dropping back look somewhere else to open the passing lane to the route most likely to be open versus that coverage.

100%. That's a thing Brock had in spades and Kyle and John talked about it last season when he was playing. How well he was doing with eye manipulation. Jimmy would over-rely on it sometimes thinking he could give a quick look off and jam a ball in and he'd set himself up for a pick.

I honestly think Jimmy never came back from that injury........ I am sure he spent his entire football life pre-injury being able to just beat teams with quick throws aided by his release....

Makes me wonder about all these picks we are hearing about from Brock.....

I would have guessed Brock either new that playbook better then any rookie has a right too....or he gambled and won a lot.

Having not seen any of the practices, and knowing next to nothing....I would really have to think Brock is gambling and loosing... Could it be his arm? Injury got him messed up still? Or was this bound to happen like it does to every "gun slinger"?

I am 200% team Brock, but if it gambling.... Shanny has to put the screws down on him. There is a time and place for chaotic brilliance, but you cant build an offense around it.
Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
ah yes, the infamous camp reports

Pretty clear consensus he hasn't been good when first read isn't open. Brock is good.
  • Furlow
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Originally posted by riverrunzthruit:
where is everyone pounding the table that TL trade is worth a day 1 pick, and laughing at the idea the TL market is actually only day3?

[crickets]

Why
Originally posted by JTB1974:
Darnold has been in the league 6 years and has started 55 games. He doesn't need pre-season reps. If that is the case why doesn't every team give their starting QB a bunch of reps in the pre-season? Hell yoiu can make the argument that Purdy can use reps more than Darnold because it's only his 2nd year and has only started 8 games but he might not play at all in the pre-season. So why does Darnold need to play?

Well for one thing every team's starter gets the bulk of the reps in practice. Another consideration is Darnold is new to the team and offense.

There are real reasons to give Darnold at least equal reps to Trey Lance in terms of team benefit. We're having a competition between the two for a job. There is no reason to give Lance more other than it helps him.
  • Furlow
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Originally posted by JTB1974:
Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:
Prepping players that might contribute to the team first? Trey's development just can't be a priority in any fashion (at the cost of what's best for the team), and I've argued myself that he should get the bulk of the reps.

If Darnold is going to be QB2, giving him as much reps as possible is going to give him a better chance to play well if we need him.

Darnold has been in the league 6 years and has started 55 games. He doesn't need pre-season reps. If that is the case why doesn't every team give their starting QB a bunch of reps in the pre-season? Hell yoiu can make the argument that Purdy can use reps more than Darnold because it's only his 2nd year and has only started 8 games but he might not play at all in the pre-season. So why does Darnold need to play?

This is Darnold's first year on this team.
Originally posted by JTB1974:
Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:
Prepping players that might contribute to the team first? Trey's development just can't be a priority in any fashion (at the cost of what's best for the team), and I've argued myself that he should get the bulk of the reps.

If Darnold is going to be QB2, giving him as much reps as possible is going to give him a better chance to play well if we need him.

Darnold has been in the league 6 years and has started 55 games. He doesn't need pre-season reps.

Why would a QB not need reps in a new offense? A complex offense with a large amount of variables?

Forget those questions for a second.....

Why would a coach, not want to see his potential number 2 QB under live fire?

The season might depend on making the right choices down the line.....
Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
ah yes, the infamous camp reports

Pretty clear consensus he hasn't been good when first read isn't open. Brock is good.

Yeah and I heard from the guys that TL > Sam from the camp reports. That changed quick. So I don't know how all in I would be going on these camp reports.
Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
ah yes, the infamous camp reports

Pretty clear consensus he hasn't been good when first read isn't open. Brock is good.

Yeah and I heard from the guys that TL > Sam from the camp reports. That changed quick. So I don't know how all in I would be going on these camp reports.

You never know what conditions those snaps entail.

For all we know, a throw was forced to test a CB or the defense...it might have absolutely nothing to do with the QB.

Not every snap in practice is about the offense, let alone the QB.
Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
Yeah and I heard from the guys that TL > Sam from the camp reports. That changed quick. So I don't know how all in I would be going on these camp reports.

