49ers Offensive Line

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
per Pff

Alex Mack 70.4 2021

Daniel Brunskill 61.4 2021

Ben Garland 59.1 2019

Mike Person 61.8 2019

Cesar Ruiz 57.6 2021

To answer your direct question on Ruiz absolutely not

Wirfs? Perhaps. Again don't know how well he can play guard. He could be like McGlinchey. Again elite play is harder to transfer between positions than terrible play.

To act like the actual player being drafted doesn't matter and it's just about their "talent" on paper is absolutely asinine. See our big FA signing as exhibit A of that.

LMAO. You're taking his RG stats in NO as a reference for how he'd do at C here after learning behind Richburg? OK.

Perhaps on Wirfs? Perhaps an all-pro RT might play better at G than what we ended up with? Oh boy.

To each his own. Until next time...

Originally posted by NCommand:
LMAO. You're taking his RG stats in NO as a reference for how he'd do at C here after learning behind Richburg? OK.

Perhaps on Wirfs? Perhaps an all-pro RT might play better at G than what we ended up with? Oh boy.

To each his own. Until next time...

Soooo.....a good player cant regress sliding over a spot,...but a bad player can only improve doing the same??

Someone help make this logic work.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
per Pff

Alex Mack 70.4 2021

Daniel Brunskill 61.4 2021

Ben Garland 59.1 2019

Mike Person 61.8 2019

Cesar Ruiz 57.6 2021

To answer your direct question on Ruiz absolutely not

Wirfs? Perhaps. Again don't know how well he can play guard. He could be like McGlinchey. Again elite play is harder to transfer between positions than terrible play.

To act like the actual player being drafted doesn't matter and it's just about their "talent" on paper is absolutely asinine. See our big FA signing as exhibit A of that.

LMFAO indeed. Guy can't even play RG competently in NO with Brees and a star studded OL, but he's going to magically come in and man the C position here at a high level 🤣

Originally posted by NCommand:
LMAO. You're taking his RG stats in NO as a reference for how he'd do at C here after learning behind Richburg? OK.

Perhaps on Wirfs? Perhaps an all-pro RT might play better at G than what we ended up with? Oh boy.

To each his own. Until next time...

Think ya meant to use this one actually.

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:
LMFAO indeed. Guy can't even play RG competently in NO with Brees and a star studded OL, but he's going to magically come in and man the C position here at a high level 🤣

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
Think ya meant to use this one actually.

Haha. He's definitely not a good G. I'll give you that. I'd never deny that!

If you think he'd come here in Aaron Banks redshirt mode and learn from Richburg and then go in for him once injured and he'd suck so bad we'd still buy Mack in 2021, that's cool. It's your hypothetical.

...but still has absolutely nothing to do with the original topic. LOL

Originally posted by NCommand:
Haha. He's definitely not a good G. I'll give you that. I'd never deny that!

If you think he'd come here in Aaron Banks redshirt mode and learn from Richburg and then go in for him once injured and he'd suck so bad we'd still buy Mack in 2021, that's cool. It's your hypothetical.

...but still has absolutely nothing to do with the original topic. LOL

Except that Richburg was on pup so he would've played weeks 1-6. No redshirt.

Yah I tend not to buy that guys who are terrible at one position will be much better a more difficult position generally. Just me tho.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Haha. He's definitely not a good G. I'll give you that. I'd never deny that!

If you think he'd come here in Aaron Banks redshirt mode and learn from Richburg and then go in for him once injured and he'd suck so bad we'd still buy Mack in 2021, that's cool. It's your hypothetical.

...but still has absolutely nothing to do with the original topic. LOL

Except that Richburg was on pup so he would've played weeks 1-6. No redshirt.

Yah I tend not to buy that guys who are terrible at one position will be much better a more difficult position generally. Just me tho.

True. Unless they kept Garland as a bridge for a bit. Getting a little NFL experience to start wouldn't have been the worst thing esp. if he ended up having to start late.

That's understandable. He could end up just being a miss. You'd like to think if he switched positions he'd at least be in the neighborhood of his former position. So it's not a terrible assumption.

Who knows, he could have been a total bust here. Ya never know.

But since you want the original topic is Wirfs and whatever OL you wanted with the 2nd 1st round pick better than Aiyuk and Kinlaw? Perhaps slightly at this point. But if Aiyuk turns into a game breaking WR that's more valuable on its face than a RT. I also don't think we sniff the playoffs without Aiyuk last year.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
But since you want the original topic is Wirfs and whatever OL you wanted with the 2nd 1st round pick better than Aiyuk and Kinlaw? Perhaps slightly at this point. But if Aiyuk turns into a game breaking WR that's more valuable on its face than a RT. I also don't think we sniff the playoffs without Aiyuk last year.

