49ers Offensive Line

Originally posted by NCommand:

Yeah, exactly. It's science. That was my point. Too funny!

Hits, pressures and sacks should go up with more attempts like they go down when you're running 200 yards a game and passing the least amount.

That's why that PBWR stat is far more meaningful on page 1115...and we're 25th there. Meaning, we still suck ass at PP despite having a QB basically leading in TTT at 2.6 . This would easily be the worst PP line if not for JG's quick processing and delivery.

And the run focusing point is true...it straight up exasperates the scenario; trickle down effect. IMHO, with such a run blocking focus the first 7 games, now that Kyle has had to pull a 180, I'm seeing a ton of breakdowns on PP as if they've forgotten some basics, key communications, lesser talent against good talent, etc.

It's just not a good OL right now. The Packers DL will be a huge test. And conversely, their OL is #1 PBWR; great test for our DL.

I hope they can get their s**t together esp. in the run game.

End of the day how the offense was going thru the first 7 games is how kyle wants to run his offense. That's how this team was built (especially the OL).

I'll bet money if you asked kyle if he'd rather have a top RB or PP lineman, he's gonna go RB.

People gotta realize that's just how it is. He will get rid of one of the best PP RTs in football because he's trash in zone blocking and spend a top 10 pick on a elite run blocking OT who's questionable in PP.

I'm all for upgrades, I'm just telling ya don't hold your breath.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

End of the day how the offense was going thru the first 7 games is how kyle wants to run his offense. That's how this team was built (especially the OL).

I'll bet money if you asked kyle if he'd rather have a top RB or PP lineman, he's gonna go RB.

People gotta realize that's just how it is. He will get rid of one of the best PP RTs in football because he's trash in zone blocking and spend a top 10 pick on a elite run blocking OT who's questionable in PP.

I'm all for upgrades, I'm just telling ya don't hold your breath.

I doubt he goes that run heavy again. My guess was that to ease Jimmy back in and simply because it was just working. He rode that horse as long as he could, and he'll likely be more balanced now. If not lean slightly more pass heavy to set up the run for later in the game. I found this nifty little table from the Falcons SB run.

https://www.sharpfootballstats.com/situational-run-pass-ratios--off-.html
This is all for comparison of what our run/pass ratio could end up like by the end of the year. Just swap the season to 2016.

Originally posted by PuckFarag10:
I doubt he goes that run heavy again. My guess was that to ease Jimmy back in and simply because it was just working. He rode that horse as long as he could, and he'll likely be more balanced now. If not lean slightly more pass heavy to set up the run for later in the game. I found this nifty little table from the Falcons SB run.

https://www.sharpfootballstats.com/situational-run-pass-ratios--off-.html
This is all for comparison of what our run/pass ratio could end up like by the end of the year. Just swap the season to 2016.

It's also all about situational football. We're losing a ton we're throwing the ball and vice a versa.

I'm talking more about his scheme/philosophy as a play caller. Kyle talks about running the ball and how that's the foundation of his offense (same as his dad).

We see how this team is built. He takes great pass-protectors and trades them in favor of great run-blockers. He spends cash on RBs. I don't think the ratio will be as lopsided (towards running the ball) like it was earlier this season BUT the backbone of his offense is running

Originally posted by Niners_D:

Pro Bowl Fan Voting. The number before their name denotes what place they are currently in the voting process. Are our fans voting for everyone with an SF logo by their name? To me Person is the only one who has performed pretty well all season. Not sure how Staley or McGlinchey have votes since they have missed so many games. IMHO we need to draft a Center in the first round next year.

Guards
10, Person, Mike (49ers)

Tackles
6, Staley, Joe (49ers)
8, McGlinchey, Mike (49ers)

Centers
8, Richburg, Weston (49ers)

I'd be pretty pissed if that happened

Originally posted by illinois9er:

Originally posted by Niners_D:
Pro Bowl Fan Voting. The number before their name denotes what place they are currently in the voting process. Are our fans voting for everyone with an SF logo by their name? To me Person is the only one who has performed pretty well all season. Not sure how Staley or McGlinchey have votes since they have missed so many games. IMHO we need to draft a Center in the first round next year.

