Dallas Cowboys QB Trey Lance Thread

Originally posted by Tman:
Fully agree on the bolded

Rarely does a QB drafted that high have this opportunity to sit and learn on a very good team. Most have to be thrust into action to sink or swim.

Absolutely. Which is why there's such differences of opinion. There really isn't a similar situation. There's some similarities to Smith/Mahomes, Flynn/Wilson, (whoever was the Pitt QB)/Big Ben… but even those don't account for the lack of experience, team dynamic, amount of money going towards the incumbent, and the incumbent's ability to win games.

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by boast:
dispelling the myth that a guy cant sit on the bench a year after not playing a year before. we all know Lance will see action during the season. he might even start the final game of the season if the Niners wrap up a bye earlier than later.

Once again Lance isn't your typical player. He has 318 pass attempts under his belt. Aaron Rodgers sat allowing him to work on his mechanics but he had twice as many attempts in college vs higher level of competition.

Yes Lance could sit, work on things and hit the ground running but it's not the same comparison.

i wasnt comparing Lance to Rodgers. i'm pointing out that QB only getting minimal snaps in a game over a few years isnt detrimental to his growth.

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
I am not arguing that he has the same grasp on the offense and NFL defenses that Jimmy does. That is not and has never been my point.

My point is that he needs to play. He needs the experience. He won't get that experience sitting on the bench. I dont mind him taking his lumps this year because I believe with Shanahans scheme and the fact that we have a good amount of talent on offense, Treys lumps will not cost us a bunch of wins. And I believe his skillset might actually win us games.

This situation is so different than most highly drafted QB's situations. He can still make some mistakes without it being a huge detriment to the team...especially given the fact that Jimmy makes a ton of mistakes even in spite of the experience.

Exactly. A lot of people are under the false impression that if you sit a QB he is gaining the same level of experience as if he were playing. That he would still be developed just as fast sitting on the bench. There is a big difference between the level of experience and reps a starting QB will get compared to QB2. Not only in-game experience and reps, But Qb1 gets way more practice reps than Qb2 during the regular season. IMO the only reason not to start a rookie Qb who we gave up 3 first-rounders is if he is just clearly no ready to start. You definitely don't want to throw him out there to destroy his confidence if he is not ready for it. But if you believe he is ready to handle being a starting QB in the NFL, then you start him. Even if you think Jimmy gave us the best chance to win. You still should start Trey to give him the most experience possible. He is the future and if he is ready to go then he should be starting.

Originally posted by boast:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by boast:
dispelling the myth that a guy cant sit on the bench a year after not playing a year before. we all know Lance will see action during the season. he might even start the final game of the season if the Niners wrap up a bye earlier than later.

Once again Lance isn't your typical player. He has 318 pass attempts under his belt. Aaron Rodgers sat allowing him to work on his mechanics but he had twice as many attempts in college vs higher level of competition.

Yes Lance could sit, work on things and hit the ground running but it's not the same comparison.

i wasnt comparing Lance to Rodgers. i'm pointing out that QB only getting minimal snaps in a game over a few years isnt detrimental to his growth.

Maybe if he hadn't sat for those years he wouldn't choke vs the 49ers in the postseason.

Originally posted by Tman:

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by Tman:

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by Tman:

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by Tman:
Right, good post. We have a shot at a Super Bowl this year if we limit mistakes just like you said. Those SB shots are few and far between like we all know to well. So if we need to limit the mistakes why start such a young, albeit super talented, inexperienced qb? Makes a whole lot more sense to ride the veteran who was here for our last SB visit.

There is wisdom in both approaches in developing Trey, I'm just on a different side then you

Because our not so young, less talented, more experienced QB makes these mistakes too.

Mistakes comes in more forms then throwing picks

Agreed. Like passing over an open WR down field in favor of a safe check down is a mistake. You dont have to tell ME this sir. I have been beating this drum since Alex Smith was our QB.

I understand we are all clamoring for the fireworks a super talented, strong armed qb will bring but you can't honestly argue Trey has the same grasp on the offense and nfl defenses that Jimmy does right now?