No, the topic back then was you don't take a RT that high to play "G" (since we had MM). My case was BPA (Wirfs or Lamb) as that stuff would work itself out. Plus the other push back was a position switch. Now we're seeing that's not applicable. For either.

We were just talking Ruiz production from C to G. But remember Brunskill from T to G to C? Big difference in play!

You also wouldn't have had to pay McGlinchey's 5th year, $10.5M option and in a year he ended up getting hurt anyhow.

Williams - Tomlinson - Mack - Wirfs - Brunskill (MM on I.R)

I'm going to guess we wouldn't have had a 42% pressure rate and <3 ypc in the playoffs???

As to the trade itself, it was only the 4th (117) for Kinlaw and 176 that we used to trade up 6 spots for Aiyuk. There's a lot of other combos to use there too. There's a good chance he's still there at 31 and if not, it was a crazy deep draft to stay pat with receivers like Justin Jefferson, for instance.

We kind of proved we didn't need Kinlaw at all and Aiyuk had modest production to help us get to the NFCCG. The OL was definitely a bigger roadblock in the playoffs as shown in here.

It's all fun to talk about but life isn't a, 'Choose your Own Adventure' book. The Kinlaw + Aiyuk and our new group of OL could work out great going forward (2022+) but I was outlining what we needed last year to get over the hump.

And as we know, Wirfs was just one little example. There's a long list of other combinations, FA moves and mock and shadow drafts out there that would have prioritized the OL more by year 6.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
But since you want the original topic is Wirfs and whatever OL you wanted with the 2nd 1st round pick better than Aiyuk and Kinlaw? Perhaps slightly at this point. But if Aiyuk turns into a game breaking WR that's more valuable on its face than a RT. I also don't think we sniff the playoffs without Aiyuk last year.

This is more about the 49er philosophy in the draft and less about player. I don't know what other Center on other teams are good pass blocker and what Center suck. I think the point is the 49er would rather draft and DT or DE and take an O line in the 5th & 6th rounds. That what they do. Look at 2020 They could have draft Wirfs but they picked an Injured Kinlaw. They could have still draft a WR at 31. Maybe ever Aiyuk falls to 31, he would have probably been gone before 31 but you never know for sure. Still at 31 they could have move into the second and pick up extra pick in the third and draft in the third round a back up center like Matt Hennessy or Lloyd Cushenberry III but they would rathe wait till the 5th for Colton McKivitz. This last draft they draft DE Drake Jackson, 4 pick later a Center was draft 1st pick on the 3rd round was Luke Fortner. Who will be better ??? I have no idea but they went with the DE Not the OL. That is what they do and now we are here looking at undrafted free agent try for the starting center position. Is Brunskill, Brendel, or Sutherland Better then Fortner at Center? I would hope they are because they have been in league Fortner is a rookie . But if they would have draft Hennessy in the 3rd round 2020 draft we would not be having this conversation because they would be prepared and have a starter in place maybe for the next 10 yr.

Originally posted by dlance:
This is more about the 49er philosophy in the draft and less about player. I don't know what other Center on other teams are good pass blocker and what Center suck. I think the point is the 49er would rather draft and DT or DE and take an O line in the 5th & 6th rounds. That what they do. Look at 2020 They could have draft Wirfs but they picked an Injured Kinlaw. They could have still draft a WR at 31. Maybe ever Aiyuk falls to 31, he would have probably been gone before 31 but you never know for sure. Still at 31 they could have move into the second and pick up extra pick in the third and draft in the third round a back up center like Matt Hennessy or Lloyd CushenTHeberry III but they would rathe wait till the 5th for Colton McKivitz. This last draft they draft DE Drake Jackson, 4 pick later a Center was draft 1st pick on the 3rd round was Luke Fortner. Who will be better ??? I have no idea but they went with the DE Not the OL. That is what they do and now we are here looking at undrafted free agent try for the starting center position. Is Brunskill, Brendel, or Sutherland Better then Fortner at Center? I have no idea I would hope they are because they have been in league Fortner is a rookie . But if they would have draft Hennessy in the 3rd round 2020 draft we would not be having this conversation because they would be prepared and have a starter in place maybe for the next 10 yr.

In the draft it's always about the player. ALWAYS. The minute you start drafting strictly on need you are screwed.

Other WR's went at top of rd 2 so if you did trade down you are looking at someone like Chase Claypool best case scenario. Does he fit what the 9ers want? Is there even a deal to be made to move down? Someone has to want to come up. Not so super cut and dry.

