49ers Offensive Line

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Not nearly as much as you'd like to think and we've got a gazillion L's to prove it. Just like we have a number of top OL's who can't help a crappy QB either. Both can only do so much.

The degree is not as big as you'd like to believe; not even for your favorite outlier player in Patrick Mahomes.

As to importance? Sure. QB is the most important player in any team sport even if he hands if off for 180 yards a game.

It's exactly as much as I and others think.

You are the one with the disconnect about you can't win a title without a tier one OL. Has anyone else said you CANT win a title without a tier one QB? Nope because you absolutely can.

We differ in the degree only.

Unless you pivot to every tier 1 QB losing because they had a tier 7 OL, evidence lacks your side esp. in the recent era.

Can a tier 1 QB win a Superbowl with a tier 2 or worse OL? Sure. But let me know when that ACTUALLY happens. Until then, I'll go with the evidence: you need both.

can a OL be tier 1 with a losing season ?

Oh God yes!

doubt it. all rankings are based on the team winning.

Nah. In facts the Browns, Ravens and Cowboys all has tier 1 OL's for a long time. It's only a portion of the winning formula.

So tiers never change throughout the season ?

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Is a tier 1 a top 5, top 3 or #1?

Depends on the day

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Not nearly as much as you'd like to think and we've got a gazillion L's to prove it. Just like we have a number of top OL's who can't help a crappy QB either. Both can only do so much.

The degree is not as big as you'd like to believe; not even for your favorite outlier player in Patrick Mahomes.

As to importance? Sure. QB is the most important player in any team sport even if he hands if off for 180 yards a game.

It's exactly as much as I and others think.

You are the one with the disconnect about you can't win a title without a tier one OL. Has anyone else said you CANT win a title without a tier one QB? Nope because you absolutely can.

We differ in the degree only.

Unless you pivot to every tier 1 QB losing because they had a tier 7 OL, evidence lacks your side esp. in the recent era.

Can a tier 1 QB win a Superbowl with a tier 2 or worse OL? Sure. But let me know when that ACTUALLY happens. Until then, I'll go with the evidence: you need both.

can a OL be tier 1 with a losing season ?

Oh God yes!

doubt it. all rankings are based on the team winning.

Nah. In facts the Browns, Ravens and Cowboys all has tier 1 OL's for a long time. It's only a portion of the winning formula.

So tiers never change throughout the season ?

They do! They evaluate both OL and DL going into the season. Then retier at the mid point and again going into the playoffs.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Not nearly as much as you'd like to think and we've got a gazillion L's to prove it. Just like we have a number of top OL's who can't help a crappy QB either. Both can only do so much.

The degree is not as big as you'd like to believe; not even for your favorite outlier player in Patrick Mahomes.

As to importance? Sure. QB is the most important player in any team sport even if he hands if off for 180 yards a game.

It's exactly as much as I and others think.

You are the one with the disconnect about you can't win a title without a tier one OL. Has anyone else said you CANT win a title without a tier one QB? Nope because you absolutely can.

We differ in the degree only.

Unless you pivot to every tier 1 QB losing because they had a tier 7 OL, evidence lacks your side esp. in the recent era.

Can a tier 1 QB win a Superbowl with a tier 2 or worse OL? Sure. But let me know when that ACTUALLY happens. Until then, I'll go with the evidence: you need both.

can a OL be tier 1 with a losing season ?

Oh God yes!

doubt it. all rankings are based on the team winning.

Nah. In facts the Browns, Ravens and Cowboys all has tier 1 OL's for a long time. It's only a portion of the winning formula.

So tiers never change throughout the season ?

They do! They evaluate both OL and DL going into the season. Then retier at the mid point and again going into the playoffs.

so there can't be a losing team with a tier 1 OL

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Is a tier 1 a top 5, top 3 or #1?

It depends. This year, there are only 2 teams in the tier 1 OL. Eagles and Lions.

There are 3 on the DL: Cowboys, 49ers and Steelers.

You are conflating the small sample of a few that you are. reading for free with what is actually in the whole article if you read the entire thing

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Is a tier 1 a top 5, top 3 or #1?

It depends. This year, there are only 2 teams in the tier 1 OL. Eagles and Lions.

There are 3 on the DL: Cowboys, 49ers and Steelers.

It doesn't depend because that leaves it up to your opinion vs everyone elses. Be decisive and give us a parameter in which we can set the standard.

