Dallas Cowboys QB Trey Lance Thread

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by Dshearn:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
I find it so weird that Trey Lance is the only QB in NFL history who the media and a big chunk of our fan base believes should be born capable of playing NFL QB and not require any time to learn how to play the position first, how to read defenses, etc.

Am I wrong on this?

As far as I know, for the entirety of the NFL existence... people expect top 5 QBs to be able to play...QB.... by their 3rd year. This has been the expectation for "franchise QBs"

This is not a new expectation for Trey.

What has been found out over the years is many QBs, including Trey are not nearly as good as they were expected to be.

You people keep saying "3rd year" as if his total regular season experience even has reached a single year. How about restate your message with "FOUR GAMES" and see if it sounds stupid or not.

Because saying "four games" games is disingenuous to what he's actually received. He's had 3 training camps, 3 OTAs, an entire year as the second string getting backups and 2-3 full years of meeting/coaching from a top staff. 3 years of pre season games.

that's a ton of coaching, that's more coaching and practice than he's probably had in his entire life Received (def from a quality standpoint).

yes, playing is extremely important but doesn't change the fact he's been getting the best coaching possible for going on three years now. Saying he has had minimal improvement because he hasn't played much is a cop out, IMO. He should still be getting better with all of that.

especially the mental side of the game. I expect the game woukdnt be too fast for him At this point and he would know the system very well, to the point where he would pull the trigger when he's supposed to more often.

Steve Young is a HOF QB that got Hall of Fame coaching for 5 years but he still didn't start to really progress until he became the regular starter. You can get all the great coaching, but you can't really put it into practice until the bullets start flying. Everyone had a plan until they get hit and practice and film study will only give you so much.

Agree 💯%, and for example you don't coach Poe missing his blocks in practice, the radio going out, or playing with broken ribs. Even playoff speed is faster than regular season speed, and Super bowl speed is even faster than playoff speed. Training camp speed doesn't even compare to regular season speed.

You can probably count all of the quarterbacks in NFL history that started off terrible and turned into HOFs on one hand. Their stories are unique. Young also had 560 pass attempts in the USFL. Another 34 games and 900+ pass attempts in college. Young had more than double the experience Lance had before he even got to the Bucs. He had another 14 games and 500 pass attempts with the Bucs before he even got to the niners.

Guys need to stop cherry picking all time greats and acting like it's a comparison for Lance. No one in nfl history has been as inexperienced as Lance. For every Steve young, there are 1000+ guys who had the same situation and never became great.

yes, I know game reps are valuable and where a lot
Of growth comes from, but to me, it's not an excuse for his overall lack of development. So wtf has he been learning/doing for 3 years? I just expected him to be much more sharp and aware at this point with the system and where/when to go with the ball.

he finished great last game and had two really nice drives, it really was awesome and I'm super happy for him, but the rest of the preseason has been horrendous, like he's never played ball before. That's the stuff I don't just write off cause he hasn't played many live games.
For a player who's reportedly very intelligent and works super hard, I've been really disappointed in the way he looks at this point. I wasn't even expecting much because he is inexperienced and working on his new mechanics/throwing motion but I thought he would be much sharper and decisive. I just hope he keeps the positive trajectory and has an awesome game against the chargers.

if anything, darnolds story is the one comparable to Steve young. Was around crap coaching and talent and 5 years or so of experience in the league/pro ball, tben goes to the 49ers with excellent coaching and talent and revitalizes his career.

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by Dshearn:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
I find it so weird that Trey Lance is the only QB in NFL history who the media and a big chunk of our fan base believes should be born capable of playing NFL QB and not require any time to learn how to play the position first, how to read defenses, etc.

Am I wrong on this?

As far as I know, for the entirety of the NFL existence... people expect top 5 QBs to be able to play...QB.... by their 3rd year. This has been the expectation for "franchise QBs"

This is not a new expectation for Trey.

What has been found out over the years is many QBs, including Trey are not nearly as good as they were expected to be.

You people keep saying "3rd year" as if his total regular season experience even has reached a single year. How about restate your message with "FOUR GAMES" and see if it sounds stupid or not.

Because saying "four games" games is disingenuous to what he's actually received. He's had 3 training camps, 3 OTAs, an entire year as the second string getting backups and 2-3 full years of meeting/coaching from a top staff. 3 years of pre season games.

that's a ton of coaching, that's more coaching and practice than he's probably had in his entire life Received (def from a quality standpoint).

yes, playing is extremely important but doesn't change the fact he's been getting the best coaching possible for going on three years now. Saying he has had minimal improvement because he hasn't played much is a cop out, IMO. He should still be getting better with all of that.

especially the mental side of the game. I expect the game woukdnt be too fast for him At this point and he would know the system very well, to the point where he would pull the trigger when he's supposed to more often.

Steve Young is a HOF QB that got Hall of Fame coaching for 5 years but he still didn't start to really progress until he became the regular starter. You can get all the great coaching, but you can't really put it into practice until the bullets start flying. Everyone had a plan until they get hit and practice and film study will only give you so much.