Fortners biggest issue is he struggles in space. Would have been a very questionable scheme fit. Drake fits what the 9ers do to a T.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by dlance:
This is more about the 49er philosophy in the draft and less about player. I don't know what other Center on other teams are good pass blocker and what Center suck. I think the point is the 49er would rather draft and DT or DE and take an O line in the 5th & 6th rounds. That what they do. Look at 2020 They could have draft Wirfs but they picked an Injured Kinlaw. They could have still draft a WR at 31. Maybe ever Aiyuk falls to 31, he would have probably been gone before 31 but you never know for sure. Still at 31 they could have move into the second and pick up extra pick in the third and draft in the third round a back up center like Matt Hennessy or Lloyd CushenTHeberry III but they would rathe wait till the 5th for Colton McKivitz. This last draft they draft DE Drake Jackson, 4 pick later a Center was draft 1st pick on the 3rd round was Luke Fortner. Who will be better ??? I have no idea but they went with the DE Not the OL. That is what they do and now we are here looking at undrafted free agent try for the starting center position. Is Brunskill, Brendel, or Sutherland Better then Fortner at Center? I have no idea I would hope they are because they have been in league Fortner is a rookie . But if they would have draft Hennessy in the 3rd round 2020 draft we would not be having this conversation because they would be prepared and have a starter in place maybe for the next 10 yr.

In the draft it's always about the player. ALWAYS. The minute you start drafting strictly on need you are screwed.

Other WR's went at top of rd 2 so if you did trade down you are looking at someone like Chase Claypool best case scenario. Does he fit what the 9ers want? Is there even a deal to be made to move down? Someone has to want to come up. Not so super cut and dry.

Fortners biggest issue is he struggles in space. Would have been a very questionable scheme fit. Drake fits what the 9ers do to a T.

Like reaching for an injured 3T who doesn't pass rush? Agreed. He's a nose tackle now. And you were against a G that high? Haha.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by dlance:
This is more about the 49er philosophy in the draft and less about player. I don't know what other Center on other teams are good pass blocker and what Center suck. I think the point is the 49er would rather draft and DT or DE and take an O line in the 5th & 6th rounds. That what they do. Look at 2020 They could have draft Wirfs but they picked an Injured Kinlaw. They could have still draft a WR at 31. Maybe ever Aiyuk falls to 31, he would have probably been gone before 31 but you never know for sure. Still at 31 they could have move into the second and pick up extra pick in the third and draft in the third round a back up center like Matt Hennessy or Lloyd CushenTHeberry III but they would rathe wait till the 5th for Colton McKivitz. This last draft they draft DE Drake Jackson, 4 pick later a Center was draft 1st pick on the 3rd round was Luke Fortner. Who will be better ??? I have no idea but they went with the DE Not the OL. That is what they do and now we are here looking at undrafted free agent try for the starting center position. Is Brunskill, Brendel, or Sutherland Better then Fortner at Center? I have no idea I would hope they are because they have been in league Fortner is a rookie . But if they would have draft Hennessy in the 3rd round 2020 draft we would not be having this conversation because they would be prepared and have a starter in place maybe for the next 10 yr.

In the draft it's always about the player. ALWAYS. The minute you start drafting strictly on need you are screwed.

Other WR's went at top of rd 2 so if you did trade down you are looking at someone like Chase Claypool best case scenario. Does he fit what the 9ers want? Is there even a deal to be made to move down? Someone has to want to come up. Not so super cut and dry.

Fortners biggest issue is he struggles in space. Would have been a very questionable scheme fit. Drake fits what the 9ers do to a T.

I Like Drake Jackson I think he is going to be a great player. My point is not Drake vs Fortner. It's that they do not prioritize the O line the same way they do DL or WR or RB. I think they need to prioritize it more in the draft and building better depth, better then Colton McKvitz and Justin Skule. They need to start think of drafting Trent William and Mike McGlinchey replacement now not after they are gone or hurt. I understand That some UDF and late round pick turn into great player, most are not. For every Tom Brady there are about 100 Gardner Minshew or Josh Johnson in the league . I think all 3 are 6th round QB

Originally posted by NCommand:
Like reaching for an injured 3T who doesn't pass rush? Agreed. He's a nose tackle now. And you were against a G that high? Haha.

Wasn't a reach at all. Was exactly the range he was pegged to go. He was drafted for upside for sure. I don't know what he is right now because he hasn't played enough to know the ceiling.

Thought you were done with this topic?

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Like reaching for an injured 3T who doesn't pass rush? Agreed. He's a nose tackle now. And you were against a G that high? Haha.

Wasn't a reach at all. Was exactly the range he was pegged to go. He was drafted for upside for sure. I don't know what he is right now because he hasn't played enough to know the ceiling.

Thought you were done with this topic?

He ain't a 3T. That's for sure. That's AA's job. There's only 1 other position inside. 1T (e.g. NT in a W9).

Deebo news roped me back to the WZ.