49ers Offensive Line

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by libertyforever:

Originally posted by random49er:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by libertyforever:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by libertyforever:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by libertyforever:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by libertyforever:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by libertyforever:

Originally posted by NCommand:
You think Hurts played like a tier 1 QB?

Entering this week he was like 4th in the MVP betting odds. He can be a tier 1 QB depending on your definition.

He's had nice stretches and has been battle tested and clutch but nothing about any of his numbers this year especially, should have him in MVP talks especially when you dive into the metrics.

Top 4 in the MVP betting odds is what it is.

That speaks more to the pour class than anything. It's Brock and then a big drop off IMHO.

So are you arguing that there is only 1 top tier QB in the NFL? and that sole top tier QB is Brock?

Odds have to include the top 3-4 players. But yes, in the NFC, without question. Nobody is in Brock's league right now. The others are tier 2, IMHO.

We were talking about the whole NFL. Why are you talking NFC only all of a sudden? Jalen Hurt is actually now top 3 in the MVP odds ahead of Maholmes, Tua, Lamar and etc.

I was talking the NFC from the graph yesterday. Brock was like 3rd or 4th which is nuts up against Hurts, Dak, etc.

You haven't answer the question. What is your definition of a tier 1 QB? How many tier 1 QBs are there in any given time?

2-3 tops.

If another supposed "tier 1" develops during a season when there are already 3,...he by default bumps one of the other 3 down to tier 2.

Lol....this is what you just said without saying it. And it is 100% illogical, as these players compete against defenses,...not each other.

2014...anyone? All of these guys were pretty much in their prime and had threw for over 4,000 yards this season. Defenses were TORCHED this year:



Doesn't even include the Russell Wilson that gave us FITS and was fresh off a SB Victory during this season.

Dude has also said Jimmy G was a Tier 2 QB during his time here,...lol. Well,...look @ the list of "Tier 2" HOF QBs that he put Jimmy on par with by saying this.

How in the HECK does someone suggest there can only be 2 or 3 "tier 1" QBs and get away with it here?

Guys,...do we even football?

We all know that when it support his so call theory, he would have no problem arguing that there are ten plus tier 1 QBs.

Yeah, when you get off Madden and have actual football standards, you don't have 75 guys in tier 1. At most, 2-3 make that tier. Just like BT has 2 tier 1 OL and 3 Tier 1 DL

How QBs play (given a full season) are independent variables, though.

Furthermore,...history has shown (see above) that more than 3 QBs can play at an ELITE level -- and even be clear HOFers in their prime -- at the same time in football.

Given that they are independent and face the defenses instead of each other,... that plus history is a 1+1=2.

You're saying "at most" while providing ZERO evidence or REASON for this stuff,...lol. (How the hell does QB#3 keep QB#4 a full "tier" below him when they do not compete against each other?)

THAT is the problem. No info or evidence,...just saying new stuff as you go along.

The truth is,...whomever got you to finally answer this question really just duped u into making up yet another falsehood that's easily provable as such.

Originally posted by Shorteous:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
And TTT has little to do with OL play. That's on the QB, play calling and the receivers.

Which is why you watch the film and see if Hurts was not seeing things or were the receivers not open.

Is there a stat that says how long it was taking before initial pressures arrived? Doesn't TTT just tell you how long before the QB passed?

Exactly. That's why that 30 pressures are deceiving cause it could've taken 5 seconds before the pressure lol. That said, I'm pretty sure our DL put an emphasis on gap integrity and rushing as a unit rather than individually trying to get to the QB as quickly as they could. I hope they do the same thing against Lamar

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by Shorteous:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
And TTT has little to do with OL play. That's on the QB, play calling and the receivers.

Which is why you watch the film and see if Hurts was not seeing things or were the receivers not open.

Is there a stat that says how long it was taking before initial pressures arrived? Doesn't TTT just tell you how long before the QB passed?

Exactly. That's why that 30 pressures are deceiving cause it could've taken 5 seconds before the pressure lol. That said, I'm pretty sure our DL put an emphasis on gap integrity and rushing as a unit rather than individually trying to get to the QB as quickly as they could. I hope they do the same thing against Lamar

The idea is that the higher the TTT under pressure the better the coverage. The lower the TTT under pressure the better the pass rush. Doesn't really matter which one won on the play. Whether the defense won or not depends on passer rating. If the TTT under pressure is high and so is the passer rating than the pass rush didn't do its job. If the TTT under pressure is low but the passer rating is high the coverage didn't do its job. If the pressure rate is low than neither the pass rush nor the coverage did its job.

