Justin Fields and his Steelers

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
Fields has only recently started playing better. He now has around one full season of starts under his belt. Playing better is a relative term since his completion % is still only 58.9 for this season. Most games have been 60% 0r less. Much of his success is because of his running which is off the charts. The question is how long will that last. Eventually he will need to stop running so much if he wants to have along career.

Now take a look at the scrub players on his team vs the stars on this team that Lance can't do anything with.

You need to stop with this narrative. Lance isn't even playing and hasn't played for two months. There is no honest basis for comparison until Lance actually has extended time as a starter when fully healthy.

Durable > injured.

When you can run through the hole with 4.4 speed instead of 4.9 and get popped before you get through that also helps.

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
Fields has only recently started playing better. He now has around one full season of starts under his belt. Playing better is a relative term since his completion % is still only 58.9 for this season. Most games have been 60% 0r less. Much of his success is because of his running which is off the charts. The question is how long will that last. Eventually he will need to stop running so much if he wants to have along career.

Now take a look at the scrub players on his team vs the stars on this team that Lance can't do anything with.

You mean Lance who only had 3 games as a starter before getting injured? The one who hadn't played in 2 years after taking his last year off. Fields had more experience when coming out of college so he should have been more ready than he looked that first year. Even now he's not a good passer. He doesn't have good receivers althiugh Claypool should help. That doesn't mean they never get open and can't play.

The Bears have a lot of cap space but it remains to be seen if they can actually build a good team. They've only had one since the 1950s so the odds are against them. Even that 1985 tream was one sided. Great defense with a mediocre QB and a great RB. That propelled them to one SB before they went back to being the EmBearssed.

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
Fields has only recently started playing better. He now has around one full season of starts under his belt. Playing better is a relative term since his completion % is still only 58.9 for this season. Most games have been 60% 0r less. Much of his success is because of his running which is off the charts. The question is how long will that last. Eventually he will need to stop running so much if he wants to have along career.

Now take a look at the scrub players on his team vs the stars on this team that Lance can't do anything with.

You need to stop with this narrative. Lance isn't even playing and hasn't played for two months. There is no honest basis for comparison until Lance actually has extended time as a starter when fully healthy.

My 2 cents.. the TL hasn't played is not really a good defense of TL.

2021 couldn't get past JG who is a middle / mediocre starter
2022 major injury and when coupled with minor 2021 injuries (plural) paints a picture as a durability concern

We don't give a lot of repeat durability offenders a pass.. see Kinlaw or JG.

Another point I can mention.. the Bears are in suckville and selling off talent like Roquan and Quinn. They are fine if Fields balls out and they lose by 1, if he is growing game to game. They are gearing up for next year.

I don't think our team is built for a 20 game stretch of us losing while the QB 'learns on the fly'. We are built to win now. So I have a hard time seeing him getting those games to grow. He was supposed to grow on the bench ala Mahomes (this was the example specifically cited by coach Shanahan as our 'model'.. may be very optimistic, and realize I don't think he was saying TL becomes Mahomes, just that he develops into a viable starter while on the bench 1 year)

Originally posted by ninerfan818:

Originally posted by 49ers_Life:

Originally posted by ninerfan818:

Originally posted by 49ers_Life:

I will no longer post in this thread because we didn't draft him so it's all ashes

Hey it's OK. We as fans have a right to resent decisions! It was POTENTIALLY a bad choice, time will tell

I will need therapy if Fields turns out to be a franchise QB

Hahahaha. We all Will

Have you been in therapy since 2005?

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
Fields has only recently started playing better. He now has around one full season of starts under his belt. Playing better is a relative term since his completion % is still only 58.9 for this season. Most games have been 60% 0r less. Much of his success is because of his running which is off the charts. The question is how long will that last. Eventually he will need to stop running so much if he wants to have along career.

Now take a look at the scrub players on his team vs the stars on this team that Lance can't do anything with.

You need to stop with this narrative. Lance isn't even playing and hasn't played for two months. There is no honest basis for comparison until Lance actually has extended time as a starter when fully healthy.

Durable > injured.

When you can run through the hole with 4.4 speed instead of 4.9 and get popped before you get through that also helps.

The bolded is true, however, that was not the point you were making.

You have been saying Lance is not a good player. That assertion is based on a very limited amount of PT. Hence, my comment you need to find another narrative. When he has had as much PT as Fields and is still not performing well, then you have a case. As for now, the sample size is far too small to make an authoritative statement.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
My 2 cents.. the TL hasn't played is not really a good defense of TL.

2021 couldn't get past JG who is a middle / mediocre starter
2022 major injury and when coupled with minor 2021 injuries (plural) paints a picture as a durability concern

We don't give a lot of repeat durability offenders a pass.. see Kinlaw or JG.

