Originally posted by NinerGM:
There's so much here to respond to because I thought we were a lot closer in our eval of football .....
So what is it then? I got people telling me if we draft a QB he has to sit for a yr to "learn". Now it's hey he's gotta play to develop? Shoot you can't do both, this league doesn't have time for that anymore. Look at all these QBs getting tossed around. Outside of Stafford none of them are older then Jimmy.
Now? This has always been the case. Reps = learning = better play for everyone who plays this game. You can't do both? I mean it's literally what Josh Allen has been doing over the past two seasons and now Buffalo is "up-and-coming." Really confused by this assessment.
Why is it that Jimmy has literally no trade market?
Again I have no idea why you're looking at things in such simplistic terms. Consider the Stafford trade. Not at ALL simple. He went where he went because of a LOT of factors beyond just the player, but also the cap situation for **both** teams. There are a number of reasons why "there's no trade market" and again, this understanding is based on a rumored tweet. Are we open to trading Jimmy and at what price? All of this assumes you know what the 49ers' asking price is for that trade or even if its real. Remember the tweet that 49ers and Stafford deal is "imminent" or "done within days?" LOL
I think we need to face it and realize Jimmy is who he is an avg starting QB in the NFL. We can talk about his "stats" from 2019, but that can be broken down to show they're not overall that impressive. His stats are right on par with Case Keenum from his 2017.
One thing that gets me fired up in NT is that people rely on stats for INDIVIDUAL (players) to tell a COMPLETE TEAM story and it's just crazy to me. Stats without context usually paint the most distorted, misconstrued picture ever. Here's an example Keenum vs Garoppolo. Keenum's stats WITH - WITH Thielen, Rudolph, Murray, etc. What 2 receiving options went to the ProBowl on offense in 2019 from the 49ers? If Jimmy and Keenum trade places 2019 v 2017, Minny wins homefield throughout and beats the Eagles in Minny. That's your difference between Case and Jimmy. Case had better offensive talent AND a better OL (uninjured mostly).
That 2019 had more to do with just being capable to run the offense, then it did with him actually making this team a whole hell of a lot better.
So let's decide what stat you want to use. You can't tell me there's validity in comparing Case and Jimmy's stat and not compare this stat: 22-8 with Jimmy starting, 6-24 without Jimmy starting. Does that mean Jimmy is indispensable and no other QB can perform in this offense? No, not what I'm saying. Is he enough to actually win? Yes. Here's the key; YOU think the difference between the 4th Q in the SB was the QB. I think the difference in the 4th Q in the SB was pass rush coming right up the middle. No one, not even you were saying "Jimmy doesn't make the team a whole lot better" in December 2019. That changed because of Q4 in the SB and a freak injury - as you've pointed out to me (which I blamed squarely on blocking) - as being the cause of his unavailability this year.
All I'm saying is SF can NOT put all their eggs in the Jimmy G basket again. There has to be some sort of plan beyond 2021. I don't think anyone truly believes he's gonna get another contract here. Do you? So then what?
This is the yr they need to make a play...if they don't win the SB big deal...if they get a FQB that's vastly more important. I want yr after yr of being a contender. I just don't understand how people are okay with not taking a shot to improve at the one position that makes everything better (including OL)?
So these two points are related ....
I 100% agree, we shouldn't put all our eggs in **any** one player's basket - which is why I (and others say) a crazy talented and competitive LOS gives you winning OPTIONS; if our QB situation dictates (because of cap, trades, timing, players) a less than optimal situation, 2019's regular season proves we can still win and win a lot when the LOS is dominant. Where you lose me is HOW you search/acquisition/method for finding the elusive FQB. It's great to have one, but there are very, very few players on the planet available as a proven commodity AND you have to be lucky and good to find one who will stay for 10 seasons.
So let's look at what's available in the year you say we MUST make a move:
Draft - Current position means less likely we'll acquire an available FQB. The real question is do we have the coaching talent or desire to find a diamond in the rough who can eventually become a FQB or should we trade up this year to get one? Well both depend on how KS and staff see the players available AND is there another team willing to trade with us to move up. Are the candidates that might be available to us be better than Jimmy? I say once you come out of the top 4, the answer gets very, very cloudy and a bust is more possible. So do we risk our luck at reaching for a FQB or do we make acquisitions for IOL, CB, Edge, WR, etc. which all NEED talent infusion THIS off-season.
FA/Trade - None officially available to date. Now if there's a reasonable situation that becomes available, let's re-evaluate.
IMHO, I don't think we ***HAVE*** to make a move for a FQB this season. And because we don't, I'm even more in the camp of make sure the LOS is crazy competitive and good and create an awesome platform for 2021 and beyond for any QB to come in and succeed. Draft, evaluate, see what's available and play the best hand you can for QB. Just ensure the team is being built YOY.
Sorry for the long(er) response bud....
There's way too much to respond to in here, I can't even anymore lol.
you and I can't have a decent convo.
