Joe Montana Legacy Secured

Originally posted by Fanaticofnfl:

Originally posted by jcs:

Originally posted by 9erReign:

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

Originally posted by PrisonOfGlass:

Originally posted by blizzuntz:

If we get 8 SBs out of Jimmy G in the same fashion....,,,

All of us would be calling him GOAT

I agree. I think people are reaching with Montana's Super Bowl stats. They're great but I'll take 5-2 (likely 6-2 soon) any day.

What about 5-3?

Montana is a better Super Bowl QB than Brady.

Silliest argument ever. Not making the playoffs or getting knocked out of the playoffs before the SB is even worse than losing a SB. Going to a SB >>>>> not going to a SB. Brady is the GOAT and it isn't even close anymore. End of the day winning SB's is the only number that matters.

End of the day Brady is going to have 6sb wins over 4 and every statistical career passing record in existence.

No he won't. Brees will have those records. Brady will finish in the top 3.

With that said, the records mean very little when determining the GOAT. Montana had 40K passing yards and under 300 touchdowns in comparison to Peyton who had over 500 and 70K but Montana is generally considered the second greatest above Peyton. Brees meanwhile will barely crack the top 10 despite having all those records.

Originally posted by jcs:

Originally posted by 9ersLiferInChicago:

Originally posted by JTsBiggestFan:
For a 4 year period, the loser of the NFC Championship Game went on to play/win the Super Bowl (with one exception):

1983 - Redskins beat 49ers
1984 - 49ers beat Bears
1985 - Bears beat *Giants (*divisional round not NFCC)
1986 - Giants beat Redskins
1987 - Redskins beat Vikings

So basically, those teams were just right there and after losing the NFCC (or divisional round for NYG), came back and won it all the next year.

The 1984 49ers shut out the Bears 23-0 in the NFCC, which led to the juggernaut 1985 Bears that smashed teams.

The 1985 Bears shut out the Giants and Rams by a combined score of 45-0, then smashed the Patsies 46-10 in the Bowl.

The 1986 Giants went on a tear crushing our Niners 49-3, then shutting out the Redskins 17-0 before beating the Donkies 39-20.

The 1987 Redskins one two close playoff games before whipping the Donkies 42-10.

So the Niners winning 4 out of 10 in this decade was incredible in hindsight. Basically won 4 because of Joe Montana's greatness.....otherwise would have been a 2 or 3 SB win max.

BTW, the '80s were a decade of a QB having to take on another team not another QB.

Montana crushed the likes of Marino & Elway in Super Bowl contests, but had two nail biters against Ken Anderson and Boomer Esiason's Bengals.

The rest of the NFC winners in that decade featured QBs who have not and will not be inducted into the Hall of Fame. Meanwhile the AFC has Marino, Elway, Kelly, in the HoF with Dan Fouts as well for a non SB participant.

I can't think of another HoF QB in the entire NFC outside of Montana which goes to show the tremendous battles he had to face.

Just think of Jim Kelly, whose only peer as a QB would be Troy Aikman..........Jeff Hostetler & Mark Rypien are game managers at best. Kelly was 0-4 in the big game and is in the HoF.

Meanwhile in the '00s and '10s, you have Brady winning SBs merely because he's a better QB than most of the AFC and every NFC QB he's battled.....and barely beating them.

These Jags & Vikings teams would be legit SB teams had they been around 10-15 years at least........definitely back in '80s and '90s. Brady beats the Jags by 4 at home where he's vastly superior a QB to Bortles.........definite loss many years ago.

The years teams bring a ferocious D with competent QB play he's lost........a few Ravens and Broncos teams come to mind, along with NYG. Mostly QBs lesser than Brady with the lone exception of Peyton Manning on Denver & Indy....but only when those teams were outright better than his team.

Also consider that the 49ers could not get past the Giants in 1990 NFCC primarily because their running game with Craig dropped off enough that the Giants could contain him in nickel/dime the entire game. An in prime Rice, Taylor, Jones blow away anything Brady played with and yet it wasn't enough to do much versus NYG. You needed an RB to ball back then.....couldn't just throw it 50-60 times against a great defense and win. Steve Young is a one time champion because he barely had a great RB outside of Watters & Hearst.

