Here are some examples of vertically stretching a zone defense in order to put stress on the defenders.
Below: 3Q 0:23 1st & 10
SEA: cover3 (I think)
49ers: High-Low concept
49ers will use a hi-lo concept to create a vertical stretch on SEA's zone defense. I love the high-low concept as it makes the QB's reads easier imo. He simply progresses from deep to shallow in terms of depth of vision. This allows for multiple WRs to be in his vision simultaneously. As opposed to having to scan left to right (right to left), he can fix his vision 'straight ahead' and have all WRs in view.
Below: Notice how all the WRs are lined up in a row at different depths (Boldin deep, Crabs intermediate, Gore short). This stretches the zone defenders and forces them to 'pick a guy'. Kap will decide who is the most available target and pull the trigger. He chose wrong as he throws it to Gore, and was inaccurate with the throw (incomplete). Notice Crabs with lots of daylight in front of him on the crosser, and a nice passing lane for the throw.
The play: The play call succeeds, the execution of the play failed.
Below: 4Q 5:39 2nd & 6.
SEA: cover 3
49ers: High-Low flood concept
The 49ers will flood the left area of the field (4 routes) as well as create a High-Low read for Kap.
Below: Notice how vertically stretched the zone defenders are along the sideline. The blue lines show the stress of having to cover both 49ers in their area. The idea is to get the defenders to commit to one 49er, then have Kap throw to the other. If they don't commit to cover a 49er, then they can cover grass. The FS has to stay over the top of VD to honor a route that breaks in as well as a route that breaks out towards the sidelines.
Below: Kap chooses the safe route and takes Crabs for a 6 yard catch.
There are many ways to beat a zone defense. The 49ers used many different zone busting concepts, from horizontal stretches, to vertical stretches, as well as combination flood concepts. With SEA playing a majority zone coverage, it allowed the 49ers to make these play calls with confidence.
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Analysis from Seahawks Game coaches film
Dec 13, 2013 at 4:23 PM
- thl408
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Dec 13, 2013 at 4:35 PM
- jonnydel
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^^^ I saw that first play too, these are the plays he really has to work on. He's getting there, but like I said earlier, I would like him to be farther along when we're trying to make a super bowl run
Dec 13, 2013 at 4:44 PM
- dtg_9er
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Originally posted by jonesadrian:
They are it wasn't meant as a slight on Boone, just how if it was executed properly that's a walk in td,
Didn't mean to indicate you slighted Boone, was actually just commenting for those who think every play should be text book and criticize players for not being perfect. Your comment was not in that vein.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Anyone watch the Lynch TD? We just about lost Ray McDonald the same exact way we lost Ian Williams. @ 12:22 2Q, watch the OT. Ray is blocking down the right side of the line slnting engaged with the RG and just as he engages, the OT dives at his knees from behind. This was ALL the way over on the left hash mark leaving an enormous cut-back lane right up the middle of the field for a TD. Not only does he decleat McDonald but then the OT rolls on the ground and takes out Willis as well.
Now, question, is this legal?
Obviously we were slanting HARD right and Brooks went straight for Wilson.
NC--didn't see an answer and am not an authoritative source, but the rolling is definately illegal. It's rarely called unless it becomes a pattern or is flagrant. As far as hitting an occupied player--didn't Gore get flagged for that last year when it was inadvertent and straight up block? I know the LOS is a no man's land when it comes to anything but holding, but this would seem to be very illegal. The niners need to bring this to the league's attention before the next game...put the refs and Seattle on notice.
Dec 13, 2013 at 4:48 PM
- thl408
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Originally posted by jonnydel:
^^^ I saw that first play too, these are the plays he really has to work on. He's getting there, but like I said earlier, I would like him to be farther along when we're trying to make a super bowl run
The 49ers are in a rare situation as a team ready to contend for a SB, but a QB still learning the ropes. At this rate, I just look for steps forward and hoping for no steps back. This SEA game was a good 'midterm exam' to gauge where he's at, and where this offense is at. I am encouraged to see many concepts being utilized in the passing attack. As Crabs and Ham get back to full health, and with VD acting as a WR, this offense has plenty of potential to create mismatches in coverage. Asnd as Kap starts to experience facing the same team and same defensive philosophies multiple times, he will learn what to do and what not to do. Then we will see some exponential growth.
