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Originally posted by HarboutTHAT:and I thought I was optimistic...I dont think we're as bad the media makes it out to be, but I also don't think were as good as you make it out to be
I think its clear the whole org. from the players, to the coaches, to Baalke himself thinks we are primed for a SB run. Our D is shaping up to be elite, we are taking a no nonsense approach to fixing all our tempo, playcalling, predictability issues...
Not to mention the media and other fanbases don't realize the cupboards wont even close they are so full of players waiting to step up... If we can fix the right side O Line we are right in there for the NFC West crown...
Originally posted by the_dynasty:
and I thought I was optimistic...I dont think we're as bad the media makes it out to be, but I also don't think were as good as you make it out to be
players and coaches and baalke have to think SB every season, and especially they have to talk like it
baalkes moves though, did not really indicate we're SB bound. we're 'reloading' with young guys for most part.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Originally posted by jreff22:
What exactly is spot on?
Martin is getting beat so I'm not sure where the extra strength comes into play? The fact that we didn't move Boone to RT, freeing up both LG and RG for competition is an indicator about how these guards aren't just plug and play.
What did the O line look like in TC 2011? Garbage. Abused every day in TC and embarassed in one-on-ones. We won 13 regular season games that year, with the O Line paving the way. Change takes time, and no element of the team is more impacted by change than the O line. Everyone (EVERYone) will tell you that you can't play fast while you are thinking. No one (other than QB) has more to process on a given play than the OL. Their learning as they play. They need reps, they need film sessions, and they need to settle into their scheme and technique. The talent is there, it really is. Factors such as health and coaching will influence how quickly everything comes together. I like Foerster. Kilgore's long recovery is a bummer. We'll see.
WRATH is THE resident expert on the OL. Trust me on that one...
We've got time...try to keep it in context...new personnel, young talent, new schemes, language and terminology, new coaches, new style and philosophy, etc. facing a very experienced front 7 that has the ability to be tops in the NFL. Not a single player along that front 7 even needs to 'think' at this point. They can just play.
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Originally posted by All22:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
I'm actually not that worried about Pears. I know that sounds crazy. He's always been a reliable pass protector, and he has been responsible for far less pressures and sacks than Davis. He has NOT been a very good drive blocker, so i am a bit concerned about the professed desire to pull Boone from the left to run power to the right. He has been a productive blocker on zone runs. Buffalo fans were pretty upset when he went down for the year in 2012. He REALLY struggled in Marrone's man/gap offense the last two years (inexplicable that Marrone went that way, since he was all ZBS under Payton several years back), and that's become the book on him, since it's hard for anyone watching the NFL to maintain a 2+ year memory.
Problem is we play in arguably the hardest division. Buffalo didn't play Sea, Arz, and St Louis twice a year. That's a whole different level of DL play and skill.
Okay, I'll play this game. Where did Mathis play.
I think Sheldon Richardson and Muhammed Wilkerson on the same line is scarier than whatever the the NFCE can put on the field.
JPP, Osi, Tuck, Kiwanuka > Richardson and Wilkerson
Maybe 5 years ago...
edit: Both the NYJ guys were demons against the run and pass. Can the NYG say that about anyone, except Tuck? Can they even say that about Tuck recently?
Originally posted by SofaKing:
I hear what you're saying. Mathis would upgrade the line this year. No doubt about that. The question is how much is he worth, and is he worth burying some of our younger talent on the bench. Still a great player, but he's going to be 34 this year. I think Thomas is the future at LG, Martin at RG, Kilgore at C. Will probably draft a young RT next year to adequately replace AD.
Originally posted by the_dynasty:not sure if i have the energy to point out so many things wrong here.,
you think we are ? we changed coaching, a ton of our cornerstones left/retired, the oline and corners are very different, and we play in a super tough division
if staff thought we were in win now mode, they wouldve kept Gore. they would make a huge attempt to keep Justin for one more year. and so on.
thats not to say 49ers wont compete, but signing old expensive vets for a 'rental' is what teams who think theyre one-two players away do, not rebuilding teams. signing randy moss made sense for our 2011 team (even though he was free). it wouldnt make sense now.
Dockett is the only real exception to this, but I think they wanted vet pass rush insurance
Originally posted by cciowa:for everything there is a beginning. the o line guys are dealing with some new faces, new ideas, new coaches not to mention they are dealing with what looks to be a very violently good defensive line. i thought they would add a new guy this week but i guess the coaches are fine with sticking with the current guys, continue to teach them, continue to coach then and i would wager the o lline will be better in five days than what it is now. the first one or two pre season games will tell alot. i am ok with letting it ride
Originally posted by cciowa:I agree about Gore.
not sure if i have the energy to point out so many things wrong here.,
a ton of cornerstones, we have the two main cornerstones of the team on offense and defense, i will not mention the names , you should know them.
the blather about gore has been talked to death. Do you understand you do not give multi years to a 32 year old running back or it is not good business.. they did not knowing they got guys who can fill the gap , they do, four guys who can run the ball, all can catch, two can pass block very well, bush is the new vet leader and mentor as rathman has used him many times to show the kids the right way to do things... what part of " a side of justins body does not work as well as it used to,", do you not get? old expensive vets? who is that. we gave very good and wise deals to reggie and darnell plus we also got some of that vet leadership back we lost with country, willis and gore. if we were rebuilding we would have note signed smith to a big deal. the coaches needed to go as their brand of ball hit the wall. what is "obvious" to you,, is silly to me
Originally posted by HarboutTHAT:i am optimistic but of course you bring up good points. i would more than happy if the team could manage a way to do what you propose. but , and of course i have been wrong many times,,, sounds like they are willing to let it ride with todays practice, day off tomorrow to analyze things and then regroup
Originally posted by cciowa:
for everything there is a beginning. the o line guys are dealing with some new faces, new ideas, new coaches not to mention they are dealing with what looks to be a very violently good defensive line. i thought they would add a new guy this week but i guess the coaches are fine with sticking with the current guys, continue to teach them, continue to coach then and i would wager the o lline will be better in five days than what it is now. the first one or two pre season games will tell alot. i am ok with letting it ride
It has the look of a problem. There is one fix on the market. Way less worried about Pears then Martin, so I hope to G-d we get the fix, then we have the choice of replacing Martin or Pears. I am 100% confident one of them will be sh!tty.
Originally posted by the_dynasty:rebuilding is when you dump everyone and let kids play. we are so far from that point it is laughable in my opinion
I agree about Gore.
I agree about Justin as well.
I consider all those good moves, this is what YOU are not 'getting'.
It's just that as a result of those moves, a large portion of the 'old' team is gone and even if new team is amazing and a future dynasty, it still needs time to gel. sure, there are some exceptions to that, but in general it holds true
you don't think we are rebuilding even though a lot of coaching and starting players are - um, ok. we are not rebuilding because the team isnt good, we are rebuilding for various reasons. any time large part of offensive and defensive personnel leave, its a rebuild.
you seem to imply 'rebuilding' has a negative connotation. it does not.
we do not need a 34 year old evan mathis, who by the way will be more expensive than bush or dockett, for only or two years. because we have young cheap linemen now and its better to go through growing pains now when coaching and players has been changed, and a lot of things start from scratch, than sometime in the future when the team might be set and we have no time to experiment.
torrey smith is a bad example as he is 26 years old. torrey smith will be here no matter what happens. evan mathis is the proverbial 'expendable' who would be signed by some team who is an olineman away (or so they think) from a superbowl for a year or two, MAX. he is a rental for a team that is pressure badly to win it all now. we are not.