I can't wait to see Trey as the starter too, patience is a virtue. It will happen sooner or later.

I am not arguing that he has the same grasp on the offense and NFL defenses that Jimmy does. That is not and has never been my point.

My point is that he needs to play. He needs the experience. He won't get that experience sitting on the bench. I dont mind him taking his lumps this year because I believe with Shanahans scheme and the fact that we have a good amount of talent on offense, Treys lumps will not cost us a bunch of wins. And I believe his skillset might actually win us games.

This situation is so different than most highly drafted QB's situations. He can still make some mistakes without it being a huge detriment to the team...especially given the fact that Jimmy makes a ton of mistakes even in spite of the experience.

Fully agree on the bolded

Rarely does a QB drafted that high have this opportunity to sit and learn on a very good team. Most have to be thrust into action to sink or swim.

There is another way to look at it too. Rarely does a QB drafted that high have the opportunity to play on a really good team with a playcaller/coach that will do everything in his power to make life easy on him. Most are thrust into action on s**t teams with s**t coaches.

Originally posted by Jeepzilla:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by tjd808185:
I'd say it's more that the team has no interest in putting up with growing pains when we're a possible SB contender. If we had a sh team and could go 6-10 yeah I'd agree but with expectations it's see ya next year when you're a year more mature and we have to split from Jimmy.

So growing pains in 2022 when we should want to be winning a super bowl as well?

then what in 2023 he will "have it down" and then we gotta start working on a extension?

fun fact no team has won a SB when the QB was making more than 13.1% of the total team salary…Jimmy is at 13.46% this year.

Well there you go folks. If you were on the fence before about Who should be starting, that extra .36% should shut down all questions and definitely start Trey..

thanks for that NY..
Hopefully you can repeat it 78 times just for precaution in cause anyone has missed it..

Showing off that Engineering degree today, eh Jeepy?

Originally posted by NinerBuff:

Originally posted by Tman:
Fully agree on the bolded

Rarely does a QB drafted that high have this opportunity to sit and learn on a very good team. Most have to be thrust into action to sink or swim.

Absolutely. Which is why there's such differences of opinion. There really isn't a similar situation. There's some similarities to Smith/Mahomes, Flynn/Wilson, (whoever was the Pitt QB)/Big Ben… but even those don't account for the lack of experience, team dynamic, amount of money going towards the incumbent, and the incumbent's ability to win games.

Luckily for us Jimmy has a knack for winning

Originally posted by boast:
i wasnt comparing Lance to Rodgers. i'm pointing out that QB only getting minimal snaps in a game over a few years isnt detrimental to his growth.

"isn't 'necessarily' detrimental to his growth."

Originally posted by Hysterikal:

Originally posted by boast:
dispelling the myth that a guy cant sit on the bench a year after not playing a year before. we all know Lance will see action during the season. he might even start the final game of the season if the Niners wrap up a bye earlier than later.

And Peyton Manning can be used to prove you can start a rookie and have a horrible year and not ruin his confidence.

Yeah not sure why we have to point to a certain scenario to prove whatever.

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by Tman:

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by Tman:

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by Tman:

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by Tman:
Right, good post. We have a shot at a Super Bowl this year if we limit mistakes just like you said. Those SB shots are few and far between like we all know to well. So if we need to limit the mistakes why start such a young, albeit super talented, inexperienced qb? Makes a whole lot more sense to ride the veteran who was here for our last SB visit.

There is wisdom in both approaches in developing Trey, I'm just on a different side then you

Because our not so young, less talented, more experienced QB makes these mistakes too.

Mistakes comes in more forms then throwing picks

Agreed. Like passing over an open WR down field in favor of a safe check down is a mistake. You dont have to tell ME this sir. I have been beating this drum since Alex Smith was our QB.

I understand we are all clamoring for the fireworks a super talented, strong armed qb will bring but you can't honestly argue Trey has the same grasp on the offense and nfl defenses that Jimmy does right now?

I can't wait to see Trey as the starter too, patience is a virtue. It will happen sooner or later.

