49ers Offensive Line

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by random49er:

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
How do you know it wasn't the replacement tackle that gave up that 30.4% pressure rate?

It may have been, which makes me wonder why their backup is better than the Niners starter. Keep in mind, they faced Bosa/Mack.

That's kinda a quick conclusion to jump to,...no?

If you want it to be, sure. Come to any conclusion you want, but you're not gonna get an argument outa me. Sorry.

So you did claim their backup is better than our starter. Also, how can you come to these conclusions if you didn't watch the game or even look at any stats?

I came to that conclusion by reading recaps like this.

LT Kendall Lamm 67 snaps, 100 percent - Lamm was excellent in relief of Pro Bowler Terron Armstead, as the Dolphins did not allow a single sack to the Chargers defense. It will be interesting to see if this gives the Dolphins a bit more patience in weighing when Armstead (three injuries) can return.

And watching a game with 3 of these.

TJ Watt is ON FIRE - 3 sacks today 🔥 pic.twitter.com/YsC4juJXsH

— NFL UK (@NFLUK) September 10, 2023

3 sacks surrendered > 0 sacks surrendered.

Additionally,
Kendall Lamm PFF grade - 68.1 67 snaps
Colton McKivitz PFF grade - 45.0 68 snaps

In the end, however, this is a message board for fans to post their OPINIONS. So why exactly are you so concerned with how I reached my opinion?

Once the O lineman gives up the pressure, it is out of the O lineman's hands if the play ends in a sack or not. So a pressure and sack are equal when it comes to O line efficiency. Both of MIA's tackles gave up 4+ pressures yesterday.

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Once the O lineman gives up the pressure, it is out of the O lineman's hands if the play ends in a sack or not. So a pressure and sack are equal when it comes to O line efficiency. Both of MIA's tackles gave up 4+ pressures yesterday.

Sacks impact the game more than pressures. Again, this is my OPINION. Arguing with a person on how or why they reach an opinion is childish and part of what's been bringing this site down. Focus on the team, not fans posting in a forum. I'm done with this.

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by NCommand:
PFF is always odd esp. for OL grades but here you go:

• Spencer Burford, RG, 28.6, 68 snaps
• Colton McKivitz, RT, 45.0, 68 snaps

I'm with you, NC. I remember during the 90's when Dallas was owning Young, Eddie went out and got players SPECIFICALLY to beat Dallas. Bryant Young to stop Emmitt Smith and Deion to stop Irvin. I guarantee you after beating Dallas the last 2 years, Jerry Jones is building that team specifically to beat the Niners, and what is the one weakness the team has? The right side of the O line. Kyle and Lynch better recognize that at some point, or they will lose to the most hated team in the league.

God, don't remind me! It still makes me cringe. Haha.

In all fairness though, PFF also had Warner as the lowest graded defender yesterday, so how they come up with numbers is a bit head scratching to me.

GTFO are you serious? That was one of his best games. Dude was flying around like a mad man.

• Fred Warner, LB, 58.9, 63 snaps
• George Odum, FS, 60.3, 2 snaps
• Austin Bryant, DE, 61.7, 16 snaps

That hit he put on Harris in the 1st quarter set the tone for the rest of the game. Like I said, no idea how they get their #s.

I read that too sounds like a crock of crap. Warner had an amazing game. He almost had a pick and caused another. Whatever there Rating system is, either need different variables or add some other relation to their matrix.

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Once the O lineman gives up the pressure, it is out of the O lineman's hands if the play ends in a sack or not. So a pressure and sack are equal when it comes to O line efficiency. Both of MIA's tackles gave up 4+ pressures yesterday.

Sacks impact the game more than pressures.

I'm not disputing that. But after the o lineman gives up the pressure, the end result of the play is out of his hands. 3 things happen when a pressure is given up. The QB either escapes the pressure and avoids the sack, the QB gets rid of the ball or the pass rusher makes the sack. Pressure speeds up the QB's decision making which can lead to TO's. Remember when Bosa walked the raiders left tackle back into Stidham and forced an INT? The QB can also avoid the pressure and make a positive play. But we are talking about strictly o line play and that should be separated from other position groups who can change the outcome of the play post pressure.