Dec 13, 2013 at 5:40 PM
- jonnydel
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Originally posted by dtg_9er:
Originally posted by jonesadrian:
They are it wasn't meant as a slight on Boone, just how if it was executed properly that's a walk in td,
Didn't mean to indicate you slighted Boone, was actually just commenting for those who think every play should be text book and criticize players for not being perfect. Your comment was not in that vein.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Anyone watch the Lynch TD? We just about lost Ray McDonald the same exact way we lost Ian Williams. @ 12:22 2Q, watch the OT. Ray is blocking down the right side of the line slnting engaged with the RG and just as he engages, the OT dives at his knees from behind. This was ALL the way over on the left hash mark leaving an enormous cut-back lane right up the middle of the field for a TD. Not only does he decleat McDonald but then the OT rolls on the ground and takes out Willis as well.
Now, question, is this legal?
Obviously we were slanting HARD right and Brooks went straight for Wilson.
NC--didn't see an answer and am not an authoritative source, but the rolling is definately illegal. It's rarely called unless it becomes a pattern or is flagrant. As far as hitting an occupied player--didn't Gore get flagged for that last year when it was inadvertent and straight up block? I know the LOS is a no man's land when it comes to anything but holding, but this would seem to be very illegal. The niners need to bring this to the league's attention before the next game...put the refs and Seattle on notice.
The difference though is how the defender is engaged. For it to be illegal, the player has to be engaged with another player and then be cut. McDonald was flowing to the play side without being engaged by anyone so the cut block is legal. Defensive players have been clamoring for a change to this rule for a couple years now because(really) it's a cheap shot and dangerous. But, as of right now, it's perfectly legal because he's not "engaged" with another defender. I'll post the pic again so you can see.
Dec 13, 2013 at 5:44 PM
- jonnydel
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Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
^^^ I saw that first play too, these are the plays he really has to work on. He's getting there, but like I said earlier, I would like him to be farther along when we're trying to make a super bowl run
The 49ers are in a rare situation as a team ready to contend for a SB, but a QB still learning the ropes. At this rate, I just look for steps forward and hoping for no steps back. This SEA game was a good 'midterm exam' to gauge where he's at, and where this offense is at. I am encouraged to see many concepts being utilized in the passing attack. As Crabs and Ham get back to full health, and with VD acting as a WR, this offense has plenty of potential to create mismatches in coverage. Asnd as Kap starts to experience facing the same team and same defensive philosophies multiple times, he will learn what to do and what not to do. Then we will see some exponential growth.
That's true, and I totally agree, it's just a little frustrating because we all know how hard it is to maintain the talent on a roster for extended periods of being able to make a run at the bowl. I feel like if Kaep can really lock down, what are essentials to playing QB he really can become special. But, until he does, we'll fall 4 yards short.... Don't get me wrong, I know it is really hard to play QB in the NFL with those big guys flying at you and all the things he has to contend with; and it's easier for me to point out the misreads and all that when I have the luxury of a bird's eye view and being able to pause and rewind. I see the definite potential, I just hope the light fully comes on by playoff time.
Dec 13, 2013 at 5:53 PM
- dtg_9er
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Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by dtg_9er:
Originally posted by jonesadrian:
They are it wasn't meant as a slight on Boone, just how if it was executed properly that's a walk in td,
Didn't mean to indicate you slighted Boone, was actually just commenting for those who think every play should be text book and criticize players for not being perfect. Your comment was not in that vein.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Anyone watch the Lynch TD? We just about lost Ray McDonald the same exact way we lost Ian Williams. @ 12:22 2Q, watch the OT. Ray is blocking down the right side of the line slnting engaged with the RG and just as he engages, the OT dives at his knees from behind. This was ALL the way over on the left hash mark leaving an enormous cut-back lane right up the middle of the field for a TD. Not only does he decleat McDonald but then the OT rolls on the ground and takes out Willis as well.
Now, question, is this legal?
Obviously we were slanting HARD right and Brooks went straight for Wilson.