Agree 💯%, and for example you don't coach Poe missing his blocks in practice, the radio going out, or playing with broken ribs. Even playoff speed is faster than regular season speed, and Super bowl speed is even faster than playoff speed. Training camp speed doesn't even compare to regular season speed.

You can probably count all of the quarterbacks in NFL history that started off terrible and turned into HOFs on one hand. Their stories are unique. Young also had 560 pass attempts in the USFL. Another 34 games and 900+ pass attempts in college. Young had more than double the experience Lance had before he even got to the Bucs. He had another 14 games and 500 pass attempts with the Bucs before he even got to the niners.

Guys need to stop cherry picking all time greats and acting like it's a comparison for Lance. No one in nfl history has been as inexperienced as Lance. For every Steve young, there are 1000+ guys who had the same situation and never became great.

yes, I know game reps are valuable and where a lot
Of growth comes from, but to me, it's not an excuse for his overall lack of development. So wtf has he been learning/doing for 3 years? I just expected him to be much more sharp and aware at this point with the system and where/when to go with the ball.

he finished great last game and had two really nice drives, it really was awesome and I'm super happy for him, but the rest of the preseason has been horrendous, like he's never played ball before. That's the stuff I don't just write off cause he hasn't played many live games.
For a player who's reportedly very intelligent and works super hard, I've been really disappointed in the way he looks at this point. I wasn't even expecting much because he is inexperienced and working on his new mechanics/throwing motion but I thought he would be much sharper and decisive. I just hope he keeps the positive trajectory and has an awesome game against the chargers.

if anything, darnolds story is the one comparable to Steve young. Was around crap coaching and talent and 5 years or so of experience in the league/pro ball, tben goes to the 49ers with excellent coaching and talent and revitalizes his career.

Rest of the preseason? As in one half vs the Raiders?

Because in training camp he was playing every bit as good as the "Brockstar!!!!"

If last year wasn't a thing Trey would be QB1 since Brock has not won the job based on training camp performance. He won the job because of stellar play in 7 games last year.

So as highly as you all think of Brockstar!!!!!!!!!!! it should he encouraging that throughout camp Trey played just as good and slightly better which one of a dozen reasons why he should be QB2 for now

Originally posted by Ezekiel38:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by Dshearn:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
I find it so weird that Trey Lance is the only QB in NFL history who the media and a big chunk of our fan base believes should be born capable of playing NFL QB and not require any time to learn how to play the position first, how to read defenses, etc.

Am I wrong on this?

As far as I know, for the entirety of the NFL existence... people expect top 5 QBs to be able to play...QB.... by their 3rd year. This has been the expectation for "franchise QBs"

This is not a new expectation for Trey.

What has been found out over the years is many QBs, including Trey are not nearly as good as they were expected to be.

You people keep saying "3rd year" as if his total regular season experience even has reached a single year. How about restate your message with "FOUR GAMES" and see if it sounds stupid or not.

Because saying "four games" games is disingenuous to what he's actually received. He's had 3 training camps, 3 OTAs, an entire year as the second string getting backups and 2-3 full years of meeting/coaching from a top staff. 3 years of pre season games.

that's a ton of coaching, that's more coaching and practice than he's probably had in his entire life Received (def from a quality standpoint).

yes, playing is extremely important but doesn't change the fact he's been getting the best coaching possible for going on three years now. Saying he has had minimal improvement because he hasn't played much is a cop out, IMO. He should still be getting better with all of that.

especially the mental side of the game. I expect the game woukdnt be too fast for him At this point and he would know the system very well, to the point where he would pull the trigger when he's supposed to more often.

Steve Young is a HOF QB that got Hall of Fame coaching for 5 years but he still didn't start to really progress until he became the regular starter. You can get all the great coaching, but you can't really put it into practice until the bullets start flying. Everyone had a plan until they get hit and practice and film study will only give you so much.

Agree 💯%, and for example you don't coach Poe missing his blocks in practice, the radio going out, or playing with broken ribs. Even playoff speed is faster than regular season speed, and Super bowl speed is even faster than playoff speed. Training camp speed doesn't even compare to regular season speed.

You can probably count all of the quarterbacks in NFL history that started off terrible and turned into HOFs on one hand. Their stories are unique. Young also had 560 pass attempts in the USFL. Another 34 games and 900+ pass attempts in college. Young had more than double the experience Lance had before he even got to the Bucs. He had another 14 games and 500 pass attempts with the Bucs before he even got to the niners.

Guys need to stop cherry picking all time greats and acting like it's a comparison for Lance. No one in nfl history has been as inexperienced as Lance. For every Steve young, there are 1000+ guys who had the same situation and never became great.

yes, I know game reps are valuable and where a lot
Of growth comes from, but to me, it's not an excuse for his overall lack of development. So wtf has he been learning/doing for 3 years? I just expected him to be much more sharp and aware at this point with the system and where/when to go with the ball.

he finished great last game and had two really nice drives, it really was awesome and I'm super happy for him, but the rest of the preseason has been horrendous, like he's never played ball before. That's the stuff I don't just write off cause he hasn't played many live games.
For a player who's reportedly very intelligent and works super hard, I've been really disappointed in the way he looks at this point. I wasn't even expecting much because he is inexperienced and working on his new mechanics/throwing motion but I thought he would be much sharper and decisive. I just hope he keeps the positive trajectory and has an awesome game against the chargers.

if anything, darnolds story is the one comparable to Steve young. Was around crap coaching and talent and 5 years or so of experience in the league/pro ball, tben goes to the 49ers with excellent coaching and talent and revitalizes his career.

