Dallas Cowboys QB Trey Lance Thread

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Interesting take from Steve Young. He doesn't think Trey is slow mentally or confused but he's thinking too much trying to be perfect. Certainly possible.

Trey seems capable of making some plays out there, but he has to just settle down and run the offense. He's overwhelmed, that's very clear. The reason he's overwhelmednder could be many different reasons.

Everything we've heard says he knows the offense super well, so why didn't he execute it properly most of Sunday?

He wasn't trusting his reads. Why? If they're processing fine, what would make a guy hesitate? If you look at where Trey was looking, it wasn't that he couldn't progress through his options, he just wouldn't pull the trigger and then half the time panicked or was late on throw to the outlet or third read.

Trey's probably never had to deal with the adversity he's dealing with right now and it kind of shows in his tentativeness. He's been privileged athlete and starter from the git go wherever he's been. This is a new experience for him being a backup and bench warmer. It kind of shows in his game as tentativeness or uncertainty because he's pressing. He's used to being The Man, not the bench warmer, and it's something he has to overcome. Being relegated to bench warmer probably has taken a toll on his confidence. It's up to Kyle to remedy that as best as he can - but it's on Trey's shoulders to overcome this adversity as Steve said in his interview. Steve had to deal with the same thing backing up Joe.

Treys hesitation reminds me of a younger Alex smith. Needed to know everything and it needed to be perfect for him to execute, which is an issue. He needs to get through it. I don't personally think Trey doesn't know what's going on, I think he's struggling to feel confident with the timing because he's inexperienced and hasn't played much in the last 5-6 yeaes. Lol especially at the nfl speed

Yeah, he can give up, or keep grinding and making mistakes - taking the heat (as he is now) - and just keep going through the adversity. That's all he can do right now - if he really wants to be a QB in the NFL, and do well in Kyle's system. Kyle wants Trey to do well, so he'll give him the needed reps and quality reps that specifically will develop him, but Kyle also has to develop Brock and so Trey has to squeeze out the learning from every rep, the way Mullens and Brock have done. It's a new way of learning for him because he's been The Man for so long in his brief experience as QB. He did get all the reps, now he doesn't.

The way he keeps talking about taking advantage of reps, it's no secret he realizes he simply hasn't seen things enough to trust what he's seeing.

Practice reps aren't helping him enough, he clearly needs a lot of live reps. I'd like to see him play an entire half Saturday, even if it's just the second half.

In the back of my mind, I kind of wonder if he is worth keeping as a third QB going forward if that situation presents itself. My guess is that doesn't happen and he does up a backup somewhere else.

Originally posted by Afrikan:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Interesting take from Steve Young. He doesn't think Trey is slow mentally or confused but he's thinking too much trying to be perfect. Certainly possible.

Trey seems capable of making some plays out there, but he has to just settle down and run the offense. He's overwhelmed, that's very clear. The reason he's overwhelmed could be many different reasons.

Everything we've heard says he knows the offense super well, so why didn't he execute it properly most of Sunday?

He wasn't trusting his reads. Why? If they're processing fine, what would make a guy hesitate? If you look at where Trey was looking, it wasn't that he couldn't progress through his options, he just wouldn't pull the trigger and then half the time panicked or was late on throw to the outlet or third read.

It shows when he is in the pocket... it's not off instincts like when he first got in the league where he just ran out of there.... you see him try to do everything that he trained over the past few years. Protecting the ball with both hands while he hitches forward or around chaos, still looking down field. Now usually this is a good thing... he has to keep with this until it becomes natural.

Another example is when he leaves the pocket, where some think his athleticism is overrated....where as, imo, it's just because he's trying to be too perfect looking downfield instead of committing 100% to running forward. He's shown his quickness already.. has shown his agility already... but that slight hesitation is enough for these NFL defenders to catch up.

Again I feel he will be fine, he just needs to be out there more often. Time is ticking though, as far as playing time.

I have never seen agility or quickness from Lance. If anything, his pocket mobility and ability to be a running threat have both been extremely underwhelming.

Originally posted by Shemp:

Originally posted by Afrikan:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Interesting take from Steve Young. He doesn't think Trey is slow mentally or confused but he's thinking too much trying to be perfect. Certainly possible.

Trey seems capable of making some plays out there, but he has to just settle down and run the offense. He's overwhelmed, that's very clear. The reason he's overwhelmed could be many different reasons.