Originally posted by YACBros85:
There was a play where it looked like the steelers ran a stunt with Watt going inside. McKivitz followed him inside to block him. Leaving Burford to try and get around them and blocking the guy looping outside. Miscommunication could have definitely played a role in that side having issues. Along with Mckivitz getting walked back into Purdy's lap on a few snaps. It wasn't all bad though. We need to give it a few more weeks before we start to panick.

Agree 💯%, and for both Purdy and McKivitz, having Bosa there should speed up Brock's clock and also help with McKivitz getting better in practice having to go head to head with Bosa on a daily basis. If Bosa was there at the beginning of training camp going against McKivitz, I think quite possibly, he'd perform better than he did last Sunday.

I think at least two or three games (as you said) before throwing in any towel on McKivitz. Personally, I don't think McKivitz was physically dominated by TJ Watt. Yes TJ beat McKivitz to the edge for three sacks, but I think McKivitz need to just have better technique, vs having to get stronger or quicker. McGlinchjy on the other hand, I've seen being bench pressed into the air by a DE. That's being physically dominated by another player.

Originally posted by bassmanr:

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by NCommand:
PFF is always odd esp. for OL grades but here you go:

• Spencer Burford, RG, 28.6, 68 snaps
• Colton McKivitz, RT, 45.0, 68 snaps

I'm with you, NC. I remember during the 90's when Dallas was owning Young, Eddie went out and got players SPECIFICALLY to beat Dallas. Bryant Young to stop Emmitt Smith and Deion to stop Irvin. I guarantee you after beating Dallas the last 2 years, Jerry Jones is building that team specifically to beat the Niners, and what is the one weakness the team has? The right side of the O line. Kyle and Lynch better recognize that at some point, or they will lose to the most hated team in the league.

God, don't remind me! It still makes me cringe. Haha.

In all fairness though, PFF also had Warner as the lowest graded defender yesterday, so how they come up with numbers is a bit head scratching to me.

GTFO are you serious? That was one of his best games. Dude was flying around like a mad man.

• Fred Warner, LB, 58.9, 63 snaps
• George Odum, FS, 60.3, 2 snaps
• Austin Bryant, DE, 61.7, 16 snaps

That hit he put on Harris in the 1st quarter set the tone for the rest of the game. Like I said, no idea how they get their #s.

I read that too sounds like a crock of crap. Warner had an amazing game. He almost had a pick and caused another. Whatever there Rating system is, either need different variables or add some other relation to their matrix.

I forgot about the near int. Does PFF state what goes into their grading, or is it like KFC's secret herbs and spices?

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Once the O lineman gives up the pressure, it is out of the O lineman's hands if the play ends in a sack or not. So a pressure and sack are equal when it comes to O line efficiency. Both of MIA's tackles gave up 4+ pressures yesterday.

Sacks impact the game more than pressures. Again, this is my OPINION. Arguing with a person on how or why they reach an opinion is childish and part of what's been bringing this site down. Focus on the team, not fans posting in a forum. I'm done with this.

Some guy named Bill Belichick would disagree with you but that's just his OPINION.

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by bassmanr:

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by NCommand:
PFF is always odd esp. for OL grades but here you go:

• Spencer Burford, RG, 28.6, 68 snaps
• Colton McKivitz, RT, 45.0, 68 snaps

I'm with you, NC. I remember during the 90's when Dallas was owning Young, Eddie went out and got players SPECIFICALLY to beat Dallas. Bryant Young to stop Emmitt Smith and Deion to stop Irvin. I guarantee you after beating Dallas the last 2 years, Jerry Jones is building that team specifically to beat the Niners, and what is the one weakness the team has? The right side of the O line. Kyle and Lynch better recognize that at some point, or they will lose to the most hated team in the league.