Rest of the preseason? As in one half vs the Raiders?

Because in training camp he was playing every bit as good as the "Brockstar!!!!"

If last year wasn't a thing Trey would be QB1 since Brock has not won the job based on training camp performance. He won the job because of stellar play in 7 games last year.

So as highly as you all think of Brockstar!!!!!!!!!!! it should he encouraging that throughout camp Trey played just as good and slightly better which one of a dozen reasons why he should be QB2 for now

According to who? We talking about practice? I'm preseason games, Trey has been outplayed by Purdy and Darnold. Is what it is.

Originally posted by Ezekiel38:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by Dshearn:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
I find it so weird that Trey Lance is the only QB in NFL history who the media and a big chunk of our fan base believes should be born capable of playing NFL QB and not require any time to learn how to play the position first, how to read defenses, etc.

Am I wrong on this?

As far as I know, for the entirety of the NFL existence... people expect top 5 QBs to be able to play...QB.... by their 3rd year. This has been the expectation for "franchise QBs"

This is not a new expectation for Trey.

What has been found out over the years is many QBs, including Trey are not nearly as good as they were expected to be.

You people keep saying "3rd year" as if his total regular season experience even has reached a single year. How about restate your message with "FOUR GAMES" and see if it sounds stupid or not.

Because saying "four games" games is disingenuous to what he's actually received. He's had 3 training camps, 3 OTAs, an entire year as the second string getting backups and 2-3 full years of meeting/coaching from a top staff. 3 years of pre season games.

that's a ton of coaching, that's more coaching and practice than he's probably had in his entire life Received (def from a quality standpoint).

yes, playing is extremely important but doesn't change the fact he's been getting the best coaching possible for going on three years now. Saying he has had minimal improvement because he hasn't played much is a cop out, IMO. He should still be getting better with all of that.

especially the mental side of the game. I expect the game woukdnt be too fast for him At this point and he would know the system very well, to the point where he would pull the trigger when he's supposed to more often.

Steve Young is a HOF QB that got Hall of Fame coaching for 5 years but he still didn't start to really progress until he became the regular starter. You can get all the great coaching, but you can't really put it into practice until the bullets start flying. Everyone had a plan until they get hit and practice and film study will only give you so much.

Agree 💯%, and for example you don't coach Poe missing his blocks in practice, the radio going out, or playing with broken ribs. Even playoff speed is faster than regular season speed, and Super bowl speed is even faster than playoff speed. Training camp speed doesn't even compare to regular season speed.

You can probably count all of the quarterbacks in NFL history that started off terrible and turned into HOFs on one hand. Their stories are unique. Young also had 560 pass attempts in the USFL. Another 34 games and 900+ pass attempts in college. Young had more than double the experience Lance had before he even got to the Bucs. He had another 14 games and 500 pass attempts with the Bucs before he even got to the niners.

Guys need to stop cherry picking all time greats and acting like it's a comparison for Lance. No one in nfl history has been as inexperienced as Lance. For every Steve young, there are 1000+ guys who had the same situation and never became great.

yes, I know game reps are valuable and where a lot
Of growth comes from, but to me, it's not an excuse for his overall lack of development. So wtf has he been learning/doing for 3 years? I just expected him to be much more sharp and aware at this point with the system and where/when to go with the ball.

he finished great last game and had two really nice drives, it really was awesome and I'm super happy for him, but the rest of the preseason has been horrendous, like he's never played ball before. That's the stuff I don't just write off cause he hasn't played many live games.
For a player who's reportedly very intelligent and works super hard, I've been really disappointed in the way he looks at this point. I wasn't even expecting much because he is inexperienced and working on his new mechanics/throwing motion but I thought he would be much sharper and decisive. I just hope he keeps the positive trajectory and has an awesome game against the chargers.

if anything, darnolds story is the one comparable to Steve young. Was around crap coaching and talent and 5 years or so of experience in the league/pro ball, tben goes to the 49ers with excellent coaching and talent and revitalizes his career.

Rest of the preseason? As in one half vs the Raiders?

Because in training camp he was playing every bit as good as the "Brockstar!!!!"

If last year wasn't a thing Trey would be QB1 since Brock has not won the job based on training camp performance. He won the job because of stellar play in 7 games last year.

So as highly as you all think of Brockstar!!!!!!!!!!! it should he encouraging that throughout camp Trey played just as good and slightly better which one of a dozen reasons why he should be QB2 for now

Only in the web zone do we put an emphasis on training camp over actual.real regular season games AND playoff games.

And even worse the poster hasn't even watched training camp. He's read some good and bad article.from Mr Grant cohn

Originally posted by tankle104:
yes, I know game reps are valuable and where a lot
Of growth comes from, but to me, it's not an excuse for his overall lack of development. So wtf has he been learning/doing for 3 years?