Everything we've heard says he knows the offense super well, so why didn't he execute it properly most of Sunday?

He wasn't trusting his reads. Why? If they're processing fine, what would make a guy hesitate? If you look at where Trey was looking, it wasn't that he couldn't progress through his options, he just wouldn't pull the trigger and then half the time panicked or was late on throw to the outlet or third read.

It shows when he is in the pocket... it's not off instincts like when he first got in the league where he just ran out of there.... you see him try to do everything that he trained over the past few years. Protecting the ball with both hands while he hitches forward or around chaos, still looking down field. Now usually this is a good thing... he has to keep with this until it becomes natural.

Another example is when he leaves the pocket, where some think his athleticism is overrated....where as, imo, it's just because he's trying to be too perfect looking downfield instead of committing 100% to running forward. He's shown his quickness already.. has shown his agility already... but that slight hesitation is enough for these NFL defenders to catch up.

Again I feel he will be fine, he just needs to be out there more often. Time is ticking though, as far as playing time.

I have never seen agility or quickness from Lance. If anything, his pocket mobility and ability to be a running threat have both been extremely underwhelming.

+1

There is clearly a major difference between Lance and Fields in terms of running ability. Makes you really question WTF our FO was looking at.

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Garbage QB. It will take him 10 years to figure out how to be remotely functional. Cut him or trade him. He was over drafted. Luckily we have the savior on board. Under a different name and draft status. So we got bailed out of this stupidity.

Cutting Lance isn't an option, it would be incredibly dumb. It would cost us more to the salary cap to cut him then it would to keep him. The only options are keep him or trade him.

Then it becomes a question of what is he worth and is it worth it to lose the depth for a mid round pick (or whatever his value is).

I'd suggest we wait until the end of the pre season and see how he looks, he may be much improved and this last week was just rust and nerves.

It's cheaper to cut him loose now than to pay him next years salary and cut him later. That said they'll find a trade if they really want it. The issue here is he's the highest paid QB on the roster and might end up QB3 if he doesn't turn things around.

Originally posted by lamontb:
There is clearly a major difference between Lance and Fields in terms of running ability. Makes you really question WTF our FO was looking at.

It's a big reason why I was so confident we would take fields. The way kyle was talking about have a dual threat and playing 11-11, I didn't see it with Lance. I thought it was crystal clear with fields.

he has above average mobility, he isn't a statue, but he also isn't mobile enough to design into a gameplan and make plays for it. IMO, he moves well enough to create time and opportunity when a play breaks down but doesn't have the agility, elusiveness, or quickness to have a designed run game around. I don't think I saw him beat a defender to the edge once on a designed run play.

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Interesting take from Steve Young. He doesn't think Trey is slow mentally or confused but he's thinking too much trying to be perfect. Certainly possible.

Trey seems capable of making some plays out there, but he has to just settle down and run the offense. He's overwhelmed, that's very clear. The reason he's overwhelmednder could be many different reasons.

Everything we've heard says he knows the offense super well, so why didn't he execute it properly most of Sunday?

He wasn't trusting his reads. Why? If they're processing fine, what would make a guy hesitate? If you look at where Trey was looking, it wasn't that he couldn't progress through his options, he just wouldn't pull the trigger and then half the time panicked or was late on throw to the outlet or third read.

Trey's probably never had to deal with the adversity he's dealing with right now and it kind of shows in his tentativeness. He's been privileged athlete and starter from the git go wherever he's been. This is a new experience for him being a backup and bench warmer. It kind of shows in his game as tentativeness or uncertainty because he's pressing. He's used to being The Man, not the bench warmer, and it's something he has to overcome. Being relegated to bench warmer probably has taken a toll on his confidence. It's up to Kyle to remedy that as best as he can - but it's on Trey's shoulders to overcome this adversity as Steve said in his interview. Steve had to deal with the same thing backing up Joe.

Treys hesitation reminds me of a younger Alex smith. Needed to know everything and it needed to be perfect for him to execute, which is an issue. He needs to get through it. I don't personally think Trey doesn't know what's going on, I think he's struggling to feel confident with the timing because he's inexperienced and hasn't played much in the last 5-6 yeaes. Lol especially at the nfl speed

Yeah, he can give up, or keep grinding and making mistakes - taking the heat (as he is now) - and just keep going through the adversity. That's all he can do right now - if he really wants to be a QB in the NFL, and do well in Kyle's system. Kyle wants Trey to do well, so he'll give him the needed reps and quality reps that specifically will develop him, but Kyle also has to develop Brock and so Trey has to squeeze out the learning from every rep, the way Mullens and Brock have done. It's a new way of learning for him because he's been The Man for so long in his brief experience as QB. He did get all the reps, now he doesn't.