God, don't remind me! It still makes me cringe. Haha.

In all fairness though, PFF also had Warner as the lowest graded defender yesterday, so how they come up with numbers is a bit head scratching to me.

GTFO are you serious? That was one of his best games. Dude was flying around like a mad man.

• Fred Warner, LB, 58.9, 63 snaps
• George Odum, FS, 60.3, 2 snaps
• Austin Bryant, DE, 61.7, 16 snaps

That hit he put on Harris in the 1st quarter set the tone for the rest of the game. Like I said, no idea how they get their #s.

I read that too sounds like a crock of crap. Warner had an amazing game. He almost had a pick and caused another. Whatever there Rating system is, either need different variables or add some other relation to their matrix.

I forgot about the near int. Does PFF state what goes into their grading, or is it like KFC's secret herbs and spices?

Top secret aka BS...just look at my post from last page. Their own numbers don't add up correctly. It's like they pick them out of a hat.

I trust their "stats" a lot more than their actual grades. Especially on the OL. Hated their OL grades ever since the days when they put up a factoid how Alex Boone had gone x straight games of not allowing a single sack or pressure. And yet the game prior he literally blocked air as the defender came in to level Kap but because he never actually engaged the defender to block him they didn't ding him. I understand some logic there since they can't 100% predict that was his guy but it's not a great look either way imo when you're blocking air and the guy coming from your gap is murdering your QB.

How did Burford do? All I can recall is the false start (on a freaking end of quarter hard count).

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Once the O lineman gives up the pressure, it is out of the O lineman's hands if the play ends in a sack or not. So a pressure and sack are equal when it comes to O line efficiency. Both of MIA's tackles gave up 4+ pressures yesterday.

Sacks impact the game more than pressures.

I'm not disputing that. But after the o lineman gives up the pressure, the end result of the play is out of his hands. 3 things happen when a pressure is given up. The QB either escapes the pressure and avoids the sack, the QB gets rid of the ball or the pass rusher makes the sack. Pressure speeds up the QB's decision making which can lead to TO's. Remember when Bosa walked the raiders left tackle back into Stidham and forced an INT? The QB can also avoid the pressure and make a positive play. But we are talking about strictly o line play and that should be separated from other position groups who can change the outcome of the play post pressure.

They're not equal, because even if you are given the concessions you are asking for, a sack is on average a more extreme version of a pressure.

All sacks are not the same and all pressures are not the same,... So the logic you are trying to will into existence is trying to force a square peg into a round hole.

Originally posted by random49er:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by SLCNiner:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Once the O lineman gives up the pressure, it is out of the O lineman's hands if the play ends in a sack or not. So a pressure and sack are equal when it comes to O line efficiency. Both of MIA's tackles gave up 4+ pressures yesterday.

Sacks impact the game more than pressures.

I'm not disputing that. But after the o lineman gives up the pressure, the end result of the play is out of his hands. 3 things happen when a pressure is given up. The QB either escapes the pressure and avoids the sack, the QB gets rid of the ball or the pass rusher makes the sack. Pressure speeds up the QB's decision making which can lead to TO's. Remember when Bosa walked the raiders left tackle back into Stidham and forced an INT? The QB can also avoid the pressure and make a positive play. But we are talking about strictly o line play and that should be separated from other position groups who can change the outcome of the play post pressure.

They're not equal, because even if you are given the concessions you are asking for, a sack is on average a more extreme version of a pressure.

All sacks are not the same and all pressures are not the same,... So the logic you are trying to will into existence is trying to force a square peg into a round hole.

No its not. It is simply separating o line play from the rest of the offense. If you cannot focus simply on the o line without adding in caveats of what the QB did or did not do on the play and instead use them to make your point about whether the O lineman had a poor rep or not than wtf are we doing here? Just because a QB escaped the pressure by moving out of the pocket or getting rid of the ball just before being hit doesn't exempt the O lineman from being responsible for giving up the pressure in the first place. Regardless of whether the play ended in a sack or not.