NC--didn't see an answer and am not an authoritative source, but the rolling is definately illegal. It's rarely called unless it becomes a pattern or is flagrant. As far as hitting an occupied player--didn't Gore get flagged for that last year when it was inadvertent and straight up block? I know the LOS is a no man's land when it comes to anything but holding, but this would seem to be very illegal. The niners need to bring this to the league's attention before the next game...put the refs and Seattle on notice.
The difference though is how the defender is engaged. For it to be illegal, the player has to be engaged with another player and then be cut. McDonald was flowing to the play side without being engaged by anyone so the cut block is legal. Defensive players have been clamoring for a change to this rule for a couple years now because(really) it's a cheap shot and dangerous. But, as of right now, it's perfectly legal because he's not "engaged" with another defender. I'll post the pic again so you can see.
NC said that in the play he referenced McDonald was engaged when hit, so this may be a different play....or this is the roll part of the play. If the OLman is on the ground rolling it doesn't matter...illegal.
[ Edited by dtg_9er on Dec 13, 2013 at 5:54 PM ]
Dec 13, 2013 at 6:21 PM
- jonnydel
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^ that is the exact play he was talking about. It's Lynch's TD run. It may have been the angle he watched it at that it looked like Ray Mac was engaged. from the endzone you can see he is not. The roll wasn't blatant either.
Dec 13, 2013 at 6:23 PM
- five1oh
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I didn't know Greg Cosell posted on here!
Dec 13, 2013 at 7:10 PM
- dtg_9er
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Originally posted by jonnydel:
^ that is the exact play he was talking about. It's Lynch's TD run. It may have been the angle he watched it at that it looked like Ray Mac was engaged. from the endzone you can see he is not. The roll wasn't blatant either.
I didn't tape the game so will accept your word. I prefer video to stills when examining plays but it appears he is not in contact with another player.
Dec 13, 2013 at 7:30 PM
- BrianGO
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Originally posted by thl408:
The play: The play call succeeds, the execution of the play failed.
You're showing a snapshot picture at the time Kap is already in his throwing motion. He has obviously made his decision already, and there are multiple defenders one step away from sacking him.
He simply went to his outlet route because of the pressure. Of course it's desirable to get the max possible out of every possible play, but if he throws that ball to Crabs into the middle of six defenders and it is intercepted, you would make a different analysis explaining how it was a poor decision, and that he should have gone to his outlet because of the pressure.
It looks like Crabtree is wide open, but in the NFL, windows like that close in a flash.
There is a defender underneath the route in the process of dropping straight to where the ball would have been thrown. He is starring right at Kap just waiting for him to throw the ball over the middle. He is absolutely not covering the crossing TE, it only appears that way because he runs to the ball after the throw is made. He was sitting there just WAITING for Kap to make a silly throw over the middle like that.
Kap could have stepped up and bought himself some more time, and then thrown the ball to Crabs. There would have been enough separation from the defender by then to do that. So sure, he could have bought some time, but he went with the safe play and picked up a nice five yard gain, instead of trying to play hero with a blitzer in his face.
These so called "windows" where you pause the play, and see a guy who looks wide open are the most deceiving thing in football. They are like those huge holes that running backs run into, that close up in a flash.
Its the movements on the field that determine who is open, not the spacing.
If Kap had another half second of time, I am sure he would have considered throwing the ball to Crabtree on that play. Kap is #8 in "Air Yards" per attempt. So it's not like he's afraid to throw the ball down field.
[ Edited by BrianGO on Dec 13, 2013 at 7:38 PM ]
Dec 13, 2013 at 8:05 PM
- jonnydel
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Originally posted by dtg_9er:
I didn't tape the game so will accept your word. I prefer video to stills when examining plays but it appears he is not in contact with another player.
I do as well, however,
1) I'm not too tech savvy and don't know how to creat GIF's
2) posting straight video is illegal, it's considered a "re-broadcast" without the NFL's consent
Dec 13, 2013 at 8:08 PM
- dtg_9er
- Veteran
- Posts: 33,204
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by dtg_9er:
I didn't tape the game so will accept your word. I prefer video to stills when examining plays but it appears he is not in contact with another player.
I do as well, however,
1) I'm not too tech savvy and don't know how to creat GIF's
2) posting straight video is illegal, it's considered a "re-broadcast" without the NFL's consent
Hey, no problem...I've been very impressed with your work here and don't do GIF's...not that I couldn't figure it out given my life expediency and a keyboard.
