49ers Offensive Line

Originally posted by NCommand:
I guess this concept is still a difficult one to grasp...even now...when we're seeing the other side of that proof.

It wasn't a hard concept to grasp. If the goal was to win a Superbowl with a classic drop back immobile QB, you needed top flight PP. Period. Jimmy never had that and it cost us. He's like every other pocket QB with average ability to transcend breakdowns in PP. Brady, Garoppolo, Stafford, etc. all fold when they don't have it.

What concept? The one where Mahomes PP and RB absolutely sucked in the SB and and almost got him killed and he had to bail them out? Or that Stafford's OL was not great throughout the playoffs and almost got him killed while providing him zero run game in the NFCCG until he bailed them out? Or is it the concept of your exaggerated notion that somehow the TB, KC and LAR OL's pst SB's that were decimated with injuries and retirements are some how even remotely close to the OLs JG had? Or is it the concept that KC had to rebuild an elite OL to be…more elite? Lol this is what I'm talking about with you.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
This is all fiction. There is actual film showing jimmy having time and having options to throw to but didn't. That is not the OLs fault

the meaningful stats were percentages lol, if he was top 3 in meaningful stats he would have been a shoe in for the probowl or at least talked about in when talking about the top QBs in the year

Now back to the OL, with them playing well it only helped jimmy a smidge in all his stats but helped tremendously in turnovers

now, the last pick in the draft comes in and this offense looks like a real offense. No gimmicks like having to stay In shotgun. Instead we have more Check downs, screens, throws to the outside, throws to the inside, deep shots, off schedule plays, extends plays, beats blitzes with his legs, beats blitzes with his arm, by god signaling to a WR that he's changing the first option to that WR ! all while doing this calm sometimes a little too calm under pressure.

A QB who can do this and keep the offense in a good rhythm makes it easier for the OL and easier to score points. Which we are seeing.

our OL ranks have been climbing higher now that Brock is under center. Which proves QBs can transcend OLs

I hate to break the news to you but every QB in every game is going to miss plays or not see or take the bigger shots. Look at the 8 Brock missed last week. The 'facts' were despite that, we were still up 10 in the 4Q before the team collapsed in concert again...we've seen this theme before. Could it have been a bigger lead then? Sure. But then again, there might have been far more time back on the clock for Stafford too. Remember the Superbowl?

You ARE aware Jimmy played in this offense this year right? And they have similar numbers? This isn't even close to the same roster as last year. LOL

I have no issues with your singular focus on Jimmy but at least keep it within context.

in no way did you help your case in anyway with this response.. you know that right ? but you like to digress and spin so i will play along

which game are you talking about being up in the 4th? what does stafford have to do with this ?

aware of jimmy playing ? did you not read what has been better since Brock is now playing ? in no way the two QBs and the games are the same.. are you aware of that ?

it actually is an issue for you about jimmy, that is the problem. this is not singularity, it's a measuring stick. like the times you and others used Beathard/Mullens and even a Lance.. as a litmus test for jimmy

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:
What concept? The one where Mahomes PP and RB absolutely sucked in the SB and and almost got him killed and he had to bail them out? Or that Stafford's OL was not great throughout the playoffs and almost got him killed while providing him zero run game in the NFCCG until he bailed them out? Or is it the concept of your exaggerated notion that somehow the TB and LAR OL's pst SB's that were decimated with injuries and retirements are some how even remotely close to the OLs JG had? Or is it the concept that KC had to rebuild an elite OL to be…more elite? Lol this is what I'm talking about with you.

And that's the issue. He is straw manning what we say as if we believe OL doesn't matter. It absolutely does.

But as PFF showed once you get to a level of competence from the OL there isn't a big deviation in performance. Then it's really left up to the QB and the rest of the skill guys. That's what happening right now. Brock is making the OL EVEN BETTER.

To suggest the 9ers O line at any point with JG was at the level of the Chiefs in the SB or the Rams this year is so amazingly disingenuous.