I am not arguing that he has the same grasp on the offense and NFL defenses that Jimmy does. That is not and has never been my point.

My point is that he needs to play. He needs the experience. He won't get that experience sitting on the bench. I dont mind him taking his lumps this year because I believe with Shanahans scheme and the fact that we have a good amount of talent on offense, Treys lumps will not cost us a bunch of wins. And I believe his skillset might actually win us games.

This situation is so different than most highly drafted QB's situations. He can still make some mistakes without it being a huge detriment to the team...especially given the fact that Jimmy makes a ton of mistakes even in spite of the experience.

Fully agree on the bolded

Rarely does a QB drafted that high have this opportunity to sit and learn on a very good team. Most have to be thrust into action to sink or swim.

There is another way to look at it too. Rarely does a QB drafted that high have the opportunity to play on a really good team with a playcaller/coach that will do everything in his power to make life easy on him. Most are thrust into action on s**t teams with s**t coaches.

Correct, 2 sides to the coin here. Luckily our team should still be pretty solid next year too with a pretty good coach.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by random49er:

Originally posted by NCommand:
LOL. OK, they were rated 32 out of 32 in a pre season game instead of 26th for a full real season.

The OLine will never be the reason why Jimmy can't test deep down the hashes.

Screaming "OLine OLine OLine!!!" to everyone incessantly doesn't somehow make Jimmy a playmaking QB.

People want to blame it on his ACL,...but I've posted in this thread the same exact thing NE was waiting to get back to their offense once Brady came back: testing the deeper ends of the field. Jimmy served well and looked good/serviceable for sure.

But his skills are limited, regardless of the OLine. Hence, the 3 1st rounders for Trey.

Literally, nobody was talking about Garoppolo. Nor was that anywhere near the point.

That's literally one of your top 3 Objectives on the board since before the trade for the #3 pick. You know,..."Narratives" and stuff.

Just about you talked about to hammer home is that we should keep the statue Quarterback without seeking another one and upgrade the OLine. The former didn't work out the way you wished, so here you are, still pushing the theory. Is there anything here wrong? Your gig is being a narrator,....dont become a denier as well.

Go, Trey, go! Go get them my bro.

Originally posted by Tman:
Luckily for us Jimmy has a knack for winning

Which make the choice hard. We don't want to lose either of our first two games. I contended either QB should be successful, but Jimmy is a proven winner.

Originally posted by random49er:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by random49er:

Originally posted by NCommand:
LOL. OK, they were rated 32 out of 32 in a pre season game instead of 26th for a full real season.

The OLine will never be the reason why Jimmy can't test deep down the hashes.

Screaming "OLine OLine OLine!!!" to everyone incessantly doesn't somehow make Jimmy a playmaking QB.

People want to blame it on his ACL,...but I've posted in this thread the same exact thing NE was waiting to get back to their offense once Brady came back: testing the deeper ends of the field. Jimmy served well and looked good/serviceable for sure.

But his skills are limited, regardless of the OLine. Hence, the 3 1st rounders for Trey.

Literally, nobody was talking about Garoppolo. Nor was that anywhere near the point.

That's literally one of your top 3 Objectives on the board since before the trade for the #3 pick. You know,..."Narratives" and stuff.

Just about you talked about to hammer home is that we should keep the statue Quarterback without seeking another one and upgrade the OLine. The former didn't work out the way you wished, so here you are, still pushing the theory. Is there anything here wrong? Your gig is being a narrator,....dont become a denier as well.

Haha. Just meant that's not what we were talking about in that exchange you jumped in on.

Fake news. We never fixed the pass protection which is vital to a classic drop back QB. And then I expanded it to mobile QB's as well. That's more than proven accurate. Like the very first pre season game WITH a mobile QB. You still need quality and consistent pass protection or it won't matter in the end. That's been my narrative for like 20 years here. LOL

Originally posted by NinerBuff:

Originally posted by Tman:
Luckily for us Jimmy has a knack for winning

Which make the choice hard. We don't want to lose either of our first two games. I contended either QB should be successful, but Jimmy is a proven winner.