I don't normally delete most of a huge post and focus on one part, but you can't be serious with this. You just can't.

1) you have no idea how much he has or hasn't developed since he was a rookie

2) there is only so much someone can develop without playing in games.

3) Trey Lance hasn't been in the NFL for 3 years. He's been in it for 2, one of which he couldn't walk.

Originally posted by tankle104:
Because saying "four games" games is disingenuous to what he's actually received. He's had 3 training camps, 3 OTAs, an entire year as the second string getting backups and 2-3 full years of meeting/coaching from a top staff. 3 years of pre season games.

that's a ton of coaching, that's more coaching and practice than he's probably had in his entire life Received (def from a quality standpoint).

yes, playing is extremely important but doesn't change the fact he's been getting the best coaching possible for going on three years now. Saying he has had minimal improvement because he hasn't played much is a cop out, IMO. He should still be getting better with all of that.

especially the mental side of the game. I expect the game woukdnt be too fast for him At this point and he would know the system very well, to the point where he would pull the trigger when he's supposed to more often.

Saying 4 starts is NOT disingenuous. Dude, I don't often agree with your posts, but these last couple have been doozies. YOU are the one being disingenuous, not the guy who wants to accurately describe his career as 4 starts.

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by Ezekiel38:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by Dshearn:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
I find it so weird that Trey Lance is the only QB in NFL history who the media and a big chunk of our fan base believes should be born capable of playing NFL QB and not require any time to learn how to play the position first, how to read defenses, etc.

Am I wrong on this?

As far as I know, for the entirety of the NFL existence... people expect top 5 QBs to be able to play...QB.... by their 3rd year. This has been the expectation for "franchise QBs"

This is not a new expectation for Trey.

What has been found out over the years is many QBs, including Trey are not nearly as good as they were expected to be.

You people keep saying "3rd year" as if his total regular season experience even has reached a single year. How about restate your message with "FOUR GAMES" and see if it sounds stupid or not.

Because saying "four games" games is disingenuous to what he's actually received. He's had 3 training camps, 3 OTAs, an entire year as the second string getting backups and 2-3 full years of meeting/coaching from a top staff. 3 years of pre season games.

that's a ton of coaching, that's more coaching and practice than he's probably had in his entire life Received (def from a quality standpoint).

yes, playing is extremely important but doesn't change the fact he's been getting the best coaching possible for going on three years now. Saying he has had minimal improvement because he hasn't played much is a cop out, IMO. He should still be getting better with all of that.

especially the mental side of the game. I expect the game woukdnt be too fast for him At this point and he would know the system very well, to the point where he would pull the trigger when he's supposed to more often.

Steve Young is a HOF QB that got Hall of Fame coaching for 5 years but he still didn't start to really progress until he became the regular starter. You can get all the great coaching, but you can't really put it into practice until the bullets start flying. Everyone had a plan until they get hit and practice and film study will only give you so much.

Agree 💯%, and for example you don't coach Poe missing his blocks in practice, the radio going out, or playing with broken ribs. Even playoff speed is faster than regular season speed, and Super bowl speed is even faster than playoff speed. Training camp speed doesn't even compare to regular season speed.

You can probably count all of the quarterbacks in NFL history that started off terrible and turned into HOFs on one hand. Their stories are unique. Young also had 560 pass attempts in the USFL. Another 34 games and 900+ pass attempts in college. Young had more than double the experience Lance had before he even got to the Bucs. He had another 14 games and 500 pass attempts with the Bucs before he even got to the niners.

Guys need to stop cherry picking all time greats and acting like it's a comparison for Lance. No one in nfl history has been as inexperienced as Lance. For every Steve young, there are 1000+ guys who had the same situation and never became great.

yes, I know game reps are valuable and where a lot
Of growth comes from, but to me, it's not an excuse for his overall lack of development. So wtf has he been learning/doing for 3 years? I just expected him to be much more sharp and aware at this point with the system and where/when to go with the ball.

he finished great last game and had two really nice drives, it really was awesome and I'm super happy for him, but the rest of the preseason has been horrendous, like he's never played ball before. That's the stuff I don't just write off cause he hasn't played many live games.
For a player who's reportedly very intelligent and works super hard, I've been really disappointed in the way he looks at this point. I wasn't even expecting much because he is inexperienced and working on his new mechanics/throwing motion but I thought he would be much sharper and decisive. I just hope he keeps the positive trajectory and has an awesome game against the chargers.

if anything, darnolds story is the one comparable to Steve young. Was around crap coaching and talent and 5 years or so of experience in the league/pro ball, tben goes to the 49ers with excellent coaching and talent and revitalizes his career.

Rest of the preseason? As in one half vs the Raiders?

Because in training camp he was playing every bit as good as the "Brockstar!!!!"

If last year wasn't a thing Trey would be QB1 since Brock has not won the job based on training camp performance. He won the job because of stellar play in 7 games last year.

So as highly as you all think of Brockstar!!!!!!!!!!! it should he encouraging that throughout camp Trey played just as good and slightly better which one of a dozen reasons why he should be QB2 for now

According to who? We talking about practice? I'm preseason games, Trey has been outplayed by Purdy and Darnold. Is what it is.

