Week 7 Seahawks coaches film analysis

Another example of dialing up the correct concept to beat the defensive coverage, but not having the talent and execution to beat the defense.

49ers look to run a pick play and free up VD down the sideline.
Versus Cover 1 blitz


I don't know if Torrey's split is too wide, or if VD lined up too far to the middle of the formation, but there is no pick/rub created (on orange) as VD comes underneath Torrey's route. Both Hyde and Miller go to pick up the blitz (blue), which makes the playaction look silly as Kap fakes to no one. Not sure if both RBs were supposed to go blitz pick up.


No separation.


Kap is just throwing it away here because there's only two routes and nothing was open.

Originally posted by thl408:

I'll show a play later where SEA defends similar a similar route concept much better than what Bethea does here. Brock and Bethea talk about it after.

I think I know exactly which play you're talking about, lol. Yes, they defended it much better. Although, it was also on a very similar play we hit VD for a 27 yard gain.

Originally posted by thl408:
Another example of dialing up the correct concept to beat the defensive coverage, but not having the talent and execution to beat the defense.

49ers look to run a pick play and free up VD down the sideline.
Versus Cover 1 blitz


I don't know if Torrey's split is too wide, or if VD lined up too far to the middle of the formation, but there is no pick/rub created (on orange) as VD comes underneath Torrey's route. Both Hyde and Miller go to pick up the blitz (blue), which makes the playaction look silly as Kap fakes to no one. Not sure if both RBs were supposed to go blitz pick up.


No separation.


Kap is just throwing it away here because there's only two routes and nothing was open.

we tried several of these scissors concept plays to try and defeat the man-coverage Seattle was playing and none of them worked.

Here's a play you've seen us run a ton, it's an old WCO staple - the slant/flat concept. It's not necessarily a progression read(although there usually is a progression listed) but it's really a "key" read.


I like the formation for this play, it gives CK a clear picture of the defense. We line up both our TE's wide and both WR's inside. Because both CB's are over each TE and you have a S and a LB over the WR's - no matter how much Dick Sherman is trying to show he's playing man, it's zone coverage. Being zone coverage, the QB is going to read the "key" defender on whichever side he chooses. If he plays outside, throw the slant in between the outside defender and before the MLB(Favre ran this play all the time under Holmgren, it's great for strong arm QB's). If the key defender stays inside, throw the flat.


The key defender on both sides shoot outside. This should mean the throw is going to go to the slant.


The bottom of the screen is where CK really should've looked, since the safety was shifted over to the wide side of the field. However, he looked to the other side, away from Sherman and Chancellor.


You see how open VD breaks(I know, the defenders are reacting to the throw, but, I strongly feel that even without that, Wagner didn't really move, so I believe VD would've had a chance to turn upfield for a good gain. It's the wrong throw, even on that side, because of the key defender. However, the receiver is still open but CK airmails it - not sure why the throw was so poor.

Either way, double fail by CK.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Here's a play you've seen us run a ton, it's an old WCO staple - the slant/flat concept. It's not necessarily a progression read(although there usually is a progression listed) but it's really a "key" read.


I like the formation for this play, it gives CK a clear picture of the defense. We line up both our TE's wide and both WR's inside. Because both CB's are over each TE and you have a S and a LB over the WR's - no matter how much Dick Sherman is trying to show he's playing man, it's zone coverage. Being zone coverage, the QB is going to read the "key" defender on whichever side he chooses. If he plays outside, throw the slant in between the outside defender and before the MLB(Favre ran this play all the time under Holmgren, it's great for strong arm QB's). If the key defender stays inside, throw the flat.


The key defender on both sides shoot outside. This should mean the throw is going to go to the slant.


The bottom of the screen is where CK really should've looked, since the safety was shifted over to the wide side of the field. However, he looked to the other side, away from Sherman and Chancellor.


You see how open VD breaks(I know, the defenders are reacting to the throw, but, I strongly feel that even without that, Wagner didn't really move, so I believe VD would've had a chance to turn upfield for a good gain. It's the wrong throw, even on that side, because of the key defender. However, the receiver is still open but CK airmails it - not sure why the throw was so poor.

Either way, double fail by CK.

So this is 12 personnel and we split the TEs wide. I like that, gets cbs on TEs like you said and it's one way to get our WRs away from Sherman.