By the way, PHI is currently ranked 25th in PBLK and 13th in RBLK.

That's not my standard. It's BT's. And it's been spot on annually. That's why I keep referencing it as a starting, mid and playoff point.

And some years they have 3 in tier 1...or just 1. So it's their standard.

Seems irelevant to our discussions in general if there is no clear cut definition for what makes a tier 1 o line. It gives too much room to move goal posts. There should be clear cut tiers or else it leaves things up to your opinion (BT's) vs everyone elses. But I know you by now. You'll never comit to anything on here which is why everyone gets so frustrated with you.

Going by your (BT's) standard, the only tier 1 o line last season was PHI and perhaps DET. DET didn't even make the playoffs and KC's tier 2-3 o line beat PHI in the SB.

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Is a tier 1 a top 5, top 3 or #1?

It depends. This year, there are only 2 teams in the tier 1 OL. Eagles and Lions.

There are 3 on the DL: Cowboys, 49ers and Steelers.

It doesn't depend because that leaves it up to your opinion vs everyone elses. Be decisive and give us a parameter in which we can set the standard.

By the way, PHI is currently ranked 25th in PBLK and 13th in RBLK.

That's not my standard. It's BT's. And it's been spot on annually. That's why I keep referencing it as a starting, mid and playoff point.

And some years they have 3 in tier 1...or just 1. So it's their standard.

Seems irelevant to our discussions in general if there is no clear cut definition for what makes a tier 1 o line. It gives too much room to move goal posts. There should be clear cut tiers or else it leaves things up to your opinion (BT's) vs everyone elses. But I know you by now. You'll never comit to anything on here which is why everyone gets so frustrated with you.

Going by your (BT's) standard, the only tier 1 o line last season was PHI and perhaps DET. DET didn't even make the playoffs and KC's tier 2-3 o line beat PHI in the SB.

Huh? OL's don't play each other. LOL

No, their only two teams in tier 1 from last year faced off in the Superbowl. One was going to win, one was going to lose. The fact that both their tier 1 OL's made the Superbowl is a pretty good indication they had accurate tiers.

This year it's Philly and now, Detroit. KC is no longer in tier 1. And Detroit OL > KC's OL this year to start as we just saw the other night.

So again, they were accurate. And have been for years.

You can look to PFF for your metrics. That's fine. I'll pivot to SME's on talent and ability as that's what typically shows up when it's needed most.

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Is a tier 1 a top 5, top 3 or #1?

It depends. This year, there are only 2 teams in the tier 1 OL. Eagles and Lions.

There are 3 on the DL: Cowboys, 49ers and Steelers.

You are conflating the small sample of a few that you are. reading for free with what is actually in the whole article if you read the entire thing

I'm not sure if this is English or not but I think you're saying I'm only focusing on the tier 1's. That's accurate as that is what I'd like to achieve here. We've done that with the defense numerous times. Tier 1's are the topic of the subject/goal/formula...and Superbowl wins.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Is a tier 1 a top 5, top 3 or #1?

It depends. This year, there are only 2 teams in the tier 1 OL. Eagles and Lions.

There are 3 on the DL: Cowboys, 49ers and Steelers.

It doesn't depend because that leaves it up to your opinion vs everyone elses. Be decisive and give us a parameter in which we can set the standard.

By the way, PHI is currently ranked 25th in PBLK and 13th in RBLK.

That's not my standard. It's BT's. And it's been spot on annually. That's why I keep referencing it as a starting, mid and playoff point.

And some years they have 3 in tier 1...or just 1. So it's their standard.

Seems irelevant to our discussions in general if there is no clear cut definition for what makes a tier 1 o line. It gives too much room to move goal posts. There should be clear cut tiers or else it leaves things up to your opinion (BT's) vs everyone elses. But I know you by now. You'll never comit to anything on here which is why everyone gets so frustrated with you.

Going by your (BT's) standard, the only tier 1 o line last season was PHI and perhaps DET. DET didn't even make the playoffs and KC's tier 2-3 o line beat PHI in the SB.

Huh? OL's don't play each other. LOL

No, their only two teams in tier 1 OL's from last year faced off in the Superbowl. One was going to win, one was going to lose. The fact that both their tier OL made the Superbowl is a pretty good indication they had accurate tiers.