Guards
10, Person, Mike (49ers)

Tackles
6, Staley, Joe (49ers)
8, McGlinchey, Mike (49ers)

Centers
8, Richburg, Weston (49ers)

I'd be pretty pissed if that happened

Yeah we don't need a center. Richburg is fine.

I do see a ton of mocks that have us drafting Creed Humphrey (who can play all the IOL positions) which I'd be fine with. I'm hoping the can move down (even a couple times) and then go BPA.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by illinois9er:

Originally posted by Niners_D:

Pro Bowl Fan Voting. The number before their name denotes what place they are currently in the voting process. Are our fans voting for everyone with an SF logo by their name? To me Person is the only one who has performed pretty well all season. Not sure how Staley or McGlinchey have votes since they have missed so many games. IMHO we need to draft a Center in the first round next year.

Guards
10, Person, Mike (49ers)

Tackles
6, Staley, Joe (49ers)
8, McGlinchey, Mike (49ers)

Centers
8, Richburg, Weston (49ers)

I'd be pretty pissed if that happened

Yeah we don't need a center. Richburg is fine.

I do see a ton of mocks that have us drafting Creed Humphrey (who can play all the IOL positions) which I'd be fine with. I'm hoping the can move down (even a couple times) and then go BPA.

While I agree that Richburg does NOT need to be replaced, I definitely think we need competition at backup C. To me, the ideal scenario is to have Brunskill replace Person at OG and have Person be the primary backup on the interior. He is light years better than Garland at both spots obviously.

Originally posted by PuckFarag10:

I doubt he goes that run heavy again. My guess was that to ease Jimmy back in and simply because it was just working. He rode that horse as long as he could, and he'll likely be more balanced now. If not lean slightly more pass heavy to set up the run for later in the game. I found this nifty little table from the Falcons SB run.

https://www.sharpfootballstats.com/situational-run-pass-ratios--off-.html
This is all for comparison of what our run/pass ratio could end up like by the end of the year. Just swap the season to 2016.

This. Until the first 6 games of this year (minus Cincy), Kyle's always been a 60/40 pass/run guy. While he FIRST likes to set up the PA pass by establishing the run, in the end, he's still a WCO passing guy. Run isn't working like last game? Tons of short quick passes as an extension of the run. We've seen PA work even when we can't run simply because of the threat. And now he's got a QB who can win exclusively with the pass.

This is why it's odd he hasn't focused more on personnel that are far better at pass protection. Maybe that changes this off season like we saw his philosophy change from Pettis to Deebo/Hurd. But to NY's point, he does seem pretty stubborn about this.

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by illinois9er:

Originally posted by Niners_D:
Pro Bowl Fan Voting. The number before their name denotes what place they are currently in the voting process. Are our fans voting for everyone with an SF logo by their name? To me Person is the only one who has performed pretty well all season. Not sure how Staley or McGlinchey have votes since they have missed so many games. IMHO we need to draft a Center in the first round next year.

Guards
10, Person, Mike (49ers)

Tackles
6, Staley, Joe (49ers)
8, McGlinchey, Mike (49ers)

Centers
8, Richburg, Weston (49ers)

I'd be pretty pissed if that happened

Yeah we don't need a center. Richburg is fine.

I do see a ton of mocks that have us drafting Creed Humphrey (who can play all the IOL positions) which I'd be fine with. I'm hoping the can move down (even a couple times) and then go BPA.

While I agree that Richburg does NOT need to be replaced, I definitely think we need competition at backup C. To me, the ideal scenario is to have Brunskill replace Person at OG and have Person be the primary backup on the interior. He is light years better than Garland at both spots obviously.