Maybe if the 9er are up 24 instead of 10 it's harder for the Rams and Chiefs to come back? Crazy thoughts. Instead bury the defense because they couldn't stop elite offenses for 60 minutes.

Originally posted by NCommand:
I hate to break the news to you but every QB in every game is going to miss plays or not see or take the bigger shots. Look at the 8 Brock missed last week. The 'facts' were despite that, we were still up 10 in the 4Q before the team collapsed in concert again...we've seen this theme before. Could it have been a bigger lead then? Sure. But then again, there might have been far more time back on the clock for Stafford too. Remember the Superbowl?

You ARE aware Jimmy played in this offense this year right? And they have similar numbers? This isn't even close to the same roster as last year. LOL

I have no issues with your singular focus on Jimmy but at least keep it within context.

The fact that you think giving up a pressure is somehow worse than missing a wide open receiver speaks volumes.

Every OL gives up pressures in every game. Guess it's ok.

The main difference between all of us in this thread is the majority of us hold our QB to a higher standard then the OL. Doesn't mean we are okay with the OL struggling but there is contenxt and nuance.

You hold the OL to a ridiculous high standard while giving Jimmy a pass on everything.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
Maybe if the 9er are up 24 instead of 10 it's harder for the Rams and Chiefs to come back? Crazy thoughts. Instead bury the defense because they couldn't stop elite offenses for 60 minutes.

That was my point all off season. If Jimmy made the plays that were there to be made, the game wouldn't have come down to the last two drives when the rams pass rush was pinning their ears back on every play.

Originally posted by YACBros85:
That was my point all off season. If Jimmy made the plays that were there to be made, the game wouldn't have come down to the last two drives when the rams pass rush was pinning their ears back on every play.

Being that he didn't make the plays that were there earlier in the game why would one believe that later in the game with great protection it'd be any different?

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
Maybe if the 9er are up 24 instead of 10 it's harder for the Rams and Chiefs to come back? Crazy thoughts. Instead bury the defense because they couldn't stop elite offenses for 60 minutes.

That was my point all off season. If Jimmy made the plays that were there to be made, the game wouldn't have come down to the last two drives when the rams pass rush was pinning their ears back on every play.

missing plays made it more predictable, x's harder and even less of a margin to be perfect

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:
What concept? The one where Mahomes PP and RB absolutely sucked in the SB and and almost got him killed and he had to bail them out? Or that Stafford's OL was not great throughout the playoffs and almost got him killed while providing him zero run game in the NFCCG until he bailed them out? Or is it the concept of your exaggerated notion that somehow the TB and LAR OL's pst SB's that were decimated with injuries and retirements are some how even remotely close to the OLs JG had? Or is it the concept that KC had to rebuild an elite OL to be…more elite? Lol this is what I'm talking about with you.

And that's the issue. He is straw manning what we say as if we believe OL doesn't matter. It absolutely does.

But as PFF showed once you get to a level of competence from the OL there isn't a big deviation in performance. Then it's really left up to the QB and the rest of the skill guys. That's what happening right now. Brock is making the OL EVEN BETTER.

To suggest the 9ers O line at any point with JG was at the level of the Chiefs in the SB or the Rams this year is so amazingly disingenuous.

It's disingenuous and done intentionally . Gets old

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:
What concept? The one where Mahomes PP and RB absolutely sucked in the SB and and almost got him killed and he had to bail them out? Or that Stafford's OL was not great throughout the playoffs and almost got him killed while providing him zero run game in the NFCCG until he bailed them out? Or is it the concept of your exaggerated notion that somehow the TB and LAR OL's pst SB's that were decimated with injuries and retirements are some how even remotely close to the OLs JG had? Or is it the concept that KC had to rebuild an elite OL to be…more elite? Lol this is what I'm talking about with you.

And that's the issue. He is straw manning what we say as if we believe OL doesn't matter. It absolutely does.

But as PFF showed once you get to a level of competence from the OL there isn't a big deviation in performance. Then it's really left up to the QB and the rest of the skill guys. That's what happening right now. Brock is making the OL EVEN BETTER.