This year it's Philly and now, Detroit. KC is no longer in tier 1. And Detroit OL > KC's OL as we just saw. So again, they were accurate. And have been for years.

You can look to PFF for your metrics. That's fine. I'll pivot to SME's on talent and ability and that's what typically shows up when it's needed most.

Really? The team with the premier tier 1 o line lossed the SB to a team with a tier 2-3 o line. Is that worded better for you?

KC didn't have a tier 1 o line last season either. Check their efficiency stats since we cannot agree on rankings. Patrick Mahomes was the 4th highest pressured QB in the playoffs, had the most scrambles (7) and their running game averaged 3.2 YPA.

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Is a tier 1 a top 5, top 3 or #1?

It depends. This year, there are only 2 teams in the tier 1 OL. Eagles and Lions.

There are 3 on the DL: Cowboys, 49ers and Steelers.

It doesn't depend because that leaves it up to your opinion vs everyone elses. Be decisive and give us a parameter in which we can set the standard.

By the way, PHI is currently ranked 25th in PBLK and 13th in RBLK.

That's not my standard. It's BT's. And it's been spot on annually. That's why I keep referencing it as a starting, mid and playoff point.

And some years they have 3 in tier 1...or just 1. So it's their standard.

Seems irelevant to our discussions in general if there is no clear cut definition for what makes a tier 1 o line. It gives too much room to move goal posts. There should be clear cut tiers or else it leaves things up to your opinion (BT's) vs everyone elses. But I know you by now. You'll never comit to anything on here which is why everyone gets so frustrated with you.

Going by your (BT's) standard, the only tier 1 o line last season was PHI and perhaps DET. DET didn't even make the playoffs and KC's tier 2-3 o line beat PHI in the SB.

Huh? OL's don't play each other. LOL

No, their only two teams in tier 1 OL's from last year faced off in the Superbowl. One was going to win, one was going to lose. The fact that both their tier OL made the Superbowl is a pretty good indication they had accurate tiers.

This year it's Philly and now, Detroit. KC is no longer in tier 1. And Detroit OL > KC's OL as we just saw. So again, they were accurate. And have been for years.

You can look to PFF for your metrics. That's fine. I'll pivot to SME's on talent and ability and that's what typically shows up when it's needed most.

Really? The team with the premier tier 1 o line lossed the SB to a team with a tier 2-3 o line. Is that worded better for you?

KC didn't have a tier 1 o line last season either. Check their efficiency stats since we cannot agree on rankings. Patrick Mahomes was the 4th highest pressured QB in the playoffs, had the most scrambles (7) and their running game averaged 3.2 YPA.

about those pressures, NC said those were good pressures

This is my favorite so far : "Huh? OL's don't play each other. LOL", "Detroit OL > KC's OL as we just saw"

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Is a tier 1 a top 5, top 3 or #1?

It depends. This year, there are only 2 teams in the tier 1 OL. Eagles and Lions.

There are 3 on the DL: Cowboys, 49ers and Steelers.

It doesn't depend because that leaves it up to your opinion vs everyone elses. Be decisive and give us a parameter in which we can set the standard.

By the way, PHI is currently ranked 25th in PBLK and 13th in RBLK.

That's not my standard. It's BT's. And it's been spot on annually. That's why I keep referencing it as a starting, mid and playoff point.

And some years they have 3 in tier 1...or just 1. So it's their standard.

Seems irelevant to our discussions in general if there is no clear cut definition for what makes a tier 1 o line. It gives too much room to move goal posts. There should be clear cut tiers or else it leaves things up to your opinion (BT's) vs everyone elses. But I know you by now. You'll never comit to anything on here which is why everyone gets so frustrated with you.

Going by your (BT's) standard, the only tier 1 o line last season was PHI and perhaps DET. DET didn't even make the playoffs and KC's tier 2-3 o line beat PHI in the SB.

Huh? OL's don't play each other. LOL

No, their only two teams in tier 1 OL's from last year faced off in the Superbowl. One was going to win, one was going to lose. The fact that both their tier OL made the Superbowl is a pretty good indication they had accurate tiers.

This year it's Philly and now, Detroit. KC is no longer in tier 1. And Detroit OL > KC's OL as we just saw. So again, they were accurate. And have been for years.

You can look to PFF for your metrics. That's fine. I'll pivot to SME's on talent and ability and that's what typically shows up when it's needed most.

