Offseason All22 Film Study

Originally posted by Niners816:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by thl408:

All that presnap side to side motion really screws with the LBs. Create a false step to improve blocking angles. I have a feeling teams will start to copy.

Pretty much every NFL coach is paid to copy successful teams. Whether they actually *can* copy is another question entirely. I think Kyle's playcalling ability probably will be difficult to copy.

True. Can't just add a play or two from another's team's playbook and think that it will have the same type of success. The plays in Kyle's playbook compliment each other well. Occasionally I'll recognize how one play looks just like another the first second after the snap, then it branches off in an entirely different direction.

Here's a great video on the evolution of the ground game. I think the increases in gap runs has really set this whole offense off. Couple that with the motion, Shift and jet sweep action and you've got just an incredible scheme. It's gonna be fun to see where it goes from here.

Awesome!!! I don't even know how much more can be added to it. LOL

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by thl408:

All that presnap side to side motion really screws with the LBs. Create a false step to improve blocking angles. I have a feeling teams will start to copy.

Pretty much every NFL coach is paid to copy successful teams. Whether they actually *can* copy is another question entirely. I think Kyle's playcalling ability probably will be difficult to copy.

True. Can't just add a play or two from another's team's playbook and think that it will have the same type of success. The plays in Kyle's playbook compliment each other well. Occasionally I'll recognize how one play looks just like another the first second after the snap, then it branches off in an entirely different direction.

Unless you steal one of Kyle's assistants who mastered Kyle's system but I think Kyle knows this and he's prepared himself for this case.

One thing that's similar between Kyle's scheme and Chip Kelley's is the fact that they don't run a lot of different plays. They just make the plays look different by running them from different sets or using different personnel at different positions. To the defense it's confusing since they can't read the play based on the set and personnel.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

One thing that's similar between Kyle's scheme and Chip Kelley's is the fact that they don't run a lot of different plays. They just make the plays look different by running them from different sets or using different personnel at different positions. To the defense it's confusing since they can't read the play based on the set and personnel.

That's like there's only 3 numbers but you have to guess the combinations in 3 seconds after the snap.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
One thing that's similar between Kyle's scheme and Chip Kelley's is the fact that they don't run a lot of different plays. They just make the plays look different by running them from different sets or using different personnel at different positions. To the defense it's confusing since they can't read the play based on the set and personnel.

Yes and No. The difference is that Kyle has more variants from each look and is able to because he runs so much more from under center. Chip kellly ran shotgun so much because it allowed him to call plays from the sideline easier.
Shanny can come out in a I formation and you have running threats in any lane sideline to sideline. You may have a WR screen, WR jet sweep, inside zone, outside zone, counter zone, split zone, toss sweep, tackle trap, end trap, iso, power(not as much but he does on occasion), we've even seen a fullback option, zone read.

With Chip Kelly, it was inside zone-read 9x, outside zone 1x.

Then, Shanny has play action off most of those runs as well.
It's really the run game that separates Shanny from other schemes. I've been watching film religiously for 8 years and I've never seen any team have the volume of running plays that Shanny does, not even close.

Passing game wise, Shanahan's playbook isn't enormous, week to week. But, that doesn't mean that it's not in there. There's an image out there of when Kyle was in CLE, I think, that caught one side of his play-call sheet close enough where you could read it. There were a ton of pass plays on there.

For example, one concept Shanny likes is the PIN concept, but I think I only saw it 6 or 7 times all last year. Over 16 games, that's not a lot. The biggest thing is, we aren't throwing it 40 times a game so you're not going to see the volume of different pass plays of a team like the Saints, but that doesn't mean they aren't in there.

With Chip Kelly, I saw the same play being run 2-3 times a game, each game. Kelly's playbook was exceptionally small, week-to-week. In any given game, I never saw more than 12 different pass plays in a game. We might be in a game where we threw it 35 times and we ran some plays 3 or 4 or even 5 times.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
One thing that's similar between Kyle's scheme and Chip Kelley's is the fact that they don't run a lot of different plays. They just make the plays look different by running them from different sets or using different personnel at different positions. To the defense it's confusing since they can't read the play based on the set and personnel.

I will agree there are certain concepts and runs that we run much more than others and we have a ton of variation in the formation and personnel sets. Like the slide concept. We run that every single game, multiple times a game and will do it from 80 different personnel and formation groups and change up who is running what routes.

Chip Kelly literally ran 1 play 99% of the time: Inside zone.

Dude was a total joke.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

One thing that's similar between Kyle's scheme and Chip Kelley's is the fact that they don't run a lot of different plays. They just make the plays look different by running them from different sets or using different personnel at different positions. To the defense it's confusing since they can't read the play based on the set and personnel.

Yes and No. The difference is that Kyle has more variants from each look and is able to because he runs so much more from under center. Chip kellly ran shotgun so much because it allowed him to call plays from the sideline easier.
Shanny can come out in a I formation and you have running threats in any lane sideline to sideline. You may have a WR screen, WR jet sweep, inside zone, outside zone, counter zone, split zone, toss sweep, tackle trap, end trap, iso, power(not as much but he does on occasion), we've even seen a fullback option, zone read.