To suggest the 9ers O line at any point with JG was at the level of the Chiefs in the SB or the Rams this year is so amazingly disingenuous.

You guys are still making Stafford-excuses? Jimmy's pressure rate through the playoffs was what, 54%? Yet the second ANY other QB gets to that level, whether Mahomes or Brady or your favorite player, Stafford, they fold.

The point is, I wouldn't expect high end big time plays under those circumstances. In fact, that pressure usually forces QB's to start looking down at pressure and getting happy feet and making poor decisions with tunnel vision and pressing.

Like I said a million times, for a classic pocket passer like Jimmy to win a Superbowl, you need elite PP. It was obvious we never came close to that level.

Now? I not only think they've got potential for that, but adding CMC (can't be understated security for a QB/Kyle) and health and Brock who adds Jimmy production with more mobility and a high-low mentality, we just might meet the Superbowl winning formula: elite QB and PP play through the playoffs.

Lol case in point

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:
It's disingenuous and done intentionally . Gets old

So is your inability to grasp a simple concept.

Still spinning.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:
What concept? The one where Mahomes PP and RB absolutely sucked in the SB and and almost got him killed and he had to bail them out? Or that Stafford's OL was not great throughout the playoffs and almost got him killed while providing him zero run game in the NFCCG until he bailed them out? Or is it the concept of your exaggerated notion that somehow the TB and LAR OL's pst SB's that were decimated with injuries and retirements are some how even remotely close to the OLs JG had? Or is it the concept that KC had to rebuild an elite OL to be…more elite? Lol this is what I'm talking about with you.

And that's the issue. He is straw manning what we say as if we believe OL doesn't matter. It absolutely does.

But as PFF showed once you get to a level of competence from the OL there isn't a big deviation in performance. Then it's really left up to the QB and the rest of the skill guys. That's what happening right now. Brock is making the OL EVEN BETTER.

To suggest the 9ers O line at any point with JG was at the level of the Chiefs in the SB or the Rams this year is so amazingly disingenuous.

You guys are still making Stafford-excuses? Jimmy's pressure rate through the playoffs was what, 54%? Yet the second ANY other QB gets to that level, whether Mahomes or Brady or your favorite player, Stafford, they fold.

The point is, I wouldn't expect high end big time plays under those circumstances. In fact, that pressure usually forces QB's to start looking down at pressure and getting happy feet and making poor decisions with tunnel vision and pressing.

Like I said a million times, for a classic pocket passer like Jimmy to win a Superbowl, you need elite PP. It was obvious we never came close to that level.

Now? I not only think they've got potential for that, but adding CMC (can't be understated security for a QB/Kyle) and health and Brock who adds Jimmy production with more mobility and a high-low mentality, we just might meet the Superbowl winning formula: elite QB and PP play through the playoffs.

It wasn't even close to 54%. LOL

Originally posted by NCommand:
You guys are still making Stafford-excuses? Jimmy's pressure rate through the playoffs was what, 54%? Yet the second ANY other QB gets to that level, whether Mahomes or Brady or your favorite player, Stafford, they fold.

The point is, I wouldn't expect high end big time plays under those circumstances. In fact, that pressure usually forces QB's to start looking down at pressure and getting happy feet and making poor decisions with tunnel vision and pressing.

Like I said a million times, for a classic pocket passer like Jimmy to win a Superbowl, you need elite PP. It was obvious we never came close to that level.

Now? I not only think they've got potential for that, but adding CMC (can't be understated security for a QB/Kyle) and health and Brock who adds Jimmy production with more mobility and a high-low mentality, we just might meet the Superbowl winning formula: elite QB and PP play through the playoffs.

Again, there is no comparison between the 9ers, Rams and Chiefs. IT WASNT THE SAME.

Originally posted by YACBros85:
It wasn't even close to 54%. LOL

Not only that, you showed him how the TTT numbers were super high. Was Pat getting over 3 seconds to throw in the SB? Was Matt this year? I have serious doubts.