Really? The team with the premier tier 1 o line lossed the SB to a team with a tier 2-3 o line. Is that worded better for you?

KC didn't have a tier 1 o line last season either. Check their efficiency stats since we cannot agree on rankings. Patrick Mahomes was the 4th highest pressured QB in the playoffs, had the most scrambles (7) and their running game averaged 3.2 YPA.

about those pressures, NC said those were good pressures

This is my favorite so far : "Huh? OL's don't play each other. LOL", "Detroit OL > KC's OL as we just saw"

Did he really use the term "good pressures"? 🤣

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Is a tier 1 a top 5, top 3 or #1?

It depends. This year, there are only 2 teams in the tier 1 OL. Eagles and Lions.

There are 3 on the DL: Cowboys, 49ers and Steelers.

It doesn't depend because that leaves it up to your opinion vs everyone elses. Be decisive and give us a parameter in which we can set the standard.

By the way, PHI is currently ranked 25th in PBLK and 13th in RBLK.

That's not my standard. It's BT's. And it's been spot on annually. That's why I keep referencing it as a starting, mid and playoff point.

And some years they have 3 in tier 1...or just 1. So it's their standard.

Seems irelevant to our discussions in general if there is no clear cut definition for what makes a tier 1 o line. It gives too much room to move goal posts. There should be clear cut tiers or else it leaves things up to your opinion (BT's) vs everyone elses. But I know you by now. You'll never comit to anything on here which is why everyone gets so frustrated with you.

Going by your (BT's) standard, the only tier 1 o line last season was PHI and perhaps DET. DET didn't even make the playoffs and KC's tier 2-3 o line beat PHI in the SB.

Huh? OL's don't play each other. LOL

No, their only two teams in tier 1 OL's from last year faced off in the Superbowl. One was going to win, one was going to lose. The fact that both their tier OL made the Superbowl is a pretty good indication they had accurate tiers.

This year it's Philly and now, Detroit. KC is no longer in tier 1. And Detroit OL > KC's OL as we just saw. So again, they were accurate. And have been for years.

You can look to PFF for your metrics. That's fine. I'll pivot to SME's on talent and ability and that's what typically shows up when it's needed most.

Really? The team with the premier tier 1 o line lossed the SB to a team with a tier 2-3 o line. Is that worded better for you?

KC didn't have a tier 1 o line last season either. Check their efficiency stats since we cannot agree on rankings. Patrick Mahomes was the 4th highest pressured QB in the playoffs, had the most scrambles (7) and their running game averaged 3.2 YPA.

about those pressures, NC said those were good pressures

This is my favorite so far : "Huh? OL's don't play each other. LOL", "Detroit OL > KC's OL as we just saw"

Did he really use the term "good pressures"? 🤣

he did as he was hit with how much PM was pressured in the SB after NC used the no Sacks as a barometer of great OL'ness (he forgot that he said the 49ers no sack game in the NFCCG was still terrible OL play)

gotta love NC

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Is a tier 1 a top 5, top 3 or #1?

It depends. This year, there are only 2 teams in the tier 1 OL. Eagles and Lions.

There are 3 on the DL: Cowboys, 49ers and Steelers.

You are conflating the small sample of a few that you are. reading for free with what is actually in the whole article if you read the entire thing

I'm not sure if this is English or not but I think you're saying I'm only focusing on the tier 1's. That's accurate as that is what I'd like to achieve here. We've done that with the defense numerous times. Tier 1's are the topic of the subject/goal/formula...and Superbowl wins.

I'm saying you can't even definitively say how many teams are in tier 1, or any tier for that matter, because you only read the freebie s**t because you won't pay for the article. You just trot out the 1st few you see. I asked you if you really even knew how many were in tier 1 and you couldn't say. And this is the s**t you cite which is lame. You also did it again the other day when ragging on the OL after the PIT game…then acknowledging you hadn't even watched. But hey at least you watched the condensed version,later…whatever that means 😂Be better

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Is a tier 1 a top 5, top 3 or #1?

It depends. This year, there are only 2 teams in the tier 1 OL. Eagles and Lions.

There are 3 on the DL: Cowboys, 49ers and Steelers.

It doesn't depend because that leaves it up to your opinion vs everyone elses. Be decisive and give us a parameter in which we can set the standard.

By the way, PHI is currently ranked 25th in PBLK and 13th in RBLK.