Preseason games are essentially just practice.

Originally posted by JoseCortez:

Originally posted by Ezekiel38:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by Dshearn:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
I find it so weird that Trey Lance is the only QB in NFL history who the media and a big chunk of our fan base believes should be born capable of playing NFL QB and not require any time to learn how to play the position first, how to read defenses, etc.

Am I wrong on this?

As far as I know, for the entirety of the NFL existence... people expect top 5 QBs to be able to play...QB.... by their 3rd year. This has been the expectation for "franchise QBs"

This is not a new expectation for Trey.

What has been found out over the years is many QBs, including Trey are not nearly as good as they were expected to be.

You people keep saying "3rd year" as if his total regular season experience even has reached a single year. How about restate your message with "FOUR GAMES" and see if it sounds stupid or not.

Because saying "four games" games is disingenuous to what he's actually received. He's had 3 training camps, 3 OTAs, an entire year as the second string getting backups and 2-3 full years of meeting/coaching from a top staff. 3 years of pre season games.

that's a ton of coaching, that's more coaching and practice than he's probably had in his entire life Received (def from a quality standpoint).

yes, playing is extremely important but doesn't change the fact he's been getting the best coaching possible for going on three years now. Saying he has had minimal improvement because he hasn't played much is a cop out, IMO. He should still be getting better with all of that.

especially the mental side of the game. I expect the game woukdnt be too fast for him At this point and he would know the system very well, to the point where he would pull the trigger when he's supposed to more often.

Steve Young is a HOF QB that got Hall of Fame coaching for 5 years but he still didn't start to really progress until he became the regular starter. You can get all the great coaching, but you can't really put it into practice until the bullets start flying. Everyone had a plan until they get hit and practice and film study will only give you so much.

Agree 💯%, and for example you don't coach Poe missing his blocks in practice, the radio going out, or playing with broken ribs. Even playoff speed is faster than regular season speed, and Super bowl speed is even faster than playoff speed. Training camp speed doesn't even compare to regular season speed.

You can probably count all of the quarterbacks in NFL history that started off terrible and turned into HOFs on one hand. Their stories are unique. Young also had 560 pass attempts in the USFL. Another 34 games and 900+ pass attempts in college. Young had more than double the experience Lance had before he even got to the Bucs. He had another 14 games and 500 pass attempts with the Bucs before he even got to the niners.

Guys need to stop cherry picking all time greats and acting like it's a comparison for Lance. No one in nfl history has been as inexperienced as Lance. For every Steve young, there are 1000+ guys who had the same situation and never became great.

yes, I know game reps are valuable and where a lot
Of growth comes from, but to me, it's not an excuse for his overall lack of development. So wtf has he been learning/doing for 3 years? I just expected him to be much more sharp and aware at this point with the system and where/when to go with the ball.

he finished great last game and had two really nice drives, it really was awesome and I'm super happy for him, but the rest of the preseason has been horrendous, like he's never played ball before. That's the stuff I don't just write off cause he hasn't played many live games.
For a player who's reportedly very intelligent and works super hard, I've been really disappointed in the way he looks at this point. I wasn't even expecting much because he is inexperienced and working on his new mechanics/throwing motion but I thought he would be much sharper and decisive. I just hope he keeps the positive trajectory and has an awesome game against the chargers.

if anything, darnolds story is the one comparable to Steve young. Was around crap coaching and talent and 5 years or so of experience in the league/pro ball, tben goes to the 49ers with excellent coaching and talent and revitalizes his career.

Rest of the preseason? As in one half vs the Raiders?

Because in training camp he was playing every bit as good as the "Brockstar!!!!"

If last year wasn't a thing Trey would be QB1 since Brock has not won the job based on training camp performance. He won the job because of stellar play in 7 games last year.

So as highly as you all think of Brockstar!!!!!!!!!!! it should he encouraging that throughout camp Trey played just as good and slightly better which one of a dozen reasons why he should be QB2 for now

Only in the web zone do we put an emphasis on training camp over actual.real regular season games AND playoff games.

And even worse the poster hasn't even watched training camp. He's read some good and bad article.from Mr Grant cohn

It should be encouraging that Trey has had a strong camp and played as good as Brock - which should be the case w all of Brocks INTs in the practices. It's Darnold who faded during camp after a couple good practices. Obv Trey had a rougher game vs the Raiders and a pretty solid day vs Denver. One half vs the Raiders is not going to overshadow last night's game as well as a strong training camp.

Actually my post does put emphasis on actual regular season games and playoffs since I was saying isn't it a good thing that Trey can play toe to toe vs Brock during camp after Brock's stellar play last year which made us think he could possibly be a franchise qb?

I think it is a good thing. And if Brock goes down to injury I think Trey can step up like Brock did last year when Trey went down. Would think this would be a good thing - season is not over if we have to go to Trey amd we can still win games and make a run at the Super Bowl.

Good to have depth at the most important position in sports as we all so painfully know from last year.

I was excited when Brock came in when Jimmy went down cuz I thought he played really well vs the 3rd stringers in preseason and thought it would translate. It did and I feel the same about Trey if he gets another opportunity.