Another point I can mention.. the Bears are in suckville and selling off talent like Roquan and Quinn. They are fine if Fields balls out and they lose by 1, if he is growing game to game. They are gearing up for next year.

I don't think our team is built for a 20 game stretch of us losing while the QB 'learns on the fly'. We are built to win now. So I have a hard time seeing him getting those games to grow. He was supposed to grow on the bench ala Mahomes (this was the example specifically cited by coach Shanahan as our 'model'.. may be very optimistic, and realize I don't think he was saying TL becomes Mahomes, just that he develops into a viable starter while on the bench 1 year)

That is a good expression of my concerns with Trey Lance. The star veterans on this team are not going to stick around and support a QB who plays down to the level of Justin Fields in his first 20 games. Imagine how Deebo might react if he is open but Lance doesn't see him and takes off running for a four-yard gain. Or, how will Bosa react if the defense plays very well only to lose the game due to three INTs?

I think we all know the answer to those questions.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
Fields has only recently started playing better. He now has around one full season of starts under his belt. Playing better is a relative term since his completion % is still only 58.9 for this season. Most games have been 60% 0r less. Much of his success is because of his running which is off the charts. The question is how long will that last. Eventually he will need to stop running so much if he wants to have along career.

Now take a look at the scrub players on his team vs the stars on this team that Lance can't do anything with.

You need to stop with this narrative. Lance isn't even playing and hasn't played for two months. There is no honest basis for comparison until Lance actually has extended time as a starter when fully healthy.

My 2 cents.. the TL hasn't played is not really a good defense of TL.

2021 couldn't get past JG who is a middle / mediocre starter
2022 major injury and when coupled with minor 2021 injuries (plural) paints a picture as a durability concern

We don't give a lot of repeat durability offenders a pass.. see Kinlaw or JG.

Another point I can mention.. the Bears are in suckville and selling off talent like Roquan and Quinn. They are fine if Fields balls out and they lose by 1, if he is growing game to game. They are gearing up for next year.

I don't think our team is built for a 20 game stretch of us losing while the QB 'learns on the fly'. We are built to win now. So I have a hard time seeing him getting those games to grow. He was supposed to grow on the bench ala Mahomes (this was the example specifically cited by coach Shanahan as our 'model'.. may be very optimistic, and realize I don't think he was saying TL becomes Mahomes, just that he develops into a viable starter while on the bench 1 year)

Its so irritating that so many people are repeating this nonsense as if it is fact. There was no QB competition in 2021. Trey got next to no reps with the first team.

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
Its so irritating that so many people are repeating this nonsense as if it is fact. There was no QB competition in 2021. Trey got next to no reps with the first team.

We have had this convo.. I see it this way:

Door 1: TL was balling or able to ball with game to game action and KS closed this door cuz he's short sighted / closed his mind to it - even tho it was the better option
Door 2: TL was raw as bleep and not nearly ready; needed the redshirt style year

I think Door 2 is most common sensical just my opinion

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
Fields has only recently started playing better. He now has around one full season of starts under his belt. Playing better is a relative term since his completion % is still only 58.9 for this season. Most games have been 60% 0r less. Much of his success is because of his running which is off the charts. The question is how long will that last. Eventually he will need to stop running so much if he wants to have along career.

Now take a look at the scrub players on his team vs the stars on this team that Lance can't do anything with.

You need to stop with this narrative. Lance isn't even playing and hasn't played for two months. There is no honest basis for comparison until Lance actually has extended time as a starter when fully healthy.

Durable > injured.

When you can run through the hole with 4.4 speed instead of 4.9 and get popped before you get through that also helps.

The bolded is true, however, that was not the point you were making.

You have been saying Lance is not a good player. That assertion is based on a very limited amount of PT. Hence, my comment you need to find another narrative. When he has had as much PT as Fields and is still not performing well, then you have a case. As for now, the sample size is far too small to make an authoritative statement.

He hasn't played well. He lost to Justin Fields and didn't look great at all. Fields looked like the far superior athlete in that game. He also made the big plays while Lance didn't. So far he threw 1 good deep ball against Houston last year. That's about it for dynamic plays. The WR made a lot of run after the catch too.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
Its so irritating that so many people are repeating this nonsense as if it is fact. There was no QB competition in 2021. Trey got next to no reps with the first team.