Originally posted by A-R-S:
How did Burford do? All I can recall is the false start (on a freaking end of quarter hard count).

I saw from the highlight clips, Burford and McKivitz are having coordination problems. BlitzBurg was - well - blitzing and stunting a lot. Two of the TJ Watt sacks, I think, McKivitz was confused on what angle to take on TJ watts pass rush, hesitated a split second and Purdy got hit. I think Burford could have helped McKivitz on one of those sacks, but was distracted by a fake blitz.

That last TJ Watt sack, I dont know why Kyle is calling (what looked like) a 7 step drop play in the late 3rd/early 4th qtr, up by over 20 points at that time. Unless Purdy just took too long, and his internal clock wasn't adjusted by Bosa at practice yet. That might be on Purdy for taking too long in the pocket.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by A-R-S:
How did Burford do? All I can recall is the false start (on a freaking end of quarter hard count).

I saw from the highlight clips, Burford and McKivitz are having coordination problems. BlitzBurg was - well - blitzing and stunting a lot. Two of the TJ Watt sacks, I think, McKivitz was confused on what angle to take on TJ watts pass rush, hesitated a split second and Purdy got hit. I think Burford could have helped McKivitz on one of those sacks, but was distracted by a fake blitz.

That last TJ Watt sack, I dont know why Kyle is calling (what looked like) a 7 step drop play in the late 3rd/early 4th qtr, up by over 20 points at that time. Unless Purdy just took too long, and his internal clock wasn't adjusted by Bosa at practice yet. That might be on Purdy for taking too long in the pocket.

Good stuff Giedi.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by A-R-S:
How did Burford do? All I can recall is the false start (on a freaking end of quarter hard count).

I saw from the highlight clips, Burford and McKivitz are having coordination problems. BlitzBurg was - well - blitzing and stunting a lot. Two of the TJ Watt sacks, I think, McKivitz was confused on what angle to take on TJ watts pass rush, hesitated a split second and Purdy got hit. I think Burford could have helped McKivitz on one of those sacks, but was distracted by a fake blitz.

That last TJ Watt sack, I dont know why Kyle is calling (what looked like) a 7 step drop play in the late 3rd/early 4th qtr, up by over 20 points at that time. Unless Purdy just took too long, and his internal clock wasn't adjusted by Bosa at practice yet. That might be on Purdy for taking too long in the pocket.

Good stuff Giedi.

Nice thing about the TV, it does highlight the O and D Line play. Wish we could rotate the camera and look at all the details of the OLIne (handfighting, footwork, overall protection scheme) The equipment manager is going to be super important in this next game as this is the first of (I think) of four or five of our astroturf games this season.

I hate that surface! Last night, I think it took out Aaron Rodgers.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by A-R-S:
How did Burford do? All I can recall is the false start (on a freaking end of quarter hard count).

I saw from the highlight clips, Burford and McKivitz are having coordination problems. BlitzBurg was - well - blitzing and stunting a lot. Two of the TJ Watt sacks, I think, McKivitz was confused on what angle to take on TJ watts pass rush, hesitated a split second and Purdy got hit. I think Burford could have helped McKivitz on one of those sacks, but was distracted by a fake blitz.

That last TJ Watt sack, I dont know why Kyle is calling (what looked like) a 7 step drop play in the late 3rd/early 4th qtr, up by over 20 points at that time. Unless Purdy just took too long, and his internal clock wasn't adjusted by Bosa at practice yet. That might be on Purdy for taking too long in the pocket.

Good stuff Giedi.

Nice thing about the TV, it does highlight the O and D Line play. Wish we could rotate the camera and look at all the details of the OLIne (handfighting, footwork, overall protection scheme) The equipment manager is going to be super important in this next game as this is the first of (I think) of four or five of our astroturf games this season.

I hate that surface! Last night, I think it took out Aaron Rodgers.

The ALL-22 is great for that.

Absolutely.