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by tankle104:

yes, I know game reps are valuable and where a lot
Of growth comes from, but to me, it's not an excuse for his overall lack of development. So wtf has he been learning/doing for 3 years?

I don't normally delete most of a huge post and focus on one part, but you can't be serious with this. You just can't.

1) you have no idea how much he has or hasn't developed since he was a rookie

2) there is only so much someone can develop without playing in games.

3) Trey Lance hasn't been in the NFL for 3 years. He's been in it for 2, one of which he couldn't walk.

I agree with this. To pull an earlier comment I had, try to think of it in terms of yourself as a manager in a new job you've barely done, a job that is insanely involved with lots of moving parts where you simply cannot learn everything you need to know by just taking notes. You can't function efficiently without a ton of time actively involved in the field. You'll be slower for a while.

Lance is like a smart guy who became a manager at a small company for a year and then got recruited for a new lucrative job @ Shanahan Inc. where everything is way more complicated. He gets a few practice tasks as an assistant year one and is expected to take over the next year, but suddenly has to take a year of medical leave. When he comes back, he may have the knowledge, but he hasn't had the live reps in the field in a long time and it's not all gonna immediately come back.

That's how I see it. Unfortunately, we don't really have the luxury of getting him those reps now. It is what it is. He isn't dumb or untalented, he's just raw and undeveloped.

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by Dshearn:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
I find it so weird that Trey Lance is the only QB in NFL history who the media and a big chunk of our fan base believes should be born capable of playing NFL QB and not require any time to learn how to play the position first, how to read defenses, etc.

Am I wrong on this?

As far as I know, for the entirety of the NFL existence... people expect top 5 QBs to be able to play...QB.... by their 3rd year. This has been the expectation for "franchise QBs"

This is not a new expectation for Trey.

What has been found out over the years is many QBs, including Trey are not nearly as good as they were expected to be.

You people keep saying "3rd year" as if his total regular season experience even has reached a single year. How about restate your message with "FOUR GAMES" and see if it sounds stupid or not.

Because saying "four games" games is disingenuous to what he's actually received. He's had 3 training camps, 3 OTAs, an entire year as the second string getting backups and 2-3 full years of meeting/coaching from a top staff. 3 years of pre season games.

that's a ton of coaching, that's more coaching and practice than he's probably had in his entire life Received (def from a quality standpoint).

yes, playing is extremely important but doesn't change the fact he's been getting the best coaching possible for going on three years now. Saying he has had minimal improvement because he hasn't played much is a cop out, IMO. He should still be getting better with all of that.

especially the mental side of the game. I expect the game woukdnt be too fast for him At this point and he would know the system very well, to the point where he would pull the trigger when he's supposed to more often.

Steve Young is a HOF QB that got Hall of Fame coaching for 5 years but he still didn't start to really progress until he became the regular starter. You can get all the great coaching, but you can't really put it into practice until the bullets start flying. Everyone had a plan until they get hit and practice and film study will only give you so much.

Agree 💯%, and for example you don't coach Poe missing his blocks in practice, the radio going out, or playing with broken ribs. Even playoff speed is faster than regular season speed, and Super bowl speed is even faster than playoff speed. Training camp speed doesn't even compare to regular season speed.

You can probably count all of the quarterbacks in NFL history that started off terrible and turned into HOFs on one hand. Their stories are unique. Young also had 560 pass attempts in the USFL. Another 34 games and 900+ pass attempts in college. Young had more than double the experience Lance had before he even got to the Bucs. He had another 14 games and 500 pass attempts with the Bucs before he even got to the niners.

Guys need to stop cherry picking all time greats and acting like it's a comparison for Lance. No one in nfl history has been as inexperienced as Lance. For every Steve young, there are 1000+ guys who had the same situation and never became great.

yes, I know game reps are valuable and where a lot
Of growth comes from, but to me, it's not an excuse for his overall lack of development. So wtf has he been learning/doing for 3 years? I just expected him to be much more sharp and aware at this point with the system and where/when to go with the ball.

he finished great last game and had two really nice drives, it really was awesome and I'm super happy for him, but the rest of the preseason has been horrendous, like he's never played ball before. That's the stuff I don't just write off cause he hasn't played many live games.
For a player who's reportedly very intelligent and works super hard, I've been really disappointed in the way he looks at this point. I wasn't even expecting much because he is inexperienced and working on his new mechanics/throwing motion but I thought he would be much sharper and decisive. I just hope he keeps the positive trajectory and has an awesome game against the chargers.

if anything, darnolds story is the one comparable to Steve young. Was around crap coaching and talent and 5 years or so of experience in the league/pro ball, tben goes to the 49ers with excellent coaching and talent and revitalizes his career.

Where Trey is having a lot of problems is his short game. The short game takes timing, touch and anticipation. Some guys like Purdy can pick those up real quick. In those short passes, you have to basically do a no-look pass. You have to anticipate the coverage (post snap) accurately, anticipate the location of the receiver and defender accurately, and you can't look at both otherwise you give an indication to the defender where you are throwing, and they will intercept it. I.e. you can theoretically learn how to dig a ditch with a shovel, but until you actually encounter the dirt, how tough the dirt is, how heavy the dirt is, and deal with unexpected rocks and tree roots, and hard to cut vegetation, poison ivy, and the like - it's not enough to just book learn how to dig a ditch, you have to actually *dig a ditch* to learn how to dig a ditch.