We have had this convo.. I see it this way:

Door 1: TL was balling or able to ball with game to game action and KS closed this door cuz he's short sighted / closed his mind to it - even tho it was the better option
Door 2: TL was raw as bleep and not nearly ready; needed the redshirt style year

I think Door 2 is most common sensical just my opinion

To be clear, you are saying if Trey was ballin against 2nd and 3rd stringers last preseason, Shanahan would have made the switch to start the season? I dont buy that idea for one second. There was no competition. Trey almost never worked with the first team. He wasnt going to become the starter no matter what he did in the preseason games.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Another point I can mention.. the Bears are in suckville and selling off talent like Roquan and Quinn.

Quinn is/was on the wrong side of 30 and they dumped his contract. Smith wasn't going to resign so it made sense to get something for him.

This is a team rebuilding with a new regime at the helm. They added Claypool to get more skill talent for Fields.

Originally posted by evil:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Another point I can mention.. the Bears are in suckville and selling off talent like Roquan and Quinn.

Quinn is/was on the wrong side of 30 and they dumped his contract. Smith wasn't going to resign so it made sense to get something for him.

This is a team rebuilding with a new regime at the helm. They added Claypool to get more skill talent for Fields.

Good points my man!

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
Fields has only recently started playing better. He now has around one full season of starts under his belt. Playing better is a relative term since his completion % is still only 58.9 for this season. Most games have been 60% 0r less. Much of his success is because of his running which is off the charts. The question is how long will that last. Eventually he will need to stop running so much if he wants to have along career.

I know he's not a Niner and I know I have an investment as an Ohio State fan but people should really watch Dilfer's weekly takes on Fields if they have the time. A Chicago radio station has him on weekly. He mentioned that he likes what the Bears are doing with their offense and with Fields but he wonders with how they have designed their offense if they even throw the ball that much in practice. He said the Bears don't have open practices so he doesn't know but he knows the Chargers realized early on what Herbert's strengths and weaknesses were and built their practices around it. The Bears are probably doing the same thing and yes Justin's strength right now is first and foremost his legs and athleticism than the Bears probably indeed are emphasizing that in practice. But to pretend like he can't throw when he was one of the most highly regarded QB prospects in history who had a completion percentage 10-11 percentage points higher in college than Josh Allen or Lamar Jackson is honestly kind of silly.

Now, it's college, and he was surrounded by talent at Ohio State. At the same time, he's not surrounded by talent in the NFL. So yes, he does need to improve but it's going to be a bit of a process for him to get there if the Bears really aren't emphasizing that right now. It probably won't happen all that much this year either. Dilfer did mention the Bears have to decide when to pull back on some of the running and put that into the pocket passer bucket.

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
To be clear, you are saying if Trey was ballin against 2nd and 3rd stringers last preseason, Shanahan would have made the switch to start the season? I dont buy that idea for one second. There was no competition. Trey almost never worked with the first team. He wasnt going to become the starter no matter what he did in the preseason games.

You say things like this but I question if you believe them. If TL was Brady (on that level) he would have started game 1. He was extremely raw and not ready. I don't blame him one bit. He was a very raw prospect, didn't even play his 2020 season, no fault of his. To suggest he could have been better than JG in 2021 but KS didn't give him a chance paints KS as an idiot for no reason.. other than to support your theory.. help me understand why KS would have closed his mind to any comp.. he saw them every day and said JG is the guy in 2021.

To tie this to Fields he probably sits year 1 here.. but has more a chance than TL as he played a lot more in college is my guess.

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
Fields has only recently started playing better. He now has around one full season of starts under his belt. Playing better is a relative term since his completion % is still only 58.9 for this season. Most games have been 60% 0r less. Much of his success is because of his running which is off the charts. The question is how long will that last. Eventually he will need to stop running so much if he wants to have along career.

Now take a look at the scrub players on his team vs the stars on this team that Lance can't do anything with.

You need to stop with this narrative. Lance isn't even playing and hasn't played for two months. There is no honest basis for comparison until Lance actually has extended time as a starter when fully healthy.

Durable > injured.

When you can run through the hole with 4.4 speed instead of 4.9 and get popped before you get through that also helps.

The bolded is true, however, that was not the point you were making.

You have been saying Lance is not a good player. That assertion is based on a very limited amount of PT. Hence, my comment you need to find another narrative. When he has had as much PT as Fields and is still not performing well, then you have a case. As for now, the sample size is far too small to make an authoritative statement.

He hasn't played well. He lost to Justin Fields and didn't look great at all. Fields looked like the far superior athlete in that game. He also made the big plays while Lance didn't. So far he threw 1 good deep ball against Houston last year. That's about it for dynamic plays. The WR made a lot of run after the catch too.

A more accurate statement would be that "he hasn't played much."

Again, you are comparing a player that had played 10 prior pro games after a full season of top-tier college ball to a guy that had only played a handful of games over a three-year time frame in both college and pro. Your sample size is arguably far too small to be making such iron-clad statements.