Dec 13, 2013 at 9:03 PM
- thl408
- Moderator
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Originally posted by BrianGO:
You're showing a snapshot picture at the time Kap is already in his throwing motion. He has obviously made his decision already, and there are multiple defenders one step away from sacking him.
He simply went to his outlet route because of the pressure. Of course it's desirable to get the max possible out of every possible play, but if he throws that ball to Crabs into the middle of six defenders and it is intercepted, you would make a different analysis explaining how it was a poor decision, and that he should have gone to his outlet because of the pressure.
It looks like Crabtree is wide open, but in the NFL, windows like that close in a flash.
There is a defender underneath the route in the process of dropping straight to where the ball would have been thrown. He is starring right at Kap just waiting for him to throw the ball over the middle. He is absolutely not covering the crossing TE, it only appears that way because he runs to the ball after the throw is made. He was sitting there just WAITING for Kap to make a silly throw over the middle like that.
Kap could have stepped up and bought himself some more time, and then thrown the ball to Crabs. There would have been enough separation from the defender by then to do that. So sure, he could have bought some time, but he went with the safe play and picked up a nice five yard gain, instead of trying to play hero with a blitzer in his face.
These so called "windows" where you pause the play, and see a guy who looks wide open are the most deceiving thing in football. They are like those huge holes that running backs run into, that close up in a flash.
Its the movements on the field that determine who is open, not the spacing.
If Kap had another half second of time, I am sure he would have considered throwing the ball to Crabtree on that play. Kap is #8 in "Air Yards" per attempt. So it's not like he's afraid to throw the ball down field.
Perhaps I should not have said the execution failed. A bit harsh. You are correct that I showed a snapshot of Kap in his throwing motion. He could have been in his throwing motion throwing it to Crabs, but he's not. I understand there are tight windows and the perfect play here is the throw to Crabs. The pressure he faced does excuse him from not making the perfect play.
Dec 13, 2013 at 9:45 PM
- OnTheClock
- Hall of Fame
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Originally posted by BrianGO:Originally posted by thl408:
The play: The play call succeeds, the execution of the play failed.
You're showing a snapshot picture at the time Kap is already in his throwing motion. He has obviously made his decision already, and there are multiple defenders one step away from sacking him.
He simply went to his outlet route because of the pressure. Of course it's desirable to get the max possible out of every possible play, but if he throws that ball to Crabs into the middle of six defenders and it is intercepted, you would make a different analysis explaining how it was a poor decision, and that he should have gone to his outlet because of the pressure.
It looks like Crabtree is wide open, but in the NFL, windows like that close in a flash.
There is a defender underneath the route in the process of dropping straight to where the ball would have been thrown. He is starring right at Kap just waiting for him to throw the ball over the middle. He is absolutely not covering the crossing TE, it only appears that way because he runs to the ball after the throw is made. He was sitting there just WAITING for Kap to make a silly throw over the middle like that.
Kap could have stepped up and bought himself some more time, and then thrown the ball to Crabs. There would have been enough separation from the defender by then to do that. So sure, he could have bought some time, but he went with the safe play and picked up a nice five yard gain, instead of trying to play hero with a blitzer in his face.
These so called "windows" where you pause the play, and see a guy who looks wide open are the most deceiving thing in football. They are like those huge holes that running backs run into, that close up in a flash.
Its the movements on the field that determine who is open, not the spacing.
If Kap had another half second of time, I am sure he would have considered throwing the ball to Crabtree on that play. Kap is #8 in "Air Yards" per attempt. So it's not like he's afraid to throw the ball down field.
I agree. More time would've been needed to complete something to Crabtree. He may have appeared open to some, or even considered himself open, but CK would have to gun it in between 3 defenders and judging by how close the high safety was, if he reads the throw he could pick it off too with a good jump if he see CK start to throw. All he has to do is react knowing if CK pumps, he's getting sacked, but if he lets go, it's a pick (maybe even a pick 6).
The defenders in that view look like they're too close in proximity for the Crabtree option to be a wise choice when he throws it. Gore was open, the decision was good, the throw was just very bad.