When defending a QB like Jalen Hurts, its best to play tight coverage and contain him in the pocket with the pass rush. Being undisciplined with your rush lanes against a QB like Hurts and he is going to kill you with his legs. Criticize the pass rush all you want but because of this tight coverage/contain rush gameplan it pressured Jalen on 61.5% of his dropbacks where he completed 55.6% of his passes, was sacked 3x and had a 86.0 passer rating.

The oline started rough against Philly, but we they held on strong. That dline is scary as hell, and they got their prized defensive rookie to shed tears of frustration lol. Them again, they practice against the actual best dline in the nfl so it's nothing new to them. I still think we need to get a new RT but McCivitz is basically playing like a cheaper McGlinchey so I'll take what I can get. This unit is pretty damn good compared to a lot of other teams. I really hope we consider grabbing a OT early in the Draft.

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by Shorteous:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
And TTT has little to do with OL play. That's on the QB, play calling and the receivers.

Which is why you watch the film and see if Hurts was not seeing things or were the receivers not open.

Is there a stat that says how long it was taking before initial pressures arrived? Doesn't TTT just tell you how long before the QB passed?

Exactly. That's why that 30 pressures are deceiving cause it could've taken 5 seconds before the pressure lol. That said, I'm pretty sure our DL put an emphasis on gap integrity and rushing as a unit rather than individually trying to get to the QB as quickly as they could. I hope they do the same thing against Lamar

The idea is that the higher the TTT under pressure the better the coverage. The lower the TTT under pressure the better the pass rush. Doesn't really matter which one won on the play. Whether the defense won or not depends on passer rating. If the TTT under pressure is high and so is the passer rating than the pass rush didn't do its job. If the TTT under pressure is low but the passer rating is high the coverage didn't do its job. If the pressure rate is low than neither the pass rush nor the coverage did its job.

When defending a QB like Jalen Hurts, its best to play tight coverage and contain him in the pocket with the pass rush. Being undisciplined with your rush lanes against a QB like Hurts and he is going to kill you with his legs. Criticize the pass rush all you want but because of this tight coverage/contain rush gameplan it pressured Jalen on 61.5% of his dropbacks where he completed 55.6% of his passes, was sacked 3x and had a 86.0 passer rating.

Who criticized the pass rush?

Originally posted by gold49digger:
The oline started rough against Philly, but we they held on strong. That dline is scary as hell, and they got their prized defensive rookie to shed tears of frustration lol. Them again, they practice against the actual best dline in the nfl so it's nothing new to them. I still think we need to get a new RT but McCivitz is basically playing like a cheaper McGlinchey so I'll take what I can get. This unit is pretty damn good compared to a lot of other teams. I really hope we consider grabbing a OT early in the Draft.

That would be my game plan too. Considering the Eagles starting OLine is (on average) 5th rounders, trade the 3rd round comp pick down that you get for Demeco and get multiple fifth round players and use a couple on the OLine.

Originally posted by 49ers808:
Exactly. That's why that 30 pressures are deceiving cause it could've taken 5 seconds before the pressure lol. That said, I'm pretty sure our DL put an emphasis on gap integrity and rushing as a unit rather than individually trying to get to the QB as quickly as they could. I hope they do the same thing against Lamar

This, go rewatch the game…they were holding hurts in the backfield and limiting them as a rushing team. They were trying to force Hurts to be a passer and take away those deep balls.

once he started leaving the pocket (because of pressure or just because that's what he does) then it was getting after the QB.

Originally posted by NCommand:
I couldn't agree more. I can't tell you how many times he didn't need to take off left or right but he did and I don't know if it worked out once. He could have easily stayed in the pocket and gone through his progressions until someone opened up. He really has never impressed me. Not that he's not talented but he's not a pure QB with athleticism to me.

Yeah I mean there aren't many pure QBs anymore. They're using his talents and what he's successful at and I feel like SF did everything they can negate it.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by NCommand:
I couldn't agree more. I can't tell you how many times he didn't need to take off left or right but he did and I don't know if it worked out once. He could have easily stayed in the pocket and gone through his progressions until someone opened up. He really has never impressed me. Not that he's not talented but he's not a pure QB with athleticism to me.

Yeah I mean there aren't many pure QBs anymore. They're using his talents and what he's successful at and I feel like SF did everything they can negate it.

Exactly.

Excellent game plan and discipline. It's super frustrating for a DL who just wants to rush with reckless abandon so extra props to them.