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Here's, officially, the 2nd pass play of the game. Seattle was prepared for this all the way.


Here, we're going to run a "mesh" concept. The primary read is VD, but it's supposed to be a "key defender" read. The middle curl route is supposed to clear the underneath defender to open up the shallow cross. They're trying to move #50 vertically and then the outside defender(Chancellor) out with the flat route, to open up VD coming across the field. If #50(can't remember which one that is for Seattle) covers the shallow cross, the middle curl route should be open, as the deep post is supposed to occupy all 3 deep defenders.


At the snap you see #54 check VD on an underneath release and #50 drop with Celek and Chancellor splitting out with Bush.


The LB's pass off Celek very well and #50 is ready for VD coming across the field, same with 54 is ready for Celek's curl. Thomas is reading CK's eyes, so he's looking to jump the post route and #50 has taken a good spot drop in the passing lane.


54 reads CK's eyes and when he checks out to McD, he moves wide, then Cary Williams starts to move up to drive on the potential curl route. 50 also then lets VD run through his zone and moves to cover the curl.


As CK's eyes come back to the middle of the field, you see how all the defenders are in a position to drive on any throw or cover a receiver. Celek looks open, but Williams has already started driving on the route.


It's a checkdown to McD for 2 yards. Seattle covered the play perfectly.

pattern match?

Thl and Jonnydel

care to go in depth about how we would punt on 4th &1 or more despite being down 17-20 points?

Originally posted by defenderDX:
Thl and Jonnydel

care to go in depth about how we would punt on 4th &1 or more despite being down 17-20 points?

because the game was already lost and there is no need to get embarrassed even more. they werent going to get 17 points in 4 minutes, dont even say maybe, there was no way, they were mentally beaten at that point. So what they go for it, make it and just punt 4 downs later? or wait, they dont convert on 4th, your qb looks like even more of a fool, and seattle puts up another 7 on you.

Originally posted by philosoraptor:

Originally posted by defenderDX:
Thl and Jonnydel

care to go in depth about how we would punt on 4th &1 or more despite being down 17-20 points?

because the game was already lost and there is no need to get embarrassed even more. they werent going to get 17 points in 4 minutes, dont even say maybe, there was no way, they were mentally beaten at that point. So what they go for it, make it and just punt 4 downs later? or wait, they dont convert on 4th, your qb looks like even more of a fool, and seattle puts up another 7 on you.

that's just scared thinking. what about not going for it int he 3rd quarter?
tomsula punted many times on 4th down. dude is a joke

Originally posted by defenderDX:

Originally posted by philosoraptor:

Originally posted by defenderDX:
Thl and Jonnydel

care to go in depth about how we would punt on 4th &1 or more despite being down 17-20 points?

because the game was already lost and there is no need to get embarrassed even more. they werent going to get 17 points in 4 minutes, dont even say maybe, there was no way, they were mentally beaten at that point. So what they go for it, make it and just punt 4 downs later? or wait, they dont convert on 4th, your qb looks like even more of a fool, and seattle puts up another 7 on you.

that's just scared thinking. what about not going for it int he 3rd quarter?
tomsula punted many times on 4th down. dude is a joke

I understand the 3rd quarter, maybe. if you do that in your own territory all you do is potentially make the gap either bigger. Just posted this in another thread. best case scenario you get a garbage time touchdown to make pissed off fans like you feel less butthurt, worst case scenario kap throws a pick or two to their awesome secondary trying to force it and you get his confidence hang over like you did versus the packers. which one of those seems more likely. all of a sudden the oline will start pass protecting, receivers will start running wide open, and kap will see them when they do? or that you just embarrass their self and turn a steep loss into a massive blow out on live television. Yeah, I bet you would be sitting here even happier, "atleast they went for it" when the score is 30+-3.

this aint madden where oyu just go for and turn off the game if it doesnt work out. guarantee people would be more pissed.