Has Brunskill ever played OG? OT's don't always work at OG. I'd rather just see them draft a OG late or pick up another OG in free agency to compete. Should be a pretty decent market for O-line this upcoming March, but I doubt they spend much there.

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by illinois9er:

Originally posted by Niners_D:

Pro Bowl Fan Voting. The number before their name denotes what place they are currently in the voting process. Are our fans voting for everyone with an SF logo by their name? To me Person is the only one who has performed pretty well all season. Not sure how Staley or McGlinchey have votes since they have missed so many games. IMHO we need to draft a Center in the first round next year.

Guards
10, Person, Mike (49ers)

Tackles
6, Staley, Joe (49ers)
8, McGlinchey, Mike (49ers)

Centers
8, Richburg, Weston (49ers)

I'd be pretty pissed if that happened

Yeah we don't need a center. Richburg is fine.

I do see a ton of mocks that have us drafting Creed Humphrey (who can play all the IOL positions) which I'd be fine with. I'm hoping the can move down (even a couple times) and then go BPA.

While I agree that Richburg does NOT need to be replaced, I definitely think we need competition at backup C. To me, the ideal scenario is to have Brunskill replace Person at OG and have Person be the primary backup on the interior. He is light years better than Garland at both spots obviously.

I'm totally on board with competition at Center but not with a 1st round pick. Anything to keep Garland from seeing the field works for me lol.

Originally posted by illinois9er:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by illinois9er:

Originally posted by Niners_D:

Pro Bowl Fan Voting. The number before their name denotes what place they are currently in the voting process. Are our fans voting for everyone with an SF logo by their name? To me Person is the only one who has performed pretty well all season. Not sure how Staley or McGlinchey have votes since they have missed so many games. IMHO we need to draft a Center in the first round next year.

Guards
10, Person, Mike (49ers)

Tackles
6, Staley, Joe (49ers)
8, McGlinchey, Mike (49ers)

Centers
8, Richburg, Weston (49ers)

I'd be pretty pissed if that happened

Yeah we don't need a center. Richburg is fine.

I do see a ton of mocks that have us drafting Creed Humphrey (who can play all the IOL positions) which I'd be fine with. I'm hoping the can move down (even a couple times) and then go BPA.

While I agree that Richburg does NOT need to be replaced, I definitely think we need competition at backup C. To me, the ideal scenario is to have Brunskill replace Person at OG and have Person be the primary backup on the interior. He is light years better than Garland at both spots obviously.

I'm totally on board with competition at Center but not with a 1st round pick. Anything to keep Garland from seeing the field works for me lol.

LOL. Amen to that.

This team needs to find talent better than our starters... we're solid at depth now at T but Staley is 40, Tomlinson has reached his ceiling and has clear weakness in pass protection esp., Richburg has nobody to challenge him, Person needs an upgrade and McGlinchey has played very poorly this year.

It's time to invest high resources in the OL if we plan on making deep playoff runs.

Originally posted by NCommand:
LOL. Amen to that.

This team needs to find talent better than our starters... we're solid at depth now at T but Staley is 40, Tomlinson has reached his ceiling and has clear weakness in pass protection esp., Richburg has nobody to challenge him, Person needs an upgrade and McGlinchey has played very poorly this year.

It's time to invest high resources in the OL if we plan on making deep playoff runs.

I've always been a huge fan of building the O and D lines before going after all the glamour positions. It makes it much easier for the QB, backs and receivers if the O line is solid at both run and pass blocking but so many teams ignore this and go for the big name. QB's fail right and left because of poor O lines. Our only problem is we don't have the draft picks to do much in 2020. I'm okay with using our 1st on O line but a lot of people think it should be wide receiver or DB. It will probably come down to who is sitting there when we pick.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by NCommand:

LOL. Amen to that.