Trey not being willing to pull the trigger in game action doesnt necessarily negate those reports. Practice and game isn't the same thing. Sam showed in his cameo that he can throw the ball to the first read against backups. That's a far cry from legit challenging Brock.
Originally posted by Dshearn:
You never know what conditions those snaps entail.

For all we know, a throw was forced to test a CB or the defense...it might have absolutely nothing to do with the QB.

Not every snap in practice is about the offense, let alone the QB.

And besides this point, you're relying on 2nd hand accounts from people who don't know this and have varying degrees of knowledge on what it is they are seeing.

You could see some of the problems with the reporting from the highlight videos released by the team (like the Trey TD to Snead for example. Some of those guys described that as good ball placement, lol).
Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
Yeah and I heard from the guys that TL > Sam from the camp reports. That changed quick. So I don't know how all in I would be going on these camp reports.

Trey not being willing to pull the trigger in game action doesnt necessarily negate those reports. Practice and game isn't the same thing. Sam showed in his cameo that he can throw the ball to the first read against backups. That's a far cry from legit challenging Brock.

I'm not getting into legit challenging Brock, I'm just saying I don't go all in on camp reports as gospel. I'll trust what I see, more. Sam looked good to me.
  • thl408
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Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by Dshearn:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:

When I went back and watched, yes while it wasn't as bad as my emotions told me, it was still REALLY bad IMO.

There could be reasons for that that I can admit I wasn't giving enough consideration to, but that said, I've got to see him do much better than this by the end of preseason at minimum. Ideally bouncing back asap on Saturday.

There was errors that were not on Trey, mistakes were made in routs....almost certainly....

Having said that... there was more then 3 bad throws...my 8 am brain just woke up brain can think of at least 4. The overthrow on check down, the one handed catch in the middle of the field, and the two near INT.

Those are on top of his timing issues, missed plays and likely confusion with coverage.

We can give him credit for his three "high level completions", but 2 of them are against a prevent defense with less then 30 seconds before half time needing to drive the length of the field.....

Nah, that game was bad.... Trey will live to fight another day. but he has to learn from that game and push forward.

To me the biggest issue is he still has almost a complete lack of anticipation, and really does not progress well down the passing chart.

Some posters have been upset that Trey never got a shot this year to compete for QB1.....yeah....if this game is indicative of what the 49ers have seen in practice.... I get it.... I get why he is not competing for QB1.

This game Trey had a hard time processing down the passing chart. He is slow to do it, and has no anticipation of where the defender will be in relation to his targets. You contrast that with Brock finding Kittle in the playoffs making up his own routs and being somewhat open somewhere he is not suppose to be and hitting him for a crucial chunk play....it does look like these two have completely different abilities to see what is taking place in front of them.

There's an element of cleverness that is missing from Lance's game and jonnydel pointed it out well in his video breakdown - eye manipulation versus zone coverage. I don't know at what point a QB starts doing this but it must be done at the NFL level. Trust the pre snap read and while dropping back look somewhere else to open the passing lane to the route most likely to be open versus that coverage.

100%. That's a thing Brock had in spades and Kyle and John talked about it last season when he was playing. How well he was doing with eye manipulation. Jimmy would over-rely on it sometimes thinking he could give a quick look off and jam a ball in and he'd set himself up for a pick.

Nice breakdown of that first play where he took a sack. I thought he should have looked first the Double Stick to the left, but you showed why he looked right - CB playing with a cushion. I still think he should look to double stick, but now I understand why he didn't. It was nice to see him adjust and hit that same concept later in the game (Double stick to the right, hit a TE for a first down).

The Three man stick to the left was a good example of him not using his eyes to first move the hook defender. How'd you get All22 of the preseason?
Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
I'm not getting into legit challenging Brock, I'm just saying I don't go all in on camp reports as gospel. I'll trust what I see, more. Sam looked good to me.

One nice pass. Rest was meh. If he gets the start vs Denver let's see him make a play when read one isn't open. Otherwise it's pray for Brocks health all year.
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