The way he keeps talking about taking advantage of reps, it's no secret he realizes he simply hasn't seen things enough to trust what he's seeing.

Practice reps aren't helping him enough, he clearly needs a lot of live reps. I'd like to see him play an entire half Saturday, even if it's just the second half.

In the back of my mind, I kind of wonder if he is worth keeping as a third QB going forward if that situation presents itself. My guess is that doesn't happen and he does up a backup somewhere else.

Is he worth keeping? Well if he continues to progress, I would say yes. He's no better than a rookie QB that has a two year contract with the 49ers right now. He does add some depth if he continues to develop. Dude has an arm and legs to play in the NFL. He has an NFL body, now he just needs to have an NFL brain. Who better to develop that brain than the one who's worked miracles with a guy like Jimmy. Point being, Kyle's had enough experience himself with good and bad QB's to basically tell who's redeemable and who isn't. Kyle basically fired himself from another NFL team because he refused to work with a QB he thought sucked.

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by lamontb:
There is clearly a major difference between Lance and Fields in terms of running ability. Makes you really question WTF our FO was looking at.

It's a big reason why I was so confident we would take fields. The way kyle was talking about have a dual threat and playing 11-11, I didn't see it with Lance. I thought it was crystal clear with fields.

he has above average mobility, he isn't a statue, but he also isn't mobile enough to design into a gameplan and make plays for it. IMO, he moves well enough to create time and opportunity when a play breaks down but doesn't have the agility, elusiveness, or quickness to have a designed run game around. I don't think I saw him beat a defender to the edge once on a designed run play.

Meh, he's a lot more mobile than Jimmy. With a stronger arm and taller.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by lamontb:
There is clearly a major difference between Lance and Fields in terms of running ability. Makes you really question WTF our FO was looking at.

It's a big reason why I was so confident we would take fields. The way kyle was talking about have a dual threat and playing 11-11, I didn't see it with Lance. I thought it was crystal clear with fields.

he has above average mobility, he isn't a statue, but he also isn't mobile enough to design into a gameplan and make plays for it. IMO, he moves well enough to create time and opportunity when a play breaks down but doesn't have the agility, elusiveness, or quickness to have a designed run game around. I don't think I saw him beat a defender to the edge once on a designed run play.

Meh, he's a lot more mobile than Jimmy. With a stronger arm and taller.

Yet not one GM in the league would take Lance over Jimmy G.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by lamontb:
There is clearly a major difference between Lance and Fields in terms of running ability. Makes you really question WTF our FO was looking at.

It's a big reason why I was so confident we would take fields. The way kyle was talking about have a dual threat and playing 11-11, I didn't see it with Lance. I thought it was crystal clear with fields.

he has above average mobility, he isn't a statue, but he also isn't mobile enough to design into a gameplan and make plays for it. IMO, he moves well enough to create time and opportunity when a play breaks down but doesn't have the agility, elusiveness, or quickness to have a designed run game around. I don't think I saw him beat a defender to the edge once on a designed run play.

Meh, he's a lot more mobile than Jimmy. With a stronger arm and taller.

He's definitely more mobile than jimmy. Jimmy looks way more athletic than he is. It's kinda surprising how slow he was. Lol or at least never attempted to run much.

Lance isn't a statue, I think where the negativity behind his mobility comes is that Kyle billed the whole selection like he wanted to play 11-11 and have that threat on every play. Almost like a fields or Lamar threat.

tbh if Lance was quicker/more agile, it would help His passing lanes open up a lot more because of the hesiststikn it would cause defenders. That's what it does for Lamar, he really isn't a very accurate QB (he isn't inaccurate) but he isn't someone who you'd necessarily worry about dicing you up if he stays in the pocket. He's just so special with his mobility that it makes it easier for him to have bigger throwing windows.

Originally posted by Shemp:
Yet not one GM in the league would take Lance over Jimmy G.

I think Jimmy is going to have his best year yet this season. I reallly do. He has some good weapons there, familiar system, and he was playing his best last year. I'm excited for him and glad he's in the AFC. I used to love watching the raiders lose but now that they're in Vegas, idc about them anymore.