Here is (possibly a repost) of JTO's 2nd review of Trey Lance. He has the same concerns as you and he's a bit more hopeful than you.



Personally, I think Trey, given his lack of game experience, is progressing pretty quickly. Now it's not as quick as Purdy, but once Trey's got the reads, timing, touch, and anticipation down, he *should* look like Purdy in the short game - with the added dimension of Treys *dominant* long game. The reason Trey isn't QB1 is because Purdy is elite at that right now. ShanaLynch doesn't need to wait for Purdy. That doesn't mean Trey can never get to that level. I think he can, but he needs more gametime reps. He'll get the needed practice reps to develop (and I'm certain he'll get a chance to play in the regular season given this teams historical injury situation), but unfortunately the best reps are reserved for Brock because the whole entire franchise is in a *win now* super bowl window, and you can't delay that by trying to develop Trey faster at this point. For now Trey will be an excellent QB2/QB3 for this year.

Originally posted by Ezekiel38:
Rest of the preseason? As in one half vs the Raiders?

Because in training camp he was playing every bit as good as the "Brockstar!!!!"

If last year wasn't a thing Trey would be QB1 since Brock has not won the job based on training camp performance. He won the job because of stellar play in 7 games last year.

So as highly as you all think of Brockstar!!!!!!!!!!! it should he encouraging that throughout camp Trey played just as good and slightly better which one of a dozen reasons why he should be QB2 for now

Lol all the reps he's taken, yeah.
you have absolutely no idea if he's been as good as Brock, or even good in camp. It's all based off of YouTube bloggers. Lol they don't even know what the team is doing when they're watching. Lance could of had a practice stat sheet of 10-15 with a touchdown and you'd think it's amazing, but we just watched in the raiders game with that same stat sheet that he looked horrendous. I don't think Lance has been terrible in camp but your "point" is literally baseless.

you also don't know if he would be QB1. The only difference would probably be that dsrnold and Lance would be competing for QB1 or the team would of tried to get Cousins or some thing. Lance isn't in this situation cause of Brock. If Lance was being a stud, the team wouldn't make him compete for QB2, it's just common sense.

lol once again, you really have no idea if Lance has been balling in camp.

Originally posted by tankle104:
Lol all the reps he's taken, yeah.
you have absolutely no idea if he's been as good as Brock, or even good in camp. It's all based off of YouTube bloggers. Lol they don't even know what the team is doing when they're watching. Lance could of had a practice stat sheet of 10-15 with a touchdown and you'd think it's amazing, but we just watched in the raiders game with that same stat sheet that he looked horrendous. I don't think Lance has been terrible in camp but your "point" is literally baseless.

you also don't know if he would be QB1. The only difference would probably be that dsrnold and Lance would be competing for QB1 or the team would of tried to get Cousins or some thing. Lance isn't in this situation cause of Brock. If Lance was being a stud, the team wouldn't make him compete for QB2, it's just common sense.

lol once again, you really have no idea if Lance has been balling in camp.

You say this to someone but have no problem posting about his lack of development, as if YOU have any sort of idea. Contradict much?

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by Dshearn:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
I find it so weird that Trey Lance is the only QB in NFL history who the media and a big chunk of our fan base believes should be born capable of playing NFL QB and not require any time to learn how to play the position first, how to read defenses, etc.

Am I wrong on this?

As far as I know, for the entirety of the NFL existence... people expect top 5 QBs to be able to play...QB.... by their 3rd year. This has been the expectation for "franchise QBs"

This is not a new expectation for Trey.

What has been found out over the years is many QBs, including Trey are not nearly as good as they were expected to be.

You people keep saying "3rd year" as if his total regular season experience even has reached a single year. How about restate your message with "FOUR GAMES" and see if it sounds stupid or not.

Because saying "four games" games is disingenuous to what he's actually received. He's had 3 training camps, 3 OTAs, an entire year as the second string getting backups and 2-3 full years of meeting/coaching from a top staff. 3 years of pre season games.

that's a ton of coaching, that's more coaching and practice than he's probably had in his entire life Received (def from a quality standpoint).

yes, playing is extremely important but doesn't change the fact he's been getting the best coaching possible for going on three years now. Saying he has had minimal improvement because he hasn't played much is a cop out, IMO. He should still be getting better with all of that.

especially the mental side of the game. I expect the game woukdnt be too fast for him At this point and he would know the system very well, to the point where he would pull the trigger when he's supposed to more often.

Steve Young is a HOF QB that got Hall of Fame coaching for 5 years but he still didn't start to really progress until he became the regular starter. You can get all the great coaching, but you can't really put it into practice until the bullets start flying. Everyone had a plan until they get hit and practice and film study will only give you so much.

Agree 💯%, and for example you don't coach Poe missing his blocks in practice, the radio going out, or playing with broken ribs. Even playoff speed is faster than regular season speed, and Super bowl speed is even faster than playoff speed. Training camp speed doesn't even compare to regular season speed.