It's a debate that can be spun many different ways. I've always been ok with saying "Montana best of the '80s", "Brady best of the '00s/10s".......Brady might have been very good in the '80s and Montana for sure in the modern game.

On a different but final note:

I like to compare QBs qualitatively.........beyond SB rings. After all, we acknowledge Marino as a f'n beast QB , probably GOAT who never won a chip. Maybe not better than Montana or Brady or maybe Peyton but sure as hell better than most of the 30-40 QBs with rings.

So why is Brady and Montana all about 5 wins vs 4 wins or 2 losses vs. 0 losses....?

On pure eye test/skill:

Montana can improvise out of pocket better.
Montana superior mobility by far (3rd all time rusher in SB game behind McNair & Kap....5/59 yards against Dolphins!).
Montana better footwork/drop back.
Montana never used shotgun (neither did Young).

Give it a tie for intangible/clutch.
Give it a tie for reading defenses, calling audibles, etc. .
Give it a general tie for throwing the football.

Give Brady an edge for being a little bit taller. (LOL)

Serious question:

What does Brady do now or before that is better than Montana, skill wise?

There are people who have very serious debates saying Young was better than Montana (and it has to be respected), but then turn around and say Brady is better than Montana in the next breath.

Wish we could discuss skills more often. More intellectually satisfying!

Hey JT, just stop trying Bro. Way too many fans here are too firmly seated in the Brady Train to understand that logic. Let them tell it Brady plays in tougher times than Joe played

NFL in 94 wasn't leaps and bounds different than the league in 00. Joe also played with an advantage of being in a superior WCO system that the league had to adjust to for most of his career.

Originally posted by jcs:
Defenses were never as complex as they are today. Brady is the best pre snap QB of all time, Montana was great but he wasn't figuring out teams in that way. Usually his teams were dominate. Brady is doing this with guys like amendola

Originally posted by PrisonOfGlass:
People are probably going to argue in favor of Joe even if Brady retires with 10 rings. This is pointless.

Originally posted by Fanaticofnfl:

Originally posted by PrisonOfGlass:

People are probably going to argue in favor of Joe even if Brady retires with 10 rings. This is pointless.

I don't know what's wrong with being a 49ers fan and admitting Brady is the greatest. Someone was going to pass Joe eventually lol. Just be thankful Brady wasn't a Cowboy or Seahawk.

Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:

Originally posted by Fanaticofnfl:

Originally posted by PrisonOfGlass:
People are probably going to argue in favor of Joe even if Brady retires with 10 rings. This is pointless.

I don't know what's wrong with being a 49ers fan and admitting Brady is the greatest. Someone was going to pass Joe eventually lol. Just be thankful Brady wasn't a Cowboy or Seahawk.

Theres nothing wrong with being wrong.its ok. Youre family here. We accept your wrongness. Its ok.

Originally posted by Fanaticofnfl:

Originally posted by jcs:

Originally posted by 9erReign:

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

Originally posted by PrisonOfGlass:

Originally posted by blizzuntz:
If we get 8 SBs out of Jimmy G in the same fashion....,,,

All of us would be calling him GOAT

I agree. I think people are reaching with Montana's Super Bowl stats. They're great but I'll take 5-2 (likely 6-2 soon) any day.

What about 5-3?

Montana is a better Super Bowl QB than Brady.

Silliest argument ever. Not making the playoffs or getting knocked out of the playoffs before the SB is even worse than losing a SB. Going to a SB >>>>> not going to a SB. Brady is the GOAT and it isn't even close anymore. End of the day winning SB's is the only number that matters.

End of the day Brady is going to have 6sb wins over 4 and every statistical career passing record in existence.

No he won't. Brees will have those records. Brady will finish in the top 3.

With that said, the records mean very little when determining the GOAT. Montana had 40K passing yards and under 300 touchdowns in comparison to Peyton who had over 500 and 70K but Montana is generally considered the second greatest above Peyton. Brees meanwhile will barely crack the top 10 despite having all those records.