That's not my standard. It's BT's. And it's been spot on annually. That's why I keep referencing it as a starting, mid and playoff point.

And some years they have 3 in tier 1...or just 1. So it's their standard.

Seems irelevant to our discussions in general if there is no clear cut definition for what makes a tier 1 o line. It gives too much room to move goal posts. There should be clear cut tiers or else it leaves things up to your opinion (BT's) vs everyone elses. But I know you by now. You'll never comit to anything on here which is why everyone gets so frustrated with you.

Going by your (BT's) standard, the only tier 1 o line last season was PHI and perhaps DET. DET didn't even make the playoffs and KC's tier 2-3 o line beat PHI in the SB.

Huh? OL's don't play each other. LOL

No, their only two teams in tier 1 OL's from last year faced off in the Superbowl. One was going to win, one was going to lose. The fact that both their tier OL made the Superbowl is a pretty good indication they had accurate tiers.

This year it's Philly and now, Detroit. KC is no longer in tier 1. And Detroit OL > KC's OL as we just saw. So again, they were accurate. And have been for years.

You can look to PFF for your metrics. That's fine. I'll pivot to SME's on talent and ability and that's what typically shows up when it's needed most.

Really? The team with the premier tier 1 o line lossed the SB to a team with a tier 2-3 o line. Is that worded better for you?

KC didn't have a tier 1 o line last season either. Check their efficiency stats since we cannot agree on rankings. Patrick Mahomes was the 4th highest pressured QB in the playoffs, had the most scrambles (7) and their running game averaged 3.2 YPA.

about those pressures, NC said those were good pressures

This is my favorite so far : "Huh? OL's don't play each other. LOL", "Detroit OL > KC's OL as we just saw"

Did he really use the term "good pressures"? 🤣

Lol 100% did

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Is a tier 1 a top 5, top 3 or #1?

It depends. This year, there are only 2 teams in the tier 1 OL. Eagles and Lions.

There are 3 on the DL: Cowboys, 49ers and Steelers.

It doesn't depend because that leaves it up to your opinion vs everyone elses. Be decisive and give us a parameter in which we can set the standard.

By the way, PHI is currently ranked 25th in PBLK and 13th in RBLK.

That's not my standard. It's BT's. And it's been spot on annually. That's why I keep referencing it as a starting, mid and playoff point.

And some years they have 3 in tier 1...or just 1. So it's their standard.

Seems irelevant to our discussions in general if there is no clear cut definition for what makes a tier 1 o line. It gives too much room to move goal posts. There should be clear cut tiers or else it leaves things up to your opinion (BT's) vs everyone elses. But I know you by now. You'll never comit to anything on here which is why everyone gets so frustrated with you.

Going by your (BT's) standard, the only tier 1 o line last season was PHI and perhaps DET. DET didn't even make the playoffs and KC's tier 2-3 o line beat PHI in the SB.

Huh? OL's don't play each other. LOL

No, their only two teams in tier 1 OL's from last year faced off in the Superbowl. One was going to win, one was going to lose. The fact that both their tier OL made the Superbowl is a pretty good indication they had accurate tiers.

This year it's Philly and now, Detroit. KC is no longer in tier 1. And Detroit OL > KC's OL as we just saw. So again, they were accurate. And have been for years.

You can look to PFF for your metrics. That's fine. I'll pivot to SME's on talent and ability and that's what typically shows up when it's needed most.

Really? The team with the premier tier 1 o line lossed the SB to a team with a tier 2-3 o line. Is that worded better for you?

KC didn't have a tier 1 o line last season either. Check their efficiency stats since we cannot agree on rankings. Patrick Mahomes was the 4th highest pressured QB in the playoffs, had the most scrambles (7) and their running game averaged 3.2 YPA.

about those pressures, NC said those were good pressures

This is my favorite so far : "Huh? OL's don't play each other. LOL", "Detroit OL > KC's OL as we just saw"

Did he really use the term "good pressures"? 🤣

he did as he was hit with how much PM was pressured in the SB after NC used the no Sacks as a barometer of great OL'ness (he forgot that he said the 49ers no sack game in the NFCCG was still terrible OL play)

gotta love NC

Thema goal posts justa keep on movin.

On a serious note. Brock Purdy was the 8th highest pressured QB in the playoffs, scrambled only twice and the run game averaged 4.4 YPA.