This team needs to find talent better than our starters... we're solid at depth now at T but Staley is 40, Tomlinson has reached his ceiling and has clear weakness in pass protection esp., Richburg has nobody to challenge him, Person needs an upgrade and McGlinchey has played very poorly this year.

It's time to invest high resources in the OL if we plan on making deep playoff runs.

I've always been a huge fan of building the O and D lines before going after all the glamour positions. It makes it much easier for the QB, backs and receivers if the O line is solid at both run and pass blocking but so many teams ignore this and go for the big name. QB's fail right and left because of poor O lines. Our only problem is we don't have the draft picks to do much in 2020. I'm okay with using our 1st on O line but a lot of people think it should be wide receiver or DB. It will probably come down to who is sitting there when we pick.

Very much agree. We're seeing that with the Rams and Browns this year. Gave up key OL and more focus on the skill positions. I'm in that camp that the first pick should be OL but it depends on the players available ATM. I'd even consider a TE if he was the BPA. Best of both worlds. Adds additional PP help, monster in the run game and Kyle would murder LB's with 2 terrific pass catchers at the TE spot.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by PuckFarag10:

I doubt he goes that run heavy again. My guess was that to ease Jimmy back in and simply because it was just working. He rode that horse as long as he could, and he'll likely be more balanced now. If not lean slightly more pass heavy to set up the run for later in the game. I found this nifty little table from the Falcons SB run.

https://www.sharpfootballstats.com/situational-run-pass-ratios--off-.html
This is all for comparison of what our run/pass ratio could end up like by the end of the year. Just swap the season to 2016.

This. Until the first 6 games of this year (minus Cincy), Kyle's always been a 60/40 pass/run guy. While he FIRST likes to set up the PA pass by establishing the run, in the end, he's still a WCO passing guy. Run isn't working like last game? Tons of short quick passes as an extension of the run. We've seen PA work even when we can't run simply because of the threat. And now he's got a QB who can win exclusively with the pass.

This is why it's odd he hasn't focused more on personnel that are far better at pass protection. Maybe that changes this off season like we saw his philosophy change from Pettis to Deebo/Hurd. But to NY's point, he does seem pretty stubborn about this.

You're right about KS being stubborn. Its almost like he doesn't learn his lesson about something until it's almost too late. Maybe after this season with the way he sees the pass protection breaking down so fast, and the OLs saving grace is Jimmy's quick decision making and release. It cant be him getting hurt again like Andrew Luck before we finally upgrade the pass protection around him, that just isn't an option.

Originally posted by NCommand:

LOL. Amen to that.

This team needs to find talent better than our starters... we're solid at depth now at T but Staley is 40, Tomlinson has reached his ceiling and has clear weakness in pass protection esp., Richburg has nobody to challenge him, Person needs an upgrade and McGlinchey has played very poorly this year.

It's time to invest high resources in the OL if we plan on making deep playoff runs.

Welp don't hold your breath. Only way joe isn't on this team the next two yrs is if he retires.

Richburg's contract guarantees he's on the team for atleast a yr or two more.

Kyle doesn't value guards as much as we'd like him to also "investing" high draft capital it's more than likely not happening either (at IOL). Maybe the can trade down a couple times and throw a pick at an IOL in the 2nd or 3rd.

Start looking for athletic run-blocking OGs because that's what he likes (that aren't looked at as 1st rd picks).

Originally posted by NCommand:

Very much agree. We're seeing that with the Rams and Browns this year. Gave up key OL and more focus on the skill positions. I'm in that camp that the first pick should be OL but it depends on the players available ATM. I'd even consider a TE if he was the BPA. Best of both worlds. Adds additional PP help, monster in the run game and Kyle would murder LB's with 2 terrific pass catchers at the TE spot.

I'd love to see if we can work a trade for OJ Howard in the off season. Throw them a 2020 5th and 4th in 2021. He's done there. Howard was a good blocker at bama and imo just isn't being used correctly in TB.

SF needs to look at safety/WR as well as IOL.