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by Shemp:
Yet not one GM in the league would take Lance over Jimmy G.

I think Jimmy is going to have his best year yet this season. I reallly do. He has some good weapons there, familiar system, and he was playing his best last year. I'm excited for him and glad he's in the AFC. I used to love watching the raiders lose but now that they're in Vegas, idc about them anymore.

If he can stay healthy. That's always the issue with him.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Interesting take from Steve Young. He doesn't think Trey is slow mentally or confused but he's thinking too much trying to be perfect. Certainly possible.

Trey seems capable of making some plays out there, but he has to just settle down and run the offense. He's overwhelmed, that's very clear. The reason he's overwhelmednder could be many different reasons.

Everything we've heard says he knows the offense super well, so why didn't he execute it properly most of Sunday?

He wasn't trusting his reads. Why? If they're processing fine, what would make a guy hesitate? If you look at where Trey was looking, it wasn't that he couldn't progress through his options, he just wouldn't pull the trigger and then half the time panicked or was late on throw to the outlet or third read.

Trey's probably never had to deal with the adversity he's dealing with right now and it kind of shows in his tentativeness. He's been privileged athlete and starter from the git go wherever he's been. This is a new experience for him being a backup and bench warmer. It kind of shows in his game as tentativeness or uncertainty because he's pressing. He's used to being The Man, not the bench warmer, and it's something he has to overcome. Being relegated to bench warmer probably has taken a toll on his confidence. It's up to Kyle to remedy that as best as he can - but it's on Trey's shoulders to overcome this adversity as Steve said in his interview. Steve had to deal with the same thing backing up Joe.

Treys hesitation reminds me of a younger Alex smith. Needed to know everything and it needed to be perfect for him to execute, which is an issue. He needs to get through it. I don't personally think Trey doesn't know what's going on, I think he's struggling to feel confident with the timing because he's inexperienced and hasn't played much in the last 5-6 yeaes. Lol especially at the nfl speed

Yeah, he can give up, or keep grinding and making mistakes - taking the heat (as he is now) - and just keep going through the adversity. That's all he can do right now - if he really wants to be a QB in the NFL, and do well in Kyle's system. Kyle wants Trey to do well, so he'll give him the needed reps and quality reps that specifically will develop him, but Kyle also has to develop Brock and so Trey has to squeeze out the learning from every rep, the way Mullens and Brock have done. It's a new way of learning for him because he's been The Man for so long in his brief experience as QB. He did get all the reps, now he doesn't.

The way he keeps talking about taking advantage of reps, it's no secret he realizes he simply hasn't seen things enough to trust what he's seeing.

Practice reps aren't helping him enough, he clearly needs a lot of live reps. I'd like to see him play an entire half Saturday, even if it's just the second half.

In the back of my mind, I kind of wonder if he is worth keeping as a third QB going forward if that situation presents itself. My guess is that doesn't happen and he does up a backup somewhere else.

Is he worth keeping? Well if he continues to progress, I would say yes. He's no better than a rookie QB that has a two year contract with the 49ers right now. He does add some depth if he continues to develop. Dude has an arm and legs to play in the NFL. He has an NFL body, now he just needs to have an NFL brain. Who better to develop that brain than the one who's worked miracles with a guy like Jimmy. Point being, Kyle's had enough experience himself with good and bad QB's to basically tell who's redeemable and who isn't. Kyle basically fired himself from another NFL team because he refused to work with a QB he thought sucked.

There's also the issue of it being a distraction to a Super Bowl challenging team. How much resources are we going to spend trying to get Lance into being a serviceable NFL QB after 3 years? What is the reward, are we still thinking we can take him from a mediocre QB to the next Mahomes? If so I want some of what those guys are smoking. Lance should have been at a certain level after completing a college career, but he essentially skipped that. Now he is way behind, and it's not worth the time and resources any more to catch him up, when we have other options.

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by Shemp:
Yet not one GM in the league would take Lance over Jimmy G.

I think Jimmy is going to have his best year yet this season. I reallly do. He has some good weapons there, familiar system, and he was playing his best last year. I'm excited for him and glad he's in the AFC. I used to love watching the raiders lose but now that they're in Vegas, idc about them anymore.

I think he will have a good season, but I doubt he would have his best season. New team, need to get familiarize with new weapons, and he did missed the off season workout dealing with the injury.