Week 2 Pittsburg Steelers coaches film analysis

Originally posted by SofaKing:

As far as Mangini, the only major gripe I have is having the safeties so far up by the LOS and expecting them to recover in Cover 2 down the field. I'm sure it made all the sense in the world on the whiteboard, trying to guard the sticks on 3rd down, but you have to know what you're up against. Big Ben feasted off that defensive look. The coverage disguise didn't work, a more simpler scheme would have helped the players tremendously.

To add, I'm a fan of mixing up the coverages. Like thl408 noted, throw in some off coverages. Throw in some pattern matches. Throw in some press. Some jam press. Throw in some pre and post snap confusion.

BUT play sound 'technique' within the calls. Better angles for the S's. Square up and knock the WR's off their routes to ensure the S's have time to retreat and recover. Use the right personnel...Reaser may have been a better match-up in press here b/c of his recovery speed. When you bring Johnson in, use his strength and length in jam to defeat a 5'10" WR at the LOS.

All this is correctable and they were just a bad matchup for us with our personnel choices, technique and game plan at this time. The Cards may be the only other team who can do the same with a veteran QB and electric speed at WR.

Own it. Fix it. Move on...

Hey jonny or thl, did you notice a big difference in the first half and second half with the Steelers defense?

Originally posted by braap49er:
Can you leave the GIF's in color, they are harder to see in black and white

I think we may get mixed thoughts on this. I am fine either way. I thought it was a good thing to go B&W for all those that are on their phones without WiFi (smaller file size makes the page load quicker). Doesn't the black and white get the point across? I mean, in a way, we are just looking at ants run around the field. It's to see the routes/coverage.

Again, I'm fine either way. Let me know, fellas.

Originally posted by thl408:

More good stuff from our new X WR. As we've discussed, the X WR is often lined up by himself on the backside. He operates without the benefit of route combinations. This puts an emphasis on being able to win athletically, and/or with precision route running. Last season, BLloyd, SJohnson, Patton, all took turns as X and did not do well. This is something they rarely saw - the CB playing with a cushion. Torrey (orange) changes that.
Backside skinny Post. Can't tell what coverage this is.


The CB is not going to get beat deep here so he gives a huge cushion at the snap and backpeddles after the snap.

That's shallow cross again. How it used to be is that backside route is an alert. So, something in coverage or speed of the guy running that route had to catch the QBs eye. Of course I'm assuming they are using a similar progression.

This is from 1994 niner playbook.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by braap49er:

Can you leave the GIF's in color, they are harder to see in black and white

I think we may get mixed thoughts on this. I am fine either way. I thought it was a good thing to go B&W for all those that are on their phones without WiFi (smaller file size makes the page load quicker). Doesn't the black and white get the point across? I mean, in a way, we are just looking at ants run around the field. It's to see the routes/coverage.

Again, I'm fine either way. Let me know, fellas.

Perfectly fine in B&W.

Originally posted by sking20854:
Hey jonny or thl, did you notice a big difference in the first half and second half with the Steelers defense?

I have not gotten to the 2nd half. But I'll be sure to check it out. I am assuming this is whether to see if Kap's 2nd half success in the passing game was aided by PIT easing off the gas pedal?

Originally posted by SofaKing:
That is interesting. Mangini surely knows how to teach pattern matching, he was a DB coach and D-coordinator for NE all those years using pattern matching.

He's a guy that will alter things week to week. Maybe he just didn't want to employ it these first 2 weeks, for whatever reason. We'll soon find out.

This. I trust him when it comes to DB's much as I would trust Fangio when it came to LB's. A guy who spent nearly a decade working under Belichick as well as Parcells, who was a DB coach for about 5 years for the Patriots, I imagine he's got a good grasp on scheming in the secondary. What he can't do is force a pass rush.

Originally posted by Niners816:
That's shallow cross again. How it used to be is that backside route is an alert. So, something in coverage or speed of the guy running that route had to catch the QBs eye. Of course I'm assuming they are using a similar progression.

This is from 1994 niner playbook.

Oh yeah...that play again. Hah! We've seen this a few times already. First time the backside was targeted. I think Kap saw the cushion being given to Torrey and took it.

Originally posted by Niners816:

That's shallow cross again. How it used to be is that backside route is an alert. So, something in coverage or speed of the guy running that route had to catch the QBs eye. Of course I'm assuming they are using a similar progression.

This is from 1994 niner playbook.

Love that you can bring this historical info to the modern day table.

Aside from the shotgun, are you seeing more WCO thus far?

Marcus Martin #66 is just god awful so far his 1st 2 seasons, how is he a starter?? and more importanly why was he drafted??Kap delivered a nice pass but couldnt really step into it more because Martin always gets spun around. I dont like him as a 49er.

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by SofaKing:
As far as Mangini, the only major gripe I have is having the safeties so far up by the LOS and expecting them to recover in Cover 2 down the field. I'm sure it made all the sense in the world on the whiteboard, trying to guard the sticks on 3rd down, but you have to know what you're up against. Big Ben feasted off that defensive look. The coverage disguise didn't work, a more simpler scheme would have helped the players tremendously.

