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Originally posted by teylo31:
In Golden Joes 4 super bowls his teams scored 139 total points
In bradys 6 super bowls his teams put up 135 total points
Dont know how many of either of those cane from special teams or defense
Originally posted by genus49:Originally posted by teylo31:The fact that Brady served a 4 game suspension for cheating just this year really makes this a non-issue anymore for me.
Also, the patriots have always done well when brady was out including going 3-1 with the backups and a rookie 3rd rounder
Seriously?
That was the most bogus suspension ever, 0 proof. Any NFL should be outraged by that. As 49er fans we've been on the receiving end of Roger "I punish who i want" Goodell.
What did Brady do? He said he prefers his balls on the lower end of the LEGAL level. The game was played in cold & rain and yet the NFL couldn't take the measurements before the game started?
Absolutely ridiculous to think Brady should be knocked down because of that, especially when you hear stories from Joe about the niners getting an edge. Every team does it.
49ers did well with a backup too...does Joe get knocked down a peg too?
Originally posted by SoCold:
Good points. How many HOFers has Tom had to work with?
If Tom had Jerry Rice would he have 10 Super Bowls by now?
Originally posted by cciowa:
if the team would have traded young to the chiefs for thomas like i wanted to, you would have fixed the defense,. montana would have won two more super bowls and then bono would have taken over. but the hell with the logic. instead you get young who was incapable of winning the big game until they had to buy him a defense
Originally posted by teylo31:
Rules are rules
Originally posted by genus49:what did he do after he won the super bowl with a store bought defense? in his defense the team refused to address the running back situation as well and we had to praise allah for bringing us terry kirby.. oh and cc said nothing wrong... did young win the big game till he was given a free agent defense? did he piss the cowboys title games down his legs? just like jimmy johnson said he would?
Originally posted by cciowa:
if the team would have traded young to the chiefs for thomas like i wanted to, you would have fixed the defense,. montana would have won two more super bowls and then bono would have taken over. but the hell with the logic. instead you get young who was incapable of winning the big game until they had to buy him a defense
Yeah cuz it was all Young. We got stuck with another HOF QB...how awful.
Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Originally posted by cciowa:
if the team would have traded young to the chiefs for thomas like i wanted to, you would have fixed the defense,. montana would have won two more super bowls and then bono would have taken over. but the hell with the logic. instead you get young who was incapable of winning the big game until they had to buy him a defense
lol Lets trade a future HOF player and keep a 36 yr old QB coming off major injuries. That may be logic in your mind but I doubt anyone in football would have done it. Love the winning 2 more SBs though like it is a given.
Originally posted by cciowa:
what did he do after he won the super bowl with a store bought defense? in his defense the team refused to address the running back situation as well and we had to praise allah for bringing us terry kirby.. oh and cc said nothing wrong... did young win the big game till he was given a free agent defense? did he piss the cowboys title games down his legs? just like jimmy johnson said he would?
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Originally posted by cciowa:
if the team would have traded young to the chiefs for thomas like i wanted to, you would have fixed the defense,. montana would have won two more super bowls and then bono would have taken over. but the hell with the logic. instead you get young who was incapable of winning the big game until they had to buy him a defense
lol Lets trade a future HOF player and keep a 36 yr old QB coming off major injuries. That may be logic in your mind but I doubt anyone in football would have done it. Love the winning 2 more SBs though like it is a given.
in your inability to be objective,, you also missed the key point. thomas would have fixed the defense which was getting old and slow and you would not have all that pressure on the offense to outscore people. at the time young was not a hall of fame player,. just a guy who put up good numbers but pissed down his legs in big games
Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:
Right, what a soap dish[Edit <---this refers to the radio commentator above not cc. ]
I agree with a thread of discussion that the Super Bowl record is not a definitive case for GOAT or BradyvMontana whose better.
The prime metrics are the athletic qualities of the player, and their body of work in total.
Looking at Super Bowl performances is more suggestive than definitive.
But the reason I believe Joe should be considered as the GOAT or one of the GOAT are his athletic and performance qualities. I've said this before -- his mobility, broad delivery prowess, perceptive performance under pressure -- and more -- all these, put him in a hyper elite category. Many other excellent QB's are just not there.
The perfect example is the Catch.
Not so much the Catch itself, as a play, but the kind of play Montana could improvise and execute, that other QB's just can't.
Mobile, checking off options, drifting to keep alive the play, the mental tenacity to extend in the face of an impossible pass rusher, the leap backwards, the delivery, in the final two minutes.
That's a pretty special tool set of qualities that only a few generational players have, Joe is one. I don't see Brady making plays like that, but of course, he makes other kinds of good plays (Joe does too) but that kind of athleticism/improvisation that's just not Brady's forte.
So it's really a question of how you go from elite to hyper-elite.
Originally posted by cciowa:Look it up, Montana had the benefit of overall better defenses than Young did. You are just showing bias, as I believe you have been watching this game a long time.
if the team would have traded young to the chiefs for thomas like i wanted to, you would have fixed the defense,. montana would have won two more super bowls and then bono would have taken over. but the hell with the logic. instead you get young who was incapable of winning the big game until they had to buy him a defense
Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Yep. Using SB wins or being undefeated in SBs as the #1 criteria for GOAT is just dumb. No other way to put it. And yes, of course Joe should be in the conversation for GOAT. I would think that virtually everyone would put Brady and Joe in the top 2 (well maybe not in Indy or Denver).
I agree that Joe made an amazing play on the Catch and perhaps Brady cant make that play. But being an elite QB and the GOAT is not only about making a once in a lifetime play. I could easily see Russell Wilson or Aaron Rodgers making that play by the way with their ability to improvise and scramble. Brady isnt that type of player but that really should not take anything away from his ability to throw accurate darts from the pocket.
Did you see where Harbaugh called Brady the GOAT? I did laugh a bit thinking it was a way to jab at a 49er and also to give kudos to his fellow Wolverine. If it was me, I was just call it a tie and say its impossible to choose between the 2.
Originally posted by BobS:
Originally posted by cciowa:Look it up, Montana had the benefit of overall better defenses than Young did. You are just showing bias, as I believe you have been watching this game a long time.
if the team would have traded young to the chiefs for thomas like i wanted to, you would have fixed the defense,. montana would have won two more super bowls and then bono would have taken over. but the hell with the logic. instead you get young who was incapable of winning the big game until they had to buy him a defense