Originally posted by TheHYDE49er:

Originally posted by Fanaticofnfl:

Originally posted by jcs:

Originally posted by 9erReign:

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

Originally posted by PrisonOfGlass:

Originally posted by blizzuntz:
If we get 8 SBs out of Jimmy G in the same fashion....,,,

All of us would be calling him GOAT

I agree. I think people are reaching with Montana's Super Bowl stats. They're great but I'll take 5-2 (likely 6-2 soon) any day.

What about 5-3?

Montana is a better Super Bowl QB than Brady.

Silliest argument ever. Not making the playoffs or getting knocked out of the playoffs before the SB is even worse than losing a SB. Going to a SB >>>>> not going to a SB. Brady is the GOAT and it isn't even close anymore. End of the day winning SB's is the only number that matters.

End of the day Brady is going to have 6sb wins over 4 and every statistical career passing record in existence.

No he won't. Brees will have those records. Brady will finish in the top 3.

With that said, the records mean very little when determining the GOAT. Montana had 40K passing yards and under 300 touchdowns in comparison to Peyton who had over 500 and 70K but Montana is generally considered the second greatest above Peyton. Brees meanwhile will barely crack the top 10 despite having all those records.

Brees will barely crack the top then, huh? He's gonna be ahead of Marino, got the stats and the SB. when it's all said and done with him, it's gonna be Brady, Montana, Manning, Brees, and Elway. Maybe Rodgers if he wins another SB and plays until his late 30s, but otherwise Brees is easily top 10.

Originally posted by 9ersLiferInChicago:

Originally posted by jcs:

Defenses were never as complex as they are today. Brady is the best pre snap QB of all time, Montana was great but he wasn't figuring out teams in that way. Usually his teams were dominate. Brady is doing this with guys like amendola

And offenses were never as protected and advantaged as they are today. Defenses were never as handcuffed then as they are today.

Originally posted by Fanaticofnfl:

I don't know what's wrong with being a 49ers fan and admitting Brady is the greatest. Someone was going to pass Joe eventually lol. Just be thankful Brady wasn't a Cowboy or Seahawk.

Originally posted by Fanaticofnfl:

Originally posted by TheHYDE49er:

Originally posted by Fanaticofnfl:

Originally posted by jcs:

Originally posted by 9erReign:

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

Originally posted by PrisonOfGlass:

Originally posted by blizzuntz:
If we get 8 SBs out of Jimmy G in the same fashion....,,,

All of us would be calling him GOAT

I agree. I think people are reaching with Montana's Super Bowl stats. They're great but I'll take 5-2 (likely 6-2 soon) any day.

What about 5-3?

Montana is a better Super Bowl QB than Brady.

Silliest argument ever. Not making the playoffs or getting knocked out of the playoffs before the SB is even worse than losing a SB. Going to a SB >>>>> not going to a SB. Brady is the GOAT and it isn't even close anymore. End of the day winning SB's is the only number that matters.

End of the day Brady is going to have 6sb wins over 4 and every statistical career passing record in existence.

No he won't. Brees will have those records. Brady will finish in the top 3.

With that said, the records mean very little when determining the GOAT. Montana had 40K passing yards and under 300 touchdowns in comparison to Peyton who had over 500 and 70K but Montana is generally considered the second greatest above Peyton. Brees meanwhile will barely crack the top 10 despite having all those records.

Brees will barely crack the top then, huh? He's gonna be ahead of Marino, got the stats and the SB. when it's all said and done with him, it's gonna be Brady, Montana, Manning, Brees, and Elway. Maybe Rodgers if he wins another SB and plays until his late 30s, but otherwise Brees is easily top 10.

Call me crazy but until Brees wins another Super Bowl (and he very well could if he wants to play for 3 more years) he's not even above Aikman, Bradshaw, Unitas or Otto Graham, and Aaron Rodgers is on pace to pass him. Right now Brees is about equal to Favre, but he'll pass him as long as he plays one more year.

Originally posted by frenchmov:

https://mobile.twitter.com/hwkbgr/status/955825964226875392

I'll leave this here. Tom Brady is overrated as f**k.