49ers Offensive Line

Originally posted by Waterbear:
Posted this in the FA thread.

Curtis Mcclendon was cut by the Raiders, he's 10x better than Nick Zakelj, as he was the highest graded rookie OL in the preseason.

Niners should have signed him. But once again, we can't scout OL.

That's interesting. I'm not too familiar with him. That has been one of my concerns...just stack talent and keep stacking talent (using all avenues) and let the chips fall where they may. This would be one of those avenues.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Hysterikal:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Hysterikal:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Chance:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Sure, when you have an insane defense like that and the Legion of Sherman, it can happen too.

So you can have a tier one defensive backfield, or a tier one defensive front and not need a tier one offensive line to win it all? Just want to make sure because these are two recent examples that seem to counter your argument.

Sure. But we just saw 2 top, ever historic, defenses lose recently too. It's much more of a passing league now then the Ravens and Seahawks-days. And neither were sustainable. So yes, there are numerous ways a team could build a Superbowl winner. But the most recent years are showing a common trend that shouldn't be ignored.

Buccs defense won the Super Bowl Vs the Chiefs not Tom Brady.

True. But he also had the #1 OL and wasn't touched that game either. Some odd guy by the name of Tristan Wirfs had the highest grade that day.

Hmmm weird how the Chiefs out gained the #1 O line in yards. Defenses > Oline

Because they got blown out. But yeah, Bucs were my pick that year. I had seen them live the year before when we played them and they were stacked in talent. Their QB was a turnover machine. Adding Tom to that roster wasn't fair. The first move they made was move up for Tristan Wirfs. They got it. Smart.

I think you can get away with drafting mid-tier and late round and UDFA's if you have a good OLine Coach and Scheme. But it does catch up to you eventually. Specially if your scouting department can't find the talent and your coaching staff can't develop the talent. Seattle SeaHawks are a good example. One reason Kyle traded up 3 first round picks is because all these other teams (rams, Seahawks, and to a certain extent Cardinals) were basically missing on those first round picks and so they started trading those first round picks for free agents to get some decent talent. It also helped that they had a TON of cap space because of being perennial bottom feeding teams.

49ers aren't bottom feeders and the cap space is going to be a premium because of Bosa. It's critical the 49ers draft well, because the cap and the bottom feeding teams will raid the 49er depth. Up and comming is Trent and his age, and I do hope the 49ers recognize the fact that they can't skimp on that left tackle spot. It would be great if ShanaLynch can find a gem like Purdy in the late rounds for the offensive line, but those are once in a generation lotto picks. Most likely either they use a first or second round pick on a OLIneman next year -- or draft at least 5 OLinemen late next year and hope one can stick at the left tackle position. (the Pareto Principle)

3-prong approach, baby!

Originally posted by NCommand:
Why do you always pivot to weird absolutes? Literally nobody is saying OL > QB. We're talking best odds. Highest probability. And that is tier 1 QB + OL play through the playoffs.

Nobody is saying a HOF QB can't mask a lot but the single QB you keep pivoting to as your one example is the SAME one that losses when he doesn't have a tier 1 OL. Which only cements my point.

Even Andy Reid "got it."

Why can't you?

I've never seen such a small weird crowd of fans who DON'T want a tier 1 OL for Jimmy, Trey, Brock, Kyle, etc. Ya'll must have a groomsmen disorder. Haha

We have weird absolutes? The irony meter has completely exploded.

I'm using your absolutes against your own logic and argument.

I have never said you have to have a tier anything to win a SB.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Why do you always pivot to weird absolutes? Literally nobody is saying OL > QB. We're talking best odds. Highest probability. And that is tier 1 QB + OL play through the playoffs.

Nobody is saying a HOF QB can't mask a lot but the single QB you keep pivoting to as your one example is the SAME one that losses when he doesn't have a tier 1 OL. Which only cements my point.

Even Andy Reid "got it."

Why can't you?

I've never seen such a small weird crowd of fans who DON'T want a tier 1 OL for Jimmy, Trey, Brock, Kyle, etc. Ya'll must have a groomsmen disorder. Haha

We have weird absolutes? The irony meter has completely exploded.

I'm using your absolutes against your own logic and argument.

I have never said you have to have a tier anything to win a SB.

So you are debating each other because you agree with each other?

And again Patrick Mahomes loses when his OL is AWFUL. NOT TIER 2. NOT TIER 3. AWFUL

But because you can't see the difference between a "tier 2" OL and what Patrick had in the SB vs the Bucs or Stafford had week 1 vs Buffalo you make large sweeping generalizations about what's required.

I don't care what Brandon Thorn thought at end of season. KCs line in playoffs was not elite in any way shape or form. Everyone sees this but you.