"Purity" evolves.

As good as the Eagles may be,...they don't have the plethora of playmakers to create mismatches that we do.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by NCommand:
I couldn't agree more. I can't tell you how many times he didn't need to take off left or right but he did and I don't know if it worked out once. He could have easily stayed in the pocket and gone through his progressions until someone opened up. He really has never impressed me. Not that he's not talented but he's not a pure QB with athleticism to me.

Yeah I mean there aren't many pure QBs anymore. They're using his talents and what he's successful at and I feel like SF did everything they can negate it.

Exactly.

Excellent game plan and discipline. It's super frustrating for a DL who just wants to rush with reckless abandon so extra props to them.

Agree, I was surprised that Jalen didn't throw much against our secondary. That Eagle offense is top 6 in the NFL. I hope Dallas kills them this weekend.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by NCommand:
I couldn't agree more. I can't tell you how many times he didn't need to take off left or right but he did and I don't know if it worked out once. He could have easily stayed in the pocket and gone through his progressions until someone opened up. He really has never impressed me. Not that he's not talented but he's not a pure QB with athleticism to me.

Yeah I mean there aren't many pure QBs anymore. They're using his talents and what he's successful at and I feel like SF did everything they can negate it.

Exactly.

Excellent game plan and discipline. It's super frustrating for a DL who just wants to rush with reckless abandon so extra props to them.

Agree, I was surprised that Jalen didn't throw much against our secondary. That Eagle offense is top 6 in the NFL. I hope Dallas kills them this weekend.

Me too!

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by NCommand:
I couldn't agree more. I can't tell you how many times he didn't need to take off left or right but he did and I don't know if it worked out once. He could have easily stayed in the pocket and gone through his progressions until someone opened up. He really has never impressed me. Not that he's not talented but he's not a pure QB with athleticism to me.

Yeah I mean there aren't many pure QBs anymore. They're using his talents and what he's successful at and I feel like SF did everything they can negate it.

Exactly.

Excellent game plan and discipline. It's super frustrating for a DL who just wants to rush with reckless abandon so extra props to them.

Agree, I was surprised that Jalen didn't throw much against our secondary. That Eagle offense is top 6 in the NFL. I hope Dallas kills them this weekend.

Me too!

Can cowboys pass rushers play as disciplined as ours is probably the biggest question going into that game.

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by NCommand:
I couldn't agree more. I can't tell you how many times he didn't need to take off left or right but he did and I don't know if it worked out once. He could have easily stayed in the pocket and gone through his progressions until someone opened up. He really has never impressed me. Not that he's not talented but he's not a pure QB with athleticism to me.

Yeah I mean there aren't many pure QBs anymore. They're using his talents and what he's successful at and I feel like SF did everything they can negate it.

Exactly.

Excellent game plan and discipline. It's super frustrating for a DL who just wants to rush with reckless abandon so extra props to them.

Agree, I was surprised that Jalen didn't throw much against our secondary. That Eagle offense is top 6 in the NFL. I hope Dallas kills them this weekend.

Me too!

Can cowboys pass rushers play as disciplined as ours is probably the biggest question going into that game.

That's highly unlikely. They are so aggressive. I just don't see them as disciplined as our boys who played some excellent team defense.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by NCommand:
I couldn't agree more. I can't tell you how many times he didn't need to take off left or right but he did and I don't know if it worked out once. He could have easily stayed in the pocket and gone through his progressions until someone opened up. He really has never impressed me. Not that he's not talented but he's not a pure QB with athleticism to me.

Yeah I mean there aren't many pure QBs anymore. They're using his talents and what he's successful at and I feel like SF did everything they can negate it.

Exactly.

Excellent game plan and discipline. It's super frustrating for a DL who just wants to rush with reckless abandon so extra props to them.

Agree, I was surprised that Jalen didn't throw much against our secondary. That Eagle offense is top 6 in the NFL. I hope Dallas kills them this weekend.

Me too!

Can cowboys pass rushers play as disciplined as ours is probably the biggest question going into that game.

That's highly unlikely. They are so aggressive. I just don't see them as disciplined as our boys who played some excellent team defense.

Exactly. I see this game being a 38-35 type of game. Hopefully the eagles lose for our sake. The bye-week and homefield advantage would make us SB bound (barring a major key injury) imo. You give Kyle an extra week to gameplan in the playoffs and the NFC is a wrap. I also don't see any contender strong enough in the AFC that could take us out except maybe the ravens but we will get a preview of that soon enough.