You can probably count all of the quarterbacks in NFL history that started off terrible and turned into HOFs on one hand. Their stories are unique. Young also had 560 pass attempts in the USFL. Another 34 games and 900+ pass attempts in college. Young had more than double the experience Lance had before he even got to the Bucs. He had another 14 games and 500 pass attempts with the Bucs before he even got to the niners.

Guys need to stop cherry picking all time greats and acting like it's a comparison for Lance. No one in nfl history has been as inexperienced as Lance. For every Steve young, there are 1000+ guys who had the same situation and never became great.

yes, I know game reps are valuable and where a lot
Of growth comes from, but to me, it's not an excuse for his overall lack of development. So wtf has he been learning/doing for 3 years? I just expected him to be much more sharp and aware at this point with the system and where/when to go with the ball.

he finished great last game and had two really nice drives, it really was awesome and I'm super happy for him, but the rest of the preseason has been horrendous, like he's never played ball before. That's the stuff I don't just write off cause he hasn't played many live games.
For a player who's reportedly very intelligent and works super hard, I've been really disappointed in the way he looks at this point. I wasn't even expecting much because he is inexperienced and working on his new mechanics/throwing motion but I thought he would be much sharper and decisive. I just hope he keeps the positive trajectory and has an awesome game against the chargers.

if anything, darnolds story is the one comparable to Steve young. Was around crap coaching and talent and 5 years or so of experience in the league/pro ball, tben goes to the 49ers with excellent coaching and talent and revitalizes his career.

Where Trey is having a lot of problems is his short game. The short game takes timing, touch and anticipation. Some guys like Purdy can pick those up real quick. In those short passes, you have to basically do a no-look pass. You have to anticipate the coverage (post snap) accurately, anticipate the location of the receiver and defender accurately, and you can't look at both otherwise you give an indication to the defender where you are throwing, and they will intercept it. I.e. you can theoretically learn how to dig a ditch with a shovel, but until you actually encounter the dirt, how tough the dirt is, how heavy the dirt is, and deal with unexpected rocks and tree roots, and hard to cut vegetation, poison ivy, and the like - it's not enough to just book learn how to dig a ditch, you have to actually *dig a ditch* to learn how to dig a ditch.

Here is (possibly a repost) of JTO's 2nd review of Trey Lance. He has the same concerns as you and he's a bit more hopeful than you.



Personally, I think Trey, given his lack of game experience, is progressing pretty quickly. Now it's not as quick as Purdy, but once Trey's got the reads, timing, touch, and anticipation down, he *should* look like Purdy in the short game - with the added dimension of Treys *dominant* long game. The reason Trey isn't QB1 is because Purdy is elite at that right now. ShanaLynch doesn't need to wait for Purdy. That doesn't mean Trey can never get to that level. I think he can, but he needs more gametime reps. He'll get the needed practice reps to develop (and I'm certain he'll get a chance to play in the regular season given this teams historical injury situation), but unfortunately the best reps are reserved for Brock because the whole entire franchise is in a *win now* super bowl window, and you can't delay that by trying to develop Trey faster at this point. For now Trey will be an excellent QB2/QB3 for this year.

Time will tell. Let's see how he does against the second unit with the chargers. I was happy for him this last game, but I think people are getting too lost in the final two drives, and ignoring the rest of his play.

There are many more reasons why Brock is QB1 over darnold and Lance then how good he is in the short game. Brock was historically good in the intermediate game, above average in the deep game. Exponentially more efficient than either of them ever have. Etc etc it's really not close for either of them. I hope he doesn't get hurt this year but if Brock does, I really hope darnold/Lance show dramatic improvements to keep super bowl hopes alive.

It was against back ups and the back ups back ups but Trey still got hot and played with confidence at the end and thats bigger than anything else for him right now moving forward. If he can play like that consistently against better teams then thats why we drafted him, big IF though lol..

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by tankle104:
Lol all the reps he's taken, yeah.
you have absolutely no idea if he's been as good as Brock, or even good in camp. It's all based off of YouTube bloggers. Lol they don't even know what the team is doing when they're watching. Lance could of had a practice stat sheet of 10-15 with a touchdown and you'd think it's amazing, but we just watched in the raiders game with that same stat sheet that he looked horrendous. I don't think Lance has been terrible in camp but your "point" is literally baseless.

you also don't know if he would be QB1. The only difference would probably be that dsrnold and Lance would be competing for QB1 or the team would of tried to get Cousins or some thing. Lance isn't in this situation cause of Brock. If Lance was being a stud, the team wouldn't make him compete for QB2, it's just common sense.

lol once again, you really have no idea if Lance has been balling in camp.

You say this to someone but have no problem posting about his lack of development, as if YOU have any sort of idea. Contradict much?

Lol his lack of development has widely been reported and shows in his play. The few times he's played. Just watch JTOs video. He talks about all these things that not even rookies typically do that Lance does.

we don't know how good any of the QBs have actually been in camp, that isn't just for Lance. CMC did an interview recentky talking about how all these reports he sees, they kinda laugh at, cause they don't really know what the team is working on.