Originally posted by philosoraptor:

Originally posted by defenderDX:

Originally posted by philosoraptor:

Originally posted by defenderDX:
Thl and Jonnydel

care to go in depth about how we would punt on 4th &1 or more despite being down 17-20 points?

because the game was already lost and there is no need to get embarrassed even more. they werent going to get 17 points in 4 minutes, dont even say maybe, there was no way, they were mentally beaten at that point. So what they go for it, make it and just punt 4 downs later? or wait, they dont convert on 4th, your qb looks like even more of a fool, and seattle puts up another 7 on you.

that's just scared thinking. what about not going for it int he 3rd quarter?
tomsula punted many times on 4th down. dude is a joke

I understand the 3rd quarter, maybe. if you do that in your own territory all you do is potentially make the gap either bigger. Just posted this in another thread. best case scenario you get a garbage time touchdown to make pissed off fans like you feel less butthurt, worst case scenario kap throws a pick or two to their awesome secondary trying to force it and you get his confidence hang over like you did versus the packers. which one of those seems more likely. all of a sudden the oline will start pass protecting, receivers will start running wide open, and kap will see them when they do? or that you just embarrass their self and turn a steep loss into a massive blow out on live television. Yeah, I bet you would be sitting here even happier, "atleast they went for it" when the score is 30+-3.

this aint madden where oyu just go for and turn off the game if it doesnt work out. guarantee people would be more pissed.

Tomsula and the entire offensive staff is conservative and has been shown to be. we were 2-4 against a division rival. i dont give a s**t that there's 4 minutes left in the game and we're down by 17. if it's 4th & 2 at least try

Originally posted by defenderDX:

Originally posted by philosoraptor:

Originally posted by defenderDX:

Originally posted by philosoraptor:

Originally posted by defenderDX:
Thl and Jonnydel

care to go in depth about how we would punt on 4th &1 or more despite being down 17-20 points?

because the game was already lost and there is no need to get embarrassed even more. they werent going to get 17 points in 4 minutes, dont even say maybe, there was no way, they were mentally beaten at that point. So what they go for it, make it and just punt 4 downs later? or wait, they dont convert on 4th, your qb looks like even more of a fool, and seattle puts up another 7 on you.

that's just scared thinking. what about not going for it int he 3rd quarter?
tomsula punted many times on 4th down. dude is a joke

I understand the 3rd quarter, maybe. if you do that in your own territory all you do is potentially make the gap either bigger. Just posted this in another thread. best case scenario you get a garbage time touchdown to make pissed off fans like you feel less butthurt, worst case scenario kap throws a pick or two to their awesome secondary trying to force it and you get his confidence hang over like you did versus the packers. which one of those seems more likely. all of a sudden the oline will start pass protecting, receivers will start running wide open, and kap will see them when they do? or that you just embarrass their self and turn a steep loss into a massive blow out on live television. Yeah, I bet you would be sitting here even happier, "atleast they went for it" when the score is 30+-3.

this aint madden where oyu just go for and turn off the game if it doesnt work out. guarantee people would be more pissed.

Tomsula and the entire offensive staff is conservative and has been shown to be. we were 2-4 against a division rival. i dont give a s**t that there's 4 minutes left in the game and we're down by 17. if it's 4th & 2 at least try

Again, your qb is shellshocked. why make it very likely worse for some idealistic reason? At the end of the day does doing that actually going to change the outcome of the game, doubt it. If the offense was actually able to move the ball that day, and kap didnt look like he was a freshmen qb playing against the varsity guys, then yes, id say go for it. All your doing is making it worse for him, or even opening him to more punishment behind that oline. there was nothing to be gained from doing that, zero. I see no benefit, none.

Originally posted by defenderDX:
Thl and Jonnydel

care to go in depth about how we would punt on 4th &1 or more despite being down 17-20 points?

LOL, I don't think that problem can be solved from film study

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by defenderDX:
Thl and Jonnydel

care to go in depth about how we would punt on 4th &1 or more despite being down 17-20 points?

LOL, I don't think that problem can be solved from film study

LOL. just had to ask. this coaching staff....

Originally posted by philosoraptor:
Again, your qb is shellshocked. why make it very likely worse for some idealistic reason? At the end of the day does doing that actually going to change the outcome of the game, doubt it. If the offense was actually able to move the ball that day, and kap didnt look like he was a freshmen qb playing against the varsity guys, then yes, id say go for it. All your doing is making it worse for him, or even opening him to more punishment behind that oline. there was nothing to be gained from doing that, zero. I see no benefit, none.

again. playing scared to win. cant do anything with this pathetic coaching staff. you look at it from a numbers standpoint. not garbage time if it's a 2 possession game in the 3rd quarter and top of the 4th