Originally posted by Cisco0623:
So you are debating each other because you agree with each other?

Hea debating a strawman he creates for everyone else. Im debating his twisted logic of absolutes.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Waterbear:
Posted this in the FA thread.

Curtis Mcclendon was cut by the Raiders, he's 10x better than Nick Zakelj, as he was the highest graded rookie OL in the preseason.

Niners should have signed him. But once again, we can't scout OL.

That's interesting. I'm not too familiar with him. That has been one of my concerns...just stack talent and keep stacking talent (using all avenues) and let the chips fall where they may. This would be one of those avenues.

He's 6-6 and reminds me of Trey Smith a little bit.

I don't understand keeping Zakelj because I don't believe he's worth developing.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Why do you always pivot to weird absolutes? Literally nobody is saying OL > QB. We're talking best odds. Highest probability. And that is tier 1 QB + OL play through the playoffs.

Nobody is saying a HOF QB can't mask a lot but the single QB you keep pivoting to as your one example is the SAME one that losses when he doesn't have a tier 1 OL. Which only cements my point.

Even Andy Reid "got it."

Why can't you?

I've never seen such a small weird crowd of fans who DON'T want a tier 1 OL for Jimmy, Trey, Brock, Kyle, etc. Ya'll must have a groomsmen disorder. Haha

We have weird absolutes? The irony meter has completely exploded.

I'm using your absolutes against your own logic and argument.

I have never said you have to have a tier anything to win a SB.

Yes, because you keep twisting it and making weird statements that I'm not saying.

Seeing a very clear and proven pattern over many many years and pointing that out annually IS logic esp. when it's proven right after using that pattern to predict it.

What isn't logic is making myopic claims about QB's transcending non-tier 1 OL's and everything else to win Superbowls. That hasn't happened.

Now, if you want to say a better formula then a tier 1 QB + OL is a tier 1 QB + tier 1 secondary, I could get behind that...if there was actual evidence of that.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
And again Patrick Mahomes loses when his OL is AWFUL. NOT TIER 2. NOT TIER 3. AWFUL

But because you can't see the difference between a "tier 2" OL and what Patrick had in the SB vs the Bucs or Stafford had week 1 vs Buffalo you make large sweeping generalizations about what's required.

I don't care what Brandon Thorn thought at end of season. KCs line in playoffs was not elite in any way shape or form. Everyone sees this but you.

You are one of about five people in the world who didn't think the Chiefs didn't have a tier 1 OL.

Are you going to tell me the Eagles didn't have a tier 1 OL either? And didn't play up to that through the playoffs?

Let's see your objective argument.

Originally posted by Waterbear:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Waterbear:
Posted this in the FA thread.

Curtis Mcclendon was cut by the Raiders, he's 10x better than Nick Zakelj, as he was the highest graded rookie OL in the preseason.

Niners should have signed him. But once again, we can't scout OL.

That's interesting. I'm not too familiar with him. That has been one of my concerns...just stack talent and keep stacking talent (using all avenues) and let the chips fall where they may. This would be one of those avenues.

He's 6-6 and reminds me of Trey Smith a little bit.

I don't understand keeping Zakelj because I don't believe he's worth developing.

Seems like a fair take. 17+ games. We're going to need that depth at some point, sadly.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
And again Patrick Mahomes loses when his OL is AWFUL. NOT TIER 2. NOT TIER 3. AWFUL

But because you can't see the difference between a "tier 2" OL and what Patrick had in the SB vs the Bucs or Stafford had week 1 vs Buffalo you make large sweeping generalizations about what's required.

I don't care what Brandon Thorn thought at end of season. KCs line in playoffs was not elite in any way shape or form. Everyone sees this but you.

You are one of about five people in the world who didn't think the Chiefs didn't have a tier 1 OL.

Are you going to tell me the Eagles didn't have a tier 1 OL either? And didn't play up to that through the playoffs?

Let's see your objective argument.

Haha. Tiered is way out of that one with ease.

Lol

IMO - Still our biggest concern.

Originally posted by NCommand:
You are one of about five people in the world who didn't think the Chiefs didn't have a tier 1 OL.

Are you going to tell me the Eagles didn't have a tier 1 OL either? And didn't play up to that through the playoffs?

Let's see your objective argument.

THEY DIDNT PLAY LIKE A TIER ONE OL

I don't care where they were ranked. People pointed out the 9ers were top 5 and you hemmed and hawwed about let's see how they do in playoffs. Yet Chiefs still get to be revered even when they don't play well.

Asking for an objective argument from me is rich when the entire basis of what you are saying is based on what one guy writes who you don't even actually read in its entirety.

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:
Lol

Its really my own fault. I should know better by now.