I don't think it's a coincidence that Tomsula's Monday morning press conference specifically addressed this failure and the possibility of not doing it as much. I saw that as a positive sign that Mangini and Tomsula knew the scheme + execution combined for the major fails here, and I expect we'll see it far less, especially against offenses more in the Pittsburgh mold.

Good posts here. Hopefully, Mangini and the rest of the D staff learns from this past game and they adjust before each game going forward according to what could work best against that particular opponent's QB & style of offense. I know this is easier said than done, and sometimes when you're up against excellent QBs like Ben you just have to do what you can do to disrupt them to keep them from going off - this means making them uncomfortable in the pocket by getting some consistent QB pressure. This is imperative for this team going forward...look who's coming up: Palmer, Rodgers, E. Manning, Flacco, Wilson, and Ryan. This week, just get to the immobile Palmer somewhat and it'll disrupt his game to force him to either be off or commit mistakes.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Love that you can bring this historical info to the modern day table.

Aside from the shotgun, are you seeing more WCO thus far?

Yeah...lots of good WCO stuff. Hell, last week was a Shanahan special with all the boot action flood stuff. That's the great thing about these concepts you can run them in whatever formation you want to. we've run a lot of stuff from pistol and gun forms, this play just happened to be a pistol form.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by SofaKing:
As far as Mangini, the only major gripe I have is having the safeties so far up by the LOS and expecting them to recover in Cover 2 down the field. I'm sure it made all the sense in the world on the whiteboard, trying to guard the sticks on 3rd down, but you have to know what you're up against. Big Ben feasted off that defensive look. The coverage disguise didn't work, a more simpler scheme would have helped the players tremendously.

To add, I'm a fan of mixing up the coverages. Like thl408 noted, throw in some off coverages. Throw in some pattern matches. Throw in some press. Some jam press. Throw in some pre and post snap confusion.

BUT play sound 'technique' within the calls. Better angles for the S's. Square up and knock the WR's off their routes to ensure the S's have time to retreat and recover. Use the right personnel...Reaser may have been a better match-up in press here b/c of his recovery speed. When you bring Johnson in, use his strength and length in jam to defeat a 5'10" WR at the LOS.

All this is correctable and they were just a bad matchup for us with our personnel choices, technique and game plan at this time. The Cards may be the only other team who can do the same with a veteran QB and electric speed at WR.

Own it. Fix it. Move on...

Right, mix it up if Mangini wants to use spot dropping and man coverage too. I can't believe that Mangini is holding back because showing pattern match coverages isn't going to give up anything in terms of secrecy. Every opponent the past seasons knew the 49ers were going to do it and they just did it. Criss crossing routes? Go ahead, pattern matching beats that. Flood concepts? Go ahead, pattern matching beats that too. It's as if Mangini cranked up the complexity of the defensive fronts, but simplified the coverage on the backend.

Originally posted by Niners816:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Love that you can bring this historical info to the modern day table.

Aside from the shotgun, are you seeing more WCO thus far?

Yeah...lots of good WCO stuff. Hell, last week was a Shanahan special with all the boot action flood stuff. That's the great thing about these concepts you can run them in whatever formation you want to. we've run a lot of stuff from pistol and gun forms, this play just happened to be a pistol form.

I just got a ChazBoner!

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by SofaKing:

As far as Mangini, the only major gripe I have is having the safeties so far up by the LOS and expecting them to recover in Cover 2 down the field. I'm sure it made all the sense in the world on the whiteboard, trying to guard the sticks on 3rd down, but you have to know what you're up against. Big Ben feasted off that defensive look. The coverage disguise didn't work, a more simpler scheme would have helped the players tremendously.

To add, I'm a fan of mixing up the coverages. Like thl408 noted, throw in some off coverages. Throw in some pattern matches. Throw in some press. Some jam press. Throw in some pre and post snap confusion.

BUT play sound 'technique' within the calls. Better angles for the S's. Square up and knock the WR's off their routes to ensure the S's have time to retreat and recover. Use the right personnel...Reaser may have been a better match-up in press here b/c of his recovery speed. When you bring Johnson in, use his strength and length in jam to defeat a 5'10" WR at the LOS.

All this is correctable and they were just a bad matchup for us with our personnel choices, technique and game plan at this time. The Cards may be the only other team who can do the same with a veteran QB and electric speed at WR.

Own it. Fix it. Move on...

Right, mix it up if Mangini wants to use spot dropping and man coverage too. I can't believe that Mangini is holding back because showing pattern match coverages isn't going to give up anything in terms of secrecy. Every opponent the past seasons knew the 49ers were going to do it and they just did it. Criss crossing routes? Go ahead, pattern matching beats that. Flood concepts? Go ahead, pattern matching beats that too. It's as if Mangini cranked up the complexity of the defensive fronts, but simplified the coverage on the backend.

You would be the first to recognize if he was running the pattern matches so I was taken back a bit when you realized we weren't running any. I haven't watched every snap but it seems we're in press a ton. Soft press.

This is certainly something we'll need to watch closely. Maybe he's installing the simple stuff first and then will add layers on as we go as we know pattern matching can become very complex and team oriented.