With Chip Kelly, it was inside zone-read 9x, outside zone 1x.

Then, Shanny has play action off most of those runs as well.
It's really the run game that separates Shanny from other schemes. I've been watching film religiously for 8 years and I've never seen any team have the volume of running plays that Shanny does, not even close.

Passing game wise, Shanahan's playbook isn't enormous, week to week. But, that doesn't mean that it's not in there. There's an image out there of when Kyle was in CLE, I think, that caught one side of his play-call sheet close enough where you could read it. There were a ton of pass plays on there.

For example, one concept Shanny likes is the PIN concept, but I think I only saw it 6 or 7 times all last year. Over 16 games, that's not a lot. The biggest thing is, we aren't throwing it 40 times a game so you're not going to see the volume of different pass plays of a team like the Saints, but that doesn't mean they aren't in there.

With Chip Kelly, I saw the same play being run 2-3 times a game, each game. Kelly's playbook was exceptionally small, week-to-week. In any given game, I never saw more than 12 different pass plays in a game. We might be in a game where we threw it 35 times and we ran some plays 3 or 4 or even 5 times.

Originally posted by Heroism:
Chip Kelly literally ran 1 play 99% of the time: Inside zone.

Dude was a total joke.

Worst Decision Jed made was letting Baalke hire Kelly. Best decision Jed made was letting Baalke hire Kelly so he could then fire both and replace with ShanaLynch.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by Heroism:

Chip Kelly literally ran 1 play 99% of the time: Inside zone.

Dude was a total joke.

Worst Decision Jed made was letting Baalke hire Kelly. Best decision Jed made was letting Baalke hire Kelly so he could then fire both and replace with ShanaLynch.

LMAO

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Worst Decision Jed made was letting Baalke hire Kelly. Best decision Jed made was letting Baalke hire Kelly so he could then fire both and replace with ShanaLynch.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Yes and No. The difference is that Kyle has more variants from each look and is able to because he runs so much more from under center. Chip kellly ran shotgun so much because it allowed him to call plays from the sideline easier.
Shanny can come out in a I formation and you have running threats in any lane sideline to sideline. You may have a WR screen, WR jet sweep, inside zone, outside zone, counter zone, split zone, toss sweep, tackle trap, end trap, iso, power(not as much but he does on occasion), we've even seen a fullback option, zone read.

With Chip Kelly, it was inside zone-read 9x, outside zone 1x.

Then, Shanny has play action off most of those runs as well.
It's really the run game that separates Shanny from other schemes. I've been watching film religiously for 8 years and I've never seen any team have the volume of running plays that Shanny does, not even close.

Passing game wise, Shanahan's playbook isn't enormous, week to week. But, that doesn't mean that it's not in there. There's an image out there of when Kyle was in CLE, I think, that caught one side of his play-call sheet close enough where you could read it. There were a ton of pass plays on there.

For example, one concept Shanny likes is the PIN concept, but I think I only saw it 6 or 7 times all last year. Over 16 games, that's not a lot. The biggest thing is, we aren't throwing it 40 times a game so you're not going to see the volume of different pass plays of a team like the Saints, but that doesn't mean they aren't in there.

With Chip Kelly, I saw the same play being run 2-3 times a game, each game. Kelly's playbook was exceptionally small, week-to-week. In any given game, I never saw more than 12 different pass plays in a game. We might be in a game where we threw it 35 times and we ran some plays 3 or 4 or even 5 times.

I agree....over the course of a season I'd be willing to bet we run a solid 20+ different passing concepts but week to week it's condensed and certain concepts are featured to exploit matchups.

s**t, go cut up an old game from the 90s and see how many different ways we use to wrap up Drive, Spot, Texas, shallow cross. Formations variation and personnel groupings lets you get away with wearing out concepts and the way Kyle does this is very similar to the good old days.

Originally posted by Heroism:

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Worst Decision Jed made was letting Baalke hire Kelly. Best decision Jed made was letting Baalke hire Kelly so he could then fire both and replace with ShanaLynch.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

One thing that's similar between Kyle's scheme and Chip Kelley's is the fact that they don't run a lot of different plays. They just make the plays look different by running them from different sets or using different personnel at different positions. To the defense it's confusing since they can't read the play based on the set and personnel.

I will agree there are certain concepts and runs that we run much more than others and we have a ton of variation in the formation and personnel sets. Like the slide concept. We run that every single game, multiple times a game and will do it from 80 different personnel and formation groups and change up who is running what routes.

Agree. Also each play, I believe, can be adjusted. You already mentioned adjustments in personnel. They literally can come up with play variations on the spot by adjusting to the different coverages they are seeing in that game. I once saw Juszczyk motion sideways just a couple of steps to influence the LB to move one yard wider so the slot guy can get a cleaner inside release for a slant (for example). Just a yard or two adjustment from the regular position, even though its the same formation and play can